I lab tested my Narrows Labs S23 capsules and this is what was found

[Renew1]

I hear what your saying man and can appreciate your perspective. If it were a larger sample size than 5 capsules or the deficiency were greater I would complain.
Their prices are very competitive so even if it is underdosed it is still relatively inexpensive compared to many others. The Sarms industry is shady and I am satisfied with the results of the test and my experiences with this company.

Fair enough my friend. Your purchase...your decision.
Thanks for popping for the sample. Things like that help us all.

 

[mixedup]

Actually their line up looks pretty good their hulk 2.0 has yk11 gw lgd and cialis and it comes with 120 tabs

 

[Rad83]

Actually their line up looks pretty good their hulk 2.0 has yk11 gw lgd and cialis and it comes with 120 tabs

I saw that,...What’s the point of the daily cialis? How is that ‘safe?’

 

[mixedup]

I saw that,...What’s the point of the daily cialis? How is that ‘safe?’

Daily cialis is good on blood pressure and it's a vasodialator so you get massive pumps

 

[RickyBlobby]

edit

 

[Smont]

Actually their line up looks pretty good their hulk 2.0 has yk11 gw lgd and cialis and it comes with 120 tabs

Say what

 

[Humble]

LOL. That's a 8.5% sampling. As far as samples go, that's huge.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not suggesting that they were attempting to cheat anyone. Only they know their motivation at this point. But apparently they did short him.

FYI, on such a small population (69), 5 observations is not a “huge” sample size from a statistical standpoint. A 90% confidence interval would require a sample size of 35.

 

[JoePaul39]

FYI, on such a small population (69), 5 observations is not a “huge” sample size from a statistical standpoint. A 90% confidence interval would require a sample size of 35.

View attachment 174454

Exactly. Reason I didn’t send in more is I needed to leave some for me to run lol.

 

[xR1pp3Rx]

Daily cialis is good on blood pressure and it's a vasodialator so you get massive pumps

I wouldn't go so far to say the pumps are massive~

 

[Renew1]

FYI, on such a small population (69), 5 observations is not a “huge” sample size from a statistical standpoint. A 90% confidence interval would require a sample size of 35.

View attachment 174454

I see what's printed there. But in my opinion, thats pretty ridiculous. Let's just make up a number.... If a "site" got in a kilo (yeah... Made up #) of a compound, do you really see them sacrificing half a kilo to get a "good sampling"?
Not going to happen.
Not with a site, and not with consumers (like JoePaul). Nobody (at least practically) is going to give away 1/2 of their product, AND pay $200+ for someone to tell them what they had.
Has it happened? Almost certainly.
Does it happen regularly with these types of compounds?
Almost certainly not.

Oh... And he had 60, not 69 to begin with.

 

[Chados]

This is exactly what I would do. over 20% gap from what is said on the bottle. You should ask for a refund. I am sure there would even be a lawsuit if this was in the case of protein.

Oh for sure. But you do as a consumer have the right to get what you buy. Most likely scenario would be the company sending another sample to you.

 

[Humble]

I see what's printed there. But in my opinion, thats pretty ridiculous. Let's just make up a number.... If a "site" got in a kilo (yeah... Made up #) of a compound, do you really see them sacrificing half a kilo to get a "good sampling"?
Not going to happen.
Not with a site, and not with consumers (like JoePaul). Nobody (at least practically) is going to give away 1/2 of their product, AND pay $200+ for someone to tell them what they had.
Has it happened? Almost certainly.
Does it happen regularly with these types of compounds?
Almost certainly not.

Oh... And he had 60, not 69 to begin with.

We agree, Renew1.

Just wanted to show that it’s difficult to know whether the remaining units were 80% or 120% of the label.

In fact, even within the 5 sample units tested there might have been substantial variation. We only know what the lab reported on all five samples.

In the end, It’s a judgment call for each consumer on whether 80% is close enough to 100% or not.

That said, I’d angle for a freebie or discount with these results.

Thanks for the response!

 

[Renew1]

We agree, Renew1.

Just wanted to show that it’s difficult to know whether the remaining units were 80% or 120% of the label.

In fact, even within the 5 sample units tested there might have been substantial variation. We only know what the lab reported on all five samples.

In the end, It’s a judgment call for each consumer on whether 80% is close enough to 100% or not.

That said, I’d angle for a freebie or discount with these results.

Thanks for the response!

Yeah... Just looking at it from a business standpoint...(assuming the best of the site owners)...they should want to know this. He actually did them a favor, and paid for something that is more their responsibility than his.

Like I said, I'm glad he got it tested. It is always better to know, regardless of the results.

 

[DWeaver]

So is Narrows Labs and Rock Labz the same people?

 

[Dthcore]

So is Narrows Labs and Rock Labz the same people?

I think they are and I can tell you their Superdrol is legit. My friend has 4 days left of it. Mother Trucker GREW! Took it with 250mg of test a week.

 

[DWeaver]

I think they are and I can tell you their Superdrol is legit. My friend has 4 days left of it. Mother Trucker GREW! Took it with 250mg of test a week.

Good to know. Thanks man.

 

[Quest]

I guess if they gave me enough of free product to provide me with what I paid for and then extra for being short.

Why would anybody settle for 20% less than what they paid for?

 

[DWeaver]

I guess if they gave me enough of free product to provide me with what I paid for and then extra for being short.

Why would anybody settle for 20% less than what they paid for?

One way to look at it is if the standard is around -10% then they are 10% less than the standard.

 

[Renew1]

One way to look at it is if the standard is around -10% then they are 10% less than the standard.

LOL.

 

[DWeaver]

LOL.

I hope you saw my facetiousness there.

 

[Renew1]

I hope you saw my facetiousness there.

LOL.
Yep.

 

[Old Witch]

One way to look at it is if the standard is around -10% then they are 10% less than the standard.

Another way to look at it is the standard is for there to not be any more than 1 mg of a SARM in there, mixed with 1mg methyl tren and half a mg of arimadex, so they're 700% above standard.

Half of all SARMS are that, the other half are just what's on the label in less than a tenth of a dose up to ten times the dose, mixed randomly in every bottle.

 

[DWeaver]

Another way to look at it is the standard is for there to not be any more than 1 mg of a SARM in there, mixed with 1mg methyl tren and half a mg of arimadex, so they're 700% above standard.

Half of all SARMS are that, the other half are just what's on the label in less than a tenth of a dose up to ten times the dose, mixed randomly in every bottle.

Only a few RC sites I trust and I really don’t see the point in running a SARM when it really isn’t that hard to get legit AAS/PH’s on line.

 

[Old Witch]

Only a few RC sites I trust and I really don’t see the point in running a SARM when it really isn’t that hard to get legit AAS/PH’s on line.

Well, they work differently, so I'd stack them... Using a SARM with an AAS is going to be like running an AAS with higher serum estrogen levels. SARMS modulate the androgen receptor to be more efficient in the way it interacts with other compounds. That's why the broscience is stated over and over that they're pointless once your test drops down below a certain level. The only exception is going to be yk11 as it is steroidal and causes actual activation of the AR beyond simple modulation.

 

[Old Witch]

Also, by that same rationale, what's the point of using PHs when you can get legit aas?

 

[DWeaver]

Also, by that same rationale, what's the point of using PHs when you can get legit aas?

I mean... I understand your point but there’s a few PH’s that are better than AAS, if you are speaking orally only.

 

[DWeaver]

Well, they work differently, so I'd stack them... Using a SARM with an AAS is going to be like running an AAS with higher serum estrogen levels. SARMS modulate the androgen receptor to be more efficient in the way it interacts with other compounds. That's why the broscience is stated over and over that they're pointless once your test drops down below a certain level. The only exception is going to be yk11 as it is steroidal and causes actual activation of the AR beyond simple modulation.

Didn’t know this. Thanks.

 

[Old Witch]

I mean... I understand your point but there’s a few PH’s that are better than AAS, if you are speaking orally only.

Mentabolan, 1AD, M1AD... They're all still steroids, just because they're Diones doesn't really mean much other than they have good compounds they can convert into, not just bad ones. Well it also makes them more effective, being active outright moreso than olones as Diones can often be.

 

[Old Witch]

I mean... I understand your point but there’s a few PH’s that are better than AAS, if you are speaking orally only.

Even injectable, actually. They used to have a 1AD estered injectable on the shelves. 1-T cyp and base too. 1AD was actually stronger, but you really notice that it's not 1-Test. 1-AD has a lot more energy to it. That stuff wasn't around long. I used a lot more 1-Test.

 

[mixedup]

I would bet if you tested 5 RC’s at least 3 would be underdosed or worse have the wrong compound.

That's why I'm weary of sarms.

 

[JoePaul39]

I think they are and I can tell you their Superdrol is legit. My friend has 4 days left of it. Mother Trucker GREW! Took it with 250mg of test a week.

What leads you to the belief Rock Labz and Narrow Labs are the same companies man?

 

[DWeaver]

What leads you to the belief Rock Labz and Narrow Labs are the same companies man?

There’s a IG account that advertises both companies. It’s 1 guy and that’s all he has on there.

 

[Dthcore]

There’s a IG account that advertises both companies. It’s 1 guy and that’s all he has on there.

This!!!! And the advertisement for the bottles look the same for some products!

 

[DWeaver]

Here’s the IG

https://instagram.com/insydeoutfitness?utm_********ig_profile_share&igsh****1si4kl8jbr2t5

 

[Dthcore]

Check it out

 

[Borashi]

The ones weary of buying SARMs, just have to find the right sources with high purity hplc tested. You can get fake gear to. That is under dosed or spiked. Reputation is all that matters.

 

[Borashi]

I recall protein is tested frequently and muscle Pharma consistently tests below prescribed dosage on the label. Last test of the combat series came in at 20 vs. 25g as claimed on label. There still in business. My point is this. Tons of companies that have poor quality control. How can that be fixed? Sue every big name company? God bless America.

 

[Renew1]

I recall protein is tested frequently and muscle Pharma consistently tests below prescribed dosage on the label. Last test of the combat series came in at 20 vs. 25g as claimed on label. There still in business. My point is this. Tons of companies that have poor quality control. How can that be fixed? Sue every big name company? God bless America.

I've seen products come along that people have been looking for, and shortly after it hits this board, they sell out.
As long as we pay for whatever they give (even if it is less than what we actually were paying them for), they'll just give whatever they choose to give. There is no reason to do better.

But if we call it to their attention (and remind them that we post our experiences on this huge board, if necessary), then they do have a reason to give us what we pay for.
The same buying power that sells out products in record time, can choose to take it's business elsewhere.

 

[Mike Arnold]

I'm definitely no Schill.

I just speak out against others trying to trash a company that provides pure raws whether its under-dosed or not.

Way to many fly by night companies that are created and under-dose or spike sarms (see CNN study for this) , I'd rather buy an under-dosed, lab tested sarm, from a reputable company vs. buying an unknown mystery brand not knowning what you are going to get. So go ahead bash Narrows all you want, but at least their raws are 99% pure and proven, so as OP pointed out, he knows exactly what he is putting into his body.

MA Research: 99% purity, properly dosed, great price (probably best price on the market).

 

[Mike Arnold]

Sure, but how can we now be confident that this shortfall is not across the board on all of their products? Wearing my "Bored, Paranoid and Suspicious As All Fuk" hat, I can think of at least half a dozen scenarios of what could possibly be going on. And one of those scenarios is that maybe their manufacturer is behind any decision to shortfall. Id assume if Narrows Labs are doing any testing, its testing of the raws prior to packaging. Which might mean they are relying on the packaging company's self-reports of standards. Id also assume, then, that NL might want to know of any inconsistency in packaging.

But I doubt NL are not doing any kind of "auditing" of their domestic manufacturer. But the possibilities are endless. Which is why Id email them the results.

How would I know what they are doing? It's not my company. I have my own research company...and I know my stuff is good. That's all I'm concerned with.

 

[Old Witch]

MA Research: 99% purity, properly dosed, great price (probably best on the market).

Any chance you might start carrying follistatin? When I was researching anabolics heavily in the early 2000s I think that would have been helpful to avoid changing compounds so often. A small dosage every six weeks would be an interesting research inquest.

 

[Mike Arnold]

I agree with you. I am actually pleased with the test results. 80 percent isn’t bad. Even if I did think I was entitled to a refund it would only be a 20 percent refund since I got 80 percent of the compound. With so many fake sarms out there I plan to continue to run their stuff. Also, keep in mind this was only a test of 5 capsules out of a 69 capsule bottle. It is very possible had I tested all the capsules it could have returned with an even higher percentage of the active compound.

It's really simple. 20% may be good compared to some companies that sell total trash,. but don't fool yourself, getting 20% less than what you paid for is not OK. You may be fine with it and if so, then that is your decision to make...but pretending that it is OK for a company to moderately under-dose a product simply because some companies are worse, is like saying it is OK if someone steals $100 from you because everyone else stole $1,000. It's flawed logic. Just because some companies are worse,it does not mean that one should lower their standards and accept mediocrity.

Now, as far as I am concerned, this very well may have been an accident (it probably was because under-dosing S23 by 20% would've made basically no difference in terms of profit, considering how inexpensive S23 is to manufacture), but anyone who finds themselves in this situation has a right to contact the company and expect either a partial refund, above average future discount code, or even a whole new bottle of S23.


In other words, it's nothing to crucify the company over, but it shouldn't be ignored, either. If something was wrong with one of my products, I would WANT the person to contact me and let me know, so that I could make it right and hopefully maintain their business. It's far better to make a little less on one sale than to lose a customer permanently.

 

[Renew1]

It's really simple. 20% may be good compared to some companies that sell total trash,. but don't fool yourself, getting 20% less than what you paid for is not OK. You may be fine with it and if so, then that is your decision to make...but pretending that it is OK for a company to moderately under-dose a product simply because some companies are worse, is like saying it is OK if someone steals $100 from you because everyone else stole $1,000. It's flawed logic. Just because some companies are worse,it does not mean that one should lower their standards and accept mediocrity.

Now, as far as I am concerned, this very well may have been an accident (it probably was because under-dosing S23 by 20% would've made basically no difference in terms of profit, considering how inexpensive S23 is to manufacture), but anyone who finds themselves in this situation has a right to contact the company and expect either a partial refund, above average future discount code, or even a whole new bottle of S23.


In other words, it's nothing to crucify the company over, but it shouldn't be ignored, either. If something was wrong with one of my products, I would WANT the person to contact me and let me know, so that I could make it right and hopefully maintain their business. It's far better to make a little less on one sale than to lose a customer permanently.

Thanks for speaking the truth, Mike.

 

[Mike Arnold]

Ostarine is at least half the price of S23 on a per mg basis so there is at least 1 cheaper Sarm out there. I also pay almost the same price on a per mg basis for S23 as I do LGD 4033.

If your prices are based on the actual production cost of these compounds (which is how it should when purchasing bulk raws), then Ostarine costs only slightly than S23. It's so close that there is no meaningful difference between the two; not from a manufacturer's or research company's perspective. With that said, if you're paying anywhere near the same amount for S23 as you are for LGD, you're either getting ripped off on the S23...or the person selling you the LGD is losing money/making nothing. I seriously doubt it is the later, so I will assume it is the former and say that it sounds like you are overpaying for the S23. S23 should be significantly cheaper than LGD, as it costs significantly less to manufacture.

 

[Mike Arnold]

Check it out

View attachment 174919


View attachment 174920

The guy (who owns this company) is just looking to get absolutely ****ed by the FDA. I guess he wants to risk prison...because that's exactly what he's doing. He sells both controlled substances AND US prescription drugs in capsule form! Either of these things could put someone in legal hot water, but selling actual controlled substances in capsule form has to be about one of the dumbest things someone could do. This guy must think he is invincible. All the FDA has to d is look at his products one time...or have someone inform the FDA...and he s ****ed! This is what happened to me with Vicaine. Someone reported me--literally tried to get me in trouble, but I wasn't stupid enough to encapsulate controlled substances and US script drugs, so I just had to stop selling it. This guy is literally asking to go to prison--openly adverting controlled substances for human use. What he's doing is no different than selling Vicodin or testosterone on a public website. This kind of stuff blows my mind.

 

[Mike Arnold]

Any chance you might start carrying follistatin? When I was researching anabolics heavily in the early 2000s I think that would have been helpful to avoid changing compounds so often. A small dosage every six weeks would be an interesting research inquest.

No...and I'll tell you why. It's because untagged follistatin costs a fortune. I've use follistatin many times...and only once did it do what it is supposed to do...because it was untagged and dosed at 500 mcg/ml (rather than the standard 100 mcg/ml). If follistatin is good, it takes about 500 mcg/day to produce the kind of gains that one should expect. I once gained 17 lbs in 21 days using 500 mcg of untagged follistatin daily. Through lab analysis it was shown to be untagged and properly dosed. Furthermore, it had just been produced 1 week prior (follistatin doesn't stay good for a very long time).

Virtually every other brand of follistatin I tried was tagged and the dosage ranged from 100 mcg to 500 mcg. All of these provided pathetic gains, if any at all. Unfortunately, almost all follistatin is tagged...and there is a huge difference between tagged and untagged follistatin. The reason it's almost always tagged is because it makes it WAY easier and cheaper to produce. Making untagged follistatin requires the molecule to be synthesized from scratch, with each part of the 300+ molecular chain being individually strung together in a very labor intensive and costly process. Therefore, after a lab makes their first run they "tag" it, so they can use it as a "copy" or "blueprint" for future runs. This makes it way easier and less costly to reproduce. The problem with this is that tagged follistatin doesn't work the same in the body. So, the only option is to spend a small fortune having it synthesized from scratch...or use tagged follistatin. In my opinion, neither option is viable.

 

[mixedup]

Hello Mike.

I trust your products and since I know they are correct was hoping you could tell me how much prami is ok I know at even 1.25 my stomach would ache thanks in advance

 

[Nac]

How would I know what they are doing? It's not my company. I have my own research company...and I know my stuff is good. That's all I'm concerned with.

Lol 1: it was kind of a rhetorical question, the point being precisely that you and I are ignorant of these facts and cant answer this question.

Lol 2: you chose to pipe up in here about this, so I dunno why youre now being all indifferent.

 

[DWeaver]

The guy (who owns this company) is just looking to get absolutely ****ed by the FDA. I guess he wants to risk prison...because that's exactly what he's doing. He sells both controlled substances AND US prescription drugs in capsule form! Either of these things could put someone in legal hot water, but selling actual controlled substances in capsule form has to be about one of the dumbest things someone could do. This guy must think he is invincible. All the FDA has to d is look at his products one time...or have someone inform the FDA...and he s ****ed! This is what happened to me with Vicaine. Someone reported me--literally tried to get me in trouble, but I wasn't stupid enough to encapsulate controlled substances and US script drugs, so I just had to stop selling it. This guy is literally asking to go to prison--openly adverting controlled substances for human use. What he's doing is no different than selling Vicodin or testosterone on a public website. This kind of stuff blows my mind.

So what was illegal about Vicaine?

 

[Old Witch]

No...and I'll tell you why. It's because untagged follistatin costs a fortune. I've use follistatin many times...and only once did it do what it is supposed to do...because it was untagged and dosed at 500 mcg/ml (rather than the standard 100 mcg/ml). If follistatin is good, it takes about 500 mcg/day to produce the kind of gains that one should expect. I once gained 17 lbs in 21 days using 500 mcg of untagged follistatin daily. Through lab analysis it was shown to be untagged and properly dosed. Furthermore, it had just been produced 1 week prior (follistatin doesn't stay good for a very long time).

Virtually every other brand of follistatin I tried was tagged and the dosage ranged from 100 mcg to 500 mcg. All of these provided pathetic gains, if any at all. Unfortunately, almost all follistatin is tagged...and there is a huge difference between tagged and untagged follistatin. The reason it's almost always tagged is because it makes it WAY easier and cheaper to produce. Making untagged follistatin requires the molecule to be synthesized from scratch, with each part of the 300+ molecular chain being individually strung together in a very labor intensive and costly process. Therefore, after a lab makes their first run they "tag" it, so they can use it as a "copy" or "blueprint" for future runs. This makes it way easier and loss costly to reproduce. The problem with this is that tagged follistatin doesn't work the same in the body. So, the only option is to spend a small fortune having it synthesized from scratch...or use tagged follistatin. In my opinion, neither option is viable.

The small dose would have been an entire 1 mg, and follistatin I've seen comes as powder, needs to be reconstituted before use. Only one place had it, I suppose it was probably tagged. Speaking openly about it, I guess I mean I was on such a heavy and prolonged cycle my gains basically stopped and i had to start swapping out compounds. i hypothesized that follistatin, one dose, might restart the process. But back then it wasn't around.