Mk667- The No BS Straight Scoop ....

ericos_bob

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
Just my personal experience with MK I hope it helps easing into it. At 5 (actually 6.25mg) i split my 12.5mg capsules I still felt stimulated but mildly so. I felt my legs were tingly the first few days of use and increased appetite. Sleep was doable at this dose. Yes it was restless a couple nights.. I'd dose first thing in the morning. After a few days I didn't feel stimulated at all anymore but gave it 2 weeks before upping the dose. Increasing the dose to 12.5mg I got the same sides as at 6.25mg but equally mild and my body adapts quickly. Additionally I'd get numb hands at times. Surprisingly after increasing to 25mg I'm not noticing much apart from my hands still falling asleep on occasion. As for muscle fullness. Tough to answer but zero weight gain/bloat at any dose for me BUT I'm cutting at the moment so my diet isn't exactly conducive to muscle fullness. Pumps in the gym have been great though, painfully good despite a caloric deficit.
 

CatSnake

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
i'm new here, so I don't know if my link will come through, but there's clinical data that shows Nolva lowers IGF-1 by 25% or so.


FWIW, i used MK677 a while back, and had hoped to have hGH-like effects (losing fat, healing injuries, etc). i did not get those effects.... MK did make my dreams amazing (like a movie!) and made me hungry all the time and hold water. great for a bulk, but not when I was trying to lose weight...
 

muchstronger2

Member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
i'm new here, so I don't know if my link will come through, but there's clinical data that shows Nolva lowers IGF-1 by 25% or so.


FWIW, i used MK677 a while back, and had hoped to have hGH-like effects (losing fat, healing injuries, etc). i did not get those effects.... MK did make my dreams amazing (like a movie!) and made me hungry all the time and hold water. great for a bulk, but not when I was trying to lose weight...
And Exemestane increases IGF-1...we could go on and on with different compounds affecting it but that's not really the topic is it?

When you say "I didn't get those effects": have you already injected 1.5 IUs/day of HGH for 3 months to get a point of comparison?
Everyone thinks it's going to turn you into Hulk, but HGH has far less dramatic effects on body composition than AAS.

Ibutamoren being a mere equivalent of those 1.5IUs daily, within a few months you'll probably lean out a bit, get more intramuscular water and have better skin.
It would also prevent muscle wasting if a disease makes you prone to it or if you are on a chronic negative nitrogen balance.

How long have you been on MK for? The results are not instantaneous.
 

CatSnake

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
And Exemestane increases IGF-1...we could go on and on with different compounds affecting it but that's not really the topic is it?

When you say "I didn't get those effects": have you already injected 1.5 IUs/day of HGH for 3 months to get a point of comparison?
Everyone thinks it's going to turn you into Hulk, but HGH has far less dramatic effects on body composition than AAS.

Ibutamoren being a mere equivalent of those 1.5IUs daily, within a few months you'll probably lean out a bit, get more intramuscular water and have better skin.
It would also prevent muscle wasting if a disease makes you prone to it or if you are on a chronic negative nitrogen balance.

How long have you been on MK for? The results are not instantaneous.

no, Aromasin does not raise IGF1, either. the action of the SERM or anti-estrogen decreases the conversion of IGF1 in the liver.

again, I'm too new to post links, but I've seen plenty of clinical data to show that SERMs and AI's clearly lower IGF1 production. for instance, one can expect a healthy male to have about a 13% drop in IGF1 while taking Aromasin.

the reason I posted that, was in mentioned to a previous posters comment.... apparently I did not use the quote function correctly.

as far as the MK, I ran it for about 4 months.
 
rtmilburn

rtmilburn

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • RockStar
  • Established
no, Aromasin does not raise IGF1, either. the action of the SERM or anti-estrogen decreases the conversion of IGF1 in the liver.

again, I'm too new to post links, but I've seen plenty of clinical data to show that SERMs and AI's clearly lower IGF1 production. for instance, one can expect a healthy male to have about a 13% drop in IGF1 while taking Aromasin.

the reason I posted that, was in mentioned to a previous posters comment.... apparently I did not use the quote function correctly.

as far as the MK, I ran it for about 4 months.
Not true look it up man. Exemestane most definitely increases igf1, same with formastane.
 

CatSnake

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
uhm, no.

I have the study saved on my computer.... Aromasin lowers it 13%. A-dex lowers it 18% and Femara lowers it 15%.

if I could post the links, I would.... when I hit 100 posts I'll come back and update this.
 
The_Old_Guy

The_Old_Guy

Well-known member
Awards
0
Everyone thinks it's going to turn you into Hulk, but HGH has far less dramatic effects on body composition than AAS.
Ibutamoren being a mere equivalent of those 1.5IUs daily, within a few months you'll probably lean out a bit, get more intramuscular water and have better skin. It would also prevent muscle wasting if a disease makes you prone to it or if you are on a chronic negative nitrogen balance.
Bravo - the only people that take GH solo, are old Hollywood actors, and Life Extensionists. Every other 'Big Name' in the BB'ing/Prep Coaching industry (that do podcasts, cuz that's how I get a lot of info) - say GH on its own for Physique purposes, is pretty useless. They equate it to being a "1" solo, but a "1+1=5" when taken with other compounds. Synergy.
 
The_Old_Guy

The_Old_Guy

Well-known member
Awards
0
uhm, no.

I have the study saved on my computer.... Aromasin lowers it 13%. A-dex lowers it 18% and Femara lowers it 15%.

if I could post the links, I would.... when I hit 100 posts I'll come back and update this.
There are probably a few - saying contradictory things... as usual :D But this one is pretty apropos:

Pharmacokinetics and Dose Finding of a Potent Aromatase Inhibitor, Aromasin (Exemestane), in Young Males

Nelly Mauras, John Lima, Deval Patel, Annie Rini, Enrico di Salle, Ambrose Kwok and Barbara Lippe

Nemours Children’s Clinic and Research Programs (N.M., J.L., A.R.), Jacksonville, Florida 32207; and University of Florida Health Sciences Center (D.P.) and Amersham Pharmacia Biotech (E.d.S., A.K., B.L.), Peapack, New Jersey 07977

Suppression of estrogen, via estrogen receptor or aromatase blockade, is being investigated in the treatment of different conditions. Exemestane (Aromasin) is a potent and selective irreversible aromatase inhibitor. To characterize its suppression of estrogen and its pharmacokinetic (PK) properties in males, healthy eugonadal subjects (14–26 yr of age) were recruited. In a cross-over study, 12 were randomly assigned to 25 and 50 mg exemestane daily, orally, for 10 d with a 14-d washout period. Blood was withdrawn before and 24 h after the last dose of each treatment period. A PK study was performed (n = 10) using a 25-mg dose. Exemestane suppressed plasma estradiol comparably with either dose [25 mg, 38% (P 0.002); 50 mg, 32% (P 0.008)], with a reciprocal increase in testosterone concentrations (60% and 56%; P 0.003 for both). Plasma lipids and IGF-I concentrations were unaffected by treatment. The PK properties of the 25-mg dose showed the highest exemestane concentrations 1 h after administration, indicating rapid absorption. The terminal half-life was 8.9 h. Maximal estradiol suppression of 62 ± 14% was observed at 12 h. The drug was well tolerated. In conclusion, exemestane is a potent aromatase inhibitor in men and an alternative to the choice of available inhibitors. Long-term efficacy and safety will need further study.

Abbreviations: AUC, Area under the curve; CBC, cell blood count; HDL, high density lipoprotein; LDL, low density lipoprotein; PK, pharmacokinetic.
 

CatSnake

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
There are probably a few - saying contradictory things... as usual :D But this one is pretty apropos:
Same study below, but with more extrapolated data, I believe... it clearly has a negative effect on IGF-1 levels.

Aromasin

These studies were approved by the Nemours Children’s Clinic clinical research review committee and Baptist Medical Center/Wolfson Children’s Hospital institutional review board. Healthy lean male volunteers between 14–26 yr of age were recruited after giving informed written consent to participate in study I or II (see below). Their clinical characteristics are summarized in Table 1.

Study I: dose finding
Analysis of the data on hormone concentrations after the 25- and 50-mg doses showed no difference in any of the parameters measured due to an order effect; hence, the data were grouped for analysis by dose. The 25- and 50-mg doses of daily exemestane had comparable effects in suppressing circulating estrogen concentrations, with 38 ± 24% (mean ± sd; P = 0.002 vs. baseline) and 32 ± 29% (P = 0.008) decreases in estradiol concentrations, 71 ± 12% (P < 0.0001) and 74 ± 12% (P < 0.0001) decreases in estrone concentrations, and 45 ± 27% (P = 0.004) and 51 ± 20% (P = 0.02) decreases in estrone sulfate concentrations after doses of 25 and 50 mg, respectively. There was an increase in circulating testosterone concentrations after both 25 mg (60 ± 58%; P = 0.001) and 50 mg (56 ± 48%; P = 0.003) exemestane. Androstenedione concentrations were increased as well after 25 mg (32 ± 36%; P = 0.004) and 50 mg (47 ± 59%; P = 0.052) exemestane, respectively (Fig. 1 and Table 2). SHBG concentrations were decreased by 21 ± 7% (P = 0.0003) and 19 ± 39% (P = 0.18) at 25 and 50 mg exemestane, respectively. Free testosterone concentrations were increased by 117 ± 74% (P = 0.0001) and 154 ± 95% (P < 0.0001) at both doses, due to the decrease in SHBG and the increase in total testosterone. No effect on circulating dehydroepiandrosterone sulfate was observed at either dose. Serum cortisol concentrations increased significantly (38 ± 39%; P = 0.008) with the 25-mg dose, but not the 50-mg dose, yet the increase was well within the normal range of cortisol concentrations. Plasma IGF-I decreased significantly (−13 ± 11%; P = 0.008) after the 25-mg dose, but not the 50-mg dose. Similarly, IGF-binding protein-3 showed a trend toward lower concentrations after the 25-mg dose (−7 ± 13%; P = 0.09), but not the 50-mg dose. There were no changes in circulating serum triglycerides, cholesterol, or LDL or HDL cholesterol concentrations with either dose of exemestane. Table 2 summarizes the results of the hormonal and lipid data.
 

CatSnake

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
Arimidex

Estrogen suppression in males: metabolic effects.
J Clin Endocrinol Metab 2000 Jul;85(7):2370-7 (ISSN: 0021-972X)
Mauras N; O'Brien KO; Klein KO;

We have shown that testosterone (T) deficiency per se is associated with marked catabolic effects on protein, calcium metabolism, and body composition in men independent of changes in GH or insulin-like growth factor I production. It is not clear,,however, whether estrogens have a major role in whole body anabolism in males. We investigated the metabolic effects of selective estrogen suppression in the male using a potent aromatase inhibitor, Arimidex (Anastrozole). First, a dose-response study of 12 males (mean age, 16.1 +/- 0.3 yr) was conducted, and blood withdrawn at baseline and after 10 days of oral Arimidex given as two different doses (either 0.5 or 1 mg) in random order with a 14-day washout in between. A sensitive estradiol (E2) assay showed an approximately 50% decrease in E2
concentrations with either of the two doses; hence, a 1-mg dose was selected for other studies. Subsequently, eight males (aged 15-22 yr; four adults and four late pubertal) had isotopic infusions of [(13)C]leucine and (42)Ca/(44)Ca, indirect calorimetry, dual energy x-ray absorptiometry, isokinetic dynamometry, and growth factors measurements performed before and after 10 weeks of daily doses of Arimidex. Contrary to the effects of T withdrawal, there were no significant changes in body composition (body mass index, fat mass, and fat-free mass) after estrogen suppression or in rates of protein synthesis or degradation; carbohydrate, lipid, or protein oxidation; muscle strength; calcium kinetics; or bone growth factors concentrations. However, E2 concentrations decreased 48% (P = 0.006), with
no significant change in mean and peak GH concentrations, but with an 18% decrease in plasma insulin-like growth factor I concentrations. There was a 58% increase in serum T (P = 0.0001), sex hormone-binding globulin did not change, whereas LH and FSH concentrations increased (P < 0.02, both). Serum bone markers, osteocalcin and bone alkaline phosphatase concentrations, and
rates of bone calcium deposition and resorption did not change. In conclusion, these data suggest that in the male 1) estrogens do not contribute significantly to the changes in body composition and protein
synthesis observed with changing androgen levels; 2) estrogen is a main regulator of the gonadal-pituitary feedback for the gonadotropin axis; and 3) this level of aromatase inhibition does not negatively impact either kinetically measured rates of bone calcium turnover or indirect markers of bone calcium turnover, at least in the short term. Further studies will provide valuable information on whether timed aromatase inhibition can be useful in increasing the height potential of pubertal boys with profound
growth retardation without the confounding negative effects of gonadal androgen suppression.
 

CatSnake

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
Femara

Short-term aromatase inhibition: effects on glucose metabolism and serum leptin levels in young and elderly men
B Lapauw, G T'Sjoen, A Mahmoud, J M Kaufman and J B Ruige
+ Author Affiliations

Department of Endocrinology,
9K12 I.E., Ghent University Hospital, De Pintelaan 185, 9000 Ghent, Belgium


Objective To assess and compare the effects of short-term aromatase inhibition on glucose metabolism, lipid profile, and adipocytokine levels in young and elderly men.

Design and methods Ten elderly and nine young healthy men were randomized to receive letrozole 2.5 mg daily or placebo for 28 days in a crossover design.

Results Both in young and elderly men, active treatment significantly increased serum testosterone (+128 and +99%, respectively) and decreased estradiol levels (−41 and −62%, respectively). Fasting glucose and insulin levels decreased in young men after active intervention (−7 and −37%, respectively) compared with placebo. Leptin levels fell markedly in both age groups (−24 and −25%, respectively), while adiponectin levels were not affected by the intervention. Lipid profile was slightly impaired in both groups, with increasing low density lipoprotein-cholesterol levels (+14%) in the younger age group and 10% lower levels of APOA1 in the elderly. A decline in IGF1 levels (−15%) was observed in the younger age group. No changes in weight or body mass index were observed in either young or old men.

Conclusions Short-term aromatase inhibition appears to affect glucose metabolism in young men, and lipid metabolism, including leptin secretion, in young and elderly men. Furthermore, the short period of exposure suggests that these changes might be mediated by direct effects of sex steroids rather than by changes in body composition.
 
AndroRage

AndroRage

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Im sorry , try now.
Stan
The 5 on 2 off schedule, could one do this but slightly altered?

For example only workout out days, and miss say Wednesdays & Sundays? So not 5 consecutive days but still 2 days break per week?

Thanks
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
The 5 on 2 off schedule, could one do this but slightly altered?

For example only workout out days, and miss say Wednesdays & Sundays? So not 5 consecutive days but still 2 days break per week?

Thanks
It doesn't have pre workout benifits so y not just stick to 5 on 2 off
 
The_Old_Guy

The_Old_Guy

Well-known member
Awards
0
Here's the whole thing. It dropped some in the 25mg group, but increased a tad in the 50mg group. Who f'n knows :D It's still the best AI IMO, when looking at overall impact compared to the others.

Assay Dose (mg) n Baseline (mean ± sd) End of 10-d treatment (mean ± sd) % Change from baseline (mean ± sd) P value (end − baseline)

IGF-I (ng/ml)

25mg 11 533 ± 137 455 ± 80 −12.5 ± 11.1 0.0075

50mg 10 491 ± 149 471 ± 118 +2.0 ± 19.4 0.8197
http://press.endocrine.org/doi/full/10.1210/jc.2003-031279
 

CatSnake

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
Here's the whole thing. It dropped some in the 25mg group, but increased a tad in the 50mg group. Who f'n knows :D It's still the best AI IMO, when looking at overall impact compared to the others.
yeah, it's odd.

I don't know anyone who runs it at 50 mg/day, tho...

Due to the AI's MOA, I suspect the higher E2 might be correlated with the higher IGF1...
 
The_Old_Guy

The_Old_Guy

Well-known member
Awards
0
yeah, it's odd.

I don't know anyone who runs it at 50 mg/day, tho...

Due to the AI's MOA, I suspect the higher E2 might be correlated with the higher IGF1...
Yeah, depending, it is usually from 6.25mg to 12.5mg ED, EOD, or even E3D for some. I've never needed it, but if I did, I wouldn't worry about it myself. Lowest impact on health bio-markers wins for me.
 
AndroRage

AndroRage

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
It doesn't have pre workout benifits so y not just stick to 5 on 2 off

It wasn't for pre workout benefits... I miss Wednesdays and Sunday so instead of 5 on 2 off do the 2 on the days I don't train
 
Smont

Smont

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
  • RockStar
It wasn't for pre workout benefits... I miss Wednesdays and Sunday so instead of 5 on 2 off do the 2 on the days I don't train
My point is what does your workouts have to do with when u take mk? Why do you specifically want to take it on workout days if it has no direct benefit to that workout?
 

CatSnake

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
My point is what does your workouts have to do with when u take mk? Why do you specifically want to take it on workout days if it has no direct benefit to that workout?
well, MK increases the size of the GH pulse, so it does have a direct effect on workout days.... granted, it has a long half-life, but I think taking it on workout days would prolly do a fine strategy.
 

muchstronger2

Member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
I tried a 10mg dose yesterday morning in the hope it would be low enough for me to sleep.
It f***** up my sleep big time again.
Is that thing supposed to make you restless?
 
solidsnake

solidsnake

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Melatonin before bed bro, you'll sleep like a baby and its synergistic with mk
 

muchstronger2

Member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Melatonin before bed bro, you'll sleep like a baby and its synergistic with mk
F*** all bro!

I take melatonin on a daily basis so my sleep is usually perfect and when I added the MK all I did was having an 8h semi-awaken dream and waking up with the puffiest eyes ever, unable to do jack **** for the rest of the day haha

Seems like it prevents me from reaching the deep sleep phase
 

Br1ck_Sh1thouse

Well-known member
Awards
0
So from I can tell it seems like 60% of people like to dose this at night before bed for the sleep benefits and the remainder of people actually get the opposite effect and so they take it in the morning. Is that about right?
 
johnnyp

johnnyp

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
I wish I were one of the people that it made energetic, it's the best sleep aid I've ever used.
 
bobi593

bobi593

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
So from I can tell it seems like 60% of people like to dose this at night before bed for the sleep benefits and the remainder of people actually get the opposite effect and so they take it in the morning. Is that about right?
Yes
 
BennyMagoo79

BennyMagoo79

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
After nearly 3 months on mk i feel like the side effects are wearing off.
 

muchstronger2

Member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
I wish I were one of the people that it made energetic, it's the best sleep aid I've ever used.
But on the other side that means you'd have to trade sleep for energy, are you sure you'd be willing to?
 
johnnyp

johnnyp

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
But on the other side that means you'd have to trade sleep for energy, are you sure you'd be willing to?
I have no trouble sleeping after a long day, melatonin will knock me out if nothing else so I never really needed a sleep aid. I do my best to limit stimulants to as needed situations so anything that provides extra energy is welcome.
 

Choppedjunior

Member
Awards
0
so mk677 won't have an effect on test or cause gyno issues?


Also what is the average lb gain if you did a MK677 only cycle? I plan to run



MK 677
LGD 4033 for 8 weeks. then nolva PCT.


I am on LGD now no issues with lethargy, so i wouldn't need a test base unless wanted one right.
 
SBH

SBH

New member
Awards
0
Sides are the usual GH sides. Water bloat, maybe some lethargy.
 

money made

New member
Awards
0
Does anyone know the detection time for MK677? I've read where the half life is 24 hours but there's more to it than that. Any insight? Thanks!
 
SBH

SBH

New member
Awards
0
And hunger!
Ya, that's more of a peptide side because it mimicks ghrehlin. MK makes me hungrier than any of the injectable peptides even GHRP-6. At least the GHRP-6 wears off quickly. Still get lean gains with the MK tho. Unless you go nuts.
 

Choppedjunior

Member
Awards
0
What about water retention ? Does everyone experience this? I'm reading some stuff that's actually worrying me about the amount of water some are gaining
 
coltonwalker

coltonwalker

Active member
Awards
0
What about water retention ? Does everyone experience this? I'm reading some stuff that's actually worrying me about the amount of water some are gaining
I have gotten quite a bit at 20mg a day. You have to weigh out the outcomes. Nice lean gains for a little bit of water retention/bloat is something I would do
 
SBH

SBH

New member
Awards
0
I have gotten quite a bit at 20mg a day. You have to weigh out the outcomes. Nice lean gains for a little bit of water retention/bloat is something I would do
I agree. It def guides the gains to the lean side.
 
JahCure

JahCure

Member
Awards
0
What about water retention ? Does everyone experience this? I'm reading some stuff that's actually worrying me about the amount of water some are gaining
I've had minor water retention, just look more full though and not so much on the bloated side.
 
coltonwalker

coltonwalker

Active member
Awards
0
Has anyone tried or heard of SP labs? Store I work at just got them capsule form. 10mg per capsule 90caps
 

CatSnake

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
What about water retention ? Does everyone experience this? I'm reading some stuff that's actually worrying me about the amount of water some are gaining
hGH (and anything that increases hGH) increases aldosterone, which leads to water retention.

add this to the increased stomach motility (which leads to increased hunger), and you can gain a ton of weight, good or bad, depending on your diet.
 

ericos_bob

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
Zero water retention having been on it for 4+ months at 25mg. It's not something everyone gets. Same with hunger sides. A noticeable increase in hunger when first starting mk but subsides after a couple weeks and now a non issue.
 

Choppedjunior

Member
Awards
0
Yeah so I guess some get it some don't. I just don't want it making me look like i gained a lot of BF, or something like that, as I'm thinking of running OL UK Mass GH,
 

ericos_bob

Active member
Awards
1
  • Established
I'd purchase MK and LGD separately if possible rather than as a single product stack unless you already have experience with how you respond to both compounds at given doses. Would suck if you can't handle one of the compounds at the given doses forcing you to drop both. Only one way to find out how you respond to MK.
 

pistonsgirl

New member
Awards
0
What is is the best to stack with Mk677 for fat loss for a female?
 
Misfit28

Misfit28

Well-known member
Awards
2
  • Established
  • RockStar
Just a quick note, I had some blood drawn today: Fasting glucose was 80 (Mine is pretty much always 80), and a1c is 4.8. Insulin is fine and I'm not insulin resistant yet.

Been on MK at 10mg ED since the 7th, bumped up to 20mg last two nights.
 
The_Old_Guy

The_Old_Guy

Well-known member
Awards
0
Just a quick note, I had some blood drawn today: Fasting glucose was 80 (Mine is pretty much always 80), and a1c is 4.8. Insulin is fine and I'm not insulin resistant yet.

Been on MK at 10mg ED since the 7th, bumped up to 20mg last two nights.
Hemoglobin A1C at 4.8 is friggen sweet man. I live with two Type-1's and 7 is the magic number :D
 

Similar threads


Top