looking for something to add to 1,4 AD cycle

[cardiojunkie]

I know that 1,4 AD is a relatively weak compound so it's not worth pulsing. The reason I'm interested in this supplement is for the endurance and recovery properties as well as it being non-toxic on the liver. Any strength and mass gains would be welcome but that's not really the main thing I'm going for.

What I'm looking for now is a way to lessen the effects of the HPTA shutdown which can occur with 1,4 AD. I know that Testabolan is designed to do that but I think that's more than what I need and has some undesirable properties.

The question is, if I'm running 1,4 AD BOLD at 600mg per day for 6-8 weeks, what can I take with it to lessen the effects of the HPTA shutdown while on cycle?

 

[isoc]

any hormonal is going to shut you down a little, so if your going to run a hormonal plan on shutdown. Testabolan is not toxic or anything, herbal extract and ecdy, I have heard good things. If it were me, I would pulse a halodrol clone or epi clone, M-W-F for 4-6 weeks, run some Cycle Support by AI on off days from pulsing. Dosing on the methyls will be dependent upon your age, experience and size. Post those and I am sure someone here can help. Also, any time you do a hormonal have a Serm on hand for pct, makes it nice and easy. For something like this a Serm and a natty test booster like testabolan should suffice, plus the continuance of the Cycle Support during pct. Hope this helps.

By the way, I know it is my first post, but I have run numerous illegal cycles as well as pro-hormones. I actually am planning on running 1,4ad bulk powder at 1.2 grams per day pulsed with epi at 50mgs per day as part of a cycle this spring. I am no guru, or scientist, but I do have some experience and there are many on this board that no their stuff, good place to be.

 

[isoc]

Just to clarify my jumbled post I meant for you to run the Bold with pulsing the hdrol or epi, sorry.

 

[cardiojunkie]

Just to clarify my jumbled post I meant for you to run the Bold with pulsing the hdrol or epi, sorry.

I had that idea before but I wasn't sure if the epi pulsing would end up increasing or decreasing natural test production. For myself though, I wouldn't pulse it at more than 20mg. I know that sounds low but I got shutdown a little before while pulsing at 30mg. It seemed to have the opposite effect at 20mg. Of course this could also be because I was suppressing more estrogen at 30mg.

I have some E-Bol on hand which is ecdy plus goodies so would that be a reasonable alternative to Testabolan so I don't have to buy more crap? Honestly though I wasn't much of a believer that ecdy does anything significant for natural test production. I only buy it because I feel relaxed when I'm on it.

By the way, where do you get bulk 1,4AD powder? I haven't seen that available for a while.

 

[EctoPower]

How old are you? What are your goals, really? And what is your height/weight? And lifting experience?

 

[VaughnTrue]

I wouldn't suggest pulsing ANYTHING...EVER.


If you need to stack it, I'd run it with Kilosports Trenadrol. That was an awesome combo for me

 

[cardiojunkie]

How old are you? What are your goals, really? And what is your height/weight? And lifting experience?

30 years old. My goal is complete fitness - cardio, muscle endurance, strength, etc. but with an emphasis on cardio and muscle endurance.

I've been lifting weights consistently for about 10 years. What I'm looking for in this cycle is something that will give me increased endurance, recovery, a little aggression, with minimal liver toxicity and minimal HPTA shutdown. I don't care nearly as much about vascularity or anything cosmetic though I know that 1,4 AD can be good for that as well.

I'm trying to figure out how to run this cycle with respect to all of this.

These are some of the supps I have on hand in case they can be used on or after the cycle:

Havoc/Epi
E-Bol
RPM
Drive
Diesel Test, Trib Test, Raw Test
Blue Up

 

[Werewolf]

I know that 1,4 AD is a relatively weak compound so it's not worth pulsing. The reason I'm interested in this supplement is for the endurance and recovery properties as well as it being non-toxic on the liver. Any strength and mass gains would be welcome but that's not really the main thing I'm going for.

What I'm looking for now is a way to lessen the effects of the HPTA shutdown which can occur with 1,4 AD. I know that Testabolan is designed to do that but I think that's more than what I need and has some undesirable properties.

The question is, if I'm running 1,4 AD BOLD at 600mg per day for 6-8 weeks, what can I take with it to lessen the effects of the HPTA shutdown while on cycle?

600 mg a day is too low a dose solo, but to each his own.

If you are worried about your balls shrinking then 1 ATD a day will help. Two may cause libido issues as you get deeper into the cycle.

I am running 1200 mg with a Epi/Phera pulse on top of it.
One ATD didn't seem like enough, but I may have panicked too early. I added 3 pumps of e-form on off days. I think this working, but with only 4 days it is too soon to known for sure. Epi has anti-e affect itself.

If it is libido you are worry about then H-drol, M-tst, or DHEA can help and I have them in reserve. If you go with DHEA beware of estrogen effects. If you are already on an AI then you may be able to go as high as 500 mgs. I can, but you may have gyno problems. DHEA is more suppressive than H-drol or M-TST.

 

[cardiojunkie]

600 mg a day is too low a dose solo, but to each his own.

May I just ask, how much do you weigh?

 

[LilPsychotic]

I had that idea before but I wasn't sure if the epi pulsing would end up increasing or decreasing natural test production. For myself though, I wouldn't pulse it at more than 20mg. I know that sounds low but I got shutdown a little before while pulsing at 30mg. It seemed to have the opposite effect at 20mg. Of course this could also be because I was suppressing more estrogen at 30mg.

I have some E-Bol on hand which is ecdy plus goodies so would that be a reasonable alternative to Testabolan so I don't have to buy more crap? Honestly though I wasn't much of a believer that ecdy does anything significant for natural test production. I only buy it because I feel relaxed when I'm on it.

By the way, where do you get bulk 1,4AD powder? I haven't seen that available for a while.

A low dose epi and bold is a pretty solid stack.

 

[cardiojunkie]

If it were me, I would pulse a halodrol clone or epi clone, M-W-F for 4-6 weeks, run some Cycle Support by AI on off days from pulsing.

I thought the main thing Cycle Support does is keep your liver healthy but in this case the only thing I'd be taking everyday is non toxic on the liver. I don't think that 20mg or so, 3 days a week of Epi/Havoc is really that hard on the liver. Also, the only flavors Cycle Support comes in is Peanut Butter and Chocolate, both of which I hate, though I'm sure I could get it down.

What I'm really looking for is something more androgenic and to counterbalance the HPTA shutdown effect of the 1,4 AD. In theory, pulsing Epi should do that, to some degree, I believe. But I'm not sure if it's enough, and if I overdo it with the Epi, then that would defeat the purpose.

Testabolan, Mass FX, and Jungle Warfare all at least claim to do what I want, but they are expensive, and I'm not sure how well they really work. So I'm still looking for something.

 

[EctoPower]

I thought the main thing Cycle Support does is keep your liver healthy but in this case the only thing I'd be taking everyday is non toxic on the liver. I don't think that 20mg or so, 3 days a week of Epi/Havoc is really that hard on the liver. Also, the only flavors Cycle Support comes in is Peanut Butter and Chocolate, both of which I hate, though I'm sure I could get it down.

What I'm really looking for is something more androgenic and to counterbalance the HPTA shutdown effect of the 1,4 AD. In theory, pulsing Epi should do that, to some degree, I believe. But I'm not sure if it's enough, and if I overdo it with the Epi, then that would defeat the purpose.

Testabolan, Mass FX, and Jungle Warfare all at least claim to do what I want, but they are expensive, and I'm not sure how well they really work. So I'm still looking for something.

It sounds like you'd be better off with something like RPM/Drive or Activate Xtreme (similar to MFX, but allegedly more potent). JW is suppressive, by the way. But you don't sound anywhere near ready for a hormonal cycle. You could get good results from a well built non-hormonal stack. And you wouldn't have to worry about HPTA shutdown.

 

[cardiojunkie]

But you don't sound anywhere near ready for a hormonal cycle. You could get good results from a well built non-hormonal stack. And you wouldn't have to worry about HPTA shutdown.

I've already done many hormonal cycles over the past several years, and with positive results for the most part. I have a reason why I'm more concerned now about HPTA shutdown than I was in the past. However, I don't think it'll be that bad given the dosages I would be using. I just wanted something to help counterbalance it some.

 

[isoc]

Vaughn is an experienced guy, I have read many of his posts on other boards,as well as this one and respect his knowledge, but I have pulsed many times with very good results and think it does have benefit in decreasing sides and lowering shutdown (yes I am a Dr. D disciple, and no I don't have any scientific evidence of the decreased shutdown, but my gains were very good and recovered rather well, meaning not much loss in pct and forward). 600 mgs is a very low dose and I have heard many experienced say that even a gram a day of the bulk was fairly weak. If you can, up the 1,4ad, and pulsed or not I do recommend it to be stacked. Epi/Halo clones are pretty mild methyls, trenadrol I have heard many good things about. the Cycle support does have liver protection, but there are a few ingredients that may help with shutdown a little. Although, if you are that concerned I would suggest not using anything hormonal, as even mild ones will shut you down to some degree. Plain old creatine mono and gms are a nice and cheap non-hormonal combo that works pretty well.

 

[cardiojunkie]

600 mgs is a very low dose and I have heard many experienced say that even a gram a day of the bulk was fairly weak.

Oddly enough, the recommended dosage on the i-force bottle is 400mg/day. Perhaps that's the amount you can take without noticeable adverse side effects.

 

[isoc]

I was not aware, I was going on feedback I have seen. Vaughn is an Iforce rep and I have seen where he has recommended higher dosages than 400 mgs.