Running Serm inverse to ADT??

[DR.D]

... I have heard negative things when using an AI for PCT, such as Letro/Aromasin.

It's cool to use a steroidal AI like Aromasin, RXT, RR or Teslac, just not an enzyme inhibitor for PCT (letro, dex, keto). The inhibitor class shuts down steroid biosynthesis so it's counter productive. An AI can be helpful especially toward the end of the PCT when test levels get high again. That's when you phase out the SERM and finish with the AI instead. Helps avoid rebound too.

 

[RenegadeRows]

It's cool to use a steroidal AI like Aromasin, RXT, RR or Teslac, just not an enzyme inhibitor for post cycle therapy (letro, dex, keto). The inhibitor class shuts down steroid biosynthesis so it's counter productive. An AI can be helpful especially toward the end of the post cycle therapy when test levels get high again. That's when you phase out the SERM and finish with the AI instead. Helps avoid rebound too.

Thanks Dr D!

Do you recommend a different protocol when using progestin-inducing compounds such as TRN, Pheraplex or Deca? Should Nolvadex not be used with these compounds? Would Tore be a better option, because it does not upregulate the PgR?

I have a case of gyno from puberty that I don't feel like making worse with Nolva with post cycle therapy for pheraplex. Thanks again.

I'm thinking about using Rebound Reloaded and also a SERM because of my pre-existing gyno. Please help.

 

[US-Marine]

Dr.D after you answer his question, mind just telling me what is our best way to protect our liver during a cycle? Milk thistle is not so great it seems. I'm running cycle support and Liv52


thank you.

 

[DR.D]

Thanks Dr D!

Do you recommend a different protocol when using progestin-inducing compounds such as TRN, Pheraplex or Deca? Should Nolvadex not be used with these compounds? Would Tore be a better option, because it does not upregulate the PgR?

I have a case of gyno from puberty that I don't feel like making worse with Nolva with post cycle therapy for pheraplex. Thanks again.

I'm thinking about using Rebound Reloaded and also a SERM because of my pre-existing gyno. Please help.

No, I don't use a different protocol really. Estradiol is what really upregulates PgR on cycle and causes the more problems. As long as you keep estrogen down, you're good to go in my experience. I've gotten gyno from using test with no AI on several unfortunate occasions and on PP once too, but never on tren or deca. Actually, both tren and deca (non-17aa progestins) seem to help a little with gyno. It makes sense to me because progesterone is antagonistic to estrogen as long as estrogen is kept low or progesterone is not abnormally high. I've used over 1000mg deca/wk before no prob, and 150mg tren ace/d with no probs either and never had a hint of gyno. Nips may get a little puffy, but never that bad. Tor is a great option, but I would save it for PCT and use an AI on cycle. Also, I did use Nolva on the PP cycle and it did work to totally clear up the gyno in 2-3wks. I caught it early and didn't let it get outta control, plus I stopped the PP immediately and added RXT too. I really hate Nolva, but I didn't have any tor or RR at the time. Clomid works well too and is much faster acting for PCT purposes, but it takes a few weeks longer to clear up gyno than Nolva, so I use a Nolva PCT when I have to abort a cycle because of gyno. If it happened now, I would definitely use a tor/RR combo because my last PCT was awesome using that stack and I suspect it will work just as well with less sides than Nolva/RXT for gyno too.

 

[DR.D]

Dr.D after you answer his question, mind just telling me what is our best way to protect our liver during a cycle? Milk thistle is not so great it seems. I'm running cycle support and Liv52


thank you.

I think MT from most companies is basically a joke, but it would work much better if good sources were used. NOW brand 80% standardized is in the form of "silymarin flavonoids". There are a least 6-8 major ones, so it may not even contain 2% of the main one with all the studies. It doesn't seem to be too consistent with it's benefits on my bloodwork and its of marginal improvement even then it seems. There is a USP supplement protocol for standardized Milk Thistle, but I don't think any company does the testing. The label may say GMP compliant or HPLC verified, but the test method is not listed as USP that I have seen, so I don't know how good the test really is that they're using. The European Pharmacopeia (EP) has some good, high standardized stuff, but US companies just don't use the high powered stuff I guess. It would probably bet a bit pricey for most users so they would not use it anyway, so they sell it cheap and people actually hope it works and buy a lot of it that way. Higher doses of a good, standardized high potency source would probably work though. I’m not sure what Liv52 has in it. Do you have a link?

There are so many good things out there that could be used as hepatoprotectants. I have told DS that they should sell a liver supp and I'd make it really good and effective with new, previously unmarketed ingredients that are far superior to what's out there now, but they probably won't if there's not enough interest in it. Email your DS reps, insist on a new liver support supp! Cycle Support looks pretty good by AI/CES, but I have not tried it yet. It's an all in one type product as the name implies, so it does not actually focus on the liver. If LMD would send me a few bottles, I'd be glad to try it though. That's my shameless hint for a freebie to try! I spend enough on supps as it is! (lol) For liver, I personally use flax, lecithin, NAC, all the common anti-oxidants including L-Selenomethionine, and MTE too with highly androgenic orals only.

 

[US-Marine]

I think MT from most companies is basically a joke, but it would work much better if good sources were used. NOW brand 80% standardized is in the form of "silymarin flavonoids". There are a least 6-8 major ones, so it may not even contain 2% of the main one with all the studies. It doesn't seem to be too consistent with it's benefits on my bloodwork and its of marginal improvement even then it seems. There is a USP supplement protocol for standardized Milk Thistle, but I don't think any company does the testing. The label may say GMP compliant or HPLC verified, but the test method is not listed as USP that I have seen, so I don't know how good the test really is that they're using. The European Pharmacopeia (EP) has some good, high standardized stuff, but US companies just don't use the high powered stuff I guess. It would probably bet a bit pricey for most users so they would not use it anyway, so they sell it cheap and people actually hope it works and buy a lot of it that way. Higher doses of a good, standardized high potency source would probably work though. I’m not sure what Liv52 has in it. Do you have a link?

There are so many good things out there that could be used as hepatoprotectants. I have told DS that they should sell a liver supp and I'd make it really good and effective with new, previously unmarketed ingredients that are far superior to what's out there now, but they probably won't if there's not enough interest in it. Email your DS reps, insist on a new liver support supp! Cycle Support looks pretty good by AI/CES, but I have not tried it yet. It's an all in one type product as the name implies, so it does not actually focus on the liver. If LMD would send me a few bottles, I'd be glad to try it though. That's my shameless hint for a freebie to try! I spend enough on supps as it is! (lol) For liver, I personally use flax, lecithin, NAC, all the common anti-oxidants including L-Selenomethionine, and MTE too with highly androgenic orals only.

Thanks for the info pal. Here's the link for Liv52. Very cheap. was $12

Invalid Link Removed

 

[ripped218]

Thanks for the info pal. Here's the link for Liv52. Very cheap. was $12

Invalid Link Removed

I have used Liv52 with good results,on cycle, and in PCT.

 

[DR.D]

Thanks for the info pal. Here's the link for Liv52. Very cheap. was $12

Invalid Link Removed

Thanks for the link Marine. The doses look a bit low, but it's got some interesting, novel ingredients. I'll have to give it a try.

 

[ABiLiTY]

Sorry havn't got back to you guys in a bit.

My doctor called back on monday with the results. he said i had nothing to worry about. So i guess everything is ok.

Dr. D at what piont would you terminate a cycle due to gyno?

 

[Lithuanian Bear]

No, I don't use a different protocol really. Estradiol is what really upregulates PgR on cycle and causes the more problems. As long as you keep estrogen down, you're good to go in my experience. I've gotten gyno from using test with no AI on several unfortunate occasions and on PP once too, but never on tren or deca. Actually, both tren and deca (non-17aa progestins) seem to help a little with gyno. It makes sense to me because progesterone is antagonistic to estrogen as long as estrogen is kept low or progesterone is not abnormally high. I've used over 1000mg deca/wk before no prob, and 150mg tren ace/d with no probs either and never had a hint of gyno. Nips may get a little puffy, but never that bad. Tor is a great option, but I would save it for post cycle therapy and use an AI on cycle. Also, I did use Nolva on the PP cycle and it did work to totally clear up the gyno in 2-3wks. I caught it early and didn't let it get outta control, plus I stopped the PP immediately and added RXT too. I really hate Nolva, but I didn't have any tor or RR at the time. Clomid works well too and is much faster acting for post cycle therapy purposes, but it takes a few weeks longer to clear up gyno than Nolva, so I use a Nolva PCT when I have to abort a cycle because of gyno. If it happened now, I would definitely use a tor/RR combo because my last PCT was awesome using that stack and I suspect it will work just as well with less sides than Nolva/RXT for gyno too.

Doc,

I assume RR stands for rebound reloaded what does tor stand for? also why do you use MTE with only highly androgenic orals what is MTE for that mater anyway LOL is it Mik thistle extract???Does the androgenicity have anything to to with liver toxicity? I thought the alteration of the carbon atom at the 17th position is what makes is more passible through the liver hence that is what is the damaging thing to your liver .

 

[RenegadeRows]

Doc,

I assume RR stands for rebound reloaded what does tor stand for? also why do you use MTE with only highly androgenic orals what is MTE for that mater anyway LOL is it Mik thistle extract???Does the androgenicity have anything to to with liver toxicity? I thought the alteration of the carbon atom at the 17th position is what makes is more passible through the liver hence that is what is the damaging thing to your liver .

Well, I think I can answer some of your questions.

MTE is Milk Thistle Extract.
Tor is Toremifene which is a SERM alternative to Tamoxifen.

Liver protection such as Milk thistle is a good idea with ANY oral, as any oral taken passes through the liver (the bodys natural filter.) Methylated oral steroids are very harsh on the liver. I don't beleive the androgenicity has very much to do with liver damage, but I could be mistaken.

 

[osr436]

Everyone

I have a question. I've followed Dr. D protocol listed below, I follow everything excepted adding the DHEA. This past Monday (three days ago) I finished the Nolva and today I'm noticing itch nipples. Currently I have one more week on the RXT.

Do I need to continue the Nolva and Stop the RXT?

I was on 4 week cycle of TRN.


wk1: Clomid 150mg/d, RXT 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 75mg/d
wk2: Clomid 100mg/d, RXT 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 50mg/d
wk3: Nolva 60mg/d, RXT 50mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 25mg/d
wk4: Nolva 40mg/d, RXT 50mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d
wk5: Nolva 20mg/d, RXT 75mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d
wk6: RXT 75mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d

 

[RenegadeRows]

Everyone

I have a question. I've followed Dr. D protocol listed below, I follow everything excepted adding the DHEA. This past Monday (three days ago) I finished the Nolva and today I'm noticing itch nipples. Currently I have one more week on the RXT.

Do I need to continue the Nolva and Stop the RXT?

I was on 4 week cycle of TRN.


wk1: Clomid 150mg/d, RXT 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 75mg/d
wk2: Clomid 100mg/d, RXT 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 50mg/d
wk3: Nolva 60mg/d, RXT 50mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 25mg/d
wk4: Nolva 40mg/d, RXT 50mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d
wk5: Nolva 20mg/d, RXT 75mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d
wk6: RXT 75mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d

I'm wondering, how itchy are they? Because my nipples itch occasionally, maybe 3 times a day, due to hair irritation or whatnot.

But when I got gyno in puberty, it felt like I had a mosquito bite that would not go away. They were constantly itching. Just wondering

 

[osr436]

RenegadeRows

I'm not sure, to me my nipples don't seem right. I might let it go a day or so, (maybe I'm paranoid). I have all the stuff ready to go, so if it doesn't get better I'll start the nolva again.

My libido is good. Not through the roof, but good. So my concern would be is my Test high and converting into estrogen? So maybe stopping the RXT would be smart since it does increase the test levels.

I'll keep you guys posted and thanks for the quick response.

osr436

 

[RenegadeRows]

RenegadeRows

I'm not sure, to me my nipples don't seem right. I might let it go a day or so, (maybe I'm paranoid). I have all the stuff ready to go, so if it doesn't get better I'll start the nolva again.

My libido is good. Not through the roof, but good. So my concern would be is my Test high and converting into estrogen? So maybe stopping the RXT would be smart since it does increase the test levels.

I'll keep you guys posted and thanks for the quick response.

osr436

IF your using Nolvadex gyno should not be popping up unless its progestin related. I would just end my PCT and see if by 'ending' your body returns itself to normal. Alot of times on cycle and PCT I'll think my nipples aren't right, psyche myself out, but once I'm off cycle they feel fine.

 

[osr436]

I think you're right, I'm going to give it a few days. Stop the RXT and see how I feel.

I'll keep you guys posted, just in case anyone else has the same problem. I do think Dr. D protocol was great. I will say that I noticed a big change using the Clomid. It seem to get me going again.

I don't think it progestin related.

osr436

 

[Lithuanian Bear]

RenegadeRows

I'm not sure, to me my nipples don't seem right. I might let it go a day or so, (maybe I'm paranoid). I have all the stuff ready to go, so if it doesn't get better I'll start the nolva again.

My libido is good. Not through the roof, but good. So my concern would be is my Test high and converting into estrogen? So maybe stopping the RXT would be smart since it does increase the test levels.

I'll keep you guys posted and thanks for the quick response.

osr436

Trust me the RXT won't cause gyno it could only help against it...while it you are right it does increase test. it does it by lowering estrogen too much estrogen is what causes gyno
so the RXT will only help battle it. Just my 2 cents...

 

[DR.D]

... Dr. D at what piont would you terminate a cycle due to gyno?

If it's in the first half of the cycle or I don't think I can manage it the rest of the way, I'll stop. Sometime it can be stopped so you can finish the cycle but if it's an aggressive case just abort.

 

[DR.D]

... why do you use MTE with only highly androgenic orals what is MTE for that mater anyway LOL is it Mik thistle extract???Does the androgenicity have anything to to with liver toxicity? I thought the alteration of the carbon atom at the 17th position is what makes is more passible through the liver hence that is what is the damaging thing to your liver .

MTE is an anti-androgen, plus the androgenic potentcy of a compound strongly correlates to liver toxicity in the 17aa class, so MTE may help with any oral but probably mainly with more androgenic stuff. If you run a search, I've broken it down in several threads before how this all works.

 

[DR.D]

Everyone

I have a question. I've followed Dr. D protocol listed below, I follow everything excepted adding the DHEA. This past Monday (three days ago) I finished the Nolva and today I'm noticing itch nipples. Currently I have one more week on the RXT.

Do I need to continue the Nolva and Stop the RXT?

I was on 4 week cycle of TRN.


wk1: Clomid 150mg/d, RXT 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 75mg/d
wk2: Clomid 100mg/d, RXT 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 50mg/d
wk3: Nolva 60mg/d, RXT 50mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 25mg/d
wk4: Nolva 40mg/d, RXT 50mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d
wk5: Nolva 20mg/d, RXT 75mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d
wk6: RXT 75mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d

If you still have some RXT, keep taking 1 a day just to be safe, but you don't want anymore Nolva. Let me know if it turns into something more in the next few days or week. I think you're alright though.

 

[GettinSwol]

I'm planning on starting my first pheradrol cycle next week. Here's what I plan ON:

PP - 10/20/30/30 - 1 morning dose pre-wo & 1 afternoon dose
AX Perfect Cycle - 2 doses/day
RYR - 1.2g/day w/ food
COQ10 - 30mg 2-3x/day w/RYR
Policosanol - 20mg 2x/day
Milk Thistle & Hawthorne Berry

I'm still adjusting my PCT but here's what I have planned so far (until reading this post)
Nolvadex - 40/40/20/20
AX post cycle therapy - 4/4/2/2 caps
Fenugreek - 3/4/5/6 caps
Milk Thistle & Saw Palmetto

Now I'm planning on getting a bottle of activate and starting it around week three, as well as adding a cortisol blocker like LXT but I'm thinking it might be a good idea to invert the Serm & ADT.
Any suggestions?

 

[somewhatgifted]

I'm planning on starting my first pheradrol cycle next week. Here's what I plan ON:

PP - 10/20/30/30 - 1 morning dose pre-wo & 1 afternoon dose
AX Perfect Cycle - 2 doses/day
RYR - 1.2g/day w/ food
COQ10 - 30mg 2-3x/day w/RYR
Policosanol - 20mg 2x/day
Milk Thistle & Hawthorne Berry

I'm still adjusting my post cycle therapy but here's what I have planned so far (until reading this post)
Nolvadex - 40/40/20/20
AX post cycle therapy - 4/4/2/2 caps
Fenugreek - 3/4/5/6 caps
Milk Thistle & Saw Palmetto

Now I'm planning on getting a bottle of activate and starting it around week three, as well as adding a cortisol blocker like LXT but I'm thinking it might be a good idea to invert the Serm & ADT.
Any suggestions?

There are 100 posts atleast specifically saying how to invert serm / AI as well as the exact cycle as yours with detailed PCT. the post before yours has a great PCT.

 

[GettinSwol]

There are 100 posts atleast specifically saying how to invert serm / AI as well as the exact cycle as yours with detailed post cycle therapy. the post before yours has a great PCT.

Yeah. I'm researching this forum which seems to have a lot more information pertaining to my needs than to the forum that I've been frequenting. I don't have clomid but I saw this example of a PCT which I think might be a good idea

Week 1 Nolvadex 40 mg
Week 2 Nolvadex 40 mg
Week 3 Nolvadex 20 mg 75 mg atd
Week 4 Nolvadex 20 mg 50 mg ATD
Week 5 50 mg ATD
Week 6 25 mg ATD
Week 7 25 mg ATD

with AX PCT as my ATD

 

[somewhatgifted]

Yeah. I'm researching this forum which seems to have a lot more information pertaining to my needs than to the forum that I've been frequenting. I don't have clomid but I saw this example of a post cycle therapy which I think might be a good idea

Week 1 Nolvadex 40 mg
Week 2 Nolvadex 40 mg
Week 3 Nolvadex 20 mg 75 mg atd
Week 4 Nolvadex 20 mg 50 mg ATD
Week 5 50 mg ATD
Week 6 25 mg ATD
Week 7 25 mg ATD

with AX PCT as my ATD

YOur not goona runn ATD and serm inversely?
EG
week 1 Nolvadex 40 mg
Week 2 Nolvadex 40 mg
Week 3 Nolvadex 20 mg 25 mg ATD
Week 4 Nolvadex 20 mg 25 mg ATD
Week 5 50 mg ATD
Week 6 75 mg ATD

 

[GettinSwol]

I copied that plan from post #17 on Invalid Link Removed
which was approved by a couple other members

I thought it made sense because you introduce the ADT when the amound of Serm is being decreased, and there's no immediate ADT drop off at the end, but obviously you know what you're talking about. I'm just here to learn, and judging by this 20+ page post, there's gotta be something to it

 

[yeahright]

with AX post cycle therapy as my ATD

AX's PCT doesn't contain ATD. It contains a different chemical sometimes called mATD or ADED. It's been described as methylated ATD. It's a different chemical (one I happen to like better than regular ATD). Just an FYI. Invalid Link Removed

 

[GettinSwol]

AX's post cycle therapy doesn't contain ATD. It contains a different chemical sometimes called mATD or ADED. It's been described as methylated ATD. It's a different chemical (one I happen to like better than regular ATD). Just an FYI. Invalid Link Removed

I read that on the site, and on the bottle, but didn't recognize that it was a completely different compound. I'm guessing that it should be used in the same manner as an ATD correct?

Luckily the only questions that I really have are about PCT which is more than a month away or I would be getting nervous now. That gives me enough time to figure which of the three PCT schedules I'm gonna run

 

[yeahright]

I read that on the site, and on the bottle, but didn't recognize that it was a completely different compound. I'm guessing that it should be used in the same manner as an ATD correct?

Luckily the only questions that I really have are about post cycle therapy which is more than a month away or I would be getting nervous now. That gives me enough time to figure which of the three post cycle therapy schedules I'm gonna run

Well, they describe it as an "analogue" of ATD so it's chemcically similar but distinct. Yes, it's used largely like ATD but the claim is that you just need to dose once a day (or at least that's what it said on the ALRI version before they licensed it to AX).

 

[GettinSwol]

Well, they describe it as an "analogue" of ATD so it's chemcically similar but distinct. Yes, it's used largely like ATD but the claim is that you just need to dose once a day (or at least that's what it said on the ALRI version before they licensed it to AX).

Sound's like I got the right stuff... Now to figure out how to use it! j/k

 

[ABiLiTY]

Dr D

I just realized today that i am lactating again. It might be because ive been checking (not squeezing) on\ around my nipples for the lumps that have gone down considerably since i started using letro at 2.5mcg ED (1 week now). I have been using cabergoline at about 250mcg eod, im probably going to bump it back up to 1mg ED. Though the lumps have gone down, my nipples have gotten pretty puffy recently and i have some numbness from time to time. I don't seem to have any fat anywhere on my pecs though still.

I dropped the sdrol after 7.5 days, and continued prop at 100mg eod and masteron at 100mg eod when i got the word from my doctor that everything checked out ok.

Im 3 weeks in and would like to continue for another 3. If my nipps dont improve by the end of this week i think i'm going to drop the prop and finish the last 2 weeks just on masteron.

I just ordered some rebound xt which has been the best for my gyno in the past.

Let me know what you think.

Thanks again.

 

[ABiLiTY]

its wierd. my left nipple has a a small lump but barley any puffyness. and my right nipple barley has a lump, very small and actually to the inside of my nipple, but gets pretty puffy at some pionts in a day.

 

[DR.D]

I copied that plan from post #17 on Invalid Link Removed
which was approved by a couple other members

I thought it made sense because you introduce the ADT when the amound of Serm is being decreased, and there's no immediate ADT drop off at the end, but obviously you know what you're talking about. I'm just here to learn, and judging by this 20+ page post, there's gotta be something to it

The abrupt cut off is just one method. Initiating AI therapy half way though is just a watered down version of the inverse taper and will probably be just as effective in many cases. It sticks to the same principle and people are different and respond to different things so don't rule it out. I've used similar protocols with equal effectiveness. It just depends on all the factors.

 

[DR.D]

its wierd. my left nipple has a a small lump but barley any puffyness. and my right nipple barley has a lump, very small and actually to the inside of my nipple, but gets pretty puffy at some pionts in a day.

Your doc did check your thyroid and TSH right? I don't know anymore Ability. Your case requires constant bloodwork because something weird is going on. It may just cause you hassles on cycle or it may turn out to be more malicious. Also, I think 1mg of cab/day is just way too much. You may start hallucinating after a week or so. I think it's time you phase it all out again and we go back to the drawing board with you.

 

[ABiLiTY]

he checked my tsh and thyroid. came out in the normal range.
is .500 mg cab ED to much?

 

[DR.D]

he checked my tsh and thyroid. came out in the normal range.
is .500 mg cab ED to much?

OK. Yes, I think that's too much cab. The only reason to use cab daily is for Parkinson's and certain other dopaminergic mental conditions. As far as prolactin suppression, it is probably not useful more often that EOD.

 

[GettinSwol]

The abrupt cut off is just one method. Initiating AI therapy half way though is just a watered down version of the inverse taper and will probably be just as effective in many cases. It sticks to the same principle and people are different and respond to different things so don't rule it out. I've used similar protocols with equal effectiveness. It just depends on all the factors.

Understood. I think I'm most likely going to take that route & introduce my AI two weeks into my PCT, then taper down like I originally posted

 

[supersize77]

Well, they describe it as an "analogue" of ATD so it's chemcically similar but distinct. Yes, it's used largely like ATD but the claim is that you just need to dose once a day (or at least that's what it said on the ALRI version before they licensed it to AX).

Does AX PCT shut down the libido like RXT (since it's just an "analogue" og ATD)?

 

[yeahright]

Does AX post cycle therapy shut down the libido like RXT (since it's just an "analogue" og ATD)?

Well, I think the talk about RXT libido shutdown is kinda overblown. At high doses, SOME people experience this....but you've got to remember that your hormones are all screwed up while in post cycle therapy anyway so blaming low libido on the AI may be blaming an entirely inaccurate target (doesn't HPTA shutdown due to the cycle seem like a more likely suspect?).

I've never expereinced libido issues related to AI use.

However, with that said, I seem to react BEST to the AI in AX's post cycle therapy in comparison to the other popular OTC AIs....recovering quickest. Your mileage may vary.

 

[ABiLiTY]

Dr.D

I've been using cab for 11 weeks now. for the majority of the time i was using .500mcg ed. right now im doing.250mcg eod.
I'm still lactating, only when i'm out in the sun though.

 

[somewhatgifted]

Dr.D

I've been using cab for 11 weeks now. for the majority of the time i was using .500mcg ed. right now im doing.250mcg eod.
I'm still lactating, only when i'm out in the sun though.

Out in the sun, certain times a day, only in one nipple.....
Men arent supposed to lactate when hormonaly sound, after 11+ weeks you continue to use hormone altering substances.
But seem to attribute it to weird phenomena out of your control. Why dont you stop cycling for atleast 6 months.
Are you A) rediculed due to your inferior muscle mass? B) A competative bodybuilder? C) A strength athlete?. If you cant say yes to any of those why risk your health and lactate when you could lift, eat, and prosper. I know you were adressing DR.d and hes a great guy willing to help, but man get off the damn hormones and youll stop lactating. short cuts in the short term for health, lead to large obstacles and dark paths in the future.

 

[DR.D]

Dr.D

I've been using cab for 11 weeks now. for the majority of the time i was using .500mcg ed. right now im doing.250mcg eod.
I'm still lactating, only when i'm out in the sun though.

I have to agree with Somewhatgifted. Photo induced lactation is just bizarre. Something is very wrong and it sounds way outta my range of expertise. I've done lots of stupid things that I've had to heal myself from 100 times before, but I have no clue in this case. I think you need a good endo and stop taking all hormones ASAP. If your prolactin secretion has become autonomous, you need some pituitary imaging done for sure to rule out tumor.

 

[RenegadeRows]

I agree man...you should stop using gear if you still are...11 weeks is a long time, personally i wouldve seen a doctor by now. sure it might be embarassing but its what doctors are there for. hell, i spend alot of money on health insurance and i'll damn well use it when i have to.

 

[ABiLiTY]

Ok, I've stopped taking hormones.

Now, should i continue taking rxt? Letro? cab?
should i start taking nolva? or anything else?

i also have hcg, but thats probably not neccesary or the best idea.

As far as supplements, what can i use?
Nac, milkthistle, flax\fish oil, creatine, fat burners, albuterol?

Things like jungle warfare, REm, and noexpload should be ruled out right?

I appreciate all your help.

My photo shoot is done, i can stop being stupid now.

 

[somewhatgifted]

Ok, I've stopped taking hormones.

Now, should i continue taking rxt? Letro? cab?
should i start taking nolva? or anything else?

i also have hcg, but thats probably not neccesary or the best idea.

As far as supplements, what can i use?
Nac, milkthistle, flax\fish oil, creatine, fat burners, albuterol?

Things like jungle warfare, REm, and noexpload should be ruled out right?

I appreciate all your help.

Educate yourself, knowing your own body gives you the best insight to make your own informed decisions. Go to a doctor explain what youve been doing and what its been doing to you. Make your own conclusions , informed conclusions, getting advice is one thing but you should be absorbing information and tweaking to individual specifics. Preventatory thinking beats reactory measures, knowing you had a prolactin or pituitary or whatever problem, causing lactation what the first clue you should get off of prohormones. "Those of us who find true success learn, life is not about the mistakes you make, its about not making the same ones over and over again." swg

 

[ABiLiTY]

thanx somewhatgifted.

When i first went to my doctor to start getting blood work like 3 monthes ago or so, i told him about what had been going on, showed him the lumps he felt them etc. He pretty much didn't want to hear it, and just said stop taking everything.

 

[ABiLiTY]

Im going to post some pictures, see what you guys think visually.

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[DR.D]

I really can't see any lumps man.

 

[wmarti7]

Dr. D
In the not so distant fututre i am planning on a halo 50 cycle. I have read all the posts on what people have used for pct. Mixed reviews of course. Checking to see if you might be willing to chime in on what you think is a good pct. I know some use nolve some don't and so on. I am starting to get the pct suff lined up so i don't drain my pocket at one time. I know the support supps, just wanted to knoe if you thought nolva is must, I know i will have it on hand. thanks for the help

 

[Fearhk213]

Jmh80 is correct. It can be used solo during post cycle therapy, but I think it may have it's best applications at the end of PCT leading into a off-cycle supp. Basically, something you just stay on whenever you're not cycling, which the RXT is not as suitable for. RXT is mildly anti-androgenic (unlike RR) in a dose dependent fashion, so it's best suited for on-cycle testicular maintenance and early PCT. At least on paper, in reality it may not make a huge difference, but RR is more libido supportive that ATD for sure and is just as effective if not better that ATD for test elevation. Also, the sense of well being is a common report by the beta testers. Twin, SS and I all experienced it too during the alpha testing. I haven't been keeping up with the logs so well, but Twin also noted immediate improvement in his pre-existing gyno with it's use. I am very excited by this stuff.

Don't be fooled by cheap knock-off products being released at the same time. The potency of RR is unparalleled because of the focus on isomer ratios. It makes a huge difference with this compound, so don't go cheap on it. Same thing with 7-OH for that matter. Be careful with cheap bulk sources, because you get what you pay for in these cases! I've tested these materials so much in the last year, that I can honestly say that without sounding like I'm pimpin' DS.

Even so, DS does have some good quality stuff.

I haven't posted on here in a while, but I've been doing a bit of reading to get my ducks in a row for a Pheradrol/Mega-Zol stack in 1 to 2 months for a clean bulk. I have previous ph experience but I haven't touched any in about a year (info: 5'11", 27, 218 @ 12%bf, ). I'm planning on AI's Cycle Support for pre, during, post and other support supps but I'm not going to be getting into that on this thread.

My question is in regards to using Rebound Reloaded while "on" and during the "inverse" taper PCT, but I'll briefly lay out my cylce/pct plan and goals.
Here's my cycle plan:
wk1: 10 P/ 100 Zol
wk2: 20 P/ 100 Zol
wk3: 20 P/ 150 Zol
wk4: 30 P(might stay @ 20) / 150 Zol
or
wk1: 10 P
wk2: 20 P
wk3: 20 P/ 100 Zol
wk4: 30 P/ 100 Zol
wk5: 150 Zol
wk6: 150 Zol

PCT
wk-1: ACT half
wk1: 120 torm/ACT full/fen 3/Retain 3
wk2: 90-120 torm/ACT full/fen 4/Retain 3
wk3: 60-90 torm/ACT full/fen 5/Retain 3
wk4: 30-60 torm/ACT full/fen 6/Retain 3
wk5: 30 torm/ACT full/Retain 2
wk6: 30 torm/ACT half/Retain 1-2
(I'm planning on adding RR in here aswell, but is everything ok so far for both the 4 and 6 week cycles?)
I hope to come away with 10 lbs (at the least) of lean body mass after PCT and keep a consistent sex life while "on" and during PCT.

I've been researching RR, but I've come up rather confused in its application. I hear it's supposed to replace RXT and be better, but it seems there are some things to RXT that are better. So here are my questions:

-I want to (a)keep shutdown as minimal as possible(testicular maintenance), (b)keep any "on" cycle gyno at bay, and (c)keep the sex life consistent during cycle. So I was planning on running RXT (25mg-50mg) while "on" in hopes to achieve this. Now I understand RXT is discountinued, and after reading the above post it seems RR may not be able to do this. If RR can't do the above, any recommendations what to do instead? If I misunderstood and RR can do all this, how would I dose it while "on"?

-How do you utilize RR in the "inverse" taper with torm?

Thanks in advance.

 

[ABiLiTY]

you cant see any lumps visually, never could. the one on my right nipp is probably half the size of a tic tac. This is by far the worst my nipples have ever looked. There puffier and larger in diameter. the puffyness is something that recently occured.

This is why i continued to take supps\gear along with anti e's and stuff. I always looked fine, even though they look much worse then they ever have.

I injected last on sat, should i do tonight thurs and sat and finish out the 6 weeks i had planned?