The Bible Study Thread

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TheUnlikelyToad said:
Basically I would like this thread to be a place where we can come and give testimony of tha lords presence in our everyday lives.
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I would like to reiterate this statement in the opening post. At the risk of sounding too PC I would like to encourage us to share our testimony rather than debating our particular doctrines. God is big enough to deal with us regarding our differences in doctrines, but unfortuantely we are too small to disolve them. Lets focus on what we are in agreement on and not on what we disagree.

Red, Brown, Yellow, Black and White we are precious in His sight. Jesus loves ALL the children of the world.

:)
 
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And an old priest said, "Speak to us of Religion."
And he said:
Have I spoken this day of aught else?
Is not religion all deeds and all reflection,
And that which is neither deed nor reflection, but a wonder and a surprise ever springing in the soul, even while the hands hew the stone or tend the loom?
Who can separate his faith from his actions, or his belief from his occupations?
Who can spread his hours before him, saying, "This for God and this for myself; This for my soul, and this other for my body?"
All your hours are wings that beat through space from self to self.
He who wears his morality but as his best garment were better naked.
The wind and the sun will tear no holes in his skin.
And he who defines his conduct by ethics imprisons his song-bird in a cage.
The freest song comes not through bars and wires.
And he to whom worshipping is a window, to open but also to shut, has not yet visited the house of his soul whose windows are from dawn to dawn.
Your daily life is your temple and your religion.
Whenever you enter into it take with you your all.
Take the plough and the forge and the mallet and the lute,
The things you have fashioned in necessity or for delight.
For in revery you cannot rise above your achievements nor fall lower than your failures.
And take with you all men:
For in adoration you cannot fly higher than their hopes nor humble yourself lower than their despair.
And if you would know God be not therefore a solver of riddles.
Rather look about you and you shall see Him playing with your children.
And look into space; you shall see Him walking in the cloud, outstretching His arms in the lightning and descending in rain. You shall see Him smiling in flowers, then rising and waving His hands in trees.
 
Not sure why but I can`t post or save a link to the above. Tried about 9 times.

Anyhow for those that don`t know it is a small book of poetry called "The Prophet" by Kahlil Gibran. I have found much strenght in it.
 
Your leave is not required and I would rather you stay.

Some of us have prayed for a day that we could openly witness and share testimony so candidly and present ourselves as transparently as some of us have. You have no idea the mockery some of us have experienced elsewhere.

As I said, our doctrine is an issue of man, not of God. I have a personal interest in this thread and will not allow the enemy to defeat us with ourselves.

I walk a fine line being a moderator. My faith is paramount in my life, and along with that comes my witness and testimony. I will moderate this thread within the bounds of discussion conducive to fellowship and peaceful and respectful sharing.

Preaching, evangelising, and conviction is not very fruitful. Fellowship brings a harvest.
 
B5150 said:
I would like to reiterate this statement in the opening post. At the risk of sounding too PC I would like to encourage us to share our testimony rather than debating our particular doctrines.

:)
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Some testimony from my life. Hopefully those of you following this read my previous post which explained my history and what I am currently experiencing. If not going back a few posts will help you understand the significance of this post.

As I stated before, I have just recently began exploring God again, and looking for answers. I told my girlfriend last night that praying was something that still just did not feel right. However, Today at work I decided to pray. I am in sales and up untill today I was at $0 dollars for the month. It is very very very hard to stay positive in my field and having a month of no sales sure drags you down.

Because it is a holiday weekend, the type of sales I am in (similar to Timeshare) holiday weekends can be hell, with lots of horrible tours. I prayed (Which still feels very unatural to me) to God, and asked him to give me strength today. I told him that I was not looking for help getting a deal, or making money today, just help with the strength to deal with the people I saw today. I asked for strength to not prejudge people, or let their negativity affect me. Well, I ended up getting a $40,000 deal today. That is a very big deal. Those are very very hard to come by. Again, I did not want his help getting a deal and actually said that in my prayer, just the strength to be able to hang in there. Putting my trust in God, Which was very hard and very unatural for me turned a horrible month completely around.

Now on the way home I was listening to a song called "gotta survive" by Mase. In case you don't know Mase is a mainstream hip hop/rap artist. The beginning of the song starts out by in short talking about his achievements in life and being on top. Normally a song like this would make me feel on top of the world and proud of MY achievements. As I started feeling like I was the "man" for my deal today, I said to myself, "Normally I would take all the credit for this. I cannot take credit for what happened today. I asked God for the strength and he gave it to me."

Then something very interesting happened. I am not too familiar with this song, do not know the lyrics, and hadn't heard it in forever. At the end of the song Mase goes on to say "Theres nothing in this world that can seperate me from what I believe. All of this is because of him. And Im telling you now, as much as you all dont want to hear it, I could do nothing by myself. It's all through him. You can't even know yourself untill you know him. And HIM is JESUS."

I immediately was overcome with emotion. I had extreme chills run up my spine, I almost started crying. I felt heavier chills then I think I ever have before. I feel stupid telling you all this, however I felt it applied extremely well. Guys, I am normally the skeptic that says "big deal, thats just coincidence." However There have just been too many signs lately for me to ignore. I feel like I have been led down this path for a reason.
 
AA thank you for that. the power of prayer and faith is an incredibly strong thing, and like dmitry said, this was not a coincidence. you reached out to him and he let you know he is there. thank you agian, that was a very moving experience.
 
adrenalinaddict said:
As I stated before, I have just recently began exploring God again, and looking for answers. I told my girlfriend last night that praying was something that still just did not feel right. However, Today at work I decided to pray. I am in sales and up untill today I was at $0 dollars for the month. It is very very very hard to stay positive in my field and having a month of no sales sure drags you down.

Because it is a holiday weekend, the type of sales I am in (similar to Timeshare) holiday weekends can be hell, with lots of horrible tours. I prayed (Which still feels very unatural to me) to God, and asked him to give me strength today. I told him that I was not looking for help getting a deal, or making money today, just help with the strength to deal with the people I saw today. I asked for strength to not prejudge people, or let their negativity affect me. Well, I ended up getting a $40,000 deal today. That is a very big deal. Those are very very hard to come by. Again, I did not want his help getting a deal and actually said that in my prayer, just the strength to be able to hang in there. Putting my trust in God, Which was very hard and very unatural for me turned a horrible month completely around.
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The relative scripture for what your obedience provided you is likely found here:
Matt 6:25 - 7:12

"Therefore I tell you, do not be anxious about your life, what you shall eat or what you shall drink, nor about your body, what you shall put on. Is not life more than food, and the body more than clothing? Look at the birds of the air: they neither sow nor reap nor gather into barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not of more value than they? And which of you by being anxious can add one cubit to his span of life? And why are you anxious about clothing? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they neither toil nor spin; yet I tell you, even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. But if God so clothes the grass of the field, which today is alive and tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will he not much more clothe you, O men of little faith? Therefore do not be anxious, saying, `What shall we eat?' or `What shall we drink?' or `What shall we wear?' For the Gentiles seek all these things; and your heavenly Father knows that you need them all. But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things shall be yours as well. "Therefore do not be anxious about tomorrow, for tomorrow will be anxious for itself. Let the day's own trouble be sufficient for the day. "Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and the measure you give will be the measure you get. Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, `Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when there is the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye. "Do not give dogs what is holy; and do not throw your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under foot and turn to attack you." Ask, and it will be given you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For every one who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. Or what man of you, if his son asks him for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a serpent? If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him! So whatever you wish that men would do to you, do so to them; for this is the law and the prophets.

I immediately was overcome with emotion. I had extreme chills run up my spine, I almost started crying. I felt heavier chills then I think I ever have before.
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What do you expect when you get filled to capacity with the Holy Spirit ;)

Everything
by Lifehouse

find me here
speak to me
i want to feel you
i need to hear you
you are the light
that is leading me
to the place where
i find peace again
you are the strength
that keeps me walking
you are the hope
that keeps me trusting
you are the life to my soul
you are my purpose
you are everything
and how can i
stand here with you
and not be moved by you
would you tell me
how could it be
any better than this
you calm the storms
you give me rest
you hold me in your hands
you won't let me fall
you still my heart
and you take my breath away
would you take me in
would you take me deeper now
'cause you're all i want
you are all i need
you are everything
everything
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i dont know if this is an absolutely appropriate place to do this but i figured this is a place with others of faith and would hope this is ok.

My girlfriends father, who is a great person, has lupus. Because of this he has an extremely low immune system and has constant virul attacks and the like on many of his organs, primarily his liver and kidneys, both of wich are on their way to failing. but tomorrow he has to go into surgery to have his gall bladder removed, if not it will quite possibly kill him. with such a weak immune system though there is a chance he will not survive the operation and if he does there is a chance he will not survive the healing process. i would just like to ask those of sufficient faith to say a prayer for him and his family, he goes in for surgery about 6 this morning so many of you may not read this by then but any thoughts and prayers will still be appreciated, i have an extremely strong testimony of the power of prayer especialy when magnified by others and would like to set forth this petition before God that if it is in his will, to allow this process to be a quick and succesful one. thank you for all that oblidge to do this as it will mean the world to me and my girlfriend. and i would like to testify again that through the power of christ anything is possible. thank you guys.
 
poopypants said:
i dont know if this is an absolutely appropriate place to do this but i figured this is a place with others of faith and would hope this is ok.

My girlfriends father, who is a great person, has lupus. Because of this he has an extremely low immune system and has constant virul attacks and the like on many of his organs, primarily his liver and kidneys, both of wich are on their way to failing. but tomorrow he has to go into surgery to have his gall bladder removed, if not it will quite possibly kill him. with such a weak immune system though there is a chance he will not survive the operation and if he does there is a chance he will not survive the healing process. i would just like to ask those of sufficient faith to say a prayer for him and his family, he goes in for surgery about 6 this morning so many of you may not read this by then but any thoughts and prayers will still be appreciated, i have an extremely strong testimony of the power of prayer especialy when magnified by others and would like to set forth this petition before God that if it is in his will, to allow this process to be a quick and succesful one. thank you for all that oblidge to do this as it will mean the world to me and my girlfriend. and i would like to testify again that through the power of christ anything is possible. thank you guys.
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I will pray that God gives you, your girlfriend, and her dad tha courage, willingness and strength to fight.
 
I pray that the Father's Will be done, and all glory and honor be given unto Him. I pray that regardless the outcome, all will recall the faithfulness and inerrant wisdom of our LORD, bringing to remembrance the story of Job.
 
TheUnlikelyToad said:
I will pray that God gives you, your girlfriend, and her dad tha courage, willingness and strength to fight.
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thank you sir for the words of comfort.

TheCrownedOne said:
I pray that the Father's Will be done, and all glory and honor be given unto Him. I pray that regardless the outcome, all will recall the faithfulness and inerrant wisdom of our LORD, bringing to remembrance the story of Job.
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Thank you as well your faith and thoughts are appreciated.

well his operation started about an hour ago and should only consist of 3 small incisions if everything goes well, if there are any complications then they will have to open him up which isnt as good with his inability to heal. thanks again guys you dont know how much it means to me.
 
poopypants said:
i dont know if this is an absolutely appropriate place to do this but i figured this is a place with others of faith and would hope this is ok.

My girlfriends father, who is a great person, has lupus. Because of this he has an extremely low immune system and has constant virul attacks and the like on many of his organs, primarily his liver and kidneys, both of wich are on their way to failing. but tomorrow he has to go into surgery to have his gall bladder removed, if not it will quite possibly kill him. with such a weak immune system though there is a chance he will not survive the operation and if he does there is a chance he will not survive the healing process. i would just like to ask those of sufficient faith to say a prayer for him and his family, he goes in for surgery about 6 this morning so many of you may not read this by then but any thoughts and prayers will still be appreciated, i have an extremely strong testimony of the power of prayer especialy when magnified by others and would like to set forth this petition before God that if it is in his will, to allow this process to be a quick and succesful one. thank you for all that oblidge to do this as it will mean the world to me and my girlfriend. and i would like to testify again that through the power of christ anything is possible. thank you guys.
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Having lupus myself, you are all in my thoughts.I hope he makes a 100% recovery.(((((Hugz)))))) to you and your girlfriend.
 
poopypants said:
i dont know if this is an absolutely appropriate place to do this but i figured this is a place with others of faith and would hope this is ok.
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Prayer for strength, courage, peace, comfort and healing. We are heirs, kings and priests. All His power is ours and we claim victory in advance.
 
Thanks Dmitry. I guess it kinda gets blurry, because any time we define God, we have (perhaps inadvertently) LIMITED God (because our definition is limited. God is not (limited to ) our definition...God is God. Unless we expand our collective consciousness to embrace the idea that (quite correctly, I believe) we cannot (in our limited human state) truly even conceive of things such as God, infinity, timelessness, etc. We must have FAITH of some kind, because not only can we not PROVE many things, we can't even CONCEIVE of some of these things.

The reason the idea of God as a loving, omnipresent "force" works for me (rather than a "person" per se) is because it is easier for me to get my brain around that idea, and also helps me see God as a force of love within our very hearts and minds, which I feel and embrace daily (as opposed to something outside of ourselves). Again, its a personal preference thing, so I tell people all the time to go with whatever your mind can best grasp. It makes little difference how you find God (to me) and their are many paths to the divine. Incidentally, I often see God as a person, because my mind naturally goes to that (seems we always try to put some familiarity to things unfamiliar or unknown or mysterious). What I try to do, though, is remind myself that even if I see God as a person, that is not ALL God is. That's just my picture of God...
DmitryWI said:
I do respect your opinion, Milwood, but you are wrong about God=just love. i want to refer again to a friend of mine who's very gifted person, Gary Spivey is his name and actually he is pretty famous person he's got his own show in Las Vegas and he's on a few radiostations all over US and I learned a LOT from him. Anyway, he talks with God like it's just another person and I know some of you won't believe it and I didn't either untill one day he helped me see Him and talk to Him. I could see God so clear I was scared at first.
Me: (talking with my mind) I'm so glad to finally meet you, Father.
God: (smiling) I'm so happy for you, my son.
God: (still smiling) Take this sword to fight demons (puts it in my chest), take this rock it'll help you to stay on your path, take this staph to use to get rid of negative energy. I love you, son.
Me: Thank you, Father.
This is was the happiest day of my life, I've met Him, I've seen Him.
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milwood said:
Thanks Dmitry. I guess it kinda gets blurry, because any time we define God, we have (perhaps inadvertently) LIMITED God (because our definition is limited. God is not (limited to ) our definition...God is God. Unless we expand our collective consciousness to embrace the idea that (quite correctly, I believe) we cannot (in our limited human state) truly even conceive of things such as God, infinity, timelessness, etc. We must have FAITH of some kind, because not only can we not PROVE many things, we can't even CONCEIVE of some of these things.

The reason the idea of God as a loving, omnipresent "force" works for me (rather than a "person" per se) is because it is easier for me to get my brain around that idea, and also helps me see God as a force of love within our very hearts and minds, which I feel and embrace daily (as opposed to something outside of ourselves). Again, its a personal preference thing, so I tell people all the time to go with whatever your mind can best grasp. It makes little difference how you find God (to me) and their are many paths to the divine. Incidentally, I often see God as a person, because my mind naturally goes to that (seems we always try to put some familiarity to things unfamiliar or unknown or mysterious). What I try to do, though, is remind myself that even if I see God as a person, that is not ALL God is. That's just my picture of God...
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I tend to agree, only because it makes sense to me. That's how I usually roll with religion. If it makes sense, I adopt it as my own. But as you alluded too, it also creates room for error which I'm ok with. Thats why I feel God doesn't care what you wear, or even which church you go to... he just wants you here (with him).

You know it took quite a bit for me to start this thread, and it seems like some people have refrained from participation stating reasons they rather not get into. That is fine... but if anyone is not posting because they fear 'social acceptance' is really limiting themselves. My original intentions was not to preach and or 'save' people, rather have a forum to share, discuss, and learn from each other of different backgrounds. I felt in an effort to facilitate discussion, it was essential in tha beginning to put myself out there with my beliefs to an extent. Tha social work term for this is creating 'mutual aid' through my 'risk taking' asserting 'commonality'. :rasp:
 
TheUnlikelyToad said:
but if anyone is not posting because they fear 'social acceptance' is really limiting themselves.
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It took me a while to post my experience with God and I didn't feel comfortable doing so, because of this reason, but I did it anyway.

PP, I prayed for your girls father, hope he is ok now.

Milwood, if this is works for you, it's all good, I'm happy for you. I just thought I'll share something very personal with you and hope you or someone else can learn something new. And I'm sure few people think that I'm nutcase LOL
 
"We judge ourselves by our intensions, others judge us by our actions."


I have learned to be tolerant of others because people were tolerant of me. At my 1st sober anniversary meeting a man I admired said to me... "When you first came around I had to sit on my hands!"

I asked "Why? Did you have the shakes that bad?"

"No I had to make sure I didn`t choke the hell out of you!"

I have since found out that this is an old AA saying not something special just for me. But the lesson is that we must allow GOD to do his work in others in HIS way not ours.

Or "There is only one GOD and you are not him!"
 
nice to see there are a lot of thinkers, seekers, visionaries, and spiritually minded people around the halls of AM. Really is refreshing. Props to everyone!
 
i thought id update you guys since many of you took the time and effort to concern yourself with my situation again wich i am very thankful for.

the surgery was hopefully going to be able to be completed with three small incisions, but in doing so (and mostly due to inflamed organs) the doctor cut the bile duct coming off the gall bladder in the wrong spot not between the 2 clamps and in doing so cuased internal bleeding and the release of bile into his abdomen. the doc had to open him up and bring in 2 more docs making the planned 45 min operation into a 4.5 hour operation. we were all very scared for a moment but i just got home last night (from my folks) and got to see him today. he looks good and knowing him he'll pull through now just fine (he has a very strong will and an amazing amount of faith) even though he has to keep 3 tubes in him for 6 weeks to drain bile internal fluids/bleeding and urine.

thank you again guys for this, your prayers and faith have been felt throughout this ordeal and again i cant even tell you how much even one prayer meant to me. at this point id like to publicly thank my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ for allowing us the priviledge of this great mans company if even for a little while longer, because im sure he will be welcomed home with open arms. thank you Lord
 
I've been tryin' to rep you, poopy, but I gotta spread it around abit.. ;)


I'm very glad to hear things are getting better.. You and yours are in my thoughts and prayers, as they were since the first post you made.. :)
 
Wow... just stumbled upon this thread. I have to say that I am very glad that I did. Always in need of some great encouragement. Glad to see that others who struggle in their relationships with God are posting here.

you fine folks are a blessing and I'm grateful that this thread is here.
 
toughchick401 said:
I see this thread and think, is god forgiving? I know stupid thought right? I agree...

In my experience god has not been very kind. I lost my sister when I was 14, she was murdered. I don't say this looking for pity, or anything else this is the facts and how I see them. Since that time I have choosen my own path, to be someone i would want her to be proud of, I choose teaching, special needs children and I love it. I coach for the special olympics, as well as give my time to charitys locally, I assist with the butterfly ball ( a lupus event to raise $ for research) and i give my time once monthly answering phones at the rape crisis center. All things I belive in.
Yet I have to think god holds a grudge, when I lost my sister, i begged god everynight to let me die, to give me some illness that would let me see my sister one more time, to tell her how much I love her and that I was so sorry.( we had a fight the last time i saw her when I got up in the morning she was gone, later to be discovered she was murdered).
Is god now giving me what I asked for? I go throught stomach cancer yrs back, now lupus, and more recently, another cancer issue. And i am healthy, I work out, teach spin when I can, eat ok, but I am not a junk food junkie, I am not a coach potatoe, it dosent make sense! I have lost my hair, ( it fell out so i shaved it like GI Jane), I have lost friends, and I have pushed loved ones away.I wont let anyone stick around and see me go throught this, because there loyal. It isent right.I have decided whats meant to be will be, for now school, teaching, coaching and attempting my masters before I die are my goals. And to enjoy my 4 yr old nephew whom i adore.

So I ask is god now giving me what I wished for over 20 yrs ago? I wish I belived that god was forgiving.....but my evidence proves otherwise
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I was just reading your story and though it may be understandably difficult for you to recognize what may be going on, I believe that god is working through you and indirectly your sister right now. You said that you want to be someone that she would be proud of, and it sounds like you're someone anyone would be prould to be related to, hell, to even know. Because of your loss you have tried to be the best person that you can, think of how many lives you've touched through the charities, the teaching, the special Olympics. Because of your pain and it causing you to want to be someone your sister would have been proud of, you have acted in a truly selfless manner, through your pain you have brought many others joy. And in all the physical suffering you've gone through you haven't been like, "oh **** it, if I'm gonna be in this much pain, then I don't care about anyone else and whatever pain they're in." There are many people out there that in you're situation would turn inward and look out only for themselves, butit seems that you've done the opposite. I know it may hurt now, but just keep believing and maybe one day you can find the peace that you have brought to so many other through your work.
 
Hang in there with the prayers PP... you and yours are on my prayer list tonight

TS if you ever need to talk about your sister.. I would be glad to list, I know she had to be a special lady because you sure seem to be a great one yourself..
 
lot of love and support around AM!keep the faith, always.

Whiskey Steve--since you're 18 and mormon, what's with the 80 proof gloss??
 
Story Time

For whatever reason, I was thinking about this quote I have in my signature over at Avant tha other day. It reads "I get the most wonderful high when I know that I've just affected a person's life in a seriously positive way. To me, this is much better than any high and it NEVER goes away. I can always look back fondly on these memories and feel the satisfaction and pride just like it happened at that moment...it's overwhelming to me. So I'm always seeking it out." These words came from SJA and are very meaningful to me for a whole host of different reasons. In fact it's how I try and live my life day by day. There will always be times where you find yourself doing things you just don't want to do, or living life at such a pace where you are constantly trying to get 'ahead'. These are times where you say to yourself "Man, I can't wait for tha weekend". Yet you fail to realize it's 5 days away. So instead of wishing your life away, or bitching about tomorrow I've always tried to heed Steve's advice and live in tha now and for my sake really try to remember things. Because in tha end, thats all you have memories and if you take tha time to smell, feel, taste and see you could be able to recall it as if it were yesterday. This is one of those stories.

A few years ago when I first started lifting at Bloomsburg, there was a guy there named Brian Keenan. He worked at tha Student Rec Center and often his shift would coincide with me and Kelby's lifting time which was 9-10 at night. Brian was one of those guys who people looked up too. Even if you thought it was uncool to look up to someone or admire someone of tha same sex in college, you could just tell by tha people he associated with that many thought tha same way. He was of different calibur all together. The girls knew this too and it was fun to sit back at times and watch them swoon, but he had a girl and a lot of times because of this he had tons of clout in playing matchmaker for friends. You can imagine how jealous guys would get too, but thats not where I'm going with this... So anyhow, I think I first met Brian that first semester as a freshman and we chatted here and there on occasion like most gym-goers do. At that time I could tell he seemed like I cool person but what was usually overlooked by him getting my name wrong. Every time he saw me it was always something different.... Jared, Jason, Johnathon etc. I guess there was a time where he saw me across campus, yelled out my name and rushed to catch up with me just to say "Hi" but I had already boarded tha shuttle bus and never even gave him tha time of day because I didn't know tha fool screaming "Jason" really meant "Jordan". :)

As time went on, so did our friendship. Because Kelby had a different schedule than I, there were times where I had to lift on my own and it was always nice to have Brian greet me at tha door. One day, after my workout, we were standing around bullshitting and I asked him if there was anyway I could get a T-Shirt like tha one they wore for work. I'm not quite sure why I asked since I knew it would be next to impossible but I liked how they had STAFF on tha back and it was tha only Student Rec shirts available. “Sorry buddy, you gotta work here” he replied. I figured as much and left it as that. Over tha next few semesters, if I’d see him and there wasn’t anything to talk about, I’d tease him about those shirts. I’d come up with humorous ways in which I could possibly get one, just for a laugh. For example, asking him if he could hook me up with one of his female co-workers just so I could sleep with her, but instead of actually sleeping with her, I just wanted to take off her clothes. Then I’d hi-tail it out tha back door with shirt in hand. Brian would always end our conversation with “For you Jordan, I’ll do what I can to get you one”.

I never realized how much those words meant to me until his last semester at Bloom. Like me, he graduated in December instead of your typical spring graduation. This would have been my Junior year, and for me personally this was one of those ‘hit you like a ton of bricks’ moments where God revealed Himself to me. It was about a week or two before finals. Once again I was doing my usual routine, hitting tha gym up late at night. Brian asked me something like how late I was going to be here (meaning in Bloom) and when my last final was. I told him I was going to stay til Friday, tha last day possible. He kinda shook his head; I laughed and thought nothing more of it. Before you knew it that THURSDAY came in a blink of an eye. I really felt bad driving to tha gym that night. I knew it would probably be tha last time I saw Brian. You try to find tha right words to say yet somehow no matter how many times you play it out in your head, it never comes out tha way in which you want it too. After my workout we said our goodbyes. I thanked him for his friendship and as always, like I tell everyone, I told him it’s been real. We shook hands and then I made my way towards tha door as tha rest of tha staff including Brian turned off tha lights and shut everything down. I was just about ready to open tha door when Brian yelled “Jordan, wait man, I have something for you”. I turned around and gave a smile as I saw saw him and tha three other girls rushing towards me. It was then that it happened. He said “It might not be tha best Christmas present to get this year but at least I hope it means something”, and with those words, in front of everyone, he took off his shirt and gave it to me… I really didn’t know what to say and to be honest tha next few seconds are nothing but a blur. I just remember tha four of us getting into cars and Brian without a shirt on, and it snowing outside. I thank God I made it home safe that night because I cried like a child all tha way to my apartment. I was dumb struck, and it was then that I knew God had his plans for me. Brian touched me as much as I touched him. "I get the most wonderful high when I know that I've just affected a person's life in a seriously positive way. To me, this is much better than any high and it NEVER goes away. I can always look back fondly on these memories and feel the satisfaction and pride just like it happened at that moment...it's overwhelming to me.” It is something I will never forget.

You want more irony? Fast forward a few years… I work at tha gym where I train – King’s Fitness for Life in Halifax, and have my own staff shirt now :)
 
although i'm an ardent atheist and have been since i was roughly 12 (and i can't ever see myself changing my mind on that) this is a fun thread to read with a lot of knowledgable people contributing

i never judge another's faith and well done on an interesting thread
 
glenihan said:
although i'm an ardent atheist and have been since i was roughly 12
Click to expand...

So out of pure curiousity, what were you before 12?

Why was 12 tha deciding age if I may ask?

If it's too personal, I understand.
 
TheUnlikelyToad said:
So out of pure curiousity, what were you before 12?

Why was 12 tha deciding age if I may ask?

If it's too personal, I understand.
Click to expand...


i was raised lutheran .. i went to sunday school and all that jazz .. and although my family isn't very religious i personally have a VAST wealth of knowledge about christianity and its history

i don't think there was anything specific about being 12 that did it .. i guess i just started to think more critically about everything

THE FOLLOWING IS NOT MEANT TO OFFEND ANYONE ... seriously i mean that
i simply decided it made absolutely no sense for god to exist .. what made far more sense to me was that primative people with no concept of science easily explained everything through supernatural powers ... there are many scientific facts that while certainly do not negate the existence of a god clearly show how everything could have happened without a god .. the things that science cannot yet explain i believe will eventually be figured out and explained scientifically and rationally

as far as i am concerned there is no proof whatsoever that a god exists and in the abscence of proof i simply cannot believe

if someone wrote down that the universe was contained in a giant salt shaker and this was passed down from generation to generation it would carry the same weight with me as much of the bible

again i sincerly do not mean this to offend anyone that believes and i truly understand why people do believe in a god .. its just not something i can believe in .. there was a time when i was around 16 or so and i really wanted to believe (i thought it would be nice to believe in a higher power/better place/etc.) but i just couldn't get myself to accept it .. it was simply to unbelievable/contrived and without any basis in reality as far as i was/am concerned

just one more time PLEASE DO NOT TAKE OFFENSE TO THIS i truly do not judge anyone based on their beliefs
 
glenihan, just out of curiosity......here are some questions i ask my atheist friends (this is no attack on your beliefs)

Why do you not lie, steal, murder, rape, etc... (hopefully you arent doing those things)

1.is it because you fear the law of the land?
2.is it because you dont want to hurt/offend another person?
3.is it your conscience/ you just think its wrong (please explain you definition of what a conscience is and why/how we have it....if you believe there is such a thing)

example: in my mind if i wanted to kill someone and i believed they had no soul and i though i could get away with it (govenmentally speaking), i would do it. In my mind that would be the same as smashing a rock. Something has to Be (forever) to offend it...it "isnt" if it does not last forever. .......sorry if my train of thought is hard to follow; what i am trying to say is that we "arent", if we can be ended(no afterlife)
 
The thought of me ceasing to be, and not having the ability to have thoughts is something so impossible to fathom that i can scarcely put it into words. The concept of a begining and an end is not feesible to me. That why Christ said things like "from eternity to eternity".
please do not take offense, i am just offering my thoughts
 
Whiskey Steve said:
glenihan, just out of curiosity......here are some questions i ask my atheist friends (this is no attack on your beliefs)

1. Why do you not lie, steal, murder, rape, etc... (hopefully you arent doing those things)

1.is it because you fear the law of the land?
2.is it because you dont want to hurt/offend another person?
3.is it your conscience/ you just think its wrong (please explain you definition of what a conscience is and why/how we have it....if you believe there is such a thing)

example: in my mind if i wanted to kill someone and i believed they had no soul and i though i could get away with it (govenmentally speaking), i would do it. In my mind that would be the same as smashing a rock. Something has to Be (forever) to offend it...it "isnt" if it does not last forever. .......sorry if my train of thought is hard to follow; what i am trying to say is that we "arent" if we can be ended(no afterlife)
Click to expand...


1. i don't do those things because i truly believe in doing unto others as you would have them do unto you ... everyone benefits from this and if everyone acted this way the world would be a much better place .. i don't need the belief in a supernatural system of morality to convince me this is not only in my best interest but in all of humanity's best interest

1. (you had two 1's lol) its not because of the law of the land .. although i suppose that has stopped me from punching certain people at times .. lol

2. see first answer

3. i wouldn't say conscience, its more a sense of doing what is best for myself and society at large (and by doing what is best for society i am indirectly helping myself as well)


if i went around killing everyone i didn't like, i could not expect others not to kill me simply because they don't like me

why do people have a "conscience" .. i believe its a product of their upbringing and years of reinforcement .. notice how some people have stronger reservations about committing "wrongs" than others
 
Whiskey Steve said:
The thought of me ceasing to be, and not having the ability to have thoughts is something so impossible to fathom that i can scarcely put it into words. The concept of a begining and an end is not feesible to me. That why Christ said things like "from eternity to eternity".
please do not take offense, i am just offering my thoughts
Click to expand...

no offense at all my friend

the thought of an "eternal life" seems completely far-fetched and nonsensical to me

to me .. when you die that's it you're dead you have no idea you are dead you simply cease to exist as no more oxygen is getting to your brain .. i don't believe we have "souls" or "spirits"

and obviously no offense of course
 
glenihan, what is your stance on pornography
(not that im particularly interested in that subjuct, i am just picking a topic considered wrong by many but is legal and doesnt hurt anyone)
 
glenihan said:
no offense at all my friend

the thought of an "eternal life" seems completely far-fetched and nonsensical to me

to me .. when you die that's it you're dead you have no idea you are dead you simply cease to exist as no more oxygen is getting to your brain .. i don't believe we have "souls" or "spirits"

and obviously no offense of course
Click to expand...
doesnt a "begining" and and "end" of "being" seem just as infeasible as no beginning and no end........just sayin
i am just putting the two concepts on the same playing field
 
TheUnlikelyToad said:
With all of you answers from above, it sparks another good question...

In your eyes, why do 'they' ?
Click to expand...


well four reasons come to mind

1. they were raised that way and either never questioned it or have thought about it and accepted it as truth

2. a belief in a higher power is a very comforting thought especially a belief in the afterlife

3. something remarkable happens and they attribute it to a god

4. nothing remarkable happens but they meet someone or some group that "shows them the light"
 
Whiskey Steve said:
glenihan, what is your stance on pornography
(not that im particularly interested in that subjuct, i am just picking a topic considered wrong by many but is legal and doesnt hurt anyone)
Click to expand...

no problem with pornography at all .. for that matter i have no problem with prostitution ... if a person can use their body to build homes and get paid for it (construction) .. why can't a person use their body to have sex and get paid for it?
 
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