Havoc Letdown :(

BigVida

BigVida

Banned
After eighteen days, I've seen no results minus some minor strength increases. Disappointed is not the word...I .put a ton of cash into this on supps and food and haven't gotten anything. Ive read tons and it seems it should've given me something by this point, or am I wrong? If something .doesnt happen withing three or four days I'm cutting the cycle and going into pct : (
 
6'1" and 160lbs? clearly bad diet and not enough experience and knowledge for a PH/DS such as epistane...Go into PCT with a SERM or use your chaparral labs thing and say bye to your nuts...get a serm seriously and don't touch PH/DS stuff until you learn to bulk naturally...and at least reach 200lbs naturally...
 
I'm 160 because infighting mma and cut down. I fight in tournaments at 155, and did pretty good at the NAGA tourney here in Houston. I'm using epi to drop a little more for an upcoming tourney while staying lean, so don't pass your almighty anabolic judgement so quick champ. If I had a dollar for every "you don't weigh enough, your diets trash" post id be ordering supps and sending them to the homeless so they could get ripped at the soup kitchen. Moving on
 
Four days over two weeks, and normal cycles of epi are 6 weeks. Patience man.

Sent from my super duper VS920 4G using Am.com app!
 
Thanks lhns, I'm basically just asking for reassurance that there's still time for mass gains/results/fat loss and it isnt a total bust. And celorza, ill plug 200mg of superdrol daily until I hit 84 before I listen to a witty 21, Twenty one! Year olds advice. I've lifted and jumped and cut weight for years, dont try and coach me on cycle tactics. I have a serm, and everythings set up how It should be. ALL I'M WANTING TO KNOW IS STRICTLY IF THERE'S STILL ROOM FOR IT TO KICK IN, not if I weigh enough. **** off
 
BigVida said:
I'm 160 because infighting mma and cut down. I fight in tournaments at 155, and did pretty good at the NAGA tourney here in Houston. I'm using epi to drop a little more for an upcoming tourney while staying lean, so don't pass your almighty anabolic judgement so quick champ. If I had a dollar for every "you don't weigh enough, your diets trash" post id be ordering supps and sending them to the homeless so they could get ripped at the soup kitchen. Moving on
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Then you must be a really sh*tty fighter if you need to be that thin to win.
 
If U were runnin it for 6 weeks, i say keep going.. My epi results didn't start til end of week 3/start of 4.. taking 30/30/40/40/40/40..
 
Pretty sure I can take your 185 lb beau bokan wanna be ass. It's my preferred weight class for many reasons. What kinda of training do u have, besides downing protein and eating superdrol? I'm sure you'll pull something out your ass to 1 up me so who cares. Anyway , thanks for the positive feedback for the two who gave legit answers, and **** you to the two self righteous ****stains that would rather start a flame war than give advice
 
I don't understand. You're complaining about not making gains but say you wanna stay the same weight for MMA. Which is it?
 
A lot of people don't feel the kick-in of epi until the end of week 3 to the middle of week 4, which you're still ahead of, so ride it out.

Also, in regards to calling Reyman a Beau Bokan wannabe...I looked up Beau Bokan on google, and I can only guess you're calling him a wannabe because of his avatar. However, I don't believe that avatar is Reyman...pretty sure that's Zyzz, and pretty sure Beau Bokan has a long way to go before reaching Zyzz status lol.
 
ReyMan said:
Then you must be a really sh*tty fighter if you need to be that thin to win.
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Epic post is epic lol...he wants to see gains in Epi also when he is trying to cut even lower? 155 at 6'0"? human beanpole dude...and besides I agree with Rey you must be some crappy fighter haha...just relax bro, no gains come in a deficit specially if you don't know how to diet like you have proven :)! Anyhow...strength gains should be there, but buying something from a bogus company can be the reason you are not seeing anything too!!
 
Wow, so much hate.

Back on topic... If you're taking an anabolic then this is innately going to push you up into a higher weight bracket as the density of muscle rises. With more synthetic testosterone you're going to lose the fat and gain some strength too (which isn't always maintained post-cycle) but the weight of muscle gained will affect you if that's the class you want to fight in. If your primary goal is to lose fat then I don't think a PH is for you mate. In my personal opinion to see most benefit from PHs an increased intake of calories and protein need to be consumed. All the best though mate, hope it kicks in soon for ya
 
Give the man solid advice or STFU. A lot of PMS'ing negative Nancies in here today.

Epistane is a compound that most people don't notice too much effect until the 3rd-4th week. Don't cut your cycle just yet.
 
Stick w it bro n try to eat pretty clean while your cutting. My havoc cycle really didn't kick in til 25 days in, I felt like a God about week 5. Goodluck
 
Wait a little longer my havoc didn't give me the full effect until week 3. Since week 3 it's been awesome!
 
BigVida said:
I'm 160 because infighting mma and cut down. I fight in tournaments at 155, and did pretty good at the NAGA tourney here in Houston. I'm using epi to drop a little more for an upcoming tourney while staying lean, so don't pass your almighty anabolic judgement so quick champ. If I had a dollar for every "you don't weigh enough, your diets trash" post id be ordering supps and sending them to the homeless so they could get ripped at the soup kitchen. Moving on
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Wiat so your trying to maintain strength while getting leaner so obviously your on a deficit of kcal.No wonder you don't feel good your fricking cutting.

Btw I don't care what you say 6 foot and 160 is skinny and you are in no position to use a PH/DS
 
Maybe up your dose to 50? You should be feeling a little different at least, since your introducing a compound. If not then maybe you got a bad batch? In either case i would finish the havoc and do a complete pct.
 
My strengths up a little, just not leaning out as quick as I expected I guess....I walk around at one eighty, but a few months before I have major tourneys I cut down a massive amount (25 lbs) . I'd rather fight at a weight I can feel good at, no matter how skinny it may be, than be bulky, slow, and uncomfortable while i train. Wasn't posting this thread to start an arguement it have a dick showing contest , which it quickly became. I feel beastier in the gym, but I was hoping to shed a little more fat and kinda recomp the rest of what's left to lose. Def sticking to the rest of the cycle, just hope Its worth it. Thanks for the feedback guys.
 
If you are eating below maintenance and still gaining strength then epi is working. also 18 days is still early, it should start to shine towards the end of the 4th week. On another note i didnt actually "feel" anything from epi until i hit 65+ mgs
 
darsh89 said:
If you are eating below maintenance and still gaining strength then epi is working. also 18 days is still early, it should start to shine towards the end of the 4th week. On another note i didnt actually "feel" anything from epi until i hit 65+ mgs
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How much muscle did u gain?
 
BigVida said:
Pretty sure I can take your 185 lb beau bokan wanna be ass. It's my preferred weight class for many reasons. What kinda of training do u have, besides downing protein and eating superdrol? I'm sure you'll pull something out your ass to 1 up me so who cares. Anyway , thanks for the positive feedback for the two who gave legit answers, and **** you to the two self righteous ****stains that would rather start a flame war than give advice
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Lolol well to answer your question I boxed throughout highschool and stopped shortly after, it doesn't make me a professional fighter but I'd still kick your lanky ass.

I've got a question though, why is your username BigVida? Mr. 6'0" 160

I hope you fail your drug test, cheater.
 
Just keep at it BigVida! Anyone that is criticizing your fighting weight obviously does not understand any weight class based competitive sport.

Reyman, Don't profess your lack of knowledge as understanding!
 
Axillist said:
Just keep at it BigVida! Anyone that is criticizing your fighting weight obviously does not understand any weight class based competitive sport.

Reyman, Don't profess your lack of knowledge as understanding!
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I understand why he would compete in a low weight class, but using steroids to get strong while staying in such a light weight class isn't respectable at all
 
Everyone uses some kinda performance enhancing drug once you get past the bottom level amateur stuff. It's an extremely competitive sport this day and age, and has surpassed boxing in every way. I'm level 3 combative trained from my army days, if you know what that even is. After completing the courses I figured.I'd stick with it. BigVidas been my username in everything, so what. I'm trying to understand why a select few of u like to click up on the new guys and try and bully people into thinking you're a buncha chemical badasses. Makes ya a cronie
 
BigVida said:
Everyone uses some kinda performance enhancing drug once you get past the bottom level amateur stuff. It's an extremely competitive sport this day and age, and has surpassed boxing in every way. I'm level 3 combative trained from my army days, if you know what that even is. After completing the courses I figured.I'd stick with it. BigVidas been my username in everything, so what. I'm trying to understand why a select few of u like to click up on the new guys and try and bully people into thinking you're a buncha chemical badasses. Makes ya a cronie
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So man up and get to 185. At your height and weight I can see smaller guys being able to take you down and pound the crap out of you. Now if your just fighting in some back yard **** fight than by all means cheat a way. 3-4 weeks for epi to kick in that's why you save the higher doses 50MG and above for weeks 4 thru 6. Remember though the strength will go quick and since you have no interest in putting on muscle just too cut weight I don't see a point in using any steriod. Epistane is not helping you win any MMA fight.
 
This guy sounds like a hormonal 16 year old. Very immature, your are definitely not ready psychologically for AAS regardless of your size.
 
Nekt said:
This guy sounds like a hormonal 16 year old. Very immature, your are definitely not ready psychologically for AAS regardless of your size.
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Take your knowledgeable eight posts ass outta here
 
darsh89 said:
If you are eating below maintenance and still gaining strength then epi is working. also 18 days is still early, it should start to shine towards the end of the 4th week. On another note i didnt actually "feel" anything from epi until i hit 65+ mgs
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If you don't feel anything until week 4 your doing it wrong.YOu should feel it in week 2 if not a few days before it.

Yes this OP really seems immature.I don't know why your coming on here and telling us off for telling you the truth.I'm sure you had your reasons for taking a DS but your behaviour is appaling.Y0ur like that MMA guy on that MTV show I'm on Steroids on youtube.Bad attitude but despite all this good luck with the fight.YOur gonna be the tallest guy in the 160lb weight class that's for sure.
 
First you should be aware of what you have on your hands... be sure if its legit first... then take a look at your mealplans and adjust em to your goals IMO if you have legit epistane, you should see results even with no change on diet...but sometims it takes time to see anything, some people feel it faster than others, you dont mention your dosing, and if you are using it solo, you better dose it high. you can keep it up and see what happens, specially if you are using the real thing, then go for PCT. just my .02 cents!
 
Hey thanks for the reply, dosing it at 30/30/30/40/40/40. I can feel the chemical, but I cant see any physical changes as of yet which is bothering me. I figured three weeks in I would have seen some kind of physical result. From what I've read, usually guys have started to cut up around 20 days in, and tommorrows day 21 for me
 
BigVida said:
Hey thanks for the reply, dosing it at 30/30/30/40/40/40. I can feel the chemical, but I cant see any physical changes as of yet which is bothering me. I figured three weeks in I would have seen some kind of physical result. From what I've read, usually guys have started to cut up around 20 days in, and tommorrows day 21 for me
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Okay, so you say you "feel the chemical" then lets assume you have the real thing, then keep it up... put it this way, you already invested in it, just see what happens, also 3 weeks is early. and keep in mind that you see yourself on a daily basis, hard to tell if you are really gettin that cutting benefits watching youserlf daily in the mirror, and if you are on a calorie deficit, you barely see strenght gains, but still youll feel endurance... my advice, dose it at 40 even 50 mgs and keep the remaining 3 weeks.... i remember when i ran havoc and tren stack... i barely could see any difference in bodyfat, until my girlfriend took a picture of me and i was very surprised... IMO havoc shouldnt dissapoint you, it is even better than winny... good luck and keep us posted!
 
KenTheEagle said:
Okay, so you say you "feel the chemical" then lets assume you have the real thing, then keep it up... put it this way, you already invested in it, just see what happens, also 3 weeks is early. and keep in mind

that you see yourself on a daily basis, hard to tell if you are really gettin that cutting benefits watching youserlf daily in the mirror, and if you are on a calorie deficit, you barely see strenght gains, but still youll feel endurance... my advice, dose it at 40 even 50 mgs and keep the remaining 3 weeks.... i remember when i ran havoc and tren stack... i barely could see any difference in bodyfat, until my girlfriend took a picture of me and i was very surprised... IMO havoc shouldnt dissapoint you, it is even better than winny... good luck and keep us posted!
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Hey thanks brother, good to hear some positive feedback amongst the petty talk. When did you start noticing lean gains? Middle of week 4?
 
BigVida said:
Hey thanks brother, good to hear some positive feedback amongst the petty talk. When did you start noticing lean gains? Middle of week 4?
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No problem bro!... when i saw most of the gains was at week 5!... sure at week 4 i was pleased, but at week 5 i was on top, veins everywhere and small waist with fuller muscles... you see theres a point when you see a dramatic change without even noticing so id say at week 5 youll be surprised. take a picture now and then at week 5-6 and youll see ;)
 
Hell yeah that's what I wanna hear. Repped ya for the positive response!
 
hvactech said:
18 days=2.5 weeks......impatient
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x2

chocolatemilk said:
this

and pick a better steroid for sports purposes
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x2

Roniboney said:
Wiat so your trying to maintain strength while getting leaner so obviously your on a deficit of kcal.No wonder you don't feel good your fricking cutting.

Btw I don't care what you say 6 foot and 160 is skinny and you are in no position to use a PH/DS
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Gotta kind of agree with this.


I understand you want to fight at 155 thats cool, I'm 215-220ish right now and I've cut down to 170-175, I understand how good it feels fighting at a lighter weight, but I don't think you will be happy with your gains from epi on a deicit diet doing a lot of mma training. So if your on an mma routine, doing weight training or conditioning and on a cutting diet, epi won't do much with that. If your diet and training is on point you should be able to get ripped up at 6'1, 160 all natural.
 
I really dont think he chose the "wrong" compound, for my understanding, he wants a recomp, and havoc definately will help him with that, is one of the best recomps agents. on the other hand, weight isnt all that matters... he can exchange water/fat weight for lean muscle and keep the same weight... look extremely dry if he wants... and epi can do that!

By the way OP here are some tips that can enhance absortion

1.- do not take your doses along with a high fiber meal

2.- take your epi with a fatty meal

3.- split the doses and take em every 6-8 hours
 
I have messed with Havoc, our own IBE Epistane, and Epi-strong and Havoc was the weakest for me.
 
Strength is way up.today guys, I'm thoroughly pleased! Hoping to see some.recomp.effects the next seven days, feeling great now!
 
KenTheEagle said:
I really dont think he chose the "wrong" compound, for my understanding, he wants a recomp, and havoc definately will help him with that, is one of the best recomps agents. on the other hand, weight isnt all that matters... he can exchange water/fat weight for lean muscle and keep the same weight... look extremely dry if he wants... and epi can do that!

By the way OP here are some tips that can enhance absortion

1.- do not take your doses along with a high fiber meal

2.- take your epi with a fatty meal

3.- split the doses and take em every 6-8 hours
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What are your thoughts on milk thistle intervening with the epi? I've been taking my C.A. four hours after , just in case .
 
There is some research out there that says sillymarin(Milk thistle) does indeed slightly inhibit androgen receptors binding potential. To what level though I don't believe has been determined. TUDCA or UDCA is also another option that doesn't seem to contain any negative side effects and actually can help increase absorption rates. The downer is that both of those substances are a little pricey. You can always go with liv52 and save a few bucks and save the milk thistle for your pct and off cycle.
 
Axillist said:
There is some research out there that says sillymarin(Milk thistle) does indeed slightly inhibit androgen receptors binding potential. To what level though I don't believe has been determined. TUDCA or UDCA is also another option that doesn't seem to contain any negative side effects and actually can help increase absorption rates. The downer is that both of those substances are a little pricey. You can always go with liv52 and save a few bucks and save the milk thistle for your pct and off cycle.
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x 2!... there is evidence of milk thistle slightly hindering gains, but is just theorical it seems... On the other hand TUDCA is an amazing liver protector, no evidence of hindering gains, in fact i think TUDCA or UDCA is the best you could run... try liver longer if you cna find it... on my past superdrol cycle i used it and i didnt ahve any single issue... some people report appetite suppression whle on a strong methyl such superdrol or madol, and i always had great appetite and no lethargy, there are blood tests with impressive results 2 ;)
 
KenTheEagle said:
x 2!... there is evidence of milk thistle slightly hindering gains, but is just theorical it seems... On the other hand TUDCA is an amazing liver protector, no evidence of hindering gains, in fact i think TUDCA or UDCA is the best you could run... try liver longer if you cna find it... on my past superdrol cycle i used it and i didnt ahve any single issue... some people report appetite suppression whle on a strong methyl such superdrol or madol, and i always had great appetite and no lethargy, there are blood tests with impressive results 2 ;)
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Agreed! Keep in mind as well that Nutraplanet is also supposed to be restocking TUDCA in the near future. Although, many of us have been waiting many months for that day.
 
Yeah this cycle hasn't been the greatest, have a week left and gained many 2 lbs ...
 
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