Fat loss insan1ty with Sup3r-11 and Ignit3

Remember what I sited above about the 1 to 4 ratio of glycogen and water. Well salt has a ratio many times above that. Closer to 100/1. Could you have added too much salt which has caused water retention?

good thinking on this. I don't know what I would have gotten the salt from except for the beef jerky. Beyond that I very little so there wasn't really any source of salt. Some spices on my chicken Maybe.

At the end of the day I am positive about my caloric intake so I know that it's going to be water weight. I'm not worried about water weight because I'm trying to lose fat.

Lyle McDonald actually discussed as a phenomenon where people tend to feel marbles under their skin as they're losing weight. And they won't lose much weight at all for a couple days or a week even and then suddenly they lose for 5 pounds. He has a hypothesis that as the fat cells burn fat the void is filled with water until suddenly it flushes out. This seems to describe the way things work whether it is true or not.

At the end of the day the water will come off eventually. As long as I'm burning fat in the interim when that finally happens I'll be much less.
 
U mentioned cheese sticks. Some cheeses have enormous amounts of salt. Just a thought. And yes beef jerky may have too. Interesting what u mentioned about lyle McDonalds theory too
 
U mentioned cheese sticks. Some cheeses have enormous amounts of salt. Just a thought. And yes beef jerky may have too. Interesting what u mentioned about lyle McDonalds theory too

. Yes. You are correct. I've never check the salt on those. I never really watched salt intake myself. If anything I'm usually trying to get more while on this diet. Don't want to start cramping up.
 
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. Yes. You are correct. I've never check the salt on those. I never really wanted her myself. If anything I'm usually trying to get more while on this diet. Don't want to start cramping up.

Haha, bro, beef jerky can supply up to half your days sodium in one serving. I used to eat them and get thirsty as hell after, chug a couple glasses of water, and hold onto the weight for a day or two. Cheese is sodium heavy as well, but less so than beef jerky. You really gotta watch sodium if you're going to watch the scale, because it can and will affect your motivation seeing the scale go up and not understanding just how high your sodium is. Then you have to account for sodium causing water retention, and potassium countering this. And on low calorie diets, low carb diets, people typically do not get near enough potassium.
 
Yeah, Jerky and cheese is high in salt. I really should have better stuff on this diet...chicken and broccoli would be ideal, but I'm out on the road a ton and timing is hard, so when I haven't had ANYTHING and I know I need to get some protein in, I can usually find jerky at a store that is at least 60-70% protein. The cheese sticks are 50 cals with 7 grams protein and 2 grams fat, so they're not perfect but still good when things are pinched
 
Yeah, Jerky and cheese is high in salt. I really should have better stuff on this diet...chicken and broccoli would be ideal, but I'm out on the road a ton and timing is hard, so when I haven't had ANYTHING and I know I need to get some protein in, I can usually find jerky at a store that is at least 60-70% protein. The cheese sticks are 50 cals with 7 grams protein and 2 grams fat, so they're not perfect but still good when things are pinched

Well then in the future it won't be weird or surprising if your weight goes up, just chalk it up to the jerky and cheese and keep grinding! Water weight doesn't negatively impact fat loss anyways, just the numbers of the scale and the image in the mirror. I get doing what you can with what you have! I do a lot of whey with 'lite salt' throughout the day. Quick fixes are sometimes the best we can do.
 
When I was in a heavy deficit I was having pretty salty stuff and I did pissed way too much lol. How much water you drink a day?
 
Hey guys, thanks for the ideas and support. The weight fluctuation doesn't bother me, it is the trend that matters.

CJNtor, I drink 2 gallons a day easily. I usually make a gallon of crystal light with 5 grams vitamin C and drink at least the entire gallon, often 1.5 of these, every day. Plus coffees, regular water, protein shakes, workout drinks, etc.

Today I ate 3 oz of chicken, 2 oz of spinach, a post workout scoop of PES Select in water, flounder, and a bag of broccoli. So far I am at around 600 calories and a little over 100 grams of protein. I will probably add another 40-50 grams protein before going to bed to get me to about 800 calories.

Had a good workout tonight. My squats have been slipping, so I added 10 pounds and ground out 5 sets of as many reps as possible with 285.

I slipped a little on my military presses with 120 and missed a couple reps on the last 2 sets.

Slipped on deadliest to 1 rep with 405. A couple weeks ago I was up to 4 reps. I just have to hold onto what I can for now.
 
Hey guys, thanks for the ideas and support. The weight fluctuation doesn't bother me, it is the trend that matters.

CJNtor, I drink 2 gallons a day easily. I usually make a gallon of crystal light with 5 grams vitamin C and drink at least the entire gallon, often 1.5 of these, every day. Plus coffees, regular water, protein shakes, workout drinks, etc.

Today I ate 3 oz of chicken, 2 oz of spinach, a post workout scoop of PES Select in water, flounder, and a bag of broccoli. So far I am at around 600 calories and a little over 100 grams of protein. I will probably add another 40-50 grams protein before going to bed to get me to about 800 calories.

Had a good workout tonight. My squats have been slipping, so I added 10 pounds and ground out 5 sets of as many reps as possible with 285.

I slipped a little on my military presses with 120 and missed a couple reps on the last 2 sets.

Slipped on deadliest to 1 rep with 405. A couple weeks ago I was up to 4 reps. I just have to hold onto what I can for now.

Oh yea exactly, just worry about what you see in the mirror. Also what I do to try to get an accurate weight in is now to eat 4 hours before bed. Also try not to do go so heavy while cutting and especially on your diet, it will definitely hinder your recovery, IMO keep is around 70%-80% your 1RM if you keep wanting to lift heavy with hindering recovery.
 
Oh yea exactly, just worry about what you see in the mirror. Also what I do to try to get an accurate weight in is now to eat 4 hours before bed. Also try not to do go so heavy while cutting and especially on your diet, it will definitely hinder your recovery, IMO keep is around 70%-80% your 1RM if you keep wanting to lift heavy with hindering recovery.

CJNator, good point. My intensity isn't as high as normal, which is part of the reason I've been trying to do the 5X5. Given the fact the squats were losing ground, I just figured I'd push back a little.

Today's weigh in:

Bodyweight: 201.5 pounds
Tanita Bodyfat %: 30%
Waist: 43.25"

Going in the right direction again, haha.
 
So, I'm crazy busy this week, as usual and just like everyone else. So far today I've had time for 110 calories worth of beef jerky (15 grams protein) and one of those muscle milk "pro" drinks (200 cals, 40 grams of protein). Total of 310 calories and 55 grams protein. I'm going to have more fish for dinner and some veggies for about another 300 calories and 35 grams of protein and then I'll probably make a shake or something for 45-50 grams more protein before I go to sleep. I'm actually not even thinking about eating, and I'm BELOW my protein and calorie goals...it's really not planned and probably not great to keep doing that. I need to be more strict in the other direction now.

On a side note, I've decided to increase my T3 intake from 25 mcg to 50 mcg. I've noticed taking the T3 really makes me feel better. I have more energy, and stimulants have a stronger effect on me. Grayson pointed out that T3 does cause an increased sensitivity to stimulants through Beta3 sensitivity and catecholamine release. This is in alignment with my experience so far - I often don't feel stimulants working until they get to the point where I've overdone it. I've been noticing monster drinks and coffee and the Ignit3/Combustion have been giving me more energy, which is never the case for me.

I've been on 25 mcg T3 for 2 weeks and I'm going to kick it up to 50 mcg. I'm going to stop at week 4 maybe and take 4 weeks off, and then re-introduce it during the last 4 weeks of this 12 week cycle while I'm running (hopefully) 500 mg/day of Sup3r-11. Or maybe I'll push it to 6 weeks and take the last 6 weeks off, we'll see.
 
Beta-2 ;) But it's okay.

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Treatment with thyroid hormone increased beta-receptor binding, increased alpha-2 receptor binding, and decreased desipramine binding, opposite to effects of hypothyroidism produced by methimazole.
 
Lmao. Sorry. I was wrong, but so what?

Well purportedly beta-3 receptors do exist... just not in humans. Or our definition is incorrect since we see a relation between brown adipose tissue and beta-3 receptors but in murine models. In humans, we only see brown adipose tissue activation.
 
Well purportedly beta-3 receptors do exist... just not in humans. Or our definition is incorrect since we see a relation between brown adipose tissue and beta-3 receptors but in murine models. In humans, we only see brown adipose tissue activation.

So T3 and clen/albuterol would be a solid stack!
 
Well purportedly beta-3 receptors do exist... just not in humans. Or our definition is incorrect since we see a relation between brown adipose tissue and beta-3 receptors but in murine models. In humans, we only see brown adipose tissue activation.

Yes!

So T3 and clen/albuterol would be a solid stack!

Yes!

Today's weigh in:

Bodyweight: 199 pounds
Tanita Bodyfat %: 30%
Waist: 43.25"...maybe a little less than that...

Just took approx. 25 mcg of T3, 3 Ignit3 and 1 Combustion. I will be taking my Brite and Sup3r-11 when I get out of the shower. I increased my second dose of T3 to 25 mcg. yesterday afternoon and last night I was wide awake. It was a little weird. I was awake and felt like I could go exercise between about 830-1030 and then got tired, passed out for about an hour, and then woke up again wide awake and not tired at all. I had taken a ZMA at about 10:15 and usually I sleep through the night with that, but when I woke up I took another half scoop of Revivarant G and then was awake for a while, then in and out of sleep until about 1:30, and then I think I slept for the rest of the night. I attribute this to the T3, but it could just be a fluke.

If I have that kind of energy during the day today though, I am gonna get stuff done!

Also, I should be working out again tonight, and despite increasing my weights my legs did not hurt yesterday and are not really hurting today. They are slightly stiff, but I could do another workout. Ironically, this often happens and then a couple hours before my evening workout time they start getting really stiff. We will see how it goes, but they feel good right now.
 
Well purportedly beta-3 receptors do exist... just not in humans. Or our definition is incorrect since we see a relation between brown adipose tissue and beta-3 receptors but in murine models. In humans, we only see brown adipose tissue activation.

Beta-3 receptors do exist in humans. The medication MYRBETRIQ (Mirabegron) is a beta-3 adrenergic agonist indicated for the treatment of overactive bladder, pretty commonly prescribed too. It's just beta-3 agonism doesn't lead to fat loss in humans. Another compound is Octopamine, which is a full agonist of the β3 receptor with weak affinity for the other two receptor subtypes, suggesting that following oral supplementation it would be a selective β3 receptor activator. While this receptor mediates fat loss effects of Octopamine, it is not known to be expressed to a high degree in human white adipose tissue (being expressed more in brown adipose tissue and in rodents relative to humans)
 
Yes!



Yes!

Today's weigh in:

Bodyweight: 199 pounds
Tanita Bodyfat %: 30%
Waist: 43.25"...maybe a little less than that...

Just took approx. 25 mcg of T3, 3 Ignit3 and 1 Combustion. I will be taking my Brite and Sup3r-11 when I get out of the shower. I increased my second dose of T3 to 25 mcg. yesterday afternoon and last night I was wide awake. It was a little weird. I was awake and felt like I could go exercise between about 830-1030 and then got tired, passed out for about an hour, and then woke up again wide awake and not tired at all. I had taken a ZMA at about 10:15 and usually I sleep through the night with that, but when I woke up I took another half scoop of Revivarant G and then was awake for a while, then in and out of sleep until about 1:30, and then I think I slept for the rest of the night. I attribute this to the T3, but it could just be a fluke.

If I have that kind of energy during the day today though, I am gonna get stuff done!

Also, I should be working out again tonight, and despite increasing my weights my legs did not hurt yesterday and are not really hurting today. They are slightly stiff, but I could do another workout. Ironically, this often happens and then a couple hours before my evening workout time they start getting really stiff. We will see how it goes, but they feel good right now.

That's awesome your legs aren't hurting, bro! Sounds like you've got the nutrition, supplementation and exercise down to the point where your progress isn't impeded by such things. Keep it up!
 
Thanks for following along guys. I kept the calories low today and increased the T3 to 50 mcg. I split the T3 into two doses. I feel really good on the Sup3r-11 and T3. My energy is up on the T3 and even at 50 mcg I feel better than on 25 mcg. I haven't taken my temp, but I will soon.

I believe the mirror is actually showing a big improvement, and I have lost about 13 pounds in 2 weeks. I think the mirror shows more progress than just 13 pounds lost.

I ate a 120 calorie/17 g protein pack of jerky and another muscle milk pro drink this afternoon. Total of 320 calories and 57 grams protein. I had a scoop of Select in water after my workout. And then I had 6 oz. Of chicken and a bag of steamed veggies for another 320 calories and about 60 grams protein.

For my workout I started strong with my squat actually increasing and my legs not cramping at all. This is good considering I went heavier last time.

I did 2 sets of 5, a set of 4 and 2 sets of 3 with 285 on the squats. 2 days ago, I did 1 set of 5, 1 set of 4 and 3 sets of 3.

My bench slipped a couple reps and I got 3 sets of 5, 1 set of 4 and 1 set of 3 with 190. Last workout I got a couple more reps.

Bent over rows were the same as the bench, lost a couple reps on the 5 sets at 190.

Finished with 5 x 3 pull ups.

Hope things keep going in this direction for a while. Maybe I can lose the entire 50 pounds I wanted to lose in the 12 week cycle.
 
Here's today's weigh in:

Bodyweight: 200 pounds
Tanita Bodyfat %: 30%
Waist: 43.25"
 
Thanks for following along guys. I kept the calories low today and increased the T3 to 50 mcg. I split the T3 into two doses. I feel really good on the Sup3r-11 and T3. My energy is up on the T3 and even at 50 mcg I feel better than on 25 mcg. I haven't taken my temp, but I will soon.

I believe the mirror is actually showing a big improvement, and I have lost about 13 pounds in 2 weeks. I think the mirror shows more progress than just 13 pounds lost.

I ate a 120 calorie/17 g protein pack of jerky and another muscle milk pro drink this afternoon. Total of 320 calories and 57 grams protein. I had a scoop of Select in water after my workout. And then I had 6 oz. Of chicken and a bag of steamed veggies for another 320 calories and about 60 grams protein.

For my workout I started strong with my squat actually increasing and my legs not cramping at all. This is good considering I went heavier last time.

I did 2 sets of 5, a set of 4 and 2 sets of 3 with 285 on the squats. 2 days ago, I did 1 set of 5, 1 set of 4 and 3 sets of 3.

My bench slipped a couple reps and I got 3 sets of 5, 1 set of 4 and 1 set of 3 with 190. Last workout I got a couple more reps.

Bent over rows were the same as the bench, lost a couple reps on the 5 sets at 190.

Finished with 5 x 3 pull ups.

Hope things keep going in this direction for a while. Maybe I can lose the entire 50 pounds I wanted to lose in the 12 week cycle.

For as hard as you're dieting, it looks like we're about the same strength. In fact, I'm not even sure I could do 5x3 pull ups, those have always been my worst enemy. I remember being so heavy that I couldn't even do 1. Sounds like your workouts are going well, keep going, brother!
 
For as hard as you're dieting, it looks like we're about the same strength. In fact, I'm not even sure I could do 5x3 pull ups, those have always been my worst enemy. I remember being so heavy that I couldn't even do 1. Sounds like your workouts are going well, keep going, brother!

Hastur, I am glad I can beat you at SOMETHING. You have me chasing you on most things though. 205 pound militaries...that's more than I bench. You have a solid 80 pounds on me on the deadlifts and I would guestimate 40-50 on the squats at least.

As for pull-ups, they are my weakness too. I'm sure there are guys on here that can bang out 20 reps with bodyweight and not even struggle. Pull ups have always been hard for me and still are. Like you, I remember being 290 pounds and starting to workout again and I would hurt myself trying to do 1 pull up. Literally the muscles around my throat would start spasming and I would hurt if I attempted a single pull up. I had to start by putting a bench near the pull up bar, standing on it so my chin was over the bar, and stepping off the bench and lowering myself as slowly as possible - which wasn't slow at all, it was pretty much a gravity drop - and then stepping back up and doing that again and again. Eventually, I could lower myself with some weight around my waist, then I could do a pull up, maybe 2, and I just kept working at it. At once point I could do 10 pull ups, but then I kind of stopped doing them and then I decided to add them in after the 5X5 because I feel they are an important movement for strength. Considering I do them after deadlifts or bent over rows now, I'm pretty happy with my progress on that.

As far as the hard diet - I'm kind of thinking this little experiment may change some peoples' stance on "muscle wasting". I mean, I'm taking T3 and eating under 1000 calories a day. It isn't healthy, but after 2 weeks, my strength loss has been relatively small - especially when you account for lack of glycogen. In some cases, I'm showing SOME potential to actually get stronger, even on this diet. And it's not like I'm a newbie...I've been training for 3 years. I'm new to 5X5 but it's honestly lower intensity than I am used to, since I follow a Mentzer-style approach normally.

I think the 11-KT is definitely helping retain some strength too - but it isn't like it is highly anabolic by any means. We could argue that it is only indirectly anabolic through cortisol inhibition, but either way it seems to be helping.

It has been pointed out to me that being a higher bodyfat % like I am now may actually help preserve some muscle wasting too - and that's probably true. I am sure once I get below 15%, the tables will turn and I won't be able to get away with quite as much.
 
I want to thank everyone for replying to this too - a bunch of you just got "likes" from me. For some reason I had a mental block and have been forgetting to hit that like button...Everyone on here has been really helpful and I appreciate all the support and feedback.
 
So, I had a cheat meal last night - my gf wanted Chinese food so we kind of let loose. I do that every Friday night, so it's part of the plan. Today's weigh in is:

Bodyweight: 201 pounds
Tanita Bodyfat % : 30%
Waist: 43" - maybe just a little over 43" but I've definitely lost a little.
 
Had a busy day today. Didn't eat ANYTHING except two cups of black coffee, and didn't even realize until right before my workout.

My workout went well, even though I hadn't eaten.

Squats:
1 x 8 at 225 warm up
3 x 5 at 285
1 x 4 at 285
1 x 3 at 285

This is a 1 rep increase on my 3rd and 4th sets.

Military Presses:
1 x 8 @ 75 warm up
3 x 5 @ 120
2 x 4 @ 120

Again, a 1 rep increase on the 3rd and 4th sets.

Deadlifts:

1 x 2 @ 385

I was aiming for 5. This has been slipping the most.

Pull Ups:
5 x 4 @ bodyweight.

I felt pretty good during the workout and was surprised since I hadn't eaten . I used Endur3 during the workout. After the workout I had 2 scoops of Select in water.

For dinner I had 5 oz of chicken and 4 oz of baby spinach.

I am planning on another 2 scoops of Select and maybe a 50 calorie cheese stick in a little bit. That should put me at about 700 calories for the day and about 150 grams of protein.

I also ordered some Isomorph last night. It looks like a good protein that is just whey and not a blend like Select, but it will give me some new flavor options.
 
Here's today's measurements:

Bodyweight: 202.5 pounds
Tanita Bodyfat %: 30%
Waist: 43.25'' (-0.25")
Chest 43.5" (-0.5")
Legs: 26.5" (same)
Biceps: 15.75" (same)

Bodyfat Caliper Measurements:
Chest: 8 mm (-1)
Waist: 29 mm (-3)
Thigh: 18 mm (-2)
Estimated % = I am dropping this because none of the charts I can find seem to be accurate, the tanita seems closer.

It feels like I am getting nowhere, but this is kind of how it works for me. I expect that around Wednesday, I will have flush and suddenly be closer to 195-196.

I will try to get new photos today. I THINK, the mirror is showing some change too. Still have a long long way to go.
 
Oh, also took BP today: 113/72 and my heart rate was 66 BPM.
 
Here is a photo taken today, 15 days after the last photos. In person I feel like I see much more progress than the photos show....IMO they look very similar.

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Just keep fighting!
I bet you are loosing fat evenly, that's why you can't see a difference.
Worst thing for me was, when I finally got rid of a lot of fat, it wasn't in the "right" places.
Lost at my arms, legs and back but it held on to my chest, hips and belly.
It took me more then a year to get in decent shape, still not where I want to be.
For comparison, take a look at my log, if you want.
 
Haha, just a year? I e been working at this for 3-4 years. I started near 300 pounds.

I lose it last in my gut for sure. My chest, arms and legs are showing some fat loss, but you cant see in the photos. It's just 2 weeks too. I am sure that over 6 weeks it will be more dramatic and over 12 weeks I am hoping it is a huge difference. If anything, it will help people who have unrealistic expectations I hope. This log will show how the change happens ...it isn't a constant downward motion and there are set backs and weight fluctuates and it is never as quick as you would like .
 
Haha, just a year? I e been working at this for 3-4 years. I started near 300 pounds.

I lose it last in my gut for sure. My chest, arms and legs are showing some fat loss, but you cant see in the photos. It's just 2 weeks too. I am sure that over 6 weeks it will be more dramatic and over 12 weeks I am hoping it is a huge difference. If anything, it will help people who have unrealistic expectations I hope. This log will show how the change happens ...it isn't a constant downward motion and there are set backs and weight fluctuates and it is never as quick as you would like .

Yep, people have unrealistic expectations. As seen on TV:

"With this magical, plastic board, loosing fat is almost pleasant.
Just stand on the board, wait until the red light switches to green and you did a whole body workout, without even feeling anything."

LOL.

I did a supervised diet in a sanatorium.
Starting at 500kcal/day , then upped to 850kcal for a month. At first 3 miles mountain hiking x day, later 6 miles and 2 hours aquagym in the afternoon. I lost 13kilo (28.5lbs)
 
With the diet you're running(not knocking you) I'd expect rebound eventually. You'd be perfect with keto diet in a 500 calorie deficiency since you're young. Eventually you'll have to get off that diet and I don't think you like what you see when you get off it. Dieting dramatically may create a psychological disorder, I'm only saying this because it happened to me for a long time. I was pretty fat at one point but I got down to 149, not muscular but ripped. Every time I looked into the mirror I saw just fat everywhere yet everyone claimed I was too skinny or assumed I had a eating disorder but they were overreacting. Only till I got crohns disease is when I lost all my gains and gained 30lbs of fat(for predisone and eating too much) then I went into a slump for a while just drinking and being sad only to realized that I looked amazing at 149 and the 164(before crohns). Not going to lie but...I guess you can I went on a magic trip ;) which is really the only reason I've realized this and many other things within my psyche. I still battle this to this day but I'm better off then I ever was. How you see you self will be a huge factor on how you diet and feel about yourself. This is just my 2 cents but I hope it helps, I haven't gone through a lot but we all have the same emotions, thoughts, instincts yet fight different battles on different levels. As I quote jadakiss,"we are all in the same game just different levels, dealing with the same hell just different devils".
 
Yep, people have unrealistic expectations. As seen on TV:

"With this magical, plastic board, loosing fat is almost pleasant.
Just stand on the board, wait until the red light switches to green and you did a whole body workout, without even feeling anything."

LOL.

I did a supervised diet in a sanatorium.
Starting at 500kcal/day , then upped to 850kcal for a month. At first 3 miles mountain hiking x day, later 6 miles and 2 hours aquagym in the afternoon. I lost 13kilo (28.5lbs)

Man, that is hard core. I was losing about 15 pounds a month on this diet last year, and I'd be completely thrilled if I lost 20 pounds/month. I need to add in some LISS or additional exercise but I've been trying to adjust to everything. I started doing 5X5 a few months back and ran into some issues with my legs cramping every second workout (you squat every workout, workout every other day). So I've been holding back just a little. The cramping seems to be clearing up, as I've now done 3 workouts in a row and no issues - so maybe soon I'll add in some additional work and I'm sure that will help. At the end of the day, I know I have to be burning fat because 800 calories/day isn't enough for me to function on, and my body has to be getting the difference from somewhere - it's basic thermodynamics, right?

With the diet you're running(not knocking you) I'd expect rebound eventually. You'd be perfect with keto diet in a 500 calorie deficiency since you're young. Eventually you'll have to get off that diet and I don't think you like what you see when you get off it. Dieting dramatically may create a psychological disorder, I'm only saying this because it happened to me for a long time. I was pretty fat at one point but I got down to 149, not muscular but ripped. Every time I looked into the mirror I saw just fat everywhere yet everyone claimed I was too skinny or assumed I had a eating disorder but they were overreacting. Only till I got crohns disease is when I lost all my gains and gained 30lbs of fat(for predisone and eating too much) then I went into a slump for a while just drinking and being sad only to realized that I looked amazing at 149 and the 164(before crohns). Not going to lie but...I guess you can I went on a magic trip ;) which is really the only reason I've realized this and many other things within my psyche. I still battle this to this day but I'm better off then I ever was. How you see you self will be a huge factor on how you diet and feel about yourself. This is just my 2 cents but I hope it helps, I haven't gone through a lot but we all have the same emotions, thoughts, instincts yet fight different battles on different levels. As I quote jadakiss,"we are all in the same game just different levels, dealing with the same hell just different devils".

This is a really great post. What I'm doing is NOT for everyone, and I really don't advise most people to try it. Last year when I did this, I was on it for months and people were asking me, "What are you doing?" and I was lying to them because I didn't want them to start following my lead without knowing what was necessary.

I am sorry to hear you had/have an issue with this, and you're quote about us all being in the same game is dead on. I personally feel like I DO have an eating disorder - I just can't stop eating. My entire family has a really unhealthy view of food and I was brought up with some bad habits and I think because of those habits I have actually caused or inherited some physciological issues that create eating problems. It's really amazing and my gf notices it when I start eating. It's like when I start eating and get past a certain point, I just keep going and going and going and going and I never get full. It's like the eating disorder goes in both directions, but everyone is afraid of eating too little.

And I expect some rebound, but not because I really believe in metabolic slow down, or even rebound itself. While this may be a factor, I feel like by far the biggest factor is the fact that when you come off a diet, any diet, you start going back to the way you were eating before. I noticed it after I came off my last PSMF. First I didn't have a lot of time because I was busy, so I'd decide to grab take out. Then it happened more, then more, then more, until I was eating out 4-5 times/week. And I will tell you what, I could eat NOTHING all day and then eat out and be a pound heavier the next day. And think of how many forces we have pressuring us to eat out - it's just so convenient, and it's everywhere, etc. We don't need to think about it, it just happens.

So, when I come off this, I have to be diligent and try to employ even MORE discipline and eat a diet that is prepared and healthy and at appropriate caloric intakes. It's really not MUCH different, except I have to eat MORE.

And I don't really feel badly about being fat. If I did, I never would have gotten to be 290+ pounds. For me, it's about being able to be active and do things. It's funny because a couple weekends ago, a co-worker was moving and everyone at work joined in to help him move. A couple years ago, I would have been huffing and puffing and in the worst shape of everyone there. Instead, I was pushing and lifting all the heavy things, and pretty much in the best shape of anyone there. So I may not show it, but I can move and be healthy and that's the prime mover. The lean part is just a personal goal for me - I don't care if anyone else sees it. Plus I know that when I'm about 180, everyone will start telling me I am too thin and I will still be around 20% body fat. I'm not really going by weight, I'm going for lean.

I've been looking at your log though man - you've come a long way. I really appreciate the feedback from everyone. It may seem like I'm not taking advise, and I don't want that to be the case. I put this all in my mind and mull it around and think about it - it just may not appear to be employed overtly right away. But when I miss meals - this post will be the warning in my head.
 
Not a great advise follower myself, here another advise, LOL:

Following a diet is NOT a temporary fat loss program, diet is what you eat day in -day out.
A good diet is what complements your lifestyle.

IMHO, a permanent change in diet is not possible by only rational means, like restricting oneself, and counting cals.
Its more like training, at some point your eating habits change, if you "trained" long enough, eating the right foods and amounts thereof.
At least this is what happened to me.

Now I only count protein intake, mostly by eye measurement, like: low fat meat the size of a deck of cards = 25gr protein.
Before I could eat 2lbs spaghetti in one sitting, now, after 2 cups I lose interest. Never thought this could happen.
 
Man, that is hard core. I was losing about 15 pounds a month on this diet last year, and I'd be completely thrilled if I lost 20 pounds/month. I need to add in some LISS or additional exercise but I've been trying to adjust to everything. I started doing 5X5 a few months back and ran into some issues with my legs cramping every second workout (you squat every workout, workout every other day). So I've been holding back just a little. The cramping seems to be clearing up, as I've now done 3 workouts in a row and no issues - so maybe soon I'll add in some additional work and I'm sure that will help. At the end of the day, I know I have to be burning fat because 800 calories/day isn't enough for me to function on, and my body has to be getting the difference from somewhere - it's basic thermodynamics, right?



This is a really great post. What I'm doing is NOT for everyone, and I really don't advise most people to try it. Last year when I did this, I was on it for months and people were asking me, "What are you doing?" and I was lying to them because I didn't want them to start following my lead without knowing what was necessary.

I am sorry to hear you had/have an issue with this, and you're quote about us all being in the same game is dead on. I personally feel like I DO have an eating disorder - I just can't stop eating. My entire family has a really unhealthy view of food and I was brought up with some bad habits and I think because of those habits I have actually caused or inherited some physciological issues that create eating problems. It's really amazing and my gf notices it when I start eating. It's like when I start eating and get past a certain point, I just keep going and going and going and going and I never get full. It's like the eating disorder goes in both directions, but everyone is afraid of eating too little.

And I expect some rebound, but not because I really believe in metabolic slow down, or even rebound itself. While this may be a factor, I feel like by far the biggest factor is the fact that when you come off a diet, any diet, you start going back to the way you were eating before. I noticed it after I came off my last PSMF. First I didn't have a lot of time because I was busy, so I'd decide to grab take out. Then it happened more, then more, then more, until I was eating out 4-5 times/week. And I will tell you what, I could eat NOTHING all day and then eat out and be a pound heavier the next day. And think of how many forces we have pressuring us to eat out - it's just so convenient, and it's everywhere, etc. We don't need to think about it, it just happens.

So, when I come off this, I have to be diligent and try to employ even MORE discipline and eat a diet that is prepared and healthy and at appropriate caloric intakes. It's really not MUCH different, except I have to eat MORE.

And I don't really feel badly about being fat. If I did, I never would have gotten to be 290+ pounds. For me, it's about being able to be active and do things. It's funny because a couple weekends ago, a co-worker was moving and everyone at work joined in to help him move. A couple years ago, I would have been huffing and puffing and in the worst shape of everyone there. Instead, I was pushing and lifting all the heavy things, and pretty much in the best shape of anyone there. So I may not show it, but I can move and be healthy and that's the prime mover. The lean part is just a personal goal for me - I don't care if anyone else sees it. Plus I know that when I'm about 180, everyone will start telling me I am too thin and I will still be around 20% body fat. I'm not really going by weight, I'm going for lean.

I've been looking at your log though man - you've come a long way. I really appreciate the feedback from everyone. It may seem like I'm not taking advise, and I don't want that to be the case. I put this all in my mind and mull it around and think about it - it just may not appear to be employed overtly right away. But when I miss meals - this post will be the warning in my head.

Best thing to do that is digging into your consciousness. Unlock shot you don't want to, go off your diet without guilt etc..... Harder then it's sounds obviously but if you can do it, if people start saying stuff take it as a grain of salt yet don't get offended. Our perceptions of reality hides the truth.
 
Not a great advise follower myself, here another advise, LOL:

Following a diet is NOT a temporary fat loss program, diet is what you eat day in -day out.
A good diet is what complements your lifestyle.

IMHO, a permanent change in diet is not possible by only rational means, like restricting oneself, and counting cals.
Its more like training, at some point your eating habits change, if you "trained" long enough, eating the right foods and amounts thereof.
At least this is what happened to me.

Now I only count protein intake, mostly by eye measurement, like: low fat meat the size of a deck of cards = 25gr protein.
Before I could eat 2lbs spaghetti in one sitting, now, after 2 cups I lose interest. Never thought this could happen.

Yes, change is hard and it takes practice. Like anything, most people try to change once, fail, and quit. Your training analogy is perfect.

Plus, our environment has more control over us than we think. I often ask people where they have their TV? They say, in my living room. (In the center of daily living). Then I ask where they have their treadmill? They say, in the basement. I then ask, how often do you watch TV? They say ...too much. How often do you use the treadmill...never. how often would you watch TV if it was in your basement?

Best thing to do that is digging into your consciousness. Unlock shot you don't want to, go off your diet without guilt etc..... Harder then it's sounds obviously but if you can do it, if people start saying stuff take it as a grain of salt yet don't get offended. Our perceptions of reality hides the truth.

Your point is good. I am a little weird I guess...I went on a PSMF last year and didn't want anyone to know, I was just doing it for me and the look at me mentality turns me off. And when I came off the diet, I had no issues other than trying to not go back to all of my old habits...which I did unfortunately, at least to a large degree.

I can also see that for some people this type of patter. can create a binge/purge mentality. But I just don't seem to have this issue mentally...My issue is purely over eating.
 
I've been a ghost in this thread, but HIT4ME, I share your struggle with overeating. My maintenance calories are "sort of" high at 2900-3100 (doing my typical 3 day low volume strength program. In higher volume/frequency programs my maintenance is usually 3500+ easily) and I tolerate carbs like a beast, but the thing is, I am a MASSIVE eater and I love eating certain foods. If you don't feel you can control the volume of food you can eat, what I would do is the following:

1) Start working out in a way where you increase the density. Stick to your current training, but take shorter breaks in between sets/exercises. Working out doesn't really burn that many calories, but every little bit helps!
2) Eat veggies (like Broccoli) before you eat your main meal and also drink lots of cold water. I've found eating broccoli, then proteins/fats, then carbs to help control my eating habits.
3) Try intermittent fasting. This is probably why my insulin sensitivity/carb tolerance is great. It also lets me eat big meals, but in an interval so I don't take in excess calories daily.

Good luck with your goals. You're running a heavy stack and doing a nice rapid fat loss diet. I'd also like to put a side note than running EvoMuse BRITE for 12 weeks, and then later on for 8 weeks, has overall increased my maintenance calories months after I stopped using it. I think EvoMuse Defuse + BRITE are two supplements that can help overeaters like you and I, which is why I keep Defuse on hand, and plan on using BRITE more often.
 
I've been a ghost in this thread, but HIT4ME, I share your struggle with overeating. My maintenance calories are "sort of" high at 2900-3100 (doing my typical 3 day low volume strength program. In higher volume/frequency programs my maintenance is usually 3500+ easily) and I tolerate carbs like a beast, but the thing is, I am a MASSIVE eater and I love eating certain foods. If you don't feel you can control the volume of food you can eat, what I would do is the following:

1) Start working out in a way where you increase the density. Stick to your current training, but take shorter breaks in between sets/exercises. Working out doesn't really burn that many calories, but every little bit helps!
2) Eat veggies (like Broccoli) before you eat your main meal and also drink lots of cold water. I've found eating broccoli, then proteins/fats, then carbs to help control my eating habits.
3) Try intermittent fasting. This is probably why my insulin sensitivity/carb tolerance is great. It also lets me eat big meals, but in an interval so I don't take in excess calories daily.

Good luck with your goals. You're running a heavy stack and doing a nice rapid fat loss diet. I'd also like to put a side note than running EvoMuse BRITE for 12 weeks, and then later on for 8 weeks, has overall increased my maintenance calories months after I stopped using it. I think EvoMuse Defuse + BRITE are two supplements that can help overeaters like you and I, which is why I keep Defuse on hand, and plan on using BRITE more often.

That sounds a bit like me, except my maintenance calories seem to be in the 2200-2500 range. And on a normal diet, I try to do all of those things - it's good advice - but as HGP was saying, trying to do something and actually being in the habit of doing it are different things.

I've been on Brite for ...I really don't know...somewhere around 12 weeks I think, and I will continue to take it through this log. It's a staple.

Today's numbers:
Bodyweight: 200 pounds
Tanita Bodyfat % : 30%
Waist: 42.75" (sudden drop of 0.5")

I normally sleep around 6-8 hours/night, but last night I got a solid 10 hours in. The night before I probably got 9, and Friday night I probably got 8-9. And I'm talking DEEP sleep. Like I took something to sleep and don't want to wake up at all, but the only thing I've used is ZMA. Once I get up and moving, I'm good, but I have to pull myself from bed.

I'm not sure if it's just the fact that it's a long weekend and I can afford to catch up a little on sleep, or if I'm just being lazy, or maybe it's something with the diet, T3, Sup3r-11. It isn't bad, since I have the time and should probably do it anyway, but it's notable.

Also, I used up my bottle of Ignit3 on Saturday, so for now I'm just taking Sup3r-11, T3, Brite. I have more Ignit3 and Combustion on hand, but it's been about 8 weeks on that and time for a break.

Maybe the lack of stimulants is helping my sleep....I hadn't thought of that, although I did seem to be starting with the deep sleep right before I ran out, so I'm not sure.
 
.....
Maybe the lack of stimulants is helping my sleep....I hadn't thought of that, although I did seem to be starting with the deep sleep right before I ran out, so I'm not sure.

I used a DMAA/Ephedra combo in the past.
It cut my appetite hard but the insomnia was bad. Not being able to sleep is worse than suppressing appetite with willpower, IMHO.
 
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Yeah, I am pretty stim tolerant, and haven't had any problems sleeping...but maybe coming off then is now making me sleep more.. .who knows.
 
So, I got some APS Mesomorph in the mail today, which I wasn't expecting because it was memorial day but Amazon rocks. I wanted something different and was excited to try the flavors, since everyone on Amazon said they were the best ever. I got Orange Dreamsicle and S'mores.

I had a scoop of Orange Dreamsicle right when it came, as I hadn't eaten all day yet. It was OK mixed in water, nothing to write home about. Straight whey is always thin in water, IMO. I can imagine it would taste excellent in milk, but it was thin and a little weak in water. Later I had 5 oz. Of chicken. Then I worked out.

As soon as I warmed up for squats, I felt like I wanted to quit. I had a headache and felt weak. Probably because Id had 320 calories all day.

I fought through the workout with a headache anyway and did the following.

Squats:
1 x 8 @225 warm-up
1 x 5 @285
1 x 4 @285
3 x 3 @285

This is a reduction from the last 3 squat workouts, but exactly the same as I did 4 workouts ago. Considering it was a struggle just to workout...I accept it as a minor set back.

Bench Presses
1 x 8 @95
3 x 5 @190
1 x 4 @190
1 x 3 @190

Again, this was a slight reduction from 2 workouts ago, but about what I did 4 workouts ago.

Bent-Over Rows-
1 x 5 @190
4 x 4 @190

This is actually a 1 rep increase from my last workout doing rows.

Finished with 3 x 3 pull ups at bodyweight.

Came home after the workout and downed some S'mores Isomorph. Again, would have been awesome in milk....in water, I prefer select.

Used Endur3 during the workout.

I am thinking of having some Salmon and veggies for dinner later. Should finish up around 800 calories and about 160 grams of protein for the day.
 
Watch your blood sugar. It could suddenly drop.
Made me nauseous, headache and lethargic.
 
Watch your blood sugar. It could suddenly drop.
Made me nauseous, headache and lethargic.

Yes, I haven't had it suddenly drop on me, but I've had times where it was low and I felt confused, depressed, out of it, agitated, weak, dizzy, etc. It can really mess with you in ways you would expect.
 
Thanks man! Thanks for joining in. All support, ideas, etc are welcome!
 
For the record, I wasn't trying to bash you or say what your doing is wrong. I posted the link to this in the other thread because it was along the lines of what socal was talking about on another forum.
 
For the record, I wasn't trying to bash you or say what your doing is wrong. I posted the link to this in the other thread because it was along the lines of what socal was talking about on another forum.

No worries at all. No one in that thread upset me. If what I was doing was smart, or not against the grain, it would be even more boring. No one sits at the bar listening to you talk about all the things that have gone right. The best stories involve things NOT going as planned.

The point of what I'm trying to do is along the following lines:

1. Lose fat as fast as possible and make people excited about what is possible.

2. Make people question their beliefs about what works - does your metabolism actually crash? Does a harsh diet burn muscle? Does T3 burn muscle? Is muscle loss to such a degree that you have to sacrifice time with slower fat loss? Is this even healthy?

I may be wrong. I may prove some beliefs right. Some people will disagree with this....I wish they would join in more. It isn't about being right, it is about the journey.
 
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