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EvoMuse DCP Writeup

HIT4ME said:
Just when you wonder if Matt even knows what he is talking about....haha, JK
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Well, we could simply hold off for another 10-15 years for a 100% certain conclusion, but looking at the situation obesity still represents a MUCH more urgent problem.

As well,. this is something I considered when merging the Vanillean with the DCP...

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"Abstract

Increased expression of specific calcium channels in some cancers and the role of calcium signaling in proliferation and invasion have led to studies assessing calcium channel inhibitors as potential therapies for some cancers. The use of channel activators to promote death of cancer cells has been suggested, but the risk of activators promoting cancer cell proliferation and the importance of the degree of channel over-expression is unclear. We developed an MCF-7 breast cancer cell line with inducible TRPV1 overexpression and assessed the role of TRPV1 levels on cell death mediated by the TRPV1 activator capsaicin and the potential for submaximal activation to promote proliferation. The TRPV1 level was a determinant of cell death induced by capsaicin. A concentration response curve with varying TRPV1 expression levels identified the minimum level of TRPV1 required for capsaicin induced cell death. At no level of TRPV1 over-expression or capsaicin concentration did TRPV1 activation enhance proliferation. Cell death induced by capsaicin was necrotic and associated with up-regulation of c-Fos and RIP3. These studies suggest that activators of specific calcium channels may be an effective way to induce necrosis and that this approach may not always be associated with enhancement of cancer cell proliferation."

There is a similar line of research using the TRPM8 receptor.
 
dsade said:
Well, we could simply hold off for another 10-15 years for a 100% certain conclusion, but looking at the situation obesity still represents a MUCH more urgent problem.

As well,. this is something I considered when merging the Vanillean with the DCP...

Invalid Link Removed

"Abstract

Increased expression of specific calcium channels in some cancers and the role of calcium signaling in proliferation and invasion have led to studies assessing calcium channel inhibitors as potential therapies for some cancers. The use of channel activators to promote death of cancer cells has been suggested, but the risk of activators promoting cancer cell proliferation and the importance of the degree of channel over-expression is unclear. We developed an MCF-7 breast cancer cell line with inducible TRPV1 overexpression and assessed the role of TRPV1 levels on cell death mediated by the TRPV1 activator capsaicin and the potential for submaximal activation to promote proliferation. The TRPV1 level was a determinant of cell death induced by capsaicin. A concentration response curve with varying TRPV1 expression levels identified the minimum level of TRPV1 required for capsaicin induced cell death. At no level of TRPV1 over-expression or capsaicin concentration did TRPV1 activation enhance proliferation. Cell death induced by capsaicin was necrotic and associated with up-regulation of c-Fos and RIP3. These studies suggest that activators of specific calcium channels may be an effective way to induce necrosis and that this approach may not always be associated with enhancement of cancer cell proliferation."

There is a similar line of research using the TRPM8 receptor.
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So, in a nutshell, capsaicin may protect against cancer by inducing cell through the TRPV1 receptor? Am I reading that right? If so, that's news to me and I've done some decent research on capsaicin. Nice find.
 
dsade said:
I definitely agree with you here. I spent a hell of a lot of time on DCP over the past 10 years, formulating it not just to bombard the receptor with ligands, but to increase the expression of both alpha and delta - then hit them with ligands in the perfect balance.

I also worked to hit the supporting pathways that support increased beta-oxidation, again not just splattering the receptor one-dimensioanlly.

Generally pharmaceutical companies can't patent "combinations" or formulas, and so they look for that magic bullet single compound/pathway that they can nuke and hope for the best. Stupid approach, IMO, and the reason they would love it if we were legislated off the face of the Earth.
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Would one be able to stick this with Gw50155 or would it be too much receptor stimulation
 
YoungBodyBuil said:
Would one be able to stick this with Gw50155 or would it be too much receptor stimulation
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I don't think we have enough info to make that much of a recommendation, but I would be curious if it would be synergistic, additive, or if DCP is already hitting the delta receptor enough that it won't do anything much at all.

If you want to try it, I would start with a low dose for sure.
 
dsade said:
I don't think we have enough info to make that much of a recommendation, but I would be curious if it would be synergistic, additive, or if DCP is already hitting the delta receptor enough that it won't do anything much at all.

If you want to try it, I would start with a low dose for sure.
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Thank you for your replies again the whole reason I even compared your product to drugs of the same category is because I know how effective your supplements can be and WHATD someone of your knowledge to help me better understand the situation. I appreciate the responses.
 
HIT4ME said:
So, in a nutshell, capsaicin may protect against cancer by inducing cell through the TRPV1 receptor? Am I reading that right? If so, that's news to me and I've done some decent research on capsaicin. Nice find.
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That's the research that some people are doing. There's also some research on using the TRPV1 receptor to open up certain channels on cancer cells to helps enhance delivery of anti-cancer drugs - but we're just looking at the effect of activating the Thermosensitive receptors on cancers alone, and especially in the context of PPAR activation.
 
YoungBodyBuil said:
Pharma companies have stated that literally every PPAR modulating drug they've either put into the market or scrapped after 10's to 100's of million dollars have been linked to cell proliferation and causing cancerous growth. Hearsay? More like look up the studies... Not just on GW but other ppar modulating drugs, it's been stated several times in studies that there was a link, now do I want this to be true? Hell no, PPAR modulators could quite well be the cure to obesity once we manage to tweak them enough and find out which agonistic effects are the best, so I'm simply just asking Dsade, a vastly knowledgeable individual his opinion on this matter... The "everything links to cancer" was completely irrelevant.
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Well, I did look up a few studies and everything comes back inconclusive and conflicts, so I asked to see if you had a study that was more definitive. Sorry if you took my post as offensive.

Anyways, glad Matt gave you (and us) his answer.
 
Package still hasnt come yet but got a missed call from aussie customs. Couldnt get a hold of them today though. Wonder what must be wrong?
 
I just want to give everyone who has been having stomach issues from the DCP an update on my experience.

My advice, get gut health. If you can't, get a good probiotic. Add Orange Triad to this if you can

The orange triad alone took care of a lot of the pain...but it still happened from time to time. I tried to get some gut health but it was out of stock so I got a decent looking probiotic. When I added in the probiotic, the pain actually worsened a little. Not as bad as before the orange triad, but it hurt again. I stuck to it, and about a week in I had pain one morning and as the day went on, it just suddenly cleared up. Now I take the DCP and feel no pain at all. The probiotic def. Made a huge difference.

And if you are having pain from DCP, stick to it - this product does work. I think it is one of the most impressive fat burners I've ever tried.
 
And for those without any issues - I really started feeling effects on a whole new level at 8-9 a day. I'm hoping this isn't messing me up.....I just like how it feels post workout and everyone say you gotta take it pre workout and of course when you wake up and before dinner and sometimes 1 before sleep....
 
Tank... So you're dosing 2 am , 2 afternoon, 2 pre and 2 post? With maybe 1 pre bed? And the effects are that much better? I never had any of the stomach pain or anything, maybe a slight heartburn once or twice. What are you seeing from increasing the dose?
 
Tank999 said:
And for those without any issues - I really started feeling effects on a whole new level at 8-9 a day. I'm hoping this isn't messing me up.....I just like how it feels post workout and everyone say you gotta take it pre workout and of course when you wake up and before dinner and sometimes 1 before sleep....
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jmaplewood said:
Tank... So you're dosing 2 am , 2 afternoon, 2 pre and 2 post? With maybe 1 pre bed? And the effects are that much better? I never had any of the stomach pain or anything, maybe a slight heartburn once or twice. What are you seeing from increasing the dose?
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Yes - what are you feeling? I have no doubt I can handle 9 a day now....what are you noticing more of?

I can tell you, I took photos for my log about 1 week after I began the DCP. 3 weeks after starting the DCP I had only lost maybe 1-2 pounds, which is extremely disappointing as I am on a PSMF and should have list more in 1 week than I did I'm 3 weeks using DCP. I was thinking that it wasn't worth the pain. Then I took some photos and compared them to 2 weeks before (in my log). The cha he in two weeks was dramatic. Not sure why I only lost a couple pounds, maybe just because my body has never liked getting lower in weight than I am at now...even in college...but I lost some serious fat mass.
 
jmaplewood said:
Tank... So you're dosing 2 am , 2 afternoon, 2 pre and 2 post? With maybe 1 pre bed? And the effects are that much better? I never had any of the stomach pain or anything, maybe a slight heartburn once or twice. What are you seeing from increasing the dose?
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See, I plateaued, and I refused to go down without a fight, so I added in the extra dose or so and it seems to have gotten things moving. I do walk around a little warmer but I am on 3x ed Brite so..... I just know what works for me - since I added in the pre dose I'm definitely sweating more during my wo
I thankfully have enough of a DCP stash now to play around with the higher doses for now.
As to all my suppz swmbo claims that it's all in my mind. To which I say - so what if?! As long as it works!
Anyhoo, I'm thinking that up to a point more is better..,just have to find that point.

Ok, sorry for the ramble
 
Tank999 said:
See, I plateaued, and I refused to go down without a fight, so I added in the extra dose or so and it seems to have gotten things moving. I do walk around a little warmer but I am on 3x ed Brite so..... I just know what works for me - since I added in the pre dose I'm definitely sweating more during my wo
I thankfully have enough of a DCP stash now to play around with the higher doses for now.
As to all my suppz swmbo claims that it's all in my mind. To which I say - so what if?! As long as it works!
Anyhoo, I'm thinking that up to a point more is better..,just have to find that point.

Ok, sorry for the ramble
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This is the thing for me - it's hard to say what's in my mind and not. But with the DCP, I honestly thought the stuff wasn't working AT ALL. I was a big disappointed that it was just another fat burner. Then I saw the photo/results. I'm sold. If this happens again in my next photo update, I won't be able to deny the stuff works.
 
I've been debating going up to 8 caps but I do feel like my stack as a whole is working really well. A bump in effects would be even better.
 
Has anyone used this in combo with a product such as recompadrol, or slinsane / slinmax and Defuse on a cheat / refeed day with good effects of reducing fat gain and bloating.
 
paul56778 said:
Has anyone used this in combo with a product such as recompadrol, or slinsane / slinmax and Defuse on a cheat / refeed day with good effects of reducing fat gain and bloating.
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I have been doing 2 (extra) dcp and 4 defuse for the last about 6 weeks before "refeeds" - but i dont go all crazy; i up the cals about 800 and switch the macros from higher protein to higher carb. It definitely helps in my situation - takes about half a day to a day for everything to go back to normal, while it used to take 2-4 days
 
Looks like I'll never get my DCP :(

USPS updated their tracking from 'received info' to tracking number not found. Looks like the idiots realised their mistake and got rid of the tracking once I asked them whats going on.

$200 AUD down the drain. Will not be using USPS again if possible.
 
aver4581 said:
Looks like I'll never get my DCP :(

USPS updated their tracking from 'received info' to tracking number not found. Looks like the idiots realised their mistake and got rid of the tracking once I asked them whats going on.

$200 AUD down the drain. Will not be using USPS again if possible.
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I'll work with you the best I can, once restock comes in.

I still can't believe how bad USPS has screwed up in the past couple of months.
 
aver4581 said:
Yep extremely dissapointed. I sent you a PM happy to work out an alternative
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Yep, I'll get something out to you to get you started until the DCP restock comes in. Should be about 2 weeks.

I have an appointment to talk to the DHL rep on Tuesday, hoping for more reliable international options.
 
rtmilburn said:
Why stop at postmaster? dsade for president go for it matt! You got my vote you'd be better then a rich toolbag, or lying mass murding old hag
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Nah! We already have one candidate who keeps falling down, has bad memory, and has poor health! :22:
 
Hi to all of you guys...
Just a few clarification questions about DCP. I'm starting my bottle today and I'm wondering if I'its OK to have the dosing as 2 in the morning with empty stomach, 2 30mins before my noon meal and 2 before bed empty stomach. Is there a suggestion or recommendation on whether I can take them with an empty stomach or it doesn't matter.

Thanks a lot!
 
lakis said:
Hi to all of you guys...
Just a few clarification questions about DCP. I'm starting my bottle today and I'm wondering if I'its OK to have the dosing as 2 in the morning with empty stomach, 2 30mins before my noon meal and 2 before bed empty stomach. Is there a suggestion or recommendation on whether I can take them with an empty stomach or it doesn't matter.

Thanks a lot!
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I don't think it seems to matter but I always take it on an empty stomach but you might notice a little burn but I've gotten used to it and it doesn't bother me anymore
 
lakis said:
Hi to all of you guys...
Just a few clarification questions about DCP. I'm starting my bottle today and I'm wondering if I'its OK to have the dosing as 2 in the morning with empty stomach, 2 30mins before my noon meal and 2 before bed empty stomach. Is there a suggestion or recommendation on whether I can take them with an empty stomach or it doesn't matter.

Thanks a lot!
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For the first week or so expect a minor burning/stomach ache if you're not eating with it. I do both with and without food. Doesn't make a huge difference whichever you choose. Drink plenty of water and I noticed eating yogurt in the morning minimizes any discomfort.
 
I take mine on empty - always more or less - and as long as i drink a full glass of water i find no discomfort
 
lakis said:
Hi to all of you guys...
Just a few clarification questions about DCP. I'm starting my bottle today and I'm wondering if I'its OK to have the dosing as 2 in the morning with empty stomach, 2 30mins before my noon meal and 2 before bed empty stomach. Is there a suggestion or recommendation on whether I can take them with an empty stomach or it doesn't matter.

Thanks a lot!
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It works fine for me on an empty stomach, but I advise caution taking before bed. I have done this with vanillean previously, and ended up with several days of heartburn as a result.
 
Yeah lying down right after taking it gives me heartburn too. Give it at least 30 before you lie down or you'll feel it come up
 
I've been using the new DCP for about 1.5 weeks at 2 caps 3 times daily. The only side effect for me is one that I've noticed with each version of DCP previously, in that I suffer from some pretty severe lethargy at times throughout the day when utilizing full label dose. Interestingly this time I've found that a nice antidote to the lethargy is the new Alphaburn, it seems to have some sort of synergistic effect with the DCP with regards to energy levels. No other stimulant I've used alongside DCP has been as effective this way.

My wife has been taking it as well, and she has found that 2 caps at a time is too much for her, it tends to lead to some pretty severe stomach cramps. She's been tolerating 1 cap twice daily with less issues, but even that has led to some issues with watery bowel movements.
 
Just in case people still have the cramp/stomach burn issues - I highly recommend a good probiotic (gut health) and Orange Triad be taken with DCP if you have issues. Take the probiotic as you normally would, take 2 OT pills with each dose of DCP. Pretty much eliminates all of the issues I had, and I was getting them pretty badly. Not sure what the exact ingredient in OT is that helped with the pain, but I'm guessing it's the bromelain.
 
HIT4ME said:
Just in case people still have the cramp/stomach burn issues - I highly recommend a good probiotic (gut health) and Orange Triad be taken with DCP if you have issues. Take the probiotic as you normally would, take 2 OT pills with each dose of DCP. Pretty much eliminates all of the issues I had, and I was getting them pretty badly. Not sure what the exact ingredient in OT is that helped with the pain, but I'm guessing it's the bromelain.
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Are you taking that with food too or all empty stomach?
 
GreenMachineX said:
Are you taking that with food too or all empty stomach?
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My personal regimen (since I'm eating very little) - I wake up in the morning and take 1 probiotic, 2 DCP, 2 squirts Brite, 2 Orange Triad and 2 Fish Oil capsules when I wake up (6:30-7:30). Then around 2 I usually have about 200 calories and take 2 OT, 2 DCP, 2 Brite and 2 Fish Oil. Then around 8 I take the same pills as at 2 PM before I have dinner. Then around 11-11:30 I get ready for bed and take another probiotic pill.

Before the OT and Probiotic, I was considering dropping the DCP because of the stomach pain. Now, I feel like I could easily double dose it if I wanted. I tried the OT first because it was on hand, and it definitely helped. Then a bit later I added in the probiotic and it actually got worse for a week and then suddenly cleared up and all has been well.
 
HIT4ME said:
Just in case people still have the cramp/stomach burn issues - I highly recommend a good probiotic (gut health) and Orange Triad be taken with DCP if you have issues. Take the probiotic as you normally would, take 2 OT pills with each dose of DCP. Pretty much eliminates all of the issues I had, and I was getting them pretty badly. Not sure what the exact ingredient in OT is that helped with the pain, but I'm guessing it's the bromelain.
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Interestingly enough my wife mentioned that her morning dose hasn't been causing her many issues, and that is taken alongside wobenzym n, which happens to have a healthy dose of bromelain. We discussed that last night, and tonight we will see if her evening dose taken with a little bit of wobenzym helps to mitigate the stomach troubles for her.
 
max silver said:
Interestingly enough my wife mentioned that her morning dose hasn't been causing her many issues, and that is taken alongside wobenzym n, which happens to have a healthy dose of bromelain. We discussed that last night, and tonight we will see if her evening dose taken with a little bit of wobenzym helps to mitigate the stomach troubles for her.
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That would be awesome if we could narrow it down. I was going to get some bromelain, but since I take the OT anyway...I decided not to.
 
HIT4ME said:
My personal regimen (since I'm eating very little) - I wake up in the morning and take 1 probiotic, 2 DCP, 2 squirts Brite, 2 Orange Triad and 2 Fish Oil capsules when I wake up (6:30-7:30). Then around 2 I usually have about 200 calories and take 2 OT, 2 DCP, 2 Brite and 2 Fish Oil. Then around 8 I take the same pills as at 2 PM before I have dinner. Then around 11-11:30 I get ready for bed and take another probiotic pill.

Before the OT and Probiotic, I was considering dropping the DCP because of the stomach pain. Now, I feel like I could easily double dose it if I wanted. I tried the OT first because it was on hand, and it definitely helped. Then a bit later I added in the probiotic and it actually got worse for a week and then suddenly cleared up and all has been well.
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i have been trying this but it has not been working. i will continue to try it.
 
I am also halfway or more through my 3rd bottle at the recommended 6 caps per day, 2x in the am fasted, 2x in the pm 2-3 hours after first meal and 2 x with last meal, also i have been using orange triad for past 8-10 weeks which has helped with burning problem, i am also using 1 tab of Digestizyme® and 1 Lactospore tab with my 1st meal.
 
luckylefty811 said:
i have been trying this but it has not been working. i will continue to try it.
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My guess is the Bromelain is the ingredient that helps. Also, what probiotic are you using? You may want to try straight bromelain to see if that helps....
 
MidwestBeast said:
Hope it works out for you, bro. I've had no issues at all with DCP (just dosing twice/day).
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ive been taking it with OT but my stomach is still tight like cramping feeling. I dont know what to do I still have over half a bottle left.
 
luckylefty811 said:
ive been taking it with OT but my stomach is still tight like cramping feeling. I dont know what to do I still have over half a bottle left.
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Did you ever try taking it with bromelain or at least with orange triad?
 
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