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Epistane / Havoc "Bible"

milkmaniac

milkmaniac

New member
Obviously, there are plenty of epistane resources around but I'm wondering if y'all have any tweaks you'd make to the info on this loftily-titled site (aside from the BB.com links):
tunedsports(DOT)com/designer-steroids/the-epistane-havoc-informative-bible
(I don't have enough posts to put in links yet - and I'm not a spammer, honest!)

This is their suggested cycle:
Week 1-2: Pre-load Cycle Support, Cycle Assist or Life Support @ Bottle Recommended dosages.
Week 2-3: Cycle/Life Support | Havoc / Epistane 30mg
Week 3-7: Cycle/Life Support | Havoc / Epistane 40mg
Week 7-9: Cycle/Life Support | Nolvadex 20mg | Lean Xtreme.
Week 9-11: Cycle/Life Support | Nolvadex 10mg | Lean Xtreme
Click to expand...
(Varying doses, cycle lengths, and additional supps are given as options). Sounds easy and agrees with most of what I've read, so I plan to follow the plan on there for my first cycle (epi and Cycle Assist en route now).

Any suggestions/changes/additions from your experience would be greatly appreciated. Especially for PCT, where everyone seems to have a different opinion on which SERM/AI/herb/vitamin etc is necessary/best. I have some puberty gyno, which is my main concern (and the reason I chose epistane over others).

My goal is to add about 10 lbs in four weeks and drop a few BF %s.

Thanks.

BTW, I'm 29 and the only other things I've used resembling PH were Rebound (since it supposedly reduced gyno) and Novedex (because I got it free... for proofreading Gaspari's website) - these were a few years ago.
 
pembroke3355 said:
That looks like a very well laid out cycle plan. If your using Life Support remember it is only 1/2 the dose of Cycle Support.
Click to expand...

Good point - I ordered Cycle Assist, but it's only gonna last a month. Do you think I also need something like PCT Assist, Novedex, etc. for T levels during PCT, or should the Nolva and Cycle Assist alone be fine?
 
milkmaniac said:
Good point - I ordered Cycle Assist, but it's only gonna last a month. Do you think I also need something like PCT Assist, Novedex, etc. for T levels during PCT, or should the Nolva and Cycle Assist alone be fine?
Click to expand...

The Nolva and Cycle Assist would be fine. Maybe a natural test booster or a cortisol product but you look good to go.
 
Got my Epi and Cycle Assist yesterday. Going in for a physical next week and plan to ask the doc for a Nolva or Clomid scrip for my slight pre-existing gyno (after reading the gyno thread on here, I discovered one side produces a little fluid! :cussing:) You can get them for about $4 with a scrip, so it's worth a shot
 
Got my appt bumped up to yesterday afternoon and asked the doc about the gyno. He didn't seem very interested, but gave my nipple a squeeze (much more awkward than the yearly "turn your head and cough" routine... which occurred immediately after) and added a progesterone level check to my lab work. Forgot to mention my uncle is a skinny guy with huge man boobs, which might have made the doc a little more concerned. Guess I'll find out soon if I can get that scrip, but it looks unlikely.
 
Does anyone ever notice any acne using Epistane???

I suffered bad acne as a teen and want to keep that at a minimum..
 
I had VERY minor body acne, like maybe 3 pimples on my chest/shoulders/back throughout the course of a 6-week cycle. It could have been from something else, honestly.
 
i'm honestly not that prone to it, and it was definately the epi that brought mine on, because it came on in week 2 pretty bad, but it lasted for a few months after cessation of the epi
 
panther77 said:
i'm honestly not that prone to it, and it was definately the epi that brought mine on, because it came on in week 2 pretty bad, but it lasted for a few months after cessation of the epi
Click to expand...

I'm already prone to body acne, guess I should stock up on Stridex pads
 
I used epi for a 4 weeker and didn't have any acne that I felt was related to it. Maybe a pimple here and there on my shoulder, but thats it. I loved epi gave me great strength gains and cut fat. kept abt 7lbs.after pct
 
n8te said:
I used epi for a 4 weeker and didn't have any acne that I felt was related to it. Maybe a pimple here and there on my shoulder, but thats it. I loved epi gave me great strength gains and cut fat. kept abt 7lbs.after pct
Click to expand...

Good to know!! How did you run it?
 
know i have a question with your nolva is it nolva or is the gaspari new novadex xt??
I'm in for this log as well since i have stocked up on a whole bunch of e-stane so rock on!
 
Last edited:
Couple of questions:
I'm not sure my epi dosing schedule is ideal, so I could use some feedback. I work out about 5:30 am, so I take one before that, another around 11, another around 3. I just increased up to four today and took the fourth at 5:30 pm. Is that about right?

As for PCT, anyone know if unscored 20mg Nolva tabs can be split in half for the 10mg dose? I can't seem to find a consistent answer. (Of course, it probably depends on the manufacturer...)

BTW, I'm in the middle of my third week (of four). Only gained about two pounds, but lost 6 BF%s, so I've packed on more than a couple pounds of muscle. Definately stronger. No recent 1 rep maxes to compare to, but one-arm pushups are freaking easy now!
 
milkmaniac said:
Couple of questions:
I'm not sure my epi dosing schedule is ideal, so I could use some feedback. I work out about 5:30 am, so I take one before that, another around 11, another around 3. I just increased up to four today and took the fourth at 5:30 pm. Is that about right?

As for PCT, anyone know if unscored 20mg Nolva tabs can be split in half for the 10mg dose? I can't seem to find a consistent answer. (Of course, it probably depends on the manufacturer...)

BTW, I'm in the middle of my third week (of four). Only gained about two pounds, but lost 6 BF%s, so I've packed on more than a couple pounds of muscle. Definately stronger. No recent 1 rep maxes to compare to, but one-arm pushups are freaking easy now!
Click to expand...

So you are recomping, right? I also want to recomp with Epi. 6% in 3 weeks are excellent.
Do you use any fatburners? Are you eating at maintance and do you watch your carb/Fat intake?
 
its strange how some people get such great strength gains and others only notice some harder muscles. i havent ran epi yet but it seems weird.
 
Yep, recomping. No fat burners. I'll probably get laughed at on here, but I've been doing P90X and only doing regular weight WOs a couple of times a week, extra focusing on bodyparts I think are proportionately underdeveloped (delts, calves) and adding at least 5lbs to every exercise, every WO (well... less for things DB lateral raises). I've gotten more results in a couple of months than the last few years of standard training. (Only tried the epi now because it looked like I might not get the chaaance later.) I'm eating my regular carbs on weight days and cutting back other days. Fats are moderate in my diet already.

I just wish I could get a decent amount of sleep.

mcgeier said:
So you are recomping, right? I also want to recomp with Epi. 6% in 3 weeks are excellent.
Do you use any fatburners? Are you eating at maintance and do you watch your carb/Fat intake?
Click to expand...
 
Finished on Saturday, now doing PCT with Nolvadex (Fenobest brand), Cycle Assist, Suppress-C, and CEE.

I think my scale was schizo the day it said I'd dropped 6% BF. I'm visibly much leaner, but now it says I only lost about .6%. I gained 5 lbs total. If I'd gotten more than five or six hours of sleep a night I probably could have doubled my fat loss and muscle gain. Gyno seems about the same.

Sides were minimal. I got back pumps on one of my last days. Had major lethargy a few days, too. Some body acne, but not much more than usual. I used some Clearasil or Noxema anti-acne bodywash. Before the cycle, I could get by shaving my face every other day, the last few weeks I've have to do it every day to not look like a whino. No libido shutdown. No extra aggression.

Overall, for me, it wasn't really worth it - considering all the additional, pricey support supps needed. If I did it again with my current sleep-deprived schedule, I might try to use a coritsol controller during the cycle instead of only after. Or just get a new job where I work less than 11 hours a day, starting at 7 am... (I plan to keep my wife, though - even though she watches TV in bed till midnight everynight)
 
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