Estrogen
- Thread starter Delita420
- Start date
ari4216
Banned
did u decide on reversitol then?
start with 1, it should be power even at one cap, if u feel the need go up to two caps. But first ascess your tolerance,these ai's kick in pretty fast.
james1
Banned
Take the one pill at night time before bed. If you don't feel it kicking in then bump the dose to two caps. If your joints start to give you problems, and things of that sort then lower the dose. Its all about finding your bodies sweet spot, as with any supp.
ari4216
Banned
divanyl based products give results, but to me theyre kind of wet gains. Ai' make u very dry and promote stregth. I wouldnt take mass fx without ai because in me it caused symptons of elevated estrogen. Either of them solo works, but work better when taken together. Some people dont think divanyl causes a lot of excess estrogen but in me it clearly did. It could be that you could run mass fx with no problems. Atd is just cheap and the thing is,everyone's body is different and these supplements are not well researcged like prescription drugs. So you have to go by, as you feel. Same thing can apply to training, use the instinctive method. You have be aware of your body and know how its feeling, looking for minute details in change.
this is why both of u should do logs to keep tabs on your progess and express minutes details day to day, so than you can see an overall effect.
pavb10
Well-known member
ari, great advice as always. I have a log right now of osteo sport for my in season ailments. Im in the works right now of setting up an off season log. The first phase of it is going to be getting my body back to normal and healthy which will be about a month. During that time ill be taking xtend, cit malate, creatine mono, beta alanine, rpm and a couple other things. Once that month is over im gonna kick it into high gear and start with the mass fx and ATD.. so to answer your question, yes there will be an incredibly detailed log. Your efforts and help will not be in vain.
pavb10
Well-known member
Im about to buy my supplements to go along with my mass fx stack and im still kinda undecided. Ive read somethings recently that say ATD can really decrease libido which i dont think my girlfriend will be to happy with. Could I instead run 300 mg of trione a day with aPCT? I dont really know how that would compare to reversitol though. Would it be suffeinect to run the trion and aPCT for the 4 weeks only while im on mass fx or should i start them before and continue them when im done with the mass fx?
ari4216
Banned
buy some chaste berry, i think part of the mass fx/puffy boob problem is do too prolactin not only estrogen.
ari4216
Banned
Prolactin is a single-chain protein hormone that has serious feminizing actions (like lactation, increased breast size, HPTA inhibition and suppression of GH production). There are a few reasons prolactin levels increase, but the one that is most common and preventable is that when estrogen levels elevate…so do prolactin levels in males and females alike.
Many are already aware that the first key to optimized testosterone production is getting rid of excess estrogen in males while stimulating LH production, and some are even aware that getting prolactin to go away once it starts is not always simply a matter of getting rid of the estrogen problems. But most are unaware of how all of this correlates and is compounded by the hormone group that triggers serious lean tissue loss.
Glucocorticoids are a group of steroids that originate at the adrenal cortex of the adrenal glands (above your kidneys). The most commonly discussed hormone of this group is cortisol. When a cortisol molecule meets up with a muscle cell, it triggers the release of amino acids from the cell. That probably does not sound like a big deal until you realize that these amino acids come from the breaking down of the muscle cell proteins. This of course means all of that hard earned lean mass tissue begins to waste away and become energy or toilet trash.
Cortisol levels are elevated as a result of stress. Unfortunately, the body views stress stimuli such as increases in muscle tissue mass, training, sickness, and the spouse in a bad mood as reason to increase circulatory cortisol levels. Cortisol production can also inhibit endogenous GH and testosterone production while fueling pathways that allow additional aromatase enzyme producing fat to accumulate around the waist and upper legs.
Prolact-X™ (Chasteberry Diterpine Matrix Extract)
There has been a long history of supplemental use of Chasteberry for treatment of PMS in women. Most researches believe that PMS is commonly the result of high prolactin levels so no surprise that we took an interest in this herb.
The amino acid dopamine is the body’s natural controller of prolactin release. Of course many dopaminergic compounds have been noted as effective treatments for increasing GH secretion as well, which correlates rather well with optimization in male performance due to the fact that elevated prolactin results in decreased GH and IGF-1 production.
So, increases in cortisol production means less muscle, more fat, and aromatization –>estrogen->prolactin…
and less testosterone production to counter it with. Kind of sucks, huh?
so u might wanna run mass fx/alri restore, not all of alri products are amazing, but this seems a perfect fit for mass fx to avoid estro,prolactin problems. Ive had a few friend try and they liked it better than atd, i forgot about this product until now.
Many are already aware that the first key to optimized testosterone production is getting rid of excess estrogen in males while stimulating LH production, and some are even aware that getting prolactin to go away once it starts is not always simply a matter of getting rid of the estrogen problems. But most are unaware of how all of this correlates and is compounded by the hormone group that triggers serious lean tissue loss.
Glucocorticoids are a group of steroids that originate at the adrenal cortex of the adrenal glands (above your kidneys). The most commonly discussed hormone of this group is cortisol. When a cortisol molecule meets up with a muscle cell, it triggers the release of amino acids from the cell. That probably does not sound like a big deal until you realize that these amino acids come from the breaking down of the muscle cell proteins. This of course means all of that hard earned lean mass tissue begins to waste away and become energy or toilet trash.
Cortisol levels are elevated as a result of stress. Unfortunately, the body views stress stimuli such as increases in muscle tissue mass, training, sickness, and the spouse in a bad mood as reason to increase circulatory cortisol levels. Cortisol production can also inhibit endogenous GH and testosterone production while fueling pathways that allow additional aromatase enzyme producing fat to accumulate around the waist and upper legs.
Prolact-X™ (Chasteberry Diterpine Matrix Extract)
There has been a long history of supplemental use of Chasteberry for treatment of PMS in women. Most researches believe that PMS is commonly the result of high prolactin levels so no surprise that we took an interest in this herb.
The amino acid dopamine is the body’s natural controller of prolactin release. Of course many dopaminergic compounds have been noted as effective treatments for increasing GH secretion as well, which correlates rather well with optimization in male performance due to the fact that elevated prolactin results in decreased GH and IGF-1 production.
So, increases in cortisol production means less muscle, more fat, and aromatization –>estrogen->prolactin…
and less testosterone production to counter it with. Kind of sucks, huh?
so u might wanna run mass fx/alri restore, not all of alri products are amazing, but this seems a perfect fit for mass fx to avoid estro,prolactin problems. Ive had a few friend try and they liked it better than atd, i forgot about this product until now.
RenegadeRows
Well-known member
ATD only decreases libido at high doses. The same is true with any anti-aromatase. Keep it at 1 cap per day and it will INCREASE your libido.
I also wanted to say that there is NO REASON to run either Trione or ATD with aPCT. aPCT contains 6-bromo which will knock estrogen out. Adding trione or ATD is asking for trouble in the libido department. When you eradicate estrogen, you will eradicate your libido.
Run the aPCT OR Trione *WITH* the Mass FX not after.
-RR
crazyfool405
Banned
trione and 6bromo/ATD have different functions but work similarly
for example 6 oxo or 3-OHAT will not DECREASE estradiol, but ATD and Bromo will, making them a perfect combo.
and it will not knock estrogen out to single digits, but it will however act as a competitive inhibitor (decreases the amount of product formed (estrogen)) and mechanism based inhibitor (time dependant inactivation) to ensure proper inhibition is obtainable.
ari4216
Banned
dude, i really think restore will be perfect for guarding of gyno, it covers estrogen,prolactin, and cortisol, for 30 bucks.
it has enough bromo in it, im sure, u dont need so much anyways,powerful stuff.
RenegadeRows
Well-known member
But they both knock out estrogen. I personally don't see the need to stack two AI's. I've always cautioned against low estrogen. Estrogen in high levels causes problems, as we all know; but it's also essential for immune function and muscle growth.
RenegadeRows
Well-known member
I've had the best results with ATD and it's cheap. 6bromo was harsh on my libido, and Trione (6oxo) is good but it's a bit pricey. I would run Trione at 600mg per day, or ATD at 25 - 50 mg per day.
crazyfool405
Banned
knocking out estrogen meaning ? lowering estradiol (the main problem that causes the hypothalmus to shut down...)
trione will leave estrogen the same, while bromo will lower it and both will cause an increase in testosterone.
it wont irradicate estrogen too much, the best way to tell if estrogen is too low is loss of libido, when that happens implicate an EOD dosing, then lower the dose a little and continue ED.
do u understand what im saying? or do i have to post studies?
RenegadeRows
Well-known member
I understand, my friend!I just don't understand the point in stacking two AI's. It's a waste of money if one does the job.
Good advice with the EOD dosing. I do that with ATD
crazyfool405
Banned
I just don't understand the point in stacking two AI's. It's a waste of money if one does the job.
Good advice with the EOD dosing. I do that with ATD
but through different mechanuisms, and different levels of hormone manipulation n u want optimal levels
theBIGcactus
Member
I didnt get much out of MASS FX out of 4 weeks, I got the most after 4 weeks, and for how much expensive it is I would say its not worth it in my opinion
pavb10
Well-known member
ive had some awesome results with mass fx and have another bottle lieing around. Guys im concerned about the price, but not as much as i am with with getting gyno. Ill run two AI's if itll be the best and safest thing. Trione seems pretty safe but is expensive. Im a little scared to run 6 bromo becuase it lowers my estrogen levels and i dunno how theyll be after im done with it. The ATD seems relativly side effect free and cheap. I really dont know guys what to take. I just wana not get gyno and have mass fx work the best...
crazyfool405
Banned
no need for 2 AIs for running it along something like this i was talking PCT.
you will be fine with the bromo i woouldnt be too worried. hyperdrol is good,
or ATD would be fine 50mg EOD or 25mg EOD depending on how it works for you.
for it to work the best you need something like 6 bromo which definetly has anabolic properties
ari4216
Banned
Prolactin is a single-chain protein hormone that has serious feminizing actions (like lactation, increased breast size, HPTA inhibition and suppression of GH production). There are a few reasons prolactin levels increase, but the one that is most common and preventable is that when estrogen levels elevate…so do prolactin levels in males and females alike.
i highly reccomend getting a chaste berry extract with aPCT
or just get the restore.
i highly reccomend getting a chaste berry extract with aPCT
or just get the restore.
ari4216
Banned
???wheres that from.
you dont have to take my advice if u dont want to.
It works differently for men and women. It lowers prolactin, women can get excessive prolactin as well.
ari4216
Banned
"Vitex or Chaste tree berry acts on the hypothalamus and pituitary glands by increasing luteinizing hormone (LH) production and mildly inhibiting the release of follicle stimulating hormone (FSH). This results in a shift in the ratio of estrogen to progesterone, with a rise in progesterone. The ability of chaste tree berry to raise progesterone levels in the body is an indirect effect, so the herb itself is not a hormone."
eveyone know increasing lh and fsh is a good thing. See some women have to much estrogen. so that why it works for them.
Yes its highly regarded as a pregnacy aid for women, but the effect are good for men also,just all the studies are mainly done on women.
eveyone know increasing lh and fsh is a good thing. See some women have to much estrogen. so that why it works for them.
Yes its highly regarded as a pregnacy aid for women, but the effect are good for men also,just all the studies are mainly done on women.
crazyfool405
Banned
aPCT would work. youd still have to take 2-3 pills,
Equilizer by intense nutriceuticals (2 caps)
cissus drol- generic labz (3 caps) (same as hyperdrol)
pavb10
Well-known member
Thanks for the help bro on the AI. you suggest 2-3 for the 4 weeks?
As for the prolactin, ive been thinking and i dont know if that is necessarlly the issue. I just remember having really really puffy nipples in 7th grade and theyve subsided but ive had them ever since. I just dont want them to grow any larger. Its really not incredibly noticable i just dont want my estrogen to spike and irritate them.
As for the prolactin, ive been thinking and i dont know if that is necessarlly the issue. I just remember having really really puffy nipples in 7th grade and theyve subsided but ive had them ever since. I just dont want them to grow any larger. Its really not incredibly noticable i just dont want my estrogen to spike and irritate them.
crazyfool405
Banned
prolactin is rarely ever present without estrogen, you can run L dopa and p5p .... but not nesecary unless something comes about IMO.
ari4216
Banned
im saying this going off of the puffy boobs, i heard this from ax reps a while ago saying that it could very well be that divanyl increases prolactin. ie the prolactin causes the puffy boobs not the estrogen. Theres a difference between gyno and puffy boobs.
gyno doesnt just appear from one dose, when i was taking activate xtreme,after one dose, my boobs would get puffy, but i didnt grow gyno in 45 minutes.
But just to comment, u may be overthinking this a little bit too much, and everyone else,including me,:duel:
gyno doesnt just appear from one dose, when i was taking activate xtreme,after one dose, my boobs would get puffy, but i didnt grow gyno in 45 minutes.
But just to comment, u may be overthinking this a little bit too much, and everyone else,including me,:duel:
pavb10
Well-known member
i dont think its puffy boobs. I have rock hard lumps of equal lumps behind both of my nipples since puberty and much smaller fat tissue running up the inside of my armpits that is unnotociable but can be felt. I think im gonna just get the aPCT from AX and dose it at 2 caps a day for the four weeks. Hopefully thatll be adequate? Does anyone know if aPCT will be back in stock soon?
ari4216
Banned
we dont know, thats REAL gyno,sounds like a small case. I actually wouldnt even take Mass fx,id be scared. Have u even taken an anti estrogen? u might just want to run hyperdrol x2 solo, or you know another good option is diesel test hardcore, doesnt cause any estrogen problems for me, and its a good test booster,
check my log bro
crazyfool405
Banned
X factor will cause high prolactin levels, all AA will cause it. so if thats something hes trying to avoid i would stay away from it.
ari4216
Banned
i havent experienced any issues with that
ari4216
Banned
x-factor is claimed so many things, it give me pumps and provides extra soreness, simple as that.
It does a bunch of other scientific things, but in the end of days, those dont really matter.
Divanyl leads to maybe prolactin to puffiness, thats what ive heard from several reports.
Anecdotal evidence is sometimes better then real hard evidence
x- factor has not induced any side effects of increased prolactin, i hear no one complaining about x-factor related high plolactinicity.
It does a bunch of other scientific things, but in the end of days, those dont really matter.
Divanyl leads to maybe prolactin to puffiness, thats what ive heard from several reports.
Anecdotal evidence is sometimes better then real hard evidence
x- factor has not induced any side effects of increased prolactin, i hear no one complaining about x-factor related high plolactinicity.
RenegadeRows
Well-known member
crazyfool405
Banned
there are tons of reports on Prolactin and AA, along with studies. you just havent seen them. there were a few over at LB
crazyfool405
Banned
That's what I'm sayin!
we misunderstoodeachother
crazyfool405
Banned
pavb10
Well-known member
hey crazy fool, do u think i should go with the restore instead of aPCT becuase it has chaste berry and 6 bromo or just stick with the aPCT? im pretty set on finishing the bottle i have of mass fx. How much 6 bromo is even in the proprietary blend and how much should i then dose?