Exotherm Run

[kisaj]

Just an observational opinion-
If every time you have a cheat meal you lose ground why do you continue to do it?
Cheat should be MAYBE once a week. 1 meal. And not like 2300 cals. More of like 1 slice of pizza or a cookie. Cheat...not give up completely and start over.



Not picking on you at all bro. Just trying to help. If you limit the cheating your progress will speed up.

Absolutely agree on this. I personally don't have a bf% goal at the time, but if I were working on one and trying a supplement to get me to that point, I wouldn't be sabotaging my progression that way.

 

[CJNator]

Often heavier people will have issues that would make it worse for them than someone leaner. Many have insulin resistance for example or even pre diabetes.
Also you can be smart about the cheat and choose high fat foods instead of super sugary ones.
Like pizza instead of cake. Both are for sure a cheat food but the pizza will satiate you more and have less of a negative impact.

Don't want to throw off the thread but can u pm me tht carb cycling diet? I'd like to try it out, I've never tried a legitimate diet just calories in calories out or once in a while iifym.

 

[HIT4ME]

Just an observational opinion-
If every time you have a cheat meal you lose ground why do you continue to do it?
Cheat should be MAYBE once a week. 1 meal. And not like 2300 cals. More of like 1 slice of pizza or a cookie. Cheat...not give up completely and start over.



Not picking on you at all bro. Just trying to help. If you limit the cheating your progress will speed up.

I have to agree with Brundel on this. I used to have 1 cheat meal a week during my cuts and it usually
consisted of about an extra 500 calories for the day. Nothing overboard. It wasn't a cheat day. Its a
chance to add a couple slices of pizza, or some chocolate cake or icecream, or some pancakes.

Don't go overboard and set yourself back. Its take 3500 calories to lose a pound. If you are eating
an extra 3000 calories on a cheat day, then your pretty much only going to hinder your losses

You are both definitely saying things that are 100% true. I generally do 1 cheat meal a week. I generally try to make that Friday night - but given my schedule, there have been some issues. And I don't GENERALLY eat 3000 calories for a cheat meal. Normally, for some reason, what I crave most often for a cheat meal is a bacon cheeseburger from a restaurant (not fast food), but this week for some reason I really felt like Olive Garden and got the Tour of Italy and a desert, and bread sticks and the soup. After the fact I added it all up....it was probably around 3,000 calories. But it didn't really set me back that much. That put my total intake for that day at less than 3,200 calories. So it was bad....and not healthy, but it's a once a week thing and I don't set limits on that. I overdid it because I was working for a friend all day and all that I ate that day was 1 scoop of protein powder in some water around noon-time.

I am currently eating around 750 calories/day right now....cheat meal aside....and I just looked at my log and in 15 days I have lost 9.5 pounds. More to my point was that water has a HUGE impact on weight and I shouldn't get excited about 2 pounds in either direction. The Olive Garden meal MAY have been enough to put on 1/3 of a pound given my BMR is probably around 2100 calories...but I still gained almost 3 pounds...the carbs really sucked up the water. This is also the reason I lost 5 pounds really fast when I started the diet....All in all, I've probably really only lost about 6 pounds of actual fat, maybe 7, in the past 2 weeks....if I am lucky....and the other 2-3 pounds is easily water, which I will gain and lose throughout the week.

My bet is I will reliably be down to 185 by Friday ...and if then I will have a cheat and gain usually around 1-2 pounds of water back, and then be back to the 185 2 days later, and then lose about 0.5 pounds/day after...and once every week or two I will have a day in the middle where I suddenly lose a couple pounds.

Also, I have had more cheats than I should - in the first week of this log, I think I had 3 cheats in 4 days because of issues in timing...and that left me with a cheat on Monday of last week, then I waited until Saturday to have a cheat and I won't have another until Friday or Saturday coming up. So hopefully I can get back on track in other words and that's what I've been working toward.

 

[HIT4ME]

Don't want to throw off the thread but can u pm me tht carb cycling diet? I'd like to try it out, I've never tried a legitimate diet just calories in calories out or once in a while iifym.

I have no issues with this discussion in the thread....It's not really what I'm doing, but dieting is dieting.

 

[HIT4ME]

Also - Brundel and Kisaj - I don't want to seem like I am refuting you at all - just explaining myself and acknowledging that I messed up a couple times on the diet, but also pointing out that I'm being a bit extreme on the other end also.

 

[NoAddedHmones]

3g of TTA each day?!! No wonder you were feeling lethargic and probably were also holding onto a boat load of water as well!

Were you feeling constantly crampy?

 

[HIT4ME]

3g of TTA each day?!! No wonder you were feeling lethargic and probably were also holding onto a boat load of water as well!

Were you feeling constantly crampy?

I was taking it at 2 grams/day for maybe 30 days - upped it to 3 grams for about 14 days - never had a single cramp. It didn't seem to have much effect on me, but maybe that was why I was so lethargic? Does it do that? The only side I ever saw was the cramps and even when I didn't use electrolytes it didn't do that too me...

 

[NoAddedHmones]

I was taking it at 2 grams/day for maybe 30 days - upped it to 3 grams for about 14 days - never had a single cramp. It didn't seem to have much effect on me, but maybe that was why I was so lethargic? Does it do that? The only side I ever saw was the cramps and even when I didn't use electrolytes it didn't do that too me...

That dose is bordering on crazy high, it will deff have impacted you. If you think back of it now, i noted you started sounding a lot more positive in this log about 10 days after you stopped TTA?

 

[HIT4ME]

I got my TTA from Smart Powders in bulk powder form....so I'm assuming it wasn't bunk, but I think they're relatively reliable.

Looking back at the first page I ran out of TTA on 7/28 and I have one post before that noting positive mood/energy levels from the Exotherm, but I have many more posts after the 28th saying the effects got stronger.

I knew 3 grams was a big dose...I know many people start to get cramps at 2 grams, but I was feeling good so I did it....didn't think it was crazy high though....hell, I would probably try 4 grams.

 

[NoAddedHmones]

I got my TTA from Smart Powders in bulk powder form....so I'm assuming it wasn't bunk, but I think they're relatively reliable.

Looking back at the first page I ran out of TTA on 7/28 and I have one post before that noting positive mood/energy levels from the Exotherm, but I have many more posts after the 28th saying the effects got stronger.

I knew 3 grams was a big dose...I know many people start to get cramps at 2 grams, but I was feeling good so I did it....didn't think it was crazy high though....hell, I would probably try 4 grams.

Anything over 1g for me and its shut the gates time. To be fair you lethargy could be a combination of
Factors especially when doing something like PSMF. Good luck with you exotherm run.

I will be watching as this products interested me.

 

[HIT4ME]

Anything over 1g for me and its shut the gates time. To be fair you lethargy could be a combination of
Factors especially when doing something like PSMF. Good luck with you exotherm run.

I will be watching as this products interested me.

Yeah- I attributed my lethargy to just being over worked for the most part. I have a buddy who is renovating a 2-family right now and I've been helping him do all kinds of physical construction work (tearing up sub floors, knocking down chimneys and carrying bricks out in buckets, framing, etc), I have another friend renovating an office building and I helped him take down a ceiling and walls in 3 rooms to make one larger room, I have had to do work on my gf's car, my car, my mom's car, I've had to do work at my house, I have a full time job in commercial real estate, I have a part-time job valuing houses that is essentially a second full time job, etc. In other words - I'm over extended and have been for a while. Lots of physical projects that need to get done and not enough time. Not saying this to break out the violins, because it's all good and I choose to do these things and help my friends, but it hopefully paints the picture of why I have been lethargic.

I didn't attribute any of the lethargy to the TTA, but I have 2 more bags and I will pay attention on my next run.

I also typically drink around 2 gallons of fluid every day without much effort. I fill a gallon jug with water, crystal light and vitamin C in the morning and usually have to refill it again before dinner, and will often drink half that before going to sleep. In addition to this I drink black coffee, bottled water, and calorie free drinks ....so I have a much larger water intake than most and I have been like that since forever.

 

[kisaj]

Also - Brundel and Kisaj - I don't want to seem like I am refuting you at all - just explaining myself and acknowledging that I messed up a couple times on the diet, but also pointing out that I'm being a bit extreme on the other end also.

No worries at all. Unless I am training for a specific goal, I don't beat myself up over not eating correctly all the time. I just didn't want you turning around in 8 weeks wondering why you didn't succeed as much as you could have. But I knew you knew that.

 

[HIT4ME]

No worries at all. Unless I am training for a specific goal, I don't beat myself up over not eating correctly all the time. I just didn't want you turning around in 8 weeks wondering why you didn't succeed as much as you could have. But I knew you knew that.

No man, I appreciate the objective views. I try to be hard on myself, and go for results, but also realize that you have to have some flexibility. I was way too flexible last week - which is why I was adding up the calories afterward and noted it was 3,000 calories. But it's good to have you and Brundel keeping me honest with myself. It's easy to just say, "whatever" and come up with a justification, but just having you and Brundel mention it has me re-evaluating it all and I will still have one, but obviously need to keep it more in-check.

I want fast results....but I have a long way to go and need to stick to this for 8-12 weeks to lose 30 pounds I bet....so I need to be able to stick to it, and that means being flexible, but also remaining honest with myself...and you and Brundel have helped!

 

[HIT4ME]

Also, the fact of the matter is, my knee jerk reaction to Kisaj and Brundel's posts was to explain and justify, which means that maybe I should re-examine my beliefs

 

[HIT4ME]

Today's Measurements - 186 pounds and 40 3/8" waist. I have been ignoring the 1/8th inch drops, because I figured they were too precise in a non-precise situation. What I have noticed though, is that these 1/8th inch drops are fairly linear - i.e.- they are consistent. This is the lowest weight I have been in probably 13 years. I looked back 1 week and I've lost 3.5 pounds since last Wed, which is exactly what I've expected....I seem to lose about 1/2 pound per day on the diet. However, as noted, I had a huge cheat meal on Saturday...so this may have been slightly better if I had kept that in control. In other words, this is a sign the Exotherm is doing something, since I had results equal to just doing the diet when I wasn't following the diet as strictly as I normally would.

Also, my gf made a comment while I was doing some work about me being more my normal self lately...much calmer and less easily aggravated. Not to share too much personal information, but I've been completely overwhelmed for a while and have (for the first time in my life) had mild anxiety and started obsessing over negative thoughts. I couldn't seem to break these patterns with conscious effort and it felt like these thoughts had control over me, not the other way around. It wasn't extremely serious but it did effect my sleep, and made me much more easily angry, aggravated, upset, etc. when I was trying to get things done and they didn't go as planned. Since I started taking the NALT and the Exotherm I have found it almost difficult to get upset with things. The patterns have just broken themselves. Since I started taking the two around the same time, I can't credit one or the other and I really think it is a combination of both. Others have mentioned the feel good feeling of Exotherm, so it has a big impact. Just these mental improvements are life changing to be honest. Things just seem easier.

Also, this has been on my mind since yesterday: "If every time you have a cheat meal you lose ground why do you continue to do it?"

This is a difficult question, asked in a strong way and I appreciate it. I can justify why I'm doing it, but the question itself has become carbon to steel. I will still cheat, and I don't beat myself up over it, but I will probably hear this when I think of cheating and this will force me to exercise more control over things. Thank you.

 

[kboxer7]

Today's Measurements - 186 pounds and 40 3/8" waist. I have been ignoring the 1/8th inch drops, because I figured they were too precise in a non-precise situation. What I have noticed though, is that these 1/8th inch drops are fairly linear - i.e.- they are consistent. This is the lowest weight I have been in probably 13 years. I looked back 1 week and I've lost 3.5 pounds since last Wed, which is exactly what I've expected....I seem to lose about 1/2 pound per day on the diet. However, as noted, I had a huge cheat meal on Saturday...so this may have been slightly better if I had kept that in control. In other words, this is a sign the Exotherm is doing something, since I had results equal to just doing the diet when I wasn't following the diet as strictly as I normally would.

Also, my gf made a comment while I was doing some work about me being more my normal self lately...much calmer and less easily aggravated. Not to share too much personal information, but I've been completely overwhelmed for a while and have (for the first time in my life) had mild anxiety and started obsessing over negative thoughts. I couldn't seem to break these patterns with conscious effort and it felt like these thoughts had control over me, not the other way around. It wasn't extremely serious but it did effect my sleep, and made me much more easily angry, aggravated, upset, etc. when I was trying to get things done and they didn't go as planned. Since I started taking the NALT and the Exotherm I have found it almost difficult to get upset with things. The patterns have just broken themselves. Since I started taking the two around the same time, I can't credit one or the other and I really think it is a combination of both. Others have mentioned the feel good feeling of Exotherm, so it has a big impact. Just these mental improvements are life changing to be honest. Things just seem easier.

Also, this has been on my mind since yesterday: "If every time you have a cheat meal you lose ground why do you continue to do it?"

This is a difficult question, asked in a strong way and I appreciate it. I can justify why I'm doing it, but the question itself has become carbon to steel. I will still cheat, and I don't beat myself up over it, but I will probably hear this when I think of cheating and this will force me to exercise more control over things. Thank you.

Appreciate you sharing your journey man. We're all here to support. I am glad to hear you are starting to feeling better and like your old self again. imo that is priceless.

As for the cheat meals...my buddy who is a ex pro bball player is hard core with nutrition. He used to call everything outside of his diet "fat boy food" lol. I remember his mantra was always "are you living to eat, or eating to live?" Always made me think. Food is fuel. I'm eating to live not the other way around.

 

[HIT4ME]

Alright. I'm a bit embarrassed to do this, but it will probably be good to show people results. I took some photos, and it doesn't even look like I work out, haha. I also question if my 25% bodyfat estimate is even close...maybe you guys could give your opinions on my bodyfat levels. I've lost over 60 pounds since January 15th, so....I'm a lot better, but not there yet.

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[HIT4ME]

Appreciate you sharing your journey man. We're all here to support. I am glad to hear you are starting to feeling better and like your old self again. imo that is priceless.

As for the cheat meals...my buddy who is a ex pro bball player is hard core with nutrition. He used to call everything outside of his diet "fat boy food" lol. I remember his mantra was always "are you living to eat, or eating to live?" Always made me think. Food is fuel. I'm eating to live not the other way around.

LOL - I understand that mentality, but I'm not an athlete either. Just a guy trying to do the best he can, competing with himself and living life. I try to be hard, intense, etc. - but I like to cheat, and I'm gonna cheat, it's just me at this point in my life.

When I was in college, I had that mentality - I ate ONLY for fuel. It becomes easy after a while, I get that. But things in life change and if it takes me an extra couple of weeks to get where I'm going, or results stop and I have to change then, fine. I know I can do better, but I also know that not many people on this forum would stick to eating 700 calories/day for 6 days a week for months.

Having said that, there is a lot of truth to that and I try to stick to that philosophy 80-90% of the time.

 

[CJNator]

Alright. I'm a bit embarrassed to do this, but it will probably be good to show people results. I took some photos, and it doesn't even look like I work out, haha. I also question if my 25% bodyfat estimate is even close...maybe you guys could give your opinions on my bodyfat levels. I've lost over 60 pounds since January 15th, so....I'm a lot better, but not there yet.

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You are probably right but I can't say. To be accurate you would have to do all that caliper stuff but don't worry about bf% just look in the mirror and see them gainz! Its going to take time my man, but in the end it will all be worth it.

 

[HIT4ME]

You are probably right but I can't say. To be accurate you would have to do all that caliper stuff but don't worry about bf% just look in the mirror and see them gainz! Its going to take time my man, but in the end it will all be worth it.

Thanks man - I think losing another 30 pounds will take me about 10 weeks, and I think it will be a huge improvement if I am right about being around 25% bodyfat. It beats being over 50% bodyfat, which I was at one point. Geez.

 

[CJNator]

Thanks man - I think losing another 30 pounds will take me about 10 weeks, and I think it will be a huge improvement if I am right about being around 25% bodyfat. It beats being over 50% bodyfat, which I was at one point. Geez.

Yea it will be a huge improvement on your physic. Also you will definitely get there, about 2 years ago I got crohns and long story short the weight fluctuation(with predisone) made me lose much muscle and gain 30lbs of fat in a month. I was about 25-30% bf and now I'm around 16% just keep it up man and you will be there before you even know it. Diet is key, then lifting, and supplements come last but you already know that lol.

 

[davidmma]

You will get there bro. I was heavier before this run the highest I weighed was 216 but I told myself I have to do it for myself not for anyone else just me to feel good and the journey is never easy but it will be worth it my friend.

 

[HIT4ME]

Thanks guys. I will get there, no worries. I appreciate the support. I'm just not the type to put photos of himself up online...so I am feeling shy haha.

Morning weigh in - 184 with a 40" waist.

 

[vujade]

Thanks guys. I will get there, no worries. I appreciate the support. I'm just not the type to put photos of himself up online...so I am feeling shy haha.

Morning weigh in - 184 with a 40" waist.

Thats really solid bro. your down 1 1/4" off your waist in the last 11 or 12 days... :biggthumpup:

 

[HIT4ME]

Thats really solid bro. your down 1 1/4" off your waist in the last 11 or 12 days... :biggthumpup:

I am happy with it. I have lost over 100 pounds over the past 3 years, more than half of it coming in the last 7 months. I guess it's a good accomplishment, but I still have a long way left to go....but in all reality, it is kind of fun and challenging and it builds character.

Historically this diet brings about 1/2 pound of weight loss per day on average over a given timeframe. These weight losses at times are extremely linear/predictable and I may go a period of a week or two where I see that 0.5 pound loss every day. Most of the time, the weight comes off in a cyclical fashion though...I gain some, lose more, gain a little, lose more.

If I go back to that first weigh in, I've only lost 4 pounds in maybe 12 days, but only a few days before that I was 197 (3-4 days before I started this log) - I lost a bunch real fast in the beginning, gained some back, lost a bunch more. What's more important is that 1.25" in my mind - to lose that and only lose 4 pounds indicates significant fat loss IMO - not just weight loss...which is another small indication that Exotherm is working some magic.

I think over time, once I average results, it will be obvious that ET was a help if I'm around that 0.5 pounds or more per day lost...but I am only at 14 days on the product, 21 days will be a better judge.

 

[HIT4ME]

HIt my back tonight and I have to update you guys. I've had a busy day at work, and was running around so much that I literally only ate 230 calories all day before my 7 PM workout. I had a protein shake and 100 cals worth of lean beef jerky, which wasn't on the diet per se, but it was the best thing I had available.

I started my workout with pull ups, which is relatively new to me, I used to do deadlifts and then pull-ups, but over the past month or so I've found that I like doing pull ups first....I feel it helps warm me up for the deads and I also feel the deads have more impact on my lats when I do it this way. Plus, I suck at pull ups, so this may help me improve more.

Last week, I got 7 reps on my first set. I started this week and got 8 reps right out of the gate, and felt strong doing it. Then when I took my break, I suddenly started getting a headache and upset stomach - as if I was having motility issues in my gut. I did my second set, and got 6 reps (3 last week) and things started getting worse. I caved and started looking for something to eat - my gf had 1 Andie's candy in her pocket book which I ate for the sugar, and then I found a Gatorade which I drank about 1/5th of the bottle...maybe around 40 calories worth of Gatorade. I then did my third set and improved from 2 reps to 3 reps. I still felt like crap but it was getting better so I pushed to deadlifts.

I got 335 for 4 reps last week and I got 5 reps this week. I kept getting better (presumably my blood sugar was low) and I kept beating my performance from last week on EVERY set.

Now, normally this would be my goal and expectation - but not on this diet. I'm happy if I just stay the same and I've had to accept some loss along the way. I don't really believe anyone gains muscle on a PSMF...but this is my second workout with improvements and tonight's improvements were even more dominant than the first.

Now, I'm coming off a period where I didn't workout for 2 months and ate like crap, and lost some real strength in the process - I was deadlifting 100 pounds more and squatting 60 pounds, and incline dumbbell pressing 20 pounds more before this break than when I came back. So maybe someone will say I'm just "coming back" - but I haven't been coming back until now, and I didn't expect to come back until after I was done dieting.

I can only credit Exotherm for these improvements, and I think they're significant. I am trying to be critical and harsh and skeptical because Brundel set the bar pretty high by using terms like, "Blow Torch" to describe this product and I respect his style and work. My hope is that his products will stand up to critical review, and so far, I'm seeing evidence that this is the case. I don't want to judge after just 2 weeks, because sometimes things get better and sometimes they get worse with more time.

So far, in about 2 weeks I've lost a solid 4 pounds, but more like 8 pounds when you examine the weight fluctuations - and 1.25" off my waist. Add to this the fact that I've been INCREASING strength on a PSMF. You can say the PSMF is to blame for the weight loss, and I believe it is a big factor, but losing that much waist size and gaining strength like that isn't normal. It's just not right

 

[HIT4ME]

Morning weigh in - 184.5 pounds and 40.25" waist. Small increase, but that is the magic of water. I only ate two scoops of protein powder (250 cals), 2 packages of beef jerky tips (100 cals total), 5 oz. Of chicken and 7 oz of broccoli yesterday...plus drank whatever water I drank (gallons)...plus the andies candy and Gatorade....maybe 675 calories total. So it isn't like I actually put on any real weight.

It just means there will be a day in the future where I lose 2-3 pounds again...

 

[HIT4ME]

Just got done with my workout - Shoulders & Triceps. Once again, I was strong on everything. Got at least 1 more rep than last time on every single set. I am definitely more aggressive, and I feel almost unbreakable - like there is no fear pushing to the limit and beyond. This may be part of the reason I'm getting extra reps, but I think this stuff is definitely anabolic, maybe mildly, but still anabolic. I got 5 hours of sleep last night, and it was good sleep, but I was really tired going to the gym ...not an ideal situation. And I still improved.

It has come up in other threads and I've mentioned it hear - when I started using Exotherm I THOUGHT I felt some heat, and either it isn't as bad, or I'm used to it, or it was just psychosomatic because I expected it (it is called exotherm after all). Others have said they have increased hunger. I have been eating less than 800 calories a day, often less than 700 calories, and I'm not hungry at all.

What I am noticing is that maybe my blood sugar is a little lower than normal. When working out, I'm getting an upset stomach and some headache when I begin my workout. Wondering if this is making me more sensitive to sugar level changes somehow...I also have noticed a few pimples popping up hear and there. I'm almost 36 and I'll get pimples once in a while, but this has been like 4-5 over the past week or so. I have oily skin....It's the Italian in me, so maybe that's just me.

Gonna have a cheat tonight, but not like last time - fried lobster and shrimp with some fries, and I looked up the nutrition ...looks to be about 800 calories. I'll have an ice cream cone for another 200 calories which will put me at about 1400 caloreis for the day....

 

[HIT4ME]

Morning weigh in - 185.5 pounds and 40 1/8" waist.

Again, the pound gain after the meal is typical and just water weight. I weighed the meal I bought and also realized the ice cream cone has 310 calories...I thought there were smaller cones that had 200... Guess not. A better estimate of my caloric intake is around 1700 for the day with the cheat and cone coming in around 1300.

Obviously I won't gain weight at this intake. ...but I gain water back for sure. Back at it for another week though and I expect I will touch 180 before Friday.

I noticed in davidmmas log he is experiencing almost the same results as me...Exotherm seems to have a reliable effect.

 

[davidmma]

Morning weigh in - 185.5 pounds and 40 1/8" waist.

Again, the pound gain after the meal is typical and just water weight. I weighed the meal I bought and also realized the ice cream cone has 310 calories...I thought there were smaller cones that had 200... Guess not. A better estimate of my caloric intake is around 1700 for the day with the cheat and cone coming in around 1300.

Obviously I won't gain weight at this intake. ...but I gain water back for sure. Back at it for another week though and I expect I will touch 180 before Friday.

I noticed in davidmmas log he is experiencing almost the same results as me...Exotherm seems to have a reliable effect.

That good hope you hit your goal by friday.

 

[HIT4ME]

No update yesterday. This weekend was LOOONG. I had to replace 3 wheel bearings, 2 axles, and a timing belt on 3 different cars (audis). Lots of physical work dealing with stuck bolts, high torque bolts, etc. I hate cars, especially when they have 315,000 miles on them. At any rate, I am in pain and moving hurts, haha. What I did notice though - I actually made it through. After Saturday I never thought I'd be able to continue on Sunday and I wound up spending all day and got things done ...and I'm REALLY tired today, but functional and there is NO WAY I would be like that normally. It was a crap load of work that would have killed me in a normal situation - let alone on a PSMF. Exotherm definitely has a positive impact on recovery abilities.

Morning weigh in - 183 pounds and 40" waist. I had to tighten my belt up one more notch also to keep my pants from falling off.

My back hurts a little from all the car work, but I expect I will take 1 extra day off and do my leg workout tomorrow night.

 

[HIT4ME]

Oh, and I took 2 pumps in the morning yesterday and two pumps at night, and I will do the same today. Starting to have issues with the pump in this bottle, as the liquid is getting lower. I opened the bottle and noticed a lot of it clings to the top of the can too, so I'm going to try to knock it down to the bottom, or maybe I will add it to a second bottle to help the pump situation...

 

[HIT4ME]

Morning weigh in - 182 pounds and 39.75" waist.

Going from the first day I started this log on 07/26/2015 I weighed 190 and waist around 41.25". I started Exotherm on Thursday afternoon on 7/23 - two and a half days before I started this log. That puts me at 8 pounds down in 19-20 days, and about 1.5" off my waist. Normally I would have lost about 10 pounds over 20 days on this diet (it usually averages out around 0.5 pounds per day). And if I look at the caloric deficit I'm on...we can do the math.

Cheat meals aside, I eat less than 800 calories/day. I'm 5'8'' and I estimate my BMR to be around 2100 calories. With activity, I'm probably around 2,500 calories/day conservatively. That's 1700 cals/day in deficit.

20 days times 1700 calories is 34,000 calories. 3,500 calories per pound of fat = 9.7 pounds of fat.

However, I've had cheat meals. So, from this 34,000 calories I can tell you 2 weeks ago I had a day where I ate 3,200 cals (almost 3,000 from a cheat meal) - this is 2,400 that I have to subtract from the 34,000. My last cheat meal put my intake for that day around 1600 calories, so I have another 800 to subtract there - 3,200 calories from 34,000 = 30,800 deficit. Divide this by 3,500 cals/pound and I have 8.8 pounds that I should have lost based on the caloric deficit.

However, the first week on this stuff, I had 3 cheat meals in 4 days because of my hectic schedule and not being ready with enough chicken on hand, and I don't even know how many calories those 3 meals were. Even if you figure each meal put me over my 800 calorie per day goal by 800 calories (which is conservative), this is another 2,400 calories to be taken away from the 30,800 calorie deficit = 28,400 calories. Divide this by 3,500 calories and I'm now at 8.1 pounds of fat loss.

So, 8 pounds is right where the diet would normally place me in this time frame, given my cheat meals. Except there are a couple things to note.

-My energy levels are high.
-Motivation is high.
-1.5" off my waist with just 8 pounds of weight lost isn't my typical experience (although I am assuming that as I get leaner, my waist will go down faster and faster as it will be the last place to have fat)
-my strength has gone up ever so slightly.
-I also see increased definition in the mirror.

Add to this the fact that my calculations above use conservative numbers for the 3 cheat meals in 4 days that I didn't track and my deficit may be slightly smaller than that.

In addition, I am "feeling" like the weight loss is picking up. I expect the next 3 weeks to be even better.

On a negative note, the pump to my bottle almost completely clogged last night. I had to estimate 2 pumps last night and this morning. I ran some water through the pump this morning and it seems to have cleaned out pretty well and I will give it another shot tonight. Some of the powder falls out of suspension pretty easily (due to the carrier being jam packed I assume), and builds up in the plumbing.

I think we're getting to the point where we can say whether or not Exotherm works and I am falling on the "it rocks" side of the fence...will see if it becomes more definitive over the next 3 weeks.

 

[HIT4ME]

Morning weigh in - 181 pounds and 39 5/8" waist. I hate to go with 1/8th inch changes, but it's not quite to 39.5 yet.

The pump on my bottle doesn't work at all now that I washed it out. I can grab one off of a new bottle, but I'm too lazy and I have just been estimating. Last night, however, I dumped out way too much and probably took the equivalent of at least 3 pumps instead of two. My right shoulder has a small amount of pain that doesn't interfere with working out, but does act up when doing day-to-day things....and that shoulder is stiff as can be today, but nothing that would stop me from continuing as is. Gonna stick with 2 pumps 2times/day for a while and see how it goes.

I'm also noticing the heat more today...my face is really warm.

Have been working like crazy, so I haven't had a chance to work out in a few days, plus I hurt my back over the weekend. Plan on doing legs tonight if I can fit it in....

 

[HIT4ME]

Oh, one more thing I noted. I have been eating under 800 calories/day since Saturday morning. I normally would be in mild ketosis by now. Just for kicks I used a ketone test strip yesterday and I wasn't really even in trace amounts of Ketosis. I drink a lot of water, and these aren't super accurate I know - but on this diet I know that by now I'd register a little at this point in the week. I think this is interesting, just because I had noted that my blood sugar seems to be lower lately and I had to have some carbs intra-workout at one point.

The goal of this diet isn't ketosis, so it's not important...but it's interesting I thought. It may be meaningless.

 

[CJNator]

Use a syringe and dump the rest of the exotherm into something to keep it safe, also so you can extract it out while measuring the content.

 

[HIT4ME]

This is what I've been thinking....but I've been too lazy to do it so far...early morning and later at night I am not in the swing of things when I apply this, haha.

 

[CJNator]

This is what I've been thinking....but I've been too lazy to do it so far...early morning and later at night I am not in the swing of things when I apply this, haha.

Lol it is definitely worth it man, best do it after a nice workout when you are full of energy! That usually when I get stuff done lol.

 

[brundel]

Once the pump sputters out there is always some left in the bottom. 5-15 ml at least. Sometimes more depending on the pump and its position.
A syringe is great or just guesstimate. A little more wont hurt .....well...might hurt the joints.

 

[HIT4ME]

Lol it is definitely worth it man, best do it after a nice workout when you are full of energy! That usually when I get stuff done lol.

Haha, yeah, I've been squeezing my workouts in when I can, and It's been 4-5 days since I've been able to get there and it sucks! When I do get there, it is because I took a break from some sort of work, did the workout, shower, eat, go back to work. I've been putting the last Exo dose on a little before bedtime...may not be optimal.

Once the pump sputters out there is always some left in the bottom. 5-15 ml at least. Sometimes more depending on the pump and its position.
A syringe is great or just guesstimate. A little more wont hurt .....well...might hurt the joints.

I can tell you, last night, I put A LOT extra on and I feel it in my joints and muscles. I feel stiff, my muscles actually feel a little weak...but weak in a stiff way, not in a way that I can't generate force. I went up a slightly steeper than normal set of stairs this morning and I was two steps from the top and I thought my legs were going to burn up. Right now, I feel HOT. I am sweating and I can't take the heat...24 hours later.....I didn't notice the heat until about 90 minutes ago. Now I'm just sitting here, sweating my nuts off.

I should have another 4-5 days left in this bottle (I'm about 21 days in but I've been running 4 pumps since Sunday)...maybe the pump just sputtered out. When I opened it, I noticed a bunch was clinging to the top too, so I hammered the bottle down on the counter a few times and it settled to the bottom.

Thanks for the replies guys. I'm new to this, so I would like to make it interesting...not sure what else to say. Hope I'm doing a good job and helping someone...

 

[HIT4ME]

Morning weigh in - 180.5 pounds and 39.5" waist. Took some skin fold measurements and the chart has me at somewhere between 15-17% bodyfat, and that makes me think I'm doing something very wrong, or they just aren't accurate. The Tanita scale had me at 23% - I think 20-23% is probably accurate. I think I have about 20-25 pounds of fat to come off still pretty easily.

I have been taking 2 pumps 2X per day since Sunday. As I said, 2 nights ago my pump stopped and I had to start estimating, and I dumped a HUGE amount on by accident. I am going to CVS today if I have some time to pick up a syringe. I've been doing an OK job estimating since the incident, but the syringe is a better idea. The large does 2 nights ago left me feeling very, very achy yesterday right up until i went to sleep last night. My right shoulder was stiff enough that I was starting to think that it would impede my workouts (once I get time to get back there!). It feels much, much better today. I am still at 4 pumps, and this may only cause minor joint pain, if any in me, but I may drop back to 3. Not sure yet, I will keep going for a little while at 4 just to see.

I was thinking about it, and NOTHING has ever really given me joint pain. I've only ever used arimistane up to about 100 mg, but mostly Alphamax is the only product I've used with Arimistane and at 75 mg that definatly had NO effect on my joints. I've used 11-Oxo orally at over a gram/day and never had any joint pain from it. I've used 11-KT at up to 4 ml/day (340 mg of 11-KT) for 10-12 week runs and never had joint pain. This stuff, has given me joint pain with a large dose.

I was thinking this morning that I really liked 11-KT and wish I had more time to use it before they pulled it. Exotherm, however, is at least as good if not better in my opinion so far. I never ran 11-KT on a PSMF so my results weren't as good, but I feel like 11-KT was not all that anabolic and I would have never seen strength GAINS on a PSMF with it. I also didn't lose fat this fast, but again the PSMF has an impact there as well...I would compare the two products as being very close at this point, even though they are very different (11-KT being a hormone). As I said before, I'm also starting to expect Exotherm is "picking up steam" and will get better from hear on out. It just seems like I'm losing weight faster in the last week than before...I may actually be 179.5 tomorrow morning, we will see.

 

[vujade]

I'd say 20-22% judging by photos alone....

 

[HIT4ME]

Those photos are soooooo last week man I'm getting ripped now. j/k- there is a difference. I will give it some more time and take new photos - maybe in 2 weeks. I'm definitely leaner than in those photos.

I've got plenty of pudge to go....the thing is, I'm losing weight at least as fast as if I was doing the PSMF, in the last week maybe a hair faster than normal, and my strength and energy are going up, and the scale only means so much. I feel like I'm recomping, which is crazy to even be considering on less than 800 cals/day and while losing almost 0.5 pounds/day.

 

[brundel]

Sorry to hear about the joint pain bro. At least you know its working
We adjusted the recommended dose to just under the threshold where most experienced joint issues so any more than the recommended dose and joint pain is likely. The good news is your also getting higher doses of the SV and Cirsium so fat burning/ metabolism is higher as well.
If you get a syringe remember 1 pump = 1.5ml.

 

[HIT4ME]

Sorry to hear about the joint pain bro. At least you know its working
We adjusted the recommended dose to just under the threshold where most experienced joint issues so any more than the recommended dose and joint pain is likely. The good news is your also getting higher doses of the SV and Cirsium so fat burning/ metabolism is higher as well.
If you get a syringe remember 1 pump = 1.5ml.

No need to be sorry. It should be expected and it isn't that bad. Low estrogen = joint issues. My real point is that even large doses of other products didn't give this side...and this stuff does. Indicates it is doing more than you would expect.

I think I may be in the 20% that can take 4 pumps...the joint pain wasn't present at all until I way over did it...but at that point the heat became pronounced too. This is why I am going to stick with 4 for a bit. The pain is minor and subsiding.

Normally, most products are under dosed and ineffective. Doubling the dose of many products has been revealing in these situations. This product is beating that test. Even 2 pumps in davidmma's thread seems to be effective ...it may hurt your sales volume....but this may be a rare product where you can use less than recommended over a longer period and see better results even. More is only better to a point and it is positive that this seems to be the case here.

 

[brundel]

No need to be sorry. It should be expected and it isn't that bad. Low estrogen = joint issues. My real point is that even large doses of other products didn't give this side...and this stuff does. Indicates it is doing more than you would expect.

I think I may be in the 20% that can take 4 pumps...the joint pain wasn't present at all until I way over did it...but at that point the heat became pronounced too. This is why I am going to stick with 4 for a bit. The pain is minor and subsiding.

Normally, most products are under dosed and ineffective. Doubling the dose of many products has been revealing in these situations. This product is beating that test. Even 2 pumps in davidmma's thread seems to be effective ...it may hurt your sales volume....but this may be a rare product where you can use less than recommended over a longer period and see better results even. More is only better to a point and it is positive that this seems to be the case here.

I dont mind if guys can get away with less. It was this way with Formeron as well.
I like that our products are strong enough to be used at lower than recommended doses. Its a testament to the formula and to our dedication to make great products.

 

[ma70]

I dont mind if guys can get away with less. It was this way with Formeron as well.
I like that our products are strong enough to be used at lower than recommended doses. Its a testament to the formula and to our dedication to make great products.

Judging by some reports I've read I don't think I'll need 3 pumps but I'm gonna try it anyway. For some reason, almost any AI I try is "super effective" to me and causes joint pain.

 

[HIT4ME]

I dont mind if guys can get away with less. It was this way with Formeron as well.
I like that our products are strong enough to be used at lower than recommended doses. Its a testament to the formula and to our dedication to make great products.

I agree and I am glad you are out there. As you may remember, I've tried everything for fat loss supplements at some point in my life and I am very skeptical. Very little does ANYTHING. Even some of the things I think are useful are only marginally effective...and when I say marginal I mean close to not at all. Green Tea and Forskolin are examples ...they have research and backing, and I think they have real world results...but they won't have any dramatic impact.

I think this has the potential to be different if it continues to build momentum. Glad I bought 4 bottles.

 

[HIT4ME]

Judging by some reports I've read I don't think I'll need 3 pumps but I'm gonna try it anyway. For some reason, almost any AI I try is "super effective" to me and causes joint pain.

I normally double the dose of a lot of things. This doesn't qualify for that. I started at 3 pumps, went to 4, and I will see how it goes but I may have gone in the wrong direction...maybe I only need 2 pumps.

 

[brundel]

As long as its working and you can tolerate it I would continue.