Testosterone and sperm count
- Thread starter corndog
- Start date
colkurtz_spf
The horror
It will effectively lower your count. Do you suffer from primary or secondary hypogonadism? If it's secondary HCG is the answer. I've used it alone for TRT with outstanding results. It will work wonders on your sperm count and seminal volume. Ask your doctor.
PumpDogg
Member
Corn I had about a page of stuff typed up for you, and I hit some freakin button on this lap top and lost it all.. soooooo
in short...
Find an endo., get on some clomid.. Clomid has been proven to reverse steriod induced hypogonadism... It was the information i armed myself with when i ask my endo for the clomid..
One last thing worth mentioning.. Any trt/hrt therapy is going to shut down your test, LH and FSH.. all three of which you must have good levels to produce healthy sperm.. it takes 72 days from start to finish to produce one healthy sperm...
I was tested 3 times for sperm count and had 0.. yes I said 0.. I have fathered 5 children since said time even when i was told I would never be able to produce sperm and make babys..
knowledge is king.. learn it and apply it
in short...
Find an endo., get on some clomid.. Clomid has been proven to reverse steriod induced hypogonadism... It was the information i armed myself with when i ask my endo for the clomid..
One last thing worth mentioning.. Any trt/hrt therapy is going to shut down your test, LH and FSH.. all three of which you must have good levels to produce healthy sperm.. it takes 72 days from start to finish to produce one healthy sperm...
I was tested 3 times for sperm count and had 0.. yes I said 0.. I have fathered 5 children since said time even when i was told I would never be able to produce sperm and make babys..
knowledge is king.. learn it and apply it
colkurtz_spf
The horror
Clomid is good for restarting your HPTA post cycle, but it isn't preferred for TRT. Long term use can cause liver damage. It's untrue to say that any trt/hrt will shut down test, LH and FSH. HCG acts as a substitute to LH and stimulates testosterone and sperm production. It will shut down LH , but not testosterone. If you're secondary you aren't producing sufficient LH anyway. Ideally Clomid would be the answer because it enhances test, LH and FSH and preserves the natural cascade of the HPTA. Unfortunately its toxicity prevents it from being a long term solution.
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EasyEJL
Never enough
I have below bottom of range test, right at bottom of range FSH, but mid towards high LH and have gotten my wife pregnant 3 times in that state, so I'm not sure what good levels are required. LH I think is the most important of the 3 as far as sperm count goes.
Gutterpump
Banned
How about Toremefine for long term use, as it has pro-estrogenic effects within the liver?
colkurtz_spf
The horror
I know many prefer it for PCT. It could be useful for long term use if it's not toxic to the liver. I haven't heard of any doctors prescribing it for TRT. It's definitely worth looking into. I'd like to hear from doctors on this. Stimulating LH would deliver a better balance in hormone levels.
PumpDogg
Member
I should have been more specific in my posting colkurtz.. I agree that you would not want to live the rest of your life on clomid nor should you have too.. Its ironic though that my endo does not see a long term issue with it as he has given me a script for it for trt for the last couple of years however by no means does that make it ok just because one doctor does not see a problem..
From my own experience with it and reading as much info as I could years ago as well as some research proving clomid to restart the HPTA if you were a past juicer ( which I was, but i had low test before the juice) i found the drug/med to be awesome.. I dont take it daily anymore because I dont have too and everything test out ok, test, estrogen, liver, blood lipids etc..
Many of you on these forums will have much more knowledge regarding drugs and reactions/side effects.. I have been out of the lifestyle for about 3 years now, but be assured I was not trying to give out poor advice or inaccurate advice either..
I posted this in another thread yesterday
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JanSz
Well-known member
Quote from link on the top:
"The mean age was 39 years, and the mean pretreatment testosterone and estrogen levels were 247.6 +/- 39.8 ng/dL and 32.3 +/- 10.9, respectively. By the first follow-up visit (4-6 weeks), the mean testosterone level rose to 610.0 +/- 178.6 ng/dL (P < 0.00001). Moreover, the T/E ratio improved from 8.7 to 14.2 (P < 0.001)."
Start
TT=247.6
E2=32.3
ratio=247.6/32.3=7.7 well close to reported 8.7
End
TT=610
ratio=14.2
E2=610/14.2=42.9
that is very high E2,
Gutterpump
Banned
I probably am going to suggest to my doc that I want to start clomid or newer serm therapy for a number of yrs before starting trt. Should I suggest an AI as well on top of the serm if my e2 is around 30? (total test = 370, free = 100)
Also, are there any newer studies on 2nd or even 3rd generation serms out there? Those 1st gen serms are so unnecessarily toxic. Toremefine (fareston) looks really good, positive impact on lipids since it is a pro-estrogen within the liver.
Aromasin looks to be a far superior AI over arimidex as well, since there will be no estrogen rebound if I decide to come off it. But it may possibly shut me down further if used long-term I am thinking?
Also, are there any newer studies on 2nd or even 3rd generation serms out there? Those 1st gen serms are so unnecessarily toxic. Toremefine (fareston) looks really good, positive impact on lipids since it is a pro-estrogen within the liver.
Aromasin looks to be a far superior AI over arimidex as well, since there will be no estrogen rebound if I decide to come off it. But it may possibly shut me down further if used long-term I am thinking?
corndog
Member
I am not looking to replace my current treatment for low test. My t levels are good I just wanted some info on if taking test lowers my sperm count. If so what was a typical coarse of action and a general length of time.
I am having a test/sperm biopsy in 2 weeks to see if I have any active/live sperm. From the sounds of what I have heard on this post I shouldnt have any since I am on test and thus not producing any myself. Funny how if taking test makes it so you stop producing sperm how so many bodybuilders have produced baby's while on the juice.
I have a few friends who have gotten their wives pregnate while on a cycle.
Sounds like I will or should be switching from test to clomid. I have also heard adding HCG to my test will get me to produce sperm.
I am having a test/sperm biopsy in 2 weeks to see if I have any active/live sperm. From the sounds of what I have heard on this post I shouldnt have any since I am on test and thus not producing any myself. Funny how if taking test makes it so you stop producing sperm how so many bodybuilders have produced baby's while on the juice.
I have a few friends who have gotten their wives pregnate while on a cycle.
Sounds like I will or should be switching from test to clomid. I have also heard adding HCG to my test will get me to produce sperm.
Gutterpump
Banned
Have you tried adding HMG along with HCG and then getting a sperm count? I apologize if it's already been mentioned here, but I was under the impression that HMG is necessary to replace FSH for a healthy, or higher sperm count.
HMG should raise production of sperm, HCG should raise natty production of test. Both are needed for healthy amount of sperm from my knowledge.
HMG should raise production of sperm, HCG should raise natty production of test. Both are needed for healthy amount of sperm from my knowledge.
corndog
Member
My results came back that I am producing 0 sperm. My test levels are in the upper part of normal, LH and FSH so low I thought the numbers were wrong.
What about getting off the test and starting something hcg/hmgclomid or something to get my boys working again. Is it possible to go from 0 sperm to producing enough to have a kid.
What about getting off the test and starting something hcg/hmgclomid or something to get my boys working again. Is it possible to go from 0 sperm to producing enough to have a kid.
Gutterpump
Banned
If you're willing to do an AI, then I'm sure it can happen. Def speak to a urologist / fertility specialist first though. HMG/HCG might be able to have you to the point of conceiving naturally.
JanSz
Well-known member
If your are using external testosterone, that will drive LH and FSH to zero.
There is no need to test for LH and FSH while on testosterone.
Plus most often the sperm would be at zero after a while in absence of LH and FSH.
If you are using Testosterone and want to procreate, then you should use HCG and possibly also HMG.
If you are using testosterone without HCG for long time, starting on HCG will revive testicles, physical sze within about a month, physiologically it takes probably longer.
You may want to consider plan like this:
Testosterone shots EOD, every other day.
Testosterone dose, as much as it takes to get BAT~575
HCG-380iu EOD on days between T shots
Liquidex- EOD on days of T shot, dose adjusted so E2 is at FreeE2(0.6 - 0.7)
If she is not pregnant within three monts after you reached
BAT~575
FreeE2(0.6 - 0.7)
add HMG-75iu every day (expensive)
give this another six monts.
Hope that works, if not, think of other alternatives.
Use this tests at Quest Diagnostics to guide you
Estradiol, Free, LC/MS/MS (36169X)
Testosterone, Free, Bio/Total (LC/MS/MS)
Dihydrotestosterone, Free, Serum (36168X)
-------------------
Because the project is about procreation,
do not use HCG older than 2 weeks.
There is Pregnyl-1500
it would be the best in this situation since the last shot would happen on day 6.
PumpDogg
Member
Yes I did it Corndog.. I was tested 3 times.. with ZERO count.. I have fathered 5 since that time.. so yes it can be done.. Just find someone to work with you and not against you