Unanswered Matthersby log: Old man on a mission

Matthersby

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That's nice gives coach a good length of time to reallly learn about his body. I've been with my coach longer but never for such a straight length no wonder you had such a great transformation
Thanks bro . It’s been fun as hell too. I’m glad it can be seen at all past my eyes.
 
Codybenz

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I’m actually going to dial back and do more travel and hiking and endurance stuff for a while. Heart health and less intrusive and restrictive hobbies. I’ll probably go back to an off season style of slowly gaining and training 3-4x a week but I probably won’t gain a whole lot focusing on more long term outdoor activities like all day hikes and stuff like that. The next 6 months are TRT only until my labs are better than anyone my age that’s not even on gear.
That’s all I know right now. There’s no way I won’t come back to this stuff as a hobby, but I’m going to do some healthier stuff for a good 6-12 months as my main focus.
Good for you brother. Hiking and travel can be good for the soul. I took the fam hiking in the Tetons and Yellowstone earlier this year. Got up over 10k feet on a couple of them. Definitely takes some endurance.
 
Matthersby

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Good for you brother. Hiking and travel can be good for the soul. I took the fam hiking in the Tetons and Yellowstone earlier this year. Got up over 10k feet on a couple of them. Definitely takes some endurance.
I started dating a really damn outdoorsy free spirited traveler, and I’ve enjoyed getting into more healthy activities with her. (This chick did Everest base camp last year) This comp in two weeks is something I’ve wanted to do for 10 years but I’m 99% sure it’s a one to two time thing and I could use the financial break from it, and the idea of going on a CA road trip without boxes of food and all my meds excites me. I want to live my life more free for a little while. When my career and schooling starts getting more intense, it may be a good time to dial some of this back in again, but I’ll be fine with just being in really good cardiovascular shape for the next year or two. Try and hang on to what I have.

My parents are US travelers now, and they picked up a 6 month contract in Yellowstone on the Wyoming side working 12 hours a week for a free camp sight for their RV, and they loved it up there! They are over in Oregon now living out their retirement plan.
 
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SkRaw85

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Good for you brother. Hiking and travel can be good for the soul. I took the fam hiking in the Tetons and Yellowstone earlier this year. Got up over 10k feet on a couple of them. Definitely takes some endurance.
Tetons and surrounding area is THE most beautiful place on this earth. Put me back please.
 
Codybenz

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I started dating a really damn outdoorsy free spirited traveler, and I’ve enjoyed getting into more healthy activities with her. (This chick did Everest base camp last year) This comp in two weeks is something I’ve wanted to do for 10 years but I’m 99% sure it’s a one to two time thing and I could use the financial break from it, and the idea of going on a CA road trip without boxes of food and all my meds excites me. I want to live my life more free for a little while. When my career and schooling starts getting more intense, it may be a good time to dial some of this back in again, but I’ll be fine with just being in really good cardiovascular shape for the next year or two. Try and hang on to what I have.

My parents are US travelers now, and they picked up a 6 month contract in Yellowstone on the Wyoming side working 12 hours a week for a free camp sight for their RV, and they loved it up there! They are over in Oregon now living out their retirement plan.
That’s awesome man. Sometimes the best thing we can do is just enjoy life and what God created, and the company of a beautiful woman. You will walk away refreshed and some new perspectives.
 
Matthersby

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That’s awesome man. Sometimes the best thing we can do is just enjoy life and what God created, and the company of a beautiful woman. You will walk away refreshed and some new perspectives.
Who am I kidding though. This is my hobby I love the most. So 6 months from now after a nice long ped break, I’ve got some EQ, Trest, Mast and Var that I’ll try to stay lean until that point, and then start bringing up all my weak points. Just want this hobby to be able to be put on hold for a few weeks travel at a time and not so worried about my food on an all-day hike.
 
mixedup

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Who am I kidding though. This is my hobby I love the most. So 6 months from now after a nice long ped break, I’ve got some EQ, Trest, Mast and Var that I’ll try to stay lean until that point, and then start bringing up all my weak points. Just want this hobby to be able to be put on hold for a few weeks travel at a time and not so worried about my food on an all-day hike.
Your going to end up like me lol
 
Hyde

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Who am I kidding though. This is my hobby I love the most. So 6 months from now after a nice long ped break, I’ve got some EQ, Trest, Mast and Var that I’ll try to stay lean until that point, and then start bringing up all my weak points. Just want this hobby to be able to be put on hold for a few weeks travel at a time and not so worried about my food on an all-day hike.
It is a hobby, not your career, so you can do that. It’s the 80/20 principle. When you are not in actual prep, you can get about 80% of the results from the first 20% of the effort. Don’t eat like an asshole even when not dieting. Train at least 3x a week when not traveling, hitting some compound moves (even if using machines choose things like hammerstrength presses and rows over pec flyes and pullovers). You can see the world and stay in good shape without living out of Tupperware or training all the time. Take a cruise shot of test dec, pack your most essential meds, make 80% of your food things things that had to be grown, hunted or picked.

Remember that 2 hard sets of 12 on one accessory will yield most of the size that 12 sets of 10 over 3 exercises would.
 
Matthersby

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It is a hobby, not your career, so you can do that. It’s the 80/20 principle. When you are not in actual prep, you can get about 80% of the results from the first 20% of the effort. Don’t eat like an asshole even when not dieting. Train at least 3x a week when not traveling, hitting some compound moves (even if using machines choose things like hammerstrength presses and rows over pec flyes and pullovers). You can see the world and stay in good shape without living out of Tupperware or training all the time. Take a cruise shot of test dec, pack your most essential meds, make 80% of your food things things that had to be grown, hunted or picked.

Remember that 2 hard sets of 12 on one accessory will yield most of the size that 12 sets of 10 over 3 exercises would.
So wise.
As always great advice.
Adjustments.JPG

I intend to do just this too. It’s too easy for me to eat this way plus what a let down starting a relationship with someone in the condition I’m in, and then just let myself go. I don’t do that. I love looking better than guys my age with a smoking hot red head on my arm that looks better than any 22 year old girl.
 
Matthersby

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So today I kicked a few up a notch and added Proviron and a second dose of Var. This is an unpleasant amount of orals and gear for me. I definitely don’t feel good, by any stretch.
Test 500/week
Tren 325/week (only have enough to do 400 the last two injections)
Mast 750/week
Winnie 75/day
Var 60/day
Proviron 100/day
Clen 80/ T3 37.5
Lots of Exem/Nolva/Prami Lots

Limited in my state to playgrounds, resistance bands and furniture for my workouts for the rest of prep.
 
mixedup

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So today I kicked a few up a notch and added Proviron and a second dose of Var. This is an unpleasant amount of orals and gear for me. I definitely don’t feel good, by any stretch.
Test 500/week
Tren 325/week (only have enough to do 400 the last two injections)
Mast 750/week
Winnie 75/day
Var 60/day
Proviron 100/day
Clen 80/ T3 37.5
Lots of Exem/Nolva/Prami Lots

Limited in my state to playgrounds, resistance bands and furniture for my workouts for the rest of prep.
Almost there stay the course
 
mixedup

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I forgot what class are you gonna be competing in? I saw a new class called true novice. I think it's for brand new or almost brand near competitors
 
Matthersby

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I forgot what class are you gonna be competing in? I saw a new class called true novice. I think it's for brand new or almost brand near competitors
I only did Men’s Physique 35+
Could have done 6 other ones too.
 

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Limited in my state to playgrounds, resistance bands and furniture for my workouts for the rest of prep.
😂😂
Hey man, gotta get creative


Wow over 3 grams a week plus clen and t3 😮


August 1st is going to be like Christmas for us over here, we are all eagerly awaiting to see how you place etc

Same goes for @Alchemist11 's ever elusive comp day 😁


ps: i would like to see your bloodwork when you are done with the comp 😁
 
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Hyde

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Hey man, gotta get creative


Wow over 3 grams a week plus clen and t3


August 1st is going to be like Christmas for us over here, we are all eagerly awaiting to see how you place etc

Same goes for @Alchemist11 's ever elusive comp day


ps: i would like to see your bloodwork when you are done with the comp
Nobody counts orals like that. For reasons I mentioned in Alchemist’s thread. You can’t compare Mtren to Dbol even, let alone PROVIRON lol. Heck, 100mg/WEEK of any SARM would be harsher than 100mg Proviron per day.

And it’s going to be lousy. Like any proper contest bloodwork where androgens are high, estrogen is low, and dry orals are at play.
 
Hyde

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Hey man, gotta get creative


Wow over 3 grams a week plus clen and t3


August 1st is going to be like Christmas for us over here, we are all eagerly awaiting to see how you place etc

Same goes for @Alchemist11 's ever elusive comp day


ps: i would like to see your bloodwork when you are done with the comp
Nobody counts orals like that. For reasons I mentioned in Alchemist’s thread. You can’t compare Mtren to Dbol even, let alone PROVIRON lol. Heck, 100mg/WEEK of any SARM would be harsher than 100mg Proviron per day.

And it’s going to be lousy. Like any proper contest bloodwork where androgens are high, estrogen is low, and dry orals are at play.
 

CroLifter

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Nobody counts orals like that. For reasons I mentioned in Alchemist’s thread. You can’t compare Mtren to Dbol even, let alone PROVIRON lol. Heck, 100mg/WEEK of any SARM would be harsher than 100mg Proviron per day.

And it’s going to be lousy. Like any proper contest bloodwork where androgens are high, estrogen is low, and dry orals are at play.
Well, orals still put a load on your body, even more than injectables.

Proviron is still an aas which sh1ts on lipids and attaches to the heart.

Also when it comes to iniectables,, they vary in harshness too. Comparing 200mg a week of tren ace to 200mg of primo or test.

Sorry I had to discuss this haha



And yes, of course bloods are going to be horrible, i know he is very health conscious like me hence i am effing with him 😁

But yeah, if there is a moment to go balls to the walls and potentially put your health in jeopardy, then that moment is pre comp.
 
Mathb33

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@CroLifter had to throw that at you haha, this is after 7 weeks NPP 600mg + anadrol 4 weeks off and 4th week into test eq tren 300mg.
 
Hyde

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Well, orals still put a load on your body, even more than injectables.

Proviron is still an aas which sh1ts on lipids and attaches to the heart.

Also when it comes to iniectables,, they vary in harshness too. Comparing 200mg a week of tren ace to 200mg of primo or test.

Sorry I had to discuss this haha



And yes, of course bloods are going to be horrible, i know he is very health conscious like me hence i am effing with him

But yeah, if there is a moment to go balls to the walls and potentially put your health in jeopardy, then that moment is pre comp.
Absolutely.

But if you say 3 grams of gear/wk, people don’t associate that with total usage is all I mean. They assume you are discussing the oil used.

His oral selection is classic contest prep compounds and doses. Same as you would expect a power lifter to be taking some kind of orals like Dbol, Drol, Halo or the like the last 2-4 weeks precontest. Most folks do this and it’s implied.
 
Mathb33

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Gotta agree with Cro that if something will mess your bloods horribly it’s orals. Perhaps it’s just me and I’m lucky but I do believe on oils you can keep lipids and important values within range or minimal out of range. Forget it with crappy orals though. That’s why I gave up on them it’s over for me with orals. I stick to oils and so far my bloods are much better.
 

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@CroLifter had to throw that at you haha, this is after 7 weeks NPP 600mg + anadrol 4 weeks off and 4th week into test eq tren 300mg.
Looks good!

But hm, you have been off orals for 8 weeks. Hdl looks fine.

But yeah injectables dont hit lipids as much, but @Matthersby is on winny var and proviron which are like the atomic bpmb towards lipids. I was all in range on 500 test and 200 mast.

People like to say that anavar is mild and tren is oh so bad, but really, i saw worse lipid bloods from anavar then from tren (but both bad of course). I have seen terrible lipid panels on anavar online.

Also, "mild" and "beginner", "legal" substances like epistane, damn that is like winstrol on the bloodwork.




Btw your ldl is high, you can remedy that much easier than you can a low hdl.
how is the diet? High fat, low fat?
 
Mathb33

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Looks good!

But hm, you have been off orals for 8 weeks. Hdl looks fine.

But yeah injectables dont hit lipids as much, but @Matthersby is on winny var and proviron which are like the atomic bpmb towards lipids. I was all in range on 500 test and 200 mast.

People like to say that anavar is mild and tren is oh so bad, but really, i saw worse lipid bloods from anavar then from tren (but both bad of course). I have seen terrible lipid panels on anavar online.



Btw your ldl is high, you can remedy that much easier than you can a low hdl.
how is the diet? High fat, low fat?
Im on 1.5gram of gear right now I pointed the finger of the barely out of range to that. Was actually glad! But hmmm fats are around 50-80g a day
 

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Gotta agree with Cro that if something will mess your bloods horribly it’s orals. Perhaps it’s just me and I’m lucky but I do believe on oils you can keep lipids and important values within range or minimal out of range. Forget it with crappy orals though. That’s why I gave up on them it’s over for me with orals. I stick to oils and so far my bloods are much better.
Yes i believe so too Dave Crossland (ucthefreak) mentioned how when he blasted grams and grams he always had low hdl but never high ldl, because he ate extremely low fat, basically rice and lean meat all day, like 12 times a day.

Ok we really have to stop derailing the thread hahaha. 7 more days till the comp.
 
Mathb33

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wonder what’s worse. Low HDL or high LDL. Gotta be high LDL. Tough call though
 
Mathb33

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I also vote high ldl. Less sh1t floating around the better.
Wish there was a way to measure how much GW made a difference in my past 2 blasts. Right now I’m running daily and in my mind GW + a healthy diet is the reason my lipid isn’t ****.
 
Matthersby

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Wish there was a way to measure how much GW made a difference in my past 2 blasts. Right now I’m running daily and in my mind GW + a healthy diet is the reason my lipid isn’t ****.
I read through these pages waiting to say EXACTLY THIS ^
There’s a huge reason I don’t stress over lipids, my diet consists of 40-55g fats/day and 2/3 of that is healthy fats. I’ve been on mast -npp -Proviron and some var with 10-20 GW and my lipids were damn near in range. This idea probably gets overlooked so much since most want to just use the excuse of bad cholesterol but not really do anything proactive about it... If LDL/HDL ratio is truly a concern, the ONLY thing that really needs to happen is adjust your fats and then take a break from gear after whatever blast you’re doing. My bloods are pretty damn good year round but that’s because I’m disciplined with diet. I don’t need to avoid any gear really if I only plan to be on it a short time.
 
Matthersby

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Yes i believe so too Dave Crossland (ucthefreak) mentioned how when he blasted grams and grams he always had low hdl but never high ldl, because he ate extremely low fat, basically rice and lean meat all day, like 12 times a day.

Ok we really have to stop derailing the thread hahaha. 7 more days till the comp.
Exactly.
This was me this whole last year. My only real concern is blood viscosity. Everything else will be back on track anyways in just 4-6 weeks from Saturday.
 

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Exactly.
This was me this whole last year. My only real concern is blood viscosity. Everything else will be back on track anyways in just 4-6 weeks from Saturday.
We over here, you, math, me, some of the others know how big of an issue hdl and lipids are hence we do our best to eat clean and therefore i would even go out on a limb and say that atherosclerosis is not a huge issue for us as we more or less keep our lipids in check.

One thing we unfortunately have no control over is the damn heart remodelling from direct binding of androgens, and i dont know how to prevent that, neither does anyone around here. This is my biggest fear, not atherosclerosis and lipids, as the latter can be managed.

I hypothesized in some previous threads how we need a compound which acts like serms do towards ER but this compound would bind to the heart and prevent androgens from binding like tamox prevents estro in mammary tissue.

I didnt get any responses so i assume such a compound doesnt exist and is not currently under development unfortunately.

One member, Old Witch (long gone from here) suggested thay estrogen binds to the heart and can prevent androgens from binding. I will take that with a pinch of salt as i never found studies supporting that.


As far as studies i managed to dig up, they all point to the fact that test, particularly dht, is the biggest offender.


When i become a billionaire i am going to invest in the development of such a compound so that you guys can blast grams and have the biggest threat removed 😁
 
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We over here, you, math, me, some of the others know how big of an issue hdl and lipids are hence we do our best to eat clean and therefore i would even go out on a limb and say that atherosclerosis is not a huge issue for us as we more or less keep our lipids in check.

One thing we unfortunately have no control over is the damn heart remodelling from direct binding of androgens, and i dont know how to prevent that, neither does anyone around here. This is my biggest fear, not atherosclerosis and lipids, as the latter can be managed.

I hypothesized in some previous threads how we need a compound which acts like serms do towards ER but this compound would bind to the heart and prevent androgens from binding like tamox prevents estro in mammary tissue.

I didnt get any responses so i assume such a compound doesnt exist and is not currently under development unfortunately.

One member, Old Witch (long gone from here) suggested thay estrogen binds to the heart and can prevent androgens from binding. I will take that with a pinch of salt as i never found studies supporting that.


As far as studies i managed to dig up, they all point to the fact that test, particularly dht, is the biggest offender.


When i become a billionaire i am going to invest in the development of such a compound so that you guys can blast grams and have the biggest threat removed 😁
Who knows, maybe a sarm prevents androgen binding in heart tissue (not that I am advocate of sarms by any means), as rad-140 has been shown to prevent androgen binding in prostate tissue.
 

CroLifter

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Who knows, maybe a sarm prevents androgen binding in heart tissue (not that I am advocate of sarms by any means), as rad-140 has been shown to prevent androgen binding in prostate tissue.
Maybe
It definitely needs more research as lives could be saved.
 
Matthersby

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Maybe
It definitely needs more research as lives could be saved.
Now, does this process continue at all once the exogenous androgen has been removed? I wonder how much of this is a legitimate threat for someone that uses AAS including heavy DHT use, oral and otherwise, but only for a total of 12-16 weeks annually... For those competing several times a year for decades, this is probably a huge issue long term.
 

CroLifter

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Now, does this process continue at all once the exogenous androgen has been removed? I wonder how much of this is a legitimate threat for someone that uses AAS including heavy DHT use, oral and otherwise, but only for a total of 12-16 weeks annually... For those competing several times a year for decades, this is probably a huge issue long term.
I am not really sure but i can share some studies whihc may point in the right direction

1) finasteride helps prevent cardiac hypertrophy in mice

2) patients were given either test or nandro, test group showed some changes in cardiac parameters while nand group didnt

3) testosterone causes more cardiac fibrosis than trenbolon as tren doesnt 5 a reduce (this one in rodents)
Take a look at figure 7


You may ask how did i come up witht those studies so swiftly?

Well this was bothering me...so I did try to find an answer to the whole heart remodelling thing before and i found some clues in these studies

What does mean for us, and does it mean anything at all?

It seems to me that the more active steroid is in so called androgenic tissues, the harsher will be towards the heart.
Out of these, testosterone is the strongest in the androgenic tissues and hence it seems to be the most deleterious towards heart, but when finasteride is used and dht reduced, all of a sudden test is much safer for the heart.

So obviously all anabolics are going to remodel the heart, but those with the most androgenic sides, those concerning secondary sexual characteristics, seemingly impact the heart in the worst way.

Cliffs: Some of you talked about this... how you felt that high test cycles seemed very rough on the body, harsher than stacking, and this research seems to support that, that high test cycles are really bad for ypu.


Now to your question how much will 12 weeks of cycling per year, 16 weeks, 10 weeks etc of an impact have, i dont know.
 
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Hyde

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We over here, you, math, me, some of the others know how big of an issue hdl and lipids are hence we do our best to eat clean and therefore i would even go out on a limb and say that atherosclerosis is not a huge issue for us as we more or less keep our lipids in check.

One thing we unfortunately have no control over is the damn heart remodelling from direct binding of androgens, and i dont know how to prevent that, neither does anyone around here. This is my biggest fear, not atherosclerosis and lipids, as the latter can be managed.

I hypothesized in some previous threads how we need a compound which acts like serms do towards ER but this compound would bind to the heart and prevent androgens from binding like tamox prevents estro in mammary tissue.

I didnt get any responses so i assume such a compound doesnt exist and is not currently under development unfortunately.

One member, Old Witch (long gone from here) suggested thay estrogen binds to the heart and can prevent androgens from binding. I will take that with a pinch of salt as i never found studies supporting that.


As far as studies i managed to dig up, they all point to the fact that test, particularly dht, is the biggest offender.


When i become a billionaire i am going to invest in the development of such a compound so that you guys can blast grams and have the biggest threat removed
I gotchu:


All weight lifters will see heart enlargement from training, even naturals, but this isn’t inherently worrisome.

However, Curcumin has been shown to help prevent LVH.

Staple supplement for me, like K2!
 

CroLifter

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I gotchu:


All weight lifters will see heart enlargement from training, even naturals, but this isn’t inherently worrisome.

However, Curcumin has been shown to help prevent LVH.

Staple supplement for me, like K2!
Thanks!

I am actually already taking some curcumin for its supposed blood thinning effects.

So according to this study, about 8mg / kg for a human to replicate.
 
Hyde

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Thanks!

I am actually already taking some curcumin for its supposed blood thinning effects.

So according to this study, about 8mg / kg for a human to replicate.
I would not take so little if you want all the health benefits. I believe Dante Trudel is an advocate of 500mg. I would definitely use at least 250mg. It does a lot of good things like anti cancer and anti anti inflammatory that make at least 250 kind of a no-brainer. The study points to the notion LVH can actually even be reversed.

Again, make sure it’s standardized to 95% curcuminoids (there’s a ton of crap out there taking advantage of your lack of knowledge) and make sure there’s Bioperine/Black pepper added or you are adding it/using it with supps that contain this. 20mg Black pepper extract is what studies have shown to be most effective in increasing absorption, which is a lot.

Also dose as far from training as reasonably possible since it’s anti inflammatory, so it doesn’t interfere with the training stimulus you worked so hard for.
 

CroLifter

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I would not take so little if you want all the health benefits. I believe Dante Trudel is an advocate of 500mg. I would definitely use at least 250mg. It does a lot of good things like anti cancer and anti anti inflammatory that make at least 250 kind of a no-brainer. The study points to the notion LVH can actually even be reversed.

Again, make sure it’s standardized to 95% curcuminoids (there’s a ton of crap out there taking advantage of your lack of knowledge) and make sure there’s Bioperine/Black pepper added or you are adding it/using it with supps that contain this. 20mg Black pepper extract is what studies have shown to be most effective in increasing absorption, which is a lot.

Also dose as far from training as reasonably possible since it’s anti inflammatory, so it doesn’t interfere with the training stimulus you worked so hard for.
8 mg per kg that is 850mg for me.
 

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@Matthersby do you get terrible body odor from tren?

I only just bumped it up to 15mg ED (ace) which is a puny dose and i can smell it and also others have tood me it smells awful, and i shower 2x a day.

Dont know if it is the hormone or are the solvents evaporating out of me hahahahahah

Its like the usual sweat stench on steroids (no pun intended).
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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@Matthersby do you get terrible body odor from tren?

I only just bumped it up to 15mg ED (ace) which is a puny dose and i can smell it and also others have tood me it smells awful, and i shower 2x a day.

Dont know if it is the hormone or are the solvents evaporating out of me hahahahahah

Its like the usual sweat stench on steroids (no pun intended).
100% yes. It smells in my sweat, my pillow, my clothes. My girlfriend notices it and has to wash her sheets after I leave. Girl has been a damn sweetheart with all this crap with me.
It’s like ammonia, pan grease, and dead dog. Literally.
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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@Matthersby do you get terrible body odor from tren?

I only just bumped it up to 15mg ED (ace) which is a puny dose and i can smell it and also others have tood me it smells awful, and i shower 2x a day.

Dont know if it is the hormone or are the solvents evaporating out of me hahahahahah

Its like the usual sweat stench on steroids (no pun intended).
100% yes. It smells in my sweat, my pillow, my clothes. My girlfriend notices it and has to wash her sheets after I leave. Girl has been a damn sweetheart with all this crap with me.
It’s like ammonia, pan grease, and dead dog. Literally.
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • Best Answer
@Matthersby do you get terrible body odor from tren?

I only just bumped it up to 15mg ED (ace) which is a puny dose and i can smell it and also others have tood me it smells awful, and i shower 2x a day.

Dont know if it is the hormone or are the solvents evaporating out of me hahahahahah

Its like the usual sweat stench on steroids (no pun intended).
I’m roughly 4x your dosage weekly so it’s as stinky as you may imagine.
 

Rebuild

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100% yes. It smells in my sweat, my pillow, my clothes. My girlfriend notices it and has to wash her sheets after I leave. Girl has been a damn sweetheart with all this crap with me.
It’s like ammonia, pan grease, and dead dog. Literally.
She sounds like a keeper! Do you think it's the actual tren or a solvent?
 

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