NEW Brand coming to AM. Time for some new blood.

Hyde

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The energy drink contains an -amine ;)
Really clean and 100% natural.

The pre has something else. I dont want to mention much but its effects are similar to ephedrine but potentially a bit stronger. We will see soon. This one also is 100% natural.

We put alot of time into making these come to life. You guys will for sure be happy. These are legit natural compounds with all the punch of old school stims or better.
Geranium extract was my favorite natural compound
 
brundel

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Geranium extract was my favorite natural compound
Are we talking DMAA or actual geranium extract?
I like DMAA but it cranks up my Blood pressure like nothing else.
 
Hyde

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Are we talking DMAA or actual geranium extract?
I like DMAA but it cranks up my Blood pressure like nothing else.
Both lol. I believe the only study that ever found DMAA in geranium was funded by USP Labs or the like.

Yeah I can’t really use it effectively any more; the bp increase is greater than the performance payout.
 
brundel

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Yah man I honestly dont think DMAA is natural.
The 2 we are working with are for certain present in plants. 1 we have tested because data was sparse and the other has been found in its parent plant numerous times.
I also agree.....I liked DMAA but I think its important to remember when we use stims in pre workout products we have to balance benefit/risk ratio. I think lots of companies either dont care so long as people buy the product, or, have lost site of the purpose of a pre workout. The purpose of making a pre workout product is not to sell them. Its to improve the performance of the user. And, large doses of stims are counter productive. I know this is redundant ....

At any rate, I have some good news.
We have been successful and stimulant 2 is ready. Should be en route to me shortly and we will run some initial tests for efficacy and potency etc. But I think we will have a new pre with a new stim by summer for sure.
Probably also a new fat burner with a few interesting new ingredients.

BLR might also have a new anabolic which is great.
Gonna chop this and start a new post.
 
brundel

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Now that we are getting close to launch lets discuss pre workout products.
What do you expect when you take a pre workout supp?
What do you WANT TO expect, meaning if you could create the perfect pre how would it work?
What is working in current formulas and what is either counterproductive or just there for fluff and show?

We plan to give you something that is so much better than present products that you will have no doubt.
 
brundel

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Really appreciate this and applaud your efforts and intent.

I wish every company would make this their goal.
Thanks man. Blr and Antaeus have been around a decade or more and both have really tried to contribute to the industry with new ingredients. NEOTEK will be the best of both brands plus some new tricks .

You will notice after 10 years blr still doesn't have a pre workout mix other than han swolo which is stim free pump. The reason is I just didn't feel like I could make something that would really be better. Could have made one that was good yah but something that really just dominates.....not until now.
Wait till you guys see. Or should I say feel.
 
Hyde

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Now that we are getting close to launch lets discuss pre workout products.
What do you expect when you take a pre workout supp?
What do you WANT TO expect, meaning if you could create the perfect pre how would it work?
What is working in current formulas and what is either counterproductive or just there for fluff and show?

We plan to give you something that is so much better than present products that you will have no doubt.
I want something to be increase my energy, drive, focus, improve mood, while also not significantly driving my heart rate (which is exhausting and makes a lot of thing counterproductive after a point). I definitely care more about the stimulation/energy aspect than enhanced pump, as I train for strength. But that doesn’t mean I want a stim bomb at all; many ingredients that I feel are actually good in certain contexts aren’t useful in a preWO for me at all. Synephrine is a good example, Yohimbine et all, too much “Eria Jarensis” extract.

Hydration is also a big plus, but that can be a hard sell because most people don’t really understand that. You’re more likely to lose sales for having an effective dose of sodium in the tub from the uneducated than getting new customers who heard about the sweet pumps customers were getting. Taurine is still a great ingredient always in my opinion that is cheap and helpful. But this category is a little wishful thinking probably.

Basically I want stims/nootropics to help me get & stay in the zone, choline, anything that promotes acute strength and general athletic readiness. I want motivation in a tub that doesn’t feel like a heart attack in a tub

Anything that acutely raises endurance is sweet too, since people aren’t going to take this daily.
 
Ziyo

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Yah man I honestly dont think DMAA is natural.
The 2 we are working with are for certain present in plants. 1 we have tested because data was sparse and the other has been found in its parent plant numerous times.
I also agree.....I liked DMAA but I think its important to remember when we use stims in pre workout products we have to balance benefit/risk ratio. I think lots of companies either dont care so long as people buy the product, or, have lost site of the purpose of a pre workout. The purpose of making a pre workout product is not to sell them. Its to improve the performance of the user. And, large doses of stims are counter productive. I know this is redundant ....

At any rate, I have some good news.
We have been successful and stimulant 2 is ready. Should be en route to me shortly and we will run some initial tests for efficacy and potency etc. But I think we will have a new pre with a new stim by summer for sure.
Probably also a new fat burner with a few interesting new ingredients.

BLR might also have a new anabolic which is great.
Gonna chop this and start a new post.
Damnnn
How is the anabalic going to compare to androgin/Follidrone/vector?
 

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I’ll also add at this stage I’m looking for a combination of ingredients that’s better than just drinking a creatine/bcaa product and a can of Monster. Way way way too many products have almost exactly the same formula, 300 mg caffeine and a few moderate pump ingredients.

I want to feel great and ready to work out without feeling a queasy, lightheaded rush. For whatever reason, I loved the feeling from the new Mesomorph but feel pretty icky on the new DVST8.

I do also appreciate slightly less caffeine (not 400mg) so I don’t have to worry about Diet Coke and tea, etc throughout the morning.

Looking forward to something new regardless
 
brundel

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I want something to be increase my energy, drive, focus, improve mood, while also not significantly driving my heart rate (which is exhausting and makes a lot of thing counterproductive after a point). I definitely care more about the stimulation/energy aspect than enhanced pump, as I train for strength. But that doesn’t mean I want a stim bomb at all; many ingredients that I feel are actually good in certain contexts aren’t useful in a preWO for me at all. Synephrine is a good example, Yohimbine et all, too much “Eria Jarensis” extract.

Hydration is also a big plus, but that can be a hard sell because most people don’t really understand that. You’re more likely to lose sales for having an effective dose of sodium in the tub from the uneducated than getting new customers who heard about the sweet pumps customers were getting. Taurine is still a great ingredient always in my opinion that is cheap and helpful. But this category is a little wishful thinking probably.

Basically I want stims/nootropics to help me get & stay in the zone, choline, anything that promotes acute strength and general athletic readiness. I want motivation in a tub that doesn’t feel like a heart attack in a tub

Anything that acutely raises endurance is sweet too, since people aren’t going to take this daily.
Yah I agree there really needs to be a balance. Most dont understand the things that really improve performance. Sure some caffeine helps but when we start adding all these other stims that are mostly vasoconstrictors its counterproductive.
The key with stims is understanding that not all are created equal. Caffeine is also a PDE inhibitor and this helps offset some of the negatives.
I do think 500-1000mg sodium is really helpful but it also really cramps any flavoring options.
 
brundel

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Damnnn
How is the anabalic going to compare to androgin/Follidrone/vector?
We will see. The first tester is on its way. Generally speaking each product has its own mechanism of action. This is why stacking Foll, Vector and androgin is so strong. They all do different things. The ingredients we are looking at look very good though.
 
brundel

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Looking at alot of these products I have noticed something that seems pretty standard.
Many will have 15 ingredients or more but only the stims are there in viable doses. Like 1g creatine or 1-2g citrulline.
This is of course because many users dont know that 1g creatine isnt a clinical dose and 2g citrulline is just a waste.

I think it makes more sense to be very select with regards to ingredients. Its better to not have something at all than to add it for the sole purpose of tricking customers.
 
Hyde

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Looking at alot of these products I have noticed something that seems pretty standard.
Many will have 15 ingredients or more but only the stims are there in viable doses. Like 1g creatine or 1-2g citrulline.
This is of course because many users dont know that 1g creatine isnt a clinical dose and 2g citrulline is just a waste.

I think it makes more sense to be very select with regards to ingredients. Its better to not have something at all than to add it for the sole purpose of tricking customers.
Very solid points. Especially when it also just takes up space requiring a bigger container and still does raise your production bottom line. And things like creatine aren’t as cheap these days anyway, so that investment to trick the uneducated isn’t even as lucrative.
 
brundel

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Very solid points. Especially when it also just takes up space requiring a bigger container and still does raise your production bottom line. And things like creatine aren’t as cheap these days anyway, so that investment to trick the uneducated isn’t even as lucrative.
Another good one is citrulline. How many pres out there have citrulline? 95%?
Now, how many have the clinical dose which starts around 6g? 20% Maybe? Why add 2g citrulline...again to trick customers.
Presently we are debating vasodilators. We know there are better options that Citrulline. Between BLR and Antaeus we have some really strong ones we are already using. It comes down to cost vs reward. And, not all vasodilators work the same way and not all work universally, meaning, some are great for peripheral vasodilation like skin and extremities and some are great for major arteries. Some are cerebral and some are pulmonary etc. So we want to give you guys the best balance possible to deliver blood to muscles, mind, lungs etc. This isnt citrulline. Its a blend of different vasos with different MOAs.
 
brundel

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Do you guys think a pre workout product has to have things like creatine, citrulline, beta alanine?
For example there are vastly better vasodilators that citrulline but everyone uses citrulline because they dont really formulate they just buy the standard from a manufacturer.
I mean literally.....if you pull up the formulas for the top 20 pre workout products they are all 95% the same.
 
Afi140

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Do you guys think a pre workout product has to have things like creatine, citrulline, beta alanine?
For example there are vastly better vasodilators that citrulline but everyone uses citrulline because they dont really formulate they just buy the standard from a manufacturer.
I mean literally.....if you pull up the formulas for the top 20 pre workout products they are all 95% the same.
No. Definitely not. Bring the innovation. Every pre is the same these days. (No beta alanine please! )
 
Rocket3015

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Do you guys think a pre workout product has to have things like creatine, citrulline, beta alanine?
For example there are vastly better vasodilators that citrulline but everyone uses citrulline because they dont really formulate they just buy the standard from a manufacturer.
I mean literally.....if you pull up the formulas for the top 20 pre workout products they are all 95% the same.
I like these things in my pre, but I am open to something new !
 

N2ofusion

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Do you guys think a pre workout product has to have things like creatine, citrulline, beta alanine?
For example there are vastly better vasodilators that citrulline but everyone uses citrulline because they dont really formulate they just buy the standard from a manufacturer.
I mean literally.....if you pull up the formulas for the top 20 pre workout products they are all 95% the same.
That describes every single PWO on Amazon. Definitely hoping for something new all around
 
Kronic

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Do you guys think a pre workout product has to have things like creatine, citrulline, beta alanine?
For example there are vastly better vasodilators that citrulline but everyone uses citrulline because they dont really formulate they just buy the standard from a manufacturer.
I mean literally.....if you pull up the formulas for the top 20 pre workout products they are all 95% the same.
can it have your quercetin-niacin crystals ? not sure what they taste like
 
PoSiTiVeFLoW

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Another good one is citrulline. How many pres out there have citrulline? 95%?
Now, how many have the clinical dose which starts around 6g? 20% Maybe? Why add 2g citrulline...again to trick customers.
Presently we are debating vasodilators. We know there are better options that Citrulline. Between BLR and Antaeus we have some really strong ones we are already using. It comes down to cost vs reward. And, not all vasodilators work the same way and not all work universally, meaning, some are great for peripheral vasodilation like skin and extremities and some are great for major arteries. Some are cerebral and some are pulmonary etc. So we want to give you guys the best balance possible to deliver blood to muscles, mind, lungs etc. This isnt citrulline. Its a blend of different vasos with different MOAs.
Take my money already! :)

Seriously though, I think more preworkouts need product differentiation to be in the way of better pump ingredients + improved energy (clean+smooth, long lasting energy - not like Adderall or caffeine OD) + cerebral boost (strongly nootropic, happy+focus) would be my wishlist... addon safe, even healthy would be a dream.
 
Segansational

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Do you guys think a pre workout product has to have things like creatine, citrulline, beta alanine?
For example there are vastly better vasodilators that citrulline but everyone uses citrulline because they dont really formulate they just buy the standard from a manufacturer.
I mean literally.....if you pull up the formulas for the top 20 pre workout products they are all 95% the same.
No, certainly doesn't need to have those ingredients if you have something better or more premium to replace it. I'm always looking for something that will hit hard stim wise and make me alert as quickly as possible since I lift early AM. Better if you don't have a crash, but I'm not as picky there. And improves explosive power for strength, which I tend to find goes hand in hand with a strong stim effect. Something that will give a good pump (maybe nitrates or nitrosigine?) if no citrulline, but again that's secondary to me. And no glycerol please. Creatine I tend to take separately anyways, so happy to keep that out.
 
brundel

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can it have your quercetin-niacin crystals ? not sure what they taste like
whats great is that Quercetin is a really solid vasodilator and so is niacin. Also only BLR and Antaeus have this ingredient ;) Quercetin has an extremely poor bioavailability though, until its been modified like a quercetin niacin co crystal. Imagine if these were combined with other vasos like Han Swolo. I will tell you guys that there is Definitely not citrulline in the product.
I think something that is overlooked by formulators is the fact that not all vasodilators work the same and produce the same results. We need a blend of vasos that each work to open blood vessels in different ways.
Just a few for quercetin-
 
brundel

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No. Definitely not. Bring the innovation. Every pre is the same these days. (No beta alanine please! )
This is a good subject.
Basically every pre workout product has beta alanine. It does have benefit of course. What does everyone think about BA?
 
brundel

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I like these things in my pre, but I am open to something new !
Let me ask you a question. Do you think you like these because you are so accustomed to them being in products or because they are the best options available? For example- if someone is accustomed to drinking beer and have never had whisky. They might be hesitant to give up the beer because they are so familiar with it but the whisky has much more punch.
 
Hyde

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This is a good subject.
Basically every pre workout product has beta alanine. It does have benefit of course. What does everyone think about BA?
I think it’s beneficial for people training CrossFit, strongman, or anything routinely over the 30 second threshold. But if you are bodybuilding, powerlifting, or training for more explosive track athletics like throwing, sprinting, jumping etc you’re wasting your money.

My wife competes in strongman, where 60 second event duration is the standard, so it’s a top ingredient we look for with her. Myself training for powerlifting, it’s just unnecessary itching that I avoid it as much as possible.
 

determination

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This is a good subject.
Basically every pre workout product has beta alanine. It does have benefit of course. What does everyone think about BA?
I do not like it. I try to avoid it and most likely won't buy a product with it. Same with any form of yohimbine. I like pre workouts that provide smooth energy and focus, a good pump and good mood. I try to avoid the ones that give me tingles, chills and anxiety.
 
Rocket3015

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Let me ask you a question. Do you think you like these because you are so accustomed to them being in products or because they are the best options available? For example- if someone is accustomed to drinking beer and have never had whisky. They might be hesitant to give up the beer because they are so familiar with it but the whisky has much more punch.
I think, I/we are comfortable with what we know, but I would love to have something better!!
 
Hyde

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I do not like it. I try to avoid it and most likely won't buy a product with it. Same with any form of yohimbine. I like pre workouts that provide smooth energy and focus, a good pump and good mood. I try to avoid the ones that give me tingles, chills and anxiety.
Well said
 
Kronic

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I don't mind beta alanine, but people who like it should just buy standalone BA and drop it in their pwo. it's cheap and has almost no flavor. also the BA dose in most the PWO is not enough for people who like BA
 
Hyde

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I don't mind beta alanine, but people who like it should just buy standalone BA and drop it in their pwo. it's cheap and has almost no flavor. also the BA dose in most the PWO is not enough for people who like BA
Yeah, it needs to be dosed daily for best effect
 
Rocket3015

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Yeah, it needs to be dosed daily for best effect
and I have found the tingles go away after you use it for awhile
 
Kronic

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and I have found the tingles go away after you use it for awhile
ya I don't really get them anymore. last time I tried 6g BA and no tingle. I'll have to try it again sometime. maybe I'll take it to 9g. 3g definitely no tingle
 
BCseacow83

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I don't mind beta alanine, but people who like it should just buy standalone BA and drop it in their pwo. it's cheap and has almost no flavor. also the BA dose in most the PWO is not enough for people who like BA

From a retailers point of view: You will loose sales without BA more so than you will gain. Most people using pre's don't even know its the BA giving them the tingles but they expect it from a pre. I have had returns because the product "did not work, I didn't get the tingles." Now the product did NOT even have BA but when explained he just looked at me like a deer in headlights.

I understand people not wanting it in their but I'm not sure it's worth loosing sales over. I understand not making a generic run of the mill but the thing does have to sell and it does not matter how great it is if people don't try it.
 
brundel

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From a retailers point of view: You will loose sales without BA more so than you will gain. Most people using pre's don't even know its the BA giving them the tingles but they expect it from a pre. I have had returns because the product "did not work, I didn't get the tingles." Now the product did NOT even have BA but when explained he just looked at me like a deer in headlights.

I understand people not wanting it in their but I'm not sure it's worth loosing sales over. I understand not making a generic run of the mill but the thing does have to sell and it does not matter how great it is if people don't try it.
I think this is an important point.
This is of course why most companies just have the same old stuff. The vast majority of users have no real idea whats in there and thats ok but we feel we have an obligation to do better. We want to appeal to both those who expect xxx and those who want something better. Its hard to fulfill both but I think we can do it.
 
brundel

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I generally don’t buy anything mainstream, fwiw
Yah, personally I just make my own using powders but the majority of users dont do this.
Ideally we could have an arsenal. Like a range of options but thats not really feasible.
The new stuff, I think is going to be exceptional. It will have most of the things people expect, a few nobody expects and better effects than the other products available. Hopefully the best of both worlds.
 
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Looking forward to trying it.
 
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In the next 90 days or so there will be a new brand in the sports nutrition industry.
View attachment 209671
Neotek is a collaboration between myself and the founder of Antaeus.
We will launch with 3 products each one featuring an new trademarked, patented stimulant.
This is not some gentle imperceptible compound. Its VERY good.
This stuff is really solid for Pre workout use and its, I think, the best stimulant fat burner I have used this side of amphetamines. In a fat burning blend its insane.
I know people talk about focus with stims....For me most stims dont really deliver on this. They claim to but its just not there for me at least. This is different. Its like a laser zoomed in.
Also there is 0 crash from this. It has a strong half life and when I take 50mg in the morning with my cup of coffee I am STRONGLY stimulated all day. This has always been a big problem with stims for me. If you take a stim to go train and after an hour it starts to give you crash symptoms this is bad.
I train and go back to work so I cant have something crash me or require a second dose. THis stuff has serious legs and no crash. Not just saying this like everyone else does. You will see.

There will be
PRE
FAT BURNER
STIM BLEND
to start. Followed by a host of really solid novel ingredients. In fact we have about 10 new trademarked and or patented ingredients coming soon but this wont be NEOTEK.

This will be a second company called Philosophers stone.
Supplying ingredients to the sports nutrition and nutraceutical industry.
We have a very stong supply chain in place that bypasses all the issues presently effecting global commerce. A real trick Ill tell you. But we will be offering all manner of novel ingredients including BLR and antaeus components as well as a host of new ones and lots of old standards.
The first 2 trademarked ones will be in the next 90 days.
Brand owners looking to up your game. PM me.

For now, sit tight.
We have a giant batch of the new stim in manufacturing stage. When its ready we will launch so it could be 90 days, maybe 60. We will have to see.
If you have any questions let me know.
So is this you and Jake?
 
FilipeBR

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Following for the fat burner updates and also to offer myself as guinea pig :p
 
brundel

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Stim #2 should be here for testing any day now.
Branding is in progress. I think it looks good. Once we get it done Ill post some stuff.
Looking for the right manufacturer. Its hard post covid because alot of the smaller guys went out of business and the bigger guys dont like to run ingredients they cant supply because they cant mark them up. BS.

We will get it dont one way or another.

The NEOTEK energy drink which features stim #1 is absolutely awe inspiring.
Drinking one right now. Is for sure better than any other energy drink.
 
Rocket3015

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Stim #2 should be here for testing any day now.
Branding is in progress. I think it looks good. Once we get it done Ill post some stuff.
Looking for the right manufacturer. Its hard post covid because alot of the smaller guys went out of business and the bigger guys dont like to run ingredients they cant supply because they cant mark them up. BS.

We will get it dont one way or another.

The NEOTEK energy drink which features stim #1 is absolutely awe inspiring.
Drinking one right now. Is for sure better than any other energy drink.
Sounding Good !!
 
JKVol

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Stim #2 should be here for testing any day now.
Branding is in progress. I think it looks good. Once we get it done Ill post some stuff.
Looking for the right manufacturer. Its hard post covid because alot of the smaller guys went out of business and the bigger guys dont like to run ingredients they cant supply because they cant mark them up. BS.

We will get it dont one way or another.

The NEOTEK energy drink which features stim #1 is absolutely awe inspiring.
Drinking one right now. Is for sure better than any other energy drink.
Is the website up yet?
 

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