Quality Protein Powder

Good discussion in here...

The biggest things I care about in a protein is purity and a blend. I personally use a blend of whey and casein post workout.

I dont use a protein powder as my carb source. I just add in my own carbs. They are cheap.

Sometimes I will just mix my whey and casein with 8-12oz of skim milk
 
Good discussion in here...

The biggest things I care about in a protein is purity and a blend. I personally use a blend of whey and casein post workout.

I dont use a protein powder as my carb source. I just add in my own carbs. They are cheap.

Sometimes I will just mix my whey and casein with 8-12oz of skim milk

For sure:

Doing a casein/whey mix with SAN's new proteins.

Would like to include PES protein soon.
 
A few years ago I used to buy 5lb of whey and 5lb of casein and would mix them post workout. Haven't bought a jug of casein for about 4 years now and always buy a protein with a blend. Just finished two jugs of Dymatize which were pretty good.

I am sure PES Protein will take over for my protein powder needs when it comes out :)
 
I like to mix my proteins. I'll do XF Whey (Arctic Lemonade) mixed with a scoop of XF UP Lemon Cream Pie. This whey I get both my isolates, concentrates, and caseins. Plus it tastes good.

I like mixing VPX SRO Graham Cracker with XP UP Cinnamon Roll. I like having whey too much fun.
 
I like to mix my proteins. I'll do XF Whey (Arctic Lemonade) mixed with a scoop of XF UP Lemon Cream Pie. This whey I get both my isolates, concentrates, and caseins. Plus it tastes good.

I like mixing VPX SRO Graham Cracker with XP UP Cinnamon Roll. I like having whey too much fun.

I see what you did there :)
 
Hmmm i didnt see that one

It was in Europe. Why I don't like about the Dymatize issue is they post the test, and where it was tested, but not why and what company sent the bottles to the testing company.

Was it a competitor? Was it truly Dymatizes product.
 
WPC is arguably the best protein source as it has the most peptide fractions.



Look into PROnom, excellent flavors, no added glycine/taurine to pad the numbers. Good number of servings as well :)
 
With time! Got so much we are working on. We nailed down one flavor...working on a second

Did this white tubs on Facebook contain flavoring samples? ;)

Or, a new product?

Either way, put me down for a truck load.

WPC is arguably the best protein source as it has the most peptide fractions.

Look into PROnom, excellent flavors, no added glycine/taurine to pad the numbers. Good number of servings as well :)

It's cheaper, too. If one doesn't have any lactose problems, it is really the best value option (instead of purchasing a pure isolate product).
 
WPC is arguably the best protein source as it has the most peptide fractions.



Look into PROnom, excellent flavors, no added glycine/taurine to pad the numbers. Good number of servings as well :)

WPC Doesn't hold a candle to what MPI offers (best of both worlds) and comparing differences between WPC and WPI is splitting hairs..
 
WPC Doesn't hold a candle to what MPI offers (best of both worlds) and comparing differences between WPC and WPI is splitting hairs..

Speaking of splitting hairs
 
Look into PROnom, excellent flavors, no added glycine/taurine to pad the numbers. Good number of servings as well :)

But what is up with the first ingredient under "other ingredients":

Nutritional Creamer (Sunflower Oil, Corn Syrup Solids, Sodium Caseinate, Mono & Diglycerides, Dipotassium Phosphate, Tri-Calcium Phosphate and Tocopherols)

This is the 3rd "trick" lobbied in the first post that some sneaky/bad proteins include:

"3. Many add creamers, corn syrup, corn starch, glucose polymers etc which are generally bad for your health"

Googling Corn Syrup Solids, I read the following in a link:

Corn syrup, corn syrup solids, and high fructose corn syrup (as well as crystalline fructose) are all made from corn, and bottom line, all are sugar. So, first off, because they’re sugar, my opinion is that they are all damaging to your health, just because sugar is so damaging.

Each of these ingredients will give you cravings for more sugar, and foods that list high fructose corn syrup, corn syrup, or fructose as one of their top 4 ingredients are overeating traps. These ingredients actually interfere with a hormone that tells your brain that you’re full! Therefore, it’s very common to overeat on foods that contain HFCS (or even the latter two).

Actually, in my experience, it’s easy to overeat on foods that contain any kind of processed sugar, or even foods high in natural sugar. The difference with HFCS, corn syrup, and fructose is that they stop the communication between your stomach and your brain until it’s too late and you’ve already overeaten.
 
You have yet to realize that the first post is marketing material by a company in this thread, not an actual scientific publication.


That scientific correlation is tenuous at best, even HFCS has been shown to be metabolized in a similar manner as regular fructose.
 
Last edited:
You have yet to realize that the first post is marketing material by a company in this thread, not an actual scientific publication.


That scientific correlation is tenuous at best, even HFCS has been shown to be metabolized in the same manner as regular sugar.

Actually the first post in the thread is my own, and I'm unaffiliated with anyone. I RECEIVED some marketing material, but was interested not in that particular company's product until it hits the market more and I see pricing and feedback, but in searching the full gamut of the market to see what "healthy" protein powders are already out & are being sold vs. those which use tricks and bad ingredients in their formulas.

I'm sitting on 2 powders that I'm no longer going to use because of the crap I found in them once I actually knew enough to look at the "other ingredients". I only bought them because they were on sale. Now I'm more focused on finding an inexpensive, healthy protein powder.
 
Actually the first post in the thread is my own, and I'm unaffiliated with anyone. I RECEIVED some marketing material, but was interested not in that particular company's product until it hits the market more and I see pricing and feedback, but in searching the full gamut of the market to see what "healthy" protein powders are already out & are being sold vs. those which use tricks and bad ingredients in their formulas.

I'm sitting on 2 powders that I'm no longer going to use because of the crap I found in them once I actually knew enough to look at the "other ingredients". I only bought them because they were on sale. Now I'm more focused on finding an inexpensive, healthy protein powder.



I would be very careful in blindly accepting vague information from a marketing publication as fact.

If you want a "natural" protein, you should really go Kaizen.
 
I would be very careful in blindly accepting vague information from a marketing publication as fact.

If you want a "natural" protein, you should really go Kaizen.

I hear you on that, but still, I know barely enough to know that if there are options aside from voluntarily ingesting corn syrup, I'll probably try to find an alternative. Not that I didn't ingest it before, the protein I have now has it in there. But I'd rather avoid it if possible.

In terms of Kaizen, I'll look into it. First search came back that they sell it in Canadian Costcos and I'm seeing some version being sold in *** for $80/5 lbs. Are there any other options to purchase it if you are aware?
 
I hear you on that, but still, I know barely enough to know that if there are options aside from voluntarily ingesting corn syrup, I'll probably try to find an alternative. Not that I didn't ingest it before, the protein I have now has it in there. But I'd rather avoid it if possible.

In terms of Kaizen, I'll look into it. First search came back that they sell it in Canadian Costcos and I'm seeing some version being sold in *** for $80/5 lbs. Are there any other options to purchase it if you are aware?

None that I trust that I can think of off hand
 
Heavily marketed products with long write ups should always get extra scrutiny from consumers. Over the years, I have found that some of the simplest and least marketed products and ingredients are usually the hidden gems that give the most bang for the buck.
 
Basically fails all 3. 1st ingredient is misc WPC, includes Taurine as its next largest ingredient aside from protein, and has corn syrup solids



These are extremely poor criteria for judging how good a protein is. Many of the best on the market use WPC.
 
These are extremely poor criteria for judging how good a protein is. Many of the best on the market use WPC.

Not saying its perfect. But it's 3 criteria. From a health perspective, what would 3 from you be? And not all WPC = bad, several mentioned in this thread as quality powders have WPC as #1 but still look great.
 
You have yet to realize that the first post is marketing material by a company in this thread, not an actual scientific publication.


That scientific correlation is tenuous at best, even HFCS has been shown to be metabolized in the same manner as regular sugar.

Are you sure?

before i go on, What is "regular sugar"?
 
Not saying its perfect. But it's 3 criteria. From a health perspective, what would 3 from you be? And not all WPC = bad, several mentioned in this thread as quality powders have WPC as #1 but still look great.

its scientific fact that the combination of protein (fast and slow) is superior to whey or casein alone, that is not debatable.
 
I hear you on that, but still, I know barely enough to know that if there are options aside from voluntarily ingesting corn syrup, I'll probably try to find an alternative. Not that I didn't ingest it before, the protein I have now has it in there. But I'd rather avoid it if possible.

In terms of Kaizen, I'll look into it. First search came back that they sell it in Canadian Costcos and I'm seeing some version being sold in *** for $80/5 lbs. Are there any other options to purchase it if you are aware?

Here is a good read..

Invalid Link Removed

Fructose, on the other hand, is more rapidly metabolized in the liver, flooding metabolic pathways and leading to increased triglyceride synthesis and fat storage in the liver. This can cause a rise in serum triglycerides, promoting an atherogenic lipid profile and elevating cardiovascular risk. Increased fat storage in the liver may lead to an increased incidence in non-alcoholic fatty liver disease, and this is one of several links between HFCS consumption and obesity as well as the metabolic syndrome.7
Fructose may have less impact on appetite than glucose, so processed foods rich in fructose can contribute to weight gain, obesity, and its related consequences by failing to manage appetite.20 Additionally, loading of the liver with large amounts of fructose leads to increased uric acid formation, which may contribute to gout in susceptible individuals.7
 
How so? Digestion rates are totally different and so is composition. Reduce some of the fat and lactose from WPC and you have WPI.


Honestly, it's not really worth it to me to answer each question individually as you have a vested interest in pushing your products.

WPC is the gold standard for a reason, it cant be beat in the grand scheme for price and effectiveness. Sure WPI and MPI are nice for those that are lactose intolerant, but it wont yield any better results. Most people can handle WPC just fine, and for those that wish...they have those other options. Digestion rates are irrelevant in the grand scheme as far as body comp goes. Saying not to buy WPC or suggesting it's poor quality is laughable.

Vilifying fructose makes no sense. Within moderation its fine, it wont increase appetite...in fact, it appears to have a suppressive effect if anything. For those of you who actually would like to learn a little about fructose/hfcs and how they relate to health:
Invalid Link Removed


Should we limit the amount of sugars we intake? Absolutely. Should we freak out if a protein has it? Absolutely not. It can very easily be managed into a diet with no health issues.


Here is a good read..

Invalid Link Removed

You should really take some time to read the link above. What you havent mentioned is the dose dependent nature.
 
Honestly, it's not really worth it to me to answer each question individually as you have a vested interest in pushing your products.

WPC is the gold standard for a reason, it cant be beat in the grand scheme for price and effectiveness. Sure WPI and MPI are nice for those that are lactose intolerant, but it wont yield any better results. Most people can handle WPC just fine, and for those that wish...they have those other options. Digestion rates are irrelevant in the grand scheme. Saying not to buy WPC or suggesting it's poor quality is laughable.

Vilifying fructose makes no sense. Within moderation its fine, it wont increase appetite...in fact, it appears to have a suppressive effect if anything. For those of you who actually would like to learn a little about fructose/hfcs and how they relate to health:
Invalid Link Removed


Should we limit the amount of sugars we intake? Absolutely. Should we freak out if a protein has it? Absolutely not. It can very easily be managed into a diet with no health issues.




You should really take some time to read the link above.

You are not pushing a product?
 
You are not pushing a product?

I think people have enough info from above to make an informed decision. We can leave it at that. If anyone has any questions, feel free to PM me.
 
I would just like to add, I support quality protein sources from companies that don't cut corners. Also, just received my USPLABS OxyElite protein, only one request. Please offer bigger tub sizes, 25 servings (not criticizing just suggesting) doesn't really last that long. :)
 
Honestly, it's not really worth it to me to answer each question individually as you have a vested interest in pushing your products.WPC is the gold standard for a reason, it cant be beat in the grand scheme for price and effectiveness. Sure WPI and MPI are nice for those that are lactose intolerant, but it wont yield any better results. Most people can handle WPC just fine, and for those that wish...they have those other options. Digestion rates are irrelevant in the grand scheme as far as body comp goes. Saying not to buy WPC or suggesting it's poor quality is laughable.Vilifying fructose makes no sense. Within moderation its fine, it wont increase appetite...in fact, it appears to have a suppressive effect if anything. For those of you who actually would like to learn a little about fructose/hfcs and how they relate to health:Invalid Link RemovedShould we limit the amount of sugars we intake? Absolutely. Should we freak out if a protein has it? Absolutely not. It can very easily be managed into a diet with no health issues.You should really take some time to read the link above. What you arent grasping, or conveniently leaving out...is the dose dependent nature
fructose should come from fruits not from your protein. HFCS has no nutritional value just a caloric load and that goes for most processed sugars. If you can avoid, you should. Protein powders also contain hydrogenated fats, are you proposing that is also acceptable in moderation? Probably but rather i get it from a snickers bar not my protein powder.
 
OxyElite Protein aside, if you are drinking whey or casein, you should combine them and not drink them separately.
 
True^^^Adulterated Dietary Supplements

In addition, even if your product listed above was not an unapproved new and misbranded drug, it and the other products distributed under your firm's label would be adulterated dietary supplements within the meaning of section 402(g)(1) of the Act [21 U.S.C. § 342(g)(1)] in that the dietary supplements have been prepared, packed, or held under conditions that do not meet the requirements set forth in the Current Good Manufacturing Practice (CGMP) in Manufacturing, Packaging, or Holding Operations for Dietary Supplements regulation, Title 21, Code of Federal Regulations, Part 111, (21 CFR Part 111).

Based on the records reviewed during this inspection, your firm sends raw materials to contract manufacturers who manufacture (b)(4) dietary supplements including Jack3d, OxyElite Pro, Prime, and Super Cissus various packaging configurations and flavors, and then return the finished products to USPlabs for distribution under your firm's own label. As a dietary supplement distributor that contracts with another contract manufacturer to manufacture dietary supplement under your firm's name, your firm is ultimately responsible for complying with the requirements relating to manufacturing operations [see 72 Fed. Reg. 34752, 34790; June 25, 2007]. Your firm has an obligation to know what and how manufacturing activities are performed so that you can make decisions related to whether your dietary supplement products conform to established specifications and whether to approve and release the products for distribution.

Furthermore, we received your firm's written responses with attachments from Lorena Macias, Quality Assurance and Quality Control Director, dated March 14 and June 1, 2012, to the Form FDA 483 (inspectional observations) that was issued to your firm at the conclusion of the inspection on February 21, 2012. We respond to your firm's written responses, below.

Specific violations are as follows:

1. Your firm failed to establish and follow written procedures, as required by 21 CFR 111.553, for the review and investigation of product complaints, as required by 21 CFR 111.560(c). Specifically, your firm's revised procedures related to product complaints in your written procedures entitled "Consumer Complaints (QA-020)" submitted in your March 14, 2012 response to the FDA-483 do not account for the requirements of 21 CFR 111.560(c) in that the procedures do not provide written instructions that quality control personnel review and approve decisions about whether to investigate a product complaint and review and approve the findings and follow-up action of any investigation performed.

2. Your firm failed to establish product specifications for the identity and purity of the finished batch of dietary supplement, and for limits on those types of contamination that may adulterate, or that may lead to adulteration of, the finished batch of dietary supplement to ensure the quality of the dietary supplement, as required by 21 CFR 111.70(e). For each dietary supplement you have manufactured, it is your firm's responsibility to establish product specifications for limits on those types of contamination that may adulterate, or that may lead to adulteration of the finished batch of the dietary supplement, as required by 21 CFR 111.70(e). As stated in the final rule (72 FR 34752 at 34837; June 25, 2007), "the manufacturer has the responsibility to determine what types of contamination are likely or certain to contaminate a given product and to determine what types of tests to conduct and when to test for such contamination."

Based on information in your supplier's COAs for certain raw materials, chemicals and pesticides are likely or certain to contaminate these raw materials; however, your firm did not establish specifications related to chemicals and pesticides for products that contain these raw materials, including Jack3d Lemon Lime, OxyElite Pro, and Prime.

Your firm's March 14 and June 1, 2012 responses, including attachments, were reviewed and determined to be inadequate. The product specification sheets you provided for many of your dietary supplement products, including Jack3d Lemon Lime, OxyElite Pro, and Prime were inadequate because the product specifications sheets failed to include identity and purity specifications for these products. You also failed to include any specifications related to chemical and pesticides listed on these sheets.

3. Your firm's quality control operations for the master manufacturing record (MMR) failed to include reviewing and approving all master manufacturing records and all modifications to the master manufacturing records, as required by 21 CFR 111.123(a)(1). Specifically, our review of your Jack3d Master Formula revealed that it was not approved by your quality control operations.

Your firm's March 14 and June 1, 2012 responses were reviewed and determined to be inadequate. Your response included your firm's Standard Operating Procedures (SOP) # QA-036, Finished Dietary Supplement Formula and MMR Approval, which indicates that your contract manufacturers submit all product formulas and master manufacturing records for review and approval. However, your response did not include an MMR reviewed and approved for Jack3d.

4. Your firm did not conduct at least one appropriate test or examination to verify the identity of a component that is a dietary ingredient, prior to its use, as required by 21 CFR 111.75(a)(1)(i). Your firm supplies its contract manufacturer with raw materials, including dietary ingredients, which are used by another manufacturer in the manufacture of your firm's dietary supplements; however, our investigators found that you did not conduct at least one test or examination to verify the identity of such dietary ingredients, as required by 21 CFR 111.75(a)(1).

Instead, your firm relied on Certificates of Analysis (COA) from your suppliers.

A COA from a supplier may not be used to verify the identity of any component that is a dietary ingredient [see 21 CFR 111.75(a)]. Specifically, your firm supplies (b)(4) dietary ingredients to its contract manufacturer for the use in production of two of your own label dietary supplement products, Jack3d and OxyELITE Pro. Your firm routinely receives and accepts (b)(4) incoming dietary ingredients into its facility with accompanying Certificates of Analysis and does not verify the identity of these dietary ingredients before sending them to the contract manufacturer for use in the manufacture of your own label dietary supplement products.

Before using a component that is a dietary ingredient, you must conduct at least one appropriate test or examination to verify the identity of any component that is a dietary ingredient, unless you have petitioned FDA for an exemption from such testing, consistent with the requirements in 21 CFR 111.75(a)(1)(ii), and FDA has granted such petition. Your firm has not petitioned FDA for such an exemption.

Furthermore, if you would like to rely on a certificate of analysis from the supplier of the components (other than dietary ingredients) you receive for use in your firm's dietary supplement products to confirm the identity of such components, you must comply with the requirements in 21 CFR 111.75(a)(2)(ii).

5. Your firm's quality control personnel failed to approve or reject all processes, written procedures, controls, tests and examinations, and deviations from or modifications to them, that may affect the identity, purity, strength, or composition of a dietary supplement, as required by 21 CFR 111.105(a). For example, your firm's quality control personnel did not approve testing methods for (b)(4)

Your firm's March 14 and June 1, 2012 responses were reviewed and determined to be inadequate. You indicated that your Quality Assurance and Quality Control Director will review all test methods, but you did not provide any supporting documentation that any test methods were actually reviewed by your Director.

6. Your firm's master manufacturing record (MMR) for the dietary supplement product Jack3d failed to identify specifications for the points, steps, or stages in the manufacturing process where control is necessary to ensure the quality of the dietary supplement and that the dietary supplement is packaged and labeled as specified in your MMR, as required by 21 CFR 111.205(b)(1). In addition, your firm's MMR for this product failed to establish controls and procedures to ensure that each batch of dietary supplements that you manufacture meets the specifications identified, as required by 21 CFR 111.205(b)(2)

Invalid Link Removed

Cliff notes? Jesus that's long lol
 
I personally don't feel WPC is a terribly inferior protein. The arguement could be made, as mentioned, that the less processing of the product (WPC vs. WPI vs HydroWhey) might have its advantages.

I don't think Non-Dairy creamer should be part of a quality protein product. Nor should sodium casienate. Also, I think its nice to see many of the companies offering products with natural sweeteners.
 
True^^^Adulterated Dietary Supplements

In addition, even if your product listed above was not an unapproved new and misbranded drug, it and the other products distributed under your firm's label would be adulterated dietary supplements within the meaning of section 402(g)(1) of the Act [21 U.S.C. § 342(g)(1)] in that the dietary supplements have been prepared, packed, or held under conditions that do not meet the requirements set forth in the Current Good Manufacturing Practice (CGMP) in Manufacturing, Packaging, or Holding Operations for Dietary Supplements regulation, Title 21, Code of Federal Regulations, Part 111, (21 CFR Part 111).

Based on the records reviewed during this inspection, your firm sends raw materials to contract manufacturers who manufacture (b)(4) dietary supplements including Jack3d, OxyElite Pro, Prime, and Super Cissus various packaging configurations and flavors, and then return the finished products to USPlabs for distribution under your firm's own label. As a dietary supplement distributor that contracts with another contract manufacturer to manufacture dietary supplement under your firm's name, your firm is ultimately responsible for complying with the requirements relating to manufacturing operations [see 72 Fed. Reg. 34752, 34790; June 25, 2007]. Your firm has an obligation to know what and how manufacturing activities are performed so that you can make decisions related to whether your dietary supplement products conform to established specifications and whether to approve and release the products for distribution.

Furthermore, we received your firm's written responses with attachments from Lorena Macias, Quality Assurance and Quality Control Director, dated March 14 and June 1, 2012, to the Form FDA 483 (inspectional observations) that was issued to your firm at the conclusion of the inspection on February 21, 2012. We respond to your firm's written responses, below.

Specific violations are as follows:

1. Your firm failed to establish and follow written procedures, as required by 21 CFR 111.553, for the review and investigation of product complaints, as required by 21 CFR 111.560(c). Specifically, your firm's revised procedures related to product complaints in your written procedures entitled "Consumer Complaints (QA-020)" submitted in your March 14, 2012 response to the FDA-483 do not account for the requirements of 21 CFR 111.560(c) in that the procedures do not provide written instructions that quality control personnel review and approve decisions about whether to investigate a product complaint and review and approve the findings and follow-up action of any investigation performed.

2. Your firm failed to establish product specifications for the identity and purity of the finished batch of dietary supplement, and for limits on those types of contamination that may adulterate, or that may lead to adulteration of, the finished batch of dietary supplement to ensure the quality of the dietary supplement, as required by 21 CFR 111.70(e). For each dietary supplement you have manufactured, it is your firm's responsibility to establish product specifications for limits on those types of contamination that may adulterate, or that may lead to adulteration of the finished batch of the dietary supplement, as required by 21 CFR 111.70(e). As stated in the final rule (72 FR 34752 at 34837; June 25, 2007), "the manufacturer has the responsibility to determine what types of contamination are likely or certain to contaminate a given product and to determine what types of tests to conduct and when to test for such contamination."

Based on information in your supplier's COAs for certain raw materials, chemicals and pesticides are likely or certain to contaminate these raw materials; however, your firm did not establish specifications related to chemicals and pesticides for products that contain these raw materials, including Jack3d Lemon Lime, OxyElite Pro, and Prime.

Your firm's March 14 and June 1, 2012 responses, including attachments, were reviewed and determined to be inadequate. The product specification sheets you provided for many of your dietary supplement products, including Jack3d Lemon Lime, OxyElite Pro, and Prime were inadequate because the product specifications sheets failed to include identity and purity specifications for these products. You also failed to include any specifications related to chemical and pesticides listed on these sheets.

3. Your firm's quality control operations for the master manufacturing record (MMR) failed to include reviewing and approving all master manufacturing records and all modifications to the master manufacturing records, as required by 21 CFR 111.123(a)(1). Specifically, our review of your Jack3d Master Formula revealed that it was not approved by your quality control operations.

Your firm's March 14 and June 1, 2012 responses were reviewed and determined to be inadequate. Your response included your firm's Standard Operating Procedures (SOP) # QA-036, Finished Dietary Supplement Formula and MMR Approval, which indicates that your contract manufacturers submit all product formulas and master manufacturing records for review and approval. However, your response did not include an MMR reviewed and approved for Jack3d.

4. Your firm did not conduct at least one appropriate test or examination to verify the identity of a component that is a dietary ingredient, prior to its use, as required by 21 CFR 111.75(a)(1)(i). Your firm supplies its contract manufacturer with raw materials, including dietary ingredients, which are used by another manufacturer in the manufacture of your firm's dietary supplements; however, our investigators found that you did not conduct at least one test or examination to verify the identity of such dietary ingredients, as required by 21 CFR 111.75(a)(1).

Instead, your firm relied on Certificates of Analysis (COA) from your suppliers.

A COA from a supplier may not be used to verify the identity of any component that is a dietary ingredient [see 21 CFR 111.75(a)]. Specifically, your firm supplies (b)(4) dietary ingredients to its contract manufacturer for the use in production of two of your own label dietary supplement products, Jack3d and OxyELITE Pro. Your firm routinely receives and accepts (b)(4) incoming dietary ingredients into its facility with accompanying Certificates of Analysis and does not verify the identity of these dietary ingredients before sending them to the contract manufacturer for use in the manufacture of your own label dietary supplement products.

Before using a component that is a dietary ingredient, you must conduct at least one appropriate test or examination to verify the identity of any component that is a dietary ingredient, unless you have petitioned FDA for an exemption from such testing, consistent with the requirements in 21 CFR 111.75(a)(1)(ii), and FDA has granted such petition. Your firm has not petitioned FDA for such an exemption.

Furthermore, if you would like to rely on a certificate of analysis from the supplier of the components (other than dietary ingredients) you receive for use in your firm's dietary supplement products to confirm the identity of such components, you must comply with the requirements in 21 CFR 111.75(a)(2)(ii).

5. Your firm's quality control personnel failed to approve or reject all processes, written procedures, controls, tests and examinations, and deviations from or modifications to them, that may affect the identity, purity, strength, or composition of a dietary supplement, as required by 21 CFR 111.105(a). For example, your firm's quality control personnel did not approve testing methods for (b)(4)

Your firm's March 14 and June 1, 2012 responses were reviewed and determined to be inadequate. You indicated that your Quality Assurance and Quality Control Director will review all test methods, but you did not provide any supporting documentation that any test methods were actually reviewed by your Director.

6. Your firm's master manufacturing record (MMR) for the dietary supplement product Jack3d failed to identify specifications for the points, steps, or stages in the manufacturing process where control is necessary to ensure the quality of the dietary supplement and that the dietary supplement is packaged and labeled as specified in your MMR, as required by 21 CFR 111.205(b)(1). In addition, your firm's MMR for this product failed to establish controls and procedures to ensure that each batch of dietary supplements that you manufacture meets the specifications identified, as required by 21 CFR 111.205(b)(2)

Invalid Link Removed

:yawn: old news.
 
Lets stay on topic.

Critique and criticism has its place as we're discussing bad products in search of the good.

But stick to protein powder. And no unneeded jabs at any particular company, stick to the ingredients in the protein. Thanks.
 
I can't believe no one has brought up ON gold standard and casein since its such a popular company.
 
I can't believe no one has brought up ON gold standard and casein since its such a popular company.

I have not looked at ON proteins in years so I am unsure of their quality but populatity has nothing to do with quality. Many of the protein powders mentioned in this thread are quite popular but are also filled with non-dairy creamers and other inferior ingredients.
 
The IronMag Labs WPI is pretty clean and sweetened with Stevia. Persoanlly I didn't like the vanilla very much.

The Species Nutrition WPI is pretty solid as well.
 
Back
Top