Lurker here... With test results and need opinion.

[Rmartin]

Hey everyone. I've been trying to get some treatment from the local Endo but he doesn't want to touch me. I believe it is because he isn't familiar since he asked me to speak to other doctors about the results. I'm going to post my numbers below in the hopes that you guys can give me an honest opinion.

IM 28yo / 212 / 21%Body fat /5'9"
Went to my PCP and had the regular blood work done. Let me know if there are any numbers from that which should be included here.

PCP said that i was perfectly healthy and looked good. He said i will need to lose a little weight but other than that i was fine. No diabetes, no super hi chol or BP or anything of the sort. I told him i had trouble losing weight even though i eat well and work out and he said that i should speak to an endo regarding my thyroid.

For the last 4 years, i have tried HARD to lose weight. the best i could do is 10 pounds before i would lose strength at the gym. In the meantime, i have "trained" others alongside me and watch them lose the pounds. I have helped 9 people lose at least 40 pounds apiece and get close to or under 15%BF. Yet I... doing the same thing and eating even better than them have been stuck here in 20-22% range.

08/14/2011
First set of results to check the thyroid, but he also checked the test because that is what he does.

Total Test Serum: 374 ng/dl
Reference Range 350-1030

Free test dialysis 2.4%
Ref: 1.5-3.2

Free test Serum 90 pg/mL
Range 52 - 280

FSH & LH
LH: 4.5 mIU/mL
Range 1.7 - 8.6

FSH: 3.3 mIU/mL
Range 1.5 - 12.4

T4
1.29 ng/dL
Range 0.82-1.77

TSH: 2.590 iIU/mL
Range 0.450 - 4.500

Looking at these numbers... I told him i was concerned about how low the test was. He told me the numbers were in normal range, but he agreed to test again later on. So we took the tests once again, and added some additional tests.

09/08/2011

Total Test Serum: 322 ng/dl
Reference Range 350-1030

Free test dialysis 3.1%
Ref: 1.5-3.2

Free test Serum 100 pg/mL
Range 52 - 280

FSH & LH
LH: 5.2 mIU/mL
Range 1.7 - 8.6

FSH: 3.5 mIU/mL
Range 1.5 - 12.4

Prolactin 6.4 ng/mL
Range 4.0 - 15.2

Estradiol 11.7 pg/mL
range: 7.6 - 42.6
Roche ECLIA Methodology

SHBG: 10.2L nmol/L
Range 14.5 - 48.8

My endo got these numbers and basically told me he didn't want to deal with me anymore, that he wasn't comfortable and that i should go see someone else. He referred me to other doctors.

I never thought i had any problems with Test before that first endo test. But looking at the symptoms... there are a few that i know i have.

I have problems with hard ons. I cant keep them often and get soft quickly. I dont ALWAYS have Morning wood. The dr was quick to prescribe Cialis but not anything else.

I have problems with my emotions, specifically sadness. I can cry at random. I feel lonely and lost sometimes. It's very inconsistent, like my body is just a big hormonal mess.

I'm strong as ****... But i tire out quickly. I have focus issues and problems with remembering things.

I think i need to speak to someone more experienced, but now that i have, i have been turned down. Before I go on the mess of looking for another DR to actually treat me, I am asking for help from the experts here. Thank you so much.

 

[v4lu3s]

i can say that you probably wont have an easy time losing fat with test like that. i am in the same boat.
definitely look for a new doctor, by the numbers he should not have a single problem looking further into it and considering TRT.

 

[ambulldog]

my guess is your diet and exercise habits have a lot to do with it. if i were your dr i wouldnt entertain trt for somone your age until you tried to improve it naturally

 

[Jasen]

Low T...

 

[Rmartin]

Thank you everyone for your input. It means a lot to me to have the help of the community.

my guess is your diet and exercise habits have a lot to do with it. if i were your dr i wouldnt entertain trt for somone your age until you tried to improve it naturally

my diet and exercise habits are pretty good. I bike to and from work everyday, jog every other day, and lift about 3 days a week.

I eat decently, no processed, no fast foods, no added sugar, minimal bad carbs. I actually enjoy salads and veggies.

Fact is, i'm a laughing stock. everyone around me sees how hard I try and no matter what, I stay fat. they daily make fun of me eating carrots and celery with a turkey sandwich while they're eating burgers and fries. They comment on my work out habits and how I have no results to show for them.

And now, with the sexual issues, i'm basically reaching my breaking point. No matter how heavy I have been, at least my pecker worked... That isn't the case any more. Women think I don't want them, our that i'm not enjoying myself because I get soft.

I don't mind the idea of self medicating, add long as it's done right. I've been thinking of doing something just to kick start my natural production and lose some fat (which i'm sure is helping to keep my numbers down) but I don't want to make maters worse.

Any suggestions?

 

[hitest]

Thank you everyone for your input. It means a lot to me to have the help of the community.
my diet and exercise habits are pretty good. I bike to and from work everyday, jog every other day, and lift about 3 days a week.

I eat decently, no processed, no fast foods, no added sugar, minimal bad carbs. I actually enjoy salads and veggies.

Fact is, i'm a laughing stock. everyone around me sees how hard I try and no matter what, I stay fat. they daily make fun of me eating carrots and celery with a turkey sandwich while they're eating burgers and fries. They comment on my work out habits and how I have no results to show for them.

And now, with the sexual issues, i'm basically reaching my breaking point. No matter how heavy I have been, at least my pecker worked... That isn't the case any more. Women think I don't want them, our that i'm not enjoying myself because I get soft.

I don't mind the idea of self medicating, add long as it's done right. I've been thinking of doing something just to kick start my natural production and lose some fat (which i'm sure is helping to keep my numbers down) but I don't want to make maters worse.

Any suggestions?

You really need to research this carefully before you start doing the more serious stuff like TRT. I understand you want to solve this quickly but you can make hard to reverse mistakes. Your T is clearly on the low side and your SHBG is also low. Your free T is in range probably because of the low SHBG. The low SHBG will make you more sensitive to E2 levels. I don't think your E2 was measured by a sensitive test and you should get that to really know where you stand. I'd be interested to know what your DHT levels are because T also converts to this.

As for your diet, it seems that you eat healthy foods but how about the number of calories? Do you snack? Shedding some weight should help. Are you taking zinc? Are you getting enough healthy fats like fish oil, omega-3s, and olive oil?

 

[The Matrix]

loose some.weight, clean up diet and be evaluated for insulin resistance. Your thyroid looks to low which also can effect shbg along with insulin. Look for.possible sleep.apnea and high carb intake in diet. This can be corrected by proper lifestyle and nutrition intervention along with identifying other parameters

wanna bet your vitamin d level are < 30 more.like 21-22 area?


Runing a lipid panel or vap, e2 sensitive Will answer of.questions. You be a fool to jump.on hrt with out looking at the cause

 

[Jasen]

Trt trt trt trt!

Jk listen to matrix

 

[Rmartin]

You really need to research this carefully before you start doing the more serious stuff like TRT. I understand you want to solve this quickly but you can make hard to reverse mistakes. Your T is clearly on the low side and your SHBG is also low. Your free T is in range probably because of the low SHBG. The low SHBG will make you more sensitive to E2 levels. I don't think your E2 was measured by a sensitive test and you should get that to really know where you stand. I'd be interested to know what your DHT levels are because T also converts to this.

As for your diet, it seems that you eat healthy foods but how about the number of calories? Do you snack? Shedding some weight should help. Are you taking zinc? Are you getting enough healthy fats like fish oil, omega-3s, and olive oil?

You are absolutely right regarding researching... One main reason I am here... and i am still learning tons.

So you are recommending i do a DHT test and the Sensitive E2 test, which isn't the one i did because I have heard that they are both unreliable, and what really matters is the movement up and down. I can take those 2 soon and post results.

loose some.weight, clean up diet and be evaluated for insulin resistance. Your thyroid looks to low which also can effect shbg along with insulin. Look for.possible sleep.apnea and high carb intake in diet. This can be corrected by proper lifestyle and nutrition intervention along with identifying other parameters

wanna bet your vitamin d level are < 30 more.like 21-22 area?


Runing a lipid panel or vap, e2 sensitive Will answer of.questions. You be a fool to jump.on hrt with out looking at the cause

Ive had 2 bad diet weeks while trying to get my numbers naturally under 350 (my doc said he would treat me if i got under, and then changed his mind). Im back to a clean and healthy diet this week, no booze, no white carbs, no sugar. Im trying to lose some weight but it hasnt worked for me so far.

He said my thyroid was fine, and according to those numbers it seems im in the middle of the range. I dont have sleep apnea (****, i barely snore at night) and i try to refrain from eating carbs (i havent had potatoes or rice or white bread in AGES).

I do have a full blood screening along with a lipid panel and most vitamins.

Chol total = 192
Trigglycerides = 210
HDL = 41
VLDL = 42
LDL = 109

Calcium Serum = 9.5
9.7 - 10.2

Yes my fats are slightly elevated but nothing that losing a little weight wont fix. Nothing out of this world or in need to medication.

I can do whatever additional tests you think are necessary.

and some background:

when i was 14, i had my jaw reconstructed due to TMJ corrective surgery. I had my mouth wired shut for 2 months and didnt eat anything. I was severely malnourished and was fainting and bed ridden near the end of the 2 months.

Before this... I was a spindly kid. I was taller than most kids my age, big head, very skinny.
After the surgery, I jumped up in weight and pretty much havent changed from there. I have lost a lot of fat since my worst levels, but i just cant get under the 20% mark.

Almost all my fat is based in my trunk. I have lean legs and arms. I can see my arm veins when pumping and can see the individual cuts in my calves and quads. But my belly is big and starting to see man boobs, though not to gyno levels.

I am not eager to start the lifelong commitment that is TRT. I do want to get my test up and see if i can kickstart my bodies natural production along with losing some of this stubborn fat. Is there anything I can do? I dont want to play around with placebos and some bs magical herbs. I want results.

EDIT: I supplement calcium and i take a Multivitamin along with 2 protein shakes a day that also contain 100% of daily recommended nutrients. I am a big fan of vitamins.

 

[The Matrix]

if you are.not absorbing food then it does.not matter. Dealing with cases like this rebalance the diet along with looking into.other factor will Most.likely give resolution. Imo you do not.need hrt but.May be get insulin.levels under control and May be try a restart which has been successfully done in the past with people. Might need little boost to get body going on own. Do not think thyroid is ok need to look deeper into it to rule out

 

[hitest]

You are absolutely right regarding researching... One main reason I am here... and i am still learning tons.

So you are recommending i do a DHT test and the Sensitive E2 test, which isn't the one i did because I have heard that they are both unreliable, and what really matters is the movement up and down. I can take those 2 soon and post results.

Ive had 2 bad diet weeks while trying to get my numbers naturally under 350 (my doc said he would treat me if i got under, and then changed his mind). Im back to a clean and healthy diet this week, no booze, no white carbs, no sugar. Im trying to lose some weight but it hasnt worked for me so far.

He said my thyroid was fine, and according to those numbers it seems im in the middle of the range. I dont have sleep apnea (****, i barely snore at night) and i try to refrain from eating carbs (i havent had potatoes or rice or white bread in AGES).

I do have a full blood screening along with a lipid panel and most vitamins.

Chol total = 192
Trigglycerides = 210
HDL = 41
VLDL = 42
LDL = 109

Calcium Serum = 9.5
9.7 - 10.2

Yes my fats are slightly elevated but nothing that losing a little weight wont fix. Nothing out of this world or in need to medication.

I can do whatever additional tests you think are necessary.
and some background: when i was 14, i had my jaw reconstructed due to TMJ corrective surgery. I had my mouth wired shut for 2 months and didnt eat anything. I was severely malnourished and was fainting and bed ridden near the end of the 2 months.

Before this... I was a spindly kid. I was taller than most kids my age, big head, very skinny.
After the surgery, I jumped up in weight and pretty much havent changed from there. I have lost a lot of fat since my worst levels, but i just cant get under the 20% mark.

Almost all my fat is based in my trunk. I have lean legs and arms. I can see my arm veins when pumping and can see the individual cuts in my calves and quads. But my belly is big and starting to see man boobs, though not to gyno levels.

I am not eager to start the lifelong commitment that is TRT. I do want to get my test up and see if i can kickstart my bodies natural production along with losing some of this stubborn fat. Is there anything I can do? I dont want to play around with placebos and some bs magical herbs. I want results.

EDIT: I supplement calcium and i take a Multivitamin along with 2 protein shakes a day that also contain 100% of daily recommended nutrients. I am a big fan of vitamins.

The Matrix may be on to something because your TSH is on the highish side by more stringent standards. The E2 is more important than the DHT but the more you test the less likely something will be missed.

Your story about gaining after a period of semi-starvation resonates with me. The only time I ever gained was after I tried to get by with 2 meals a day. Big mistake.

You didn't say anything about your calorie intake. I'm guessing you are eating too now much based on your 2 protein shakes a day. I'd start by giving those up. I'd also give up anything else you drink that isn't water.

 

[The Matrix]

check rt3 in you were undereating as.well as adrenaline.cortisol 24 hour saliva test. I have am currently dealing with a lot of these type cases now. They are literally train wrecks which Will take from 6 months to 1 year or.longer to rebalance. It depends on severity and the imbalances found.

 

[Rmartin]

Sigh... I shouldve known my current doctor sucks. He is the only one without a Mid November wait time.

Do you think it is possible to get my PCP to prescribe me some of the additional tests needed and/or actual treatment options?

 

[The Matrix]

Yes,
It really depends on your practioner. When dealing with people directly, I look at issues which may dealing with and recommend further testing to get from their Dr. Usually this time they are "like ok let me appease this person". Usually the results are abnormal levels revealing for clinical information to the puzzle. Its all about collecting and knowing what test to perform. Since I have been exploring the immune system it has opened a lot more information to peoples issue which have been unresolved through HRT or other traditional methods. A comprehensive and integrative approach will give more answers to hidden factors.

 

[EasyEJL]

my diet and exercise habits are pretty good. I bike to and from work everyday, jog every other day, and lift about 3 days a week.

I eat decently, no processed, no fast foods, no added sugar, minimal bad carbs. I actually enjoy salads and veggies.

i'm sure I sound like a broken record with it, but what is your fat intake like?

 

[The Matrix]

Low fat intake with malabsoprtion = major hormone issues. I can not mentioned how many times I see this pattern in younger guys. If identifed then HRT is not need, but you may need something to help the body retrain to send the signal.

 

[Jasen]

i'm sure I sound like a broken record with it, but what is your fat intake like?

3 fat chicks a week,......... BAZZZZING!

 

[EasyEJL]

3 fat chicks a week,......... BAZZZZING!

that would explain erectile dysfunction anyhow

 

[The Matrix]

3 fat chicks a week,......... BAZZZZING!

I am sure we all have been "hogging" before cut the guy some break. It must have been the beer googles LOL

 

[Dath]

Low fat intake with malabsoprtion = major hormone issues. I can not mentioned how many times I see this pattern in younger guys. If identifed then HRT is not need, but you may need something to help the body retrain to send the signal.

Matrix, is fixing a malabsorption problem as simple as taking things like digestive enzymes, betaine hydrochloride, probiotics, etc???

 

[The Matrix]

Wish it was, but there is a lot.to it. There is.no cookie cutter method to.go.about doing.it, it has been done.on individual basis. I had some people.it took.over a year to.heal.because of.how damage they were. The.wait.paid off and they are doing excellent. Since i found the top gi.Dr.in the US who.believes naturopathic.approaches i referred a few people to him and surprisingly i was not to far off except i did.not.understand the immune system like i do now.which is a huge component why others failed. Understanding the cellular integration of immune, neurology endocrine and psychological.system allows.for a more comprehensive and success approach.

 

[Rmartin]

An update...

Endo only wanted to treat symptoms. Wanted to put me on Cialis and mood drugs instead of treat the low test.

Went to pcp and had them refer me to a urologist that does test and Ed issues. Appointment is tomorrow and i'm kind of nervous.

I've drop from 21% bf to 19%, but i'm practically killing myself. I bike or run over 20 miles a week along with hard weight lifting 4 times a week.

I don't eat amazing, but I don't eat **** either. I have a very well balanced diet and pretty much stay away from overly starchy or fried foods. I get enough of everything else and take vitamins all the time.

We'll see what they say tomorrow. I'll let you guys know and keep you up to date.

PS haven't been on here... I met the perfect woman for me, and I couldn't **** her because of a limp dick. Now she won't give me the time of day. I've reached the end of my line with this issue. This is the only stressor in my life, and it's pretty much taken over every aspect of my being.

I hate who I am right now and who I have become. I need this to work for me... I don't know how much more I can handle.

 

[The Matrix]

An update...

Endo only wanted to treat symptoms. Wanted to put me on Cialis and mood drugs instead of treat the low test.

Went to pcp and had them refer me to a urologist that does test and Ed issues. Appointment is tomorrow and i'm kind of nervous.

I've drop from 21% bf to 19%, but i'm practically killing myself. I bike or run over 20 miles a week along with hard weight lifting 4 times a week.

I don't eat amazing, but I don't eat **** either. I have a very well balanced diet and pretty much stay away from overly starchy or fried foods. I get enough of everything else and take vitamins all the time.

We'll see what they say tomorrow. I'll let you guys know and keep you up to date.

PS haven't been on here... I met the perfect woman for me, and I couldn't **** her because of a limp dick. Now she won't give me the time of day. I've reached the end of my line with this issue. This is the only stressor in my life, and it's pretty much taken over every aspect of my being.

I hate who I am right now and who I have become. I need this to work for me... I don't know how much more I can handle.

Even with HRT you still treating symptoms, It will help with some thing, but will not completely resolve the issue. I've got a guy tuned up through his DR with total awesome HRT levels, but t does not mean crap because he can not absorb crap he is eating which is the going to be the next step and then over time when we have all green lights from thyroid, adrenal, and other factors we will test a restart. I use this principle when consulting with Dr's as it has been shown the most promising for dealing with root cause and not just symptoms.

 

[Rmartin]

Even with HRT you still treating symptoms, It will help with some thing, but will not completely resolve the issue. I've got a guy tuned up through his DR with total awesome HRT levels, but t does not mean crap because he can not absorb crap he is eating which is the going to be the next step and then over time when we have all green lights from thyroid, adrenal, and other factors we will test a restart. I use this principle when consulting with Dr's as it has been shown the most promising for dealing with root cause and not just symptoms.

So, what are you recommending? I can't sit around while my life falls apart around me.

I need to get back on track. If the TRT helps my dick and my body lose weight and retain muscle, then that would be a huge step in the right direction.

I need to start there. I need some sort of results. I'm a laughing stock. I'm the butt of jokes. I'm losing my best years. It us driving me mad.

 

[hitest]

So, what are you recommending? I can't sit around while my life falls apart around me.

I need to get back on track. If the TRT helps my dick and my body lose weight and retain muscle, then that would be a huge step in the right direction.

I need to start there. I need some sort of results. I'm a laughing stock. I'm the butt of jokes. I'm losing my best years. It us driving me mad.

If you need something short term try the Cialis. This will not hurt you and can get you back in the game. If the Cialis doesn't work then it is also somewhat diagnostic. You need to get that E2 test because that could be your next short term target. I hope your new doctor will order a more comprehensive panel of tests to help sort this out for the long term.

 

[The Matrix]

With Dr's I consult with I will recommend to have them people on HRT if quality of life is affect while I research other areas deeper and bring other areas back into balance to allow them to feel the full benefit of HRT. When I rip apart peoples blood work and work with some ones Dr, its amazing what is over looked by traditional medicine and antiaging clinics these days

 

[Rmartin]

Thanks for the Cialis recommendation, but i dont want to go down that road. It only fixes my dick, and it costs about $120 per week just for that.

Im having so many issues with my body including emotions and muscles and working out and all that jazz, i cant be happy with just hardons.

I have an appointment in an hour with a urologist that is highly recommended and supposedly works almost exclusively with things like this. His focus is Hypogonadism, and ED. Hopefully with his experience and my symptoms we can get on some sort of treatment that gets me in the right direction.

Ill make sure to get the E2 Sensitive test soon, but im not sure how accurate that is going to be since the test itself has been questioned a few times. I have done the regular e2 test and came back in a normal range, but i dont know how normal that is considering the test isnt very accurate and is actually meant for a womans levels.

Ill let you guys know as soon as i can.

Going to also try and get a nice battery of tests (as they are covered under my insruance as long as a dr orders them) which include the following:

Testosterone (total and free)
Estradiol
Luteinizing hormone (LH)
Follicle-stimulating hormone (FSH)
Prolactin
Dihydrotestosterone (DHT)
Progesterone
Prostate-specific antigen (PSA)
Dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) and DHEA-S
Pregnenolone
Cortisol
IGF-1
Testosterone (total and free)
Estradiol
Luteinizing hormone (LH)
Follicle-stimulating hormone (FSH)
Prolactin
Dihydrotestosterone (DHT)
Progesterone
Prostate-specific antigen (PSA)
Dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) and DHEA-S
Pregnenolone
Cortisol
IGF-1
Vitamin D status
Doctor’s Data Urine Toxic Metals view sample test results
SpectraCell Nutrient Testing

 

[The Matrix]

Thanks for the Cialis recommendation, but i dont want to go down that road. It only fixes my dick, and it costs about $120 per week just for that.

Im having so many issues with my body including emotions and muscles and working out and all that jazz, i cant be happy with just hardons.

I have an appointment in an hour with a urologist that is highly recommended and supposedly works almost exclusively with things like this. His focus is Hypogonadism, and ED. Hopefully with his experience and my symptoms we can get on some sort of treatment that gets me in the right direction.

Ill make sure to get the E2 Sensitive test soon, but im not sure how accurate that is going to be since the test itself has been questioned a few times. I have done the regular e2 test and came back in a normal range, but i dont know how normal that is considering the test isnt very accurate and is actually meant for a womans levels.

Ill let you guys know as soon as i can.

Going to also try and get a nice battery of tests (as they are covered under my insruance as long as a dr orders them) which include the following:

Testosterone (total and free)
Estradiol
Luteinizing hormone (LH)
Follicle-stimulating hormone (FSH)
Prolactin
Dihydrotestosterone (DHT)
Progesterone
Prostate-specific antigen (PSA)
Dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) and DHEA-S
Pregnenolone
Cortisol
IGF-1
Testosterone (total and free)
Estradiol
Luteinizing hormone (LH)
Follicle-stimulating hormone (FSH)
Prolactin
Dihydrotestosterone (DHT)
Progesterone
Prostate-specific antigen (PSA)
Dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) and DHEA-S
Pregnenolone
Cortisol
IGF-1
Vitamin D status
Doctor’s Data Urine Toxic Metals view sample test results
SpectraCell Nutrient Testing

Spectra cell is worth less, I have used it with Dr's in the past and did not show functional deficiency as nutra eval does when proper evaluated.

Heavy metals is useless with out the DMPS. This test are a start, but need to be more comprehensive.