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Companies to look out for in 2017??

Admin said:
Logical viewpoint.

I guess I tend to look at things form a company owner standpoint as well as a consumer and some are just locked into the consumer side.
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Likewise.
 
Danes said:
Good read for sure.

Personaly, I dont trust Prop blend products

Lets say I make Testosterone Booster which is 2g prop blend of:
-PrimaVie
-KSM66
-LJ100
-Tribulus

People see 3 patent pended ingredients such as Primavie,KSM 66 and LJ100 so people automatically believe this product will be good. But lets say in 2g prop blend I just use 100mg primavie,100mg ksm66, 50mg LJ100 and rest cheap tribulus powder. Then I will introduce it with introduction price (24.99$).
Would this be good product? Definitely not!
But it may sell and I could earn money on it.

Prop blend is effective way to hide the dose of each ingredients and it would be VERY naive to believe supplement companies are not doing stuff like this !

Its not my business what people spend their money on but people should be aware of those ****ty sale/marketing tactics many companies are serving
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But the assumption here is that all prop blends are poorly dosed.
 
BloodManor said:
Thing is that with prop blends the doses can change batch to batch without anyone being the wiser
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All of the arguments against prop blends are correct. Definitely won't have an argument with me over that.

However there are always 2 sides to the coin. I see some products on the market that contain ingredients that have blatant interaction issues, and that alone shows me that some companies don't invest much on R&D or have no real idea what they are doing
 
muscleupcrohn said:
But it's not to each his own, as by encouraging spiked products, you are increasing the likelihood that someone else will unknowingly take a spiked product with potentially dangerous products.
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:amish:that is like saying if you drink a shot of jack, someone else will drink a bottle, drive a car and kill someone---c'mon, lol.
 
VeinNutrition is going to leave a mark on the industry. Not that side, this side... right here.

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justhere4comm said:
VeinNutrition is going to leave a mark on the industry. Not that side, this side... right here.

Invalid Link Removed
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Fat guy in a little coooaaattt
 
thebigt said:
:amish:that is like saying if you drink a shot of jack, someone else will drink a bottle, drive a car and kill someone---c'mon, lol.
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What? With a shot and a bottle, the alcohol content is known. If there is a demand for spiked products, and companies make spiked products, some people will unknowing end up taking a spiked product when they didn't want to. Who is Unknowingly drinking a bottle thinking it's a shot? A more relevant alcohol example would be making a bottle have much higher alcohol content, or adding another substance intended to get you drunk/high without telling consumers that it's in there. Yeah, some people would like it, and want to still buy it, but it's unethical and potentially dangerous.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
What? With a shot and a bottle, the alcohol content is known. If there is a demand for spiked products, and companies make spiked products, some people will unknowing end up taking a spiked product when they didn't want to. Who is Unknowingly drinking a bottle thinking it's a shot? A more relevant alcohol example would be making a bottle have much higher alcohol content, or adding another substance intended to get you drunk/high without telling consumers that it's in there. Yeah, some people would like it, and want to still buy it, but it's unethical and potentially dangerous.
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My ex-wife's bartender thought it would be funny to spike her fruity martini with a 151 float....while my license was suspended....and we had the kids with us. Her usual "1 drink and fine to drive" turned into biting **** in the parking lot and me having to drive home.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
What? With a shot and a bottle, the alcohol content is known. If there is a demand for spiked products, and companies make spiked products, some people will unknowing end up taking a spiked product when they didn't want to. Who is Unknowingly drinking a bottle thinking it's a shot? A more relevant alcohol example would be making a bottle have much higher alcohol content, or adding another substance intended to get you drunk/high without telling consumers that it's in there. Yeah, some people would like it, and want to still buy it, but it's unethical and potentially dangerous.
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one could make the argument that getting drunk is unethical and dangerous, particularly when that person is in possession of keys to a car. arguing morality is a moot point in todays world, imo.
 
dsade said:
My ex-wife's bartender thought it would be funny to spike her fruity martini with a 151 float....while my license was suspended....and we had the kids with us. Her usual "1 drink and fine to drive" turned into biting **** in the parking lot and me having to drive home.
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I guess that is at least one reason she is your 'ex-wife', lol. hopefully your 'ex-bartender' as well.
 
thebigt said:
I guess that is at least one reason she is your 'ex-wife', lol. hopefully your 'ex-bartender' as well.
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I would type out the rest of the reasons, but Erin would have to upgrade the servers.
 
thebigt said:
:amish:that is like saying if you drink a shot of jack, someone else will drink a bottle, drive a car and kill someone---c'mon, lol.
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I think it's more like taking a bottle over Everclear and labeling it Grey Goose. Or giving someone some green dragon and telling them it's normal alcohol. When I use a product, I want to know what I'm getting into (or at least have a general idea, as in a prop blend). When there are compounds in there that aren't on the label, it's much harder to make that decision since the information you have at your disposal to make that decision is incorrect.
 
VO2Maxima said:
I think it's more like taking a bottle over Everclear and labeling it Grey Goose. Or giving someone some green dragon and telling them it's normal alcohol. When I use a product, I want to know what I'm getting into (or at least have a general idea, as in a prop blend). When there are compounds in there that aren't on the label, it's much harder to make that decision since the information you have at your disposal to make that decision is incorrect.
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I was just having fun with my friend muscleupcrohn....

I have a question, I really don't know the answer to-is it illegal to put a false label on supplements, and if so what is the penalty?
 
thebigt said:
I was just having fun with my friend muscleupcrohn....

I have a question, I really don't know the answer to-is it illegal to put a false label on supplements, and if so what is the penalty?
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FTC violation, at the very least. Depends on the danger level of the misleading label, I would suppose.
 
thebigt said:
I was just having fun with my friend muscleupcrohn....

I have a question, I really don't know the answer to-is it illegal to put a false label on supplements, and if so what is the penalty?
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I wasn't quite sure if you were serious or not, and had a whole response typed out, haha. My internet sarcasm detector needs to be re-tuned I suppose. This is what I had already typed up:
Societal concepts of morality aren't exactly the same thing as business ethics. If nothing a business can do is unethical because of the social climate we live in today, do you propose complete deregulation, since it's a "moot point" to argue morality today? If not, how is your statement relevant to this topic?
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thebigt said:
I was just having fun with my friend muscleupcrohn....

I have a question, I really don't know the answer to-is it illegal to put a false label on supplements, and if so what is the penalty?
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If the product is underdosed, I dont think there will be any penalty but Company will definitely lose customers which is good enough penalty.
Spiked product is a different story. USADA and other would be involved
 
muscleupcrohn said:
I wasn't quite sure if you were serious or not, and had a whole response typed out, haha. My internet sarcasm detector needs to be re-tuned I suppose. This is what I had already typed up:
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lol...I knew I could count on you!!!

morality is in the eye of the beholder....some have better eyesight than others, lol.
 
Dammit,.
 
thebigt said:
lol...I knew I could count on you!!!

morality is in the eye of the beholder....some have better eyesight than others, lol.
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Haha. Morality is a relative subject. Hell, there are massive differences between different cultures and philosophies. Compare Tao Te Ching (Taoism) to Nietzsche's Beyond Good and Evil, and you'll see how vastly different concepts of morality can be. On a note more relevant to this discussion, you can make an argument that using Mr. Olympia to sell under-dosed creatine products is not exactly moral, but adding dianabol to a "test booster" without labeling it is clearly unethical, and most certainly illegal, haha. The fact that, as someone said earlier, they'd still use it once they found out that it was spiked, doesn't change anything.
 
I don't mind EvoMuse prop blends though. That is probably the only company I'll ever take stuff without even looking at the label.
 
ma70 said:
I don't mind EvoMuse prop blends though. That is probably the only company I'll ever take stuff without even looking at the label.
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And here it is- the key to the whole problem-

why would you continue to use a prop from Evomuse?

answer should be pretty simple- TRUST

so companies that do props- build up the trust relationship with the customer base- pretty easy to do, just don't F up
 
smith_69 said:
And here it is- the key to the whole problem-

why would you continue to use a prop from Evomuse?

answer should be pretty simple- TRUST

so companies that do props- build up the trust relationship with the customer base- pretty easy to do, just don't F up
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I trust him cause of his character and cause his stuff works. The only exception to my anti-prop blend rule. I can't find any guy who will send me extra stuff by accident, then tell me to keep it because he screwed up. Although I ended up paying it forward and helped fulfill other people's orders by sending it their way, it was his intent that was great!
 
Thread title to content ratio is strongly trending downward...with that said I really have a feeling Driven Sports is going to have a killer 2017 and will be the breakout brand of the year ;)
 
smith_69 said:
And here it is- the key to the whole problem-

why would you continue to use a prop from Evomuse?

answer should be pretty simple- TRUST

so companies that do props- build up the trust relationship with the customer base- pretty easy to do, just don't F up
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dsade is legend
 
carguy123 said:
Thread title to content ratio is strongly trending downward...with that said I really have a feeling Driven Sports is going to have a killer 2017 and will be the breakout brand of the year ;)
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yes, the beauty of a forum- this thread has some great debate information from both sides and in the end as it was in the beginning, the choice is yours. if a company is going to put hard work in the product and be truthful with the consumer base, that is really what we as consumers want. how you get there is up to the company
 
smith_69 said:
And here it is- the key to the whole problem-

why would you continue to use a prop from Evomuse?

answer should be pretty simple- TRUST

so companies that do props- build up the trust relationship with the customer base- pretty easy to do, just don't F up
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I agree with this statement, but am also perplexed because I get flamed for having this exact opinion.

Moreover, some of the most anti-prop blenders uses Evomuse products religiously, and while that is a smart move because Evomuse is awesome, I can't help but feel bewildered by that. The key is trust, and I absolutely trust that a lot of board sponsors here who use prop blends also put out effective products. Evomuse being just one example.

So some companies we can trust the prop blends they use are well dosed and others we can't? Yep, welcome to my side of the fence.
 
Jiigzz said:
I agree with this statement, but am also perplexed because I get flamed for having this exact opinion.

Moreover, one of the most anti-prop blenders uses Evomuse products religiously, and while that is a smart move because Evomuse is awesome, I can't help but feel bewildered by that. The key is trust, and I absolutely trust that a lot of board sponsors here who use prop blends also put out effective products. Evomuse being just one example.

So some companies we can trust the prop blends they use are well dosed and others we can't? Yep, welcome to my side of the fence.
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Just chiming in here. Although chaosand pain is anti prop blend I understand the need for them especially internationally. Nobody ever thinks of the business side of things.
 
Jiigzz said:
I agree with this statement, but am also perplexed because I get flamed for having this exact opinion.

Moreover, some of the most anti-prop blenders uses Evomuse products religiously, and while that is a smart move because Evomuse is awesome, I can't help but feel bewildered by that. The key is trust, and I absolutely trust that a lot of board sponsors here who use prop blends also put out effective products. Evomuse being just one example.

So some companies we can trust the prop blends they use are well dosed and others we can't? Yep, welcome to my side of the fence.
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Don't know if you were conjuring my gorgeous image when you wrote that - but I take exactly 1 EvoMuse Product - a topical lotion. There is *almost* ZERO data on topical fat loss (yes, you can find some tidbits on PubMed, some related to Thiomucase, some Licorice - but compared to orally consumed supplements, it's a barren wasteland). So - it's not like there's anything to judge against anyway *OR* options for going with a product that lists amounts (non-existent for what amounts to a cosmetic). So it's either use it, or nothing at all. Since I did my own "study", controlling as many variables as I could, and in the end dropped 1mm or two - it's a calculated risk.

But I wouldn't use any of EvM's prop blended stuff, because: Prop Blends = "Something is being hidden from me, what is it, and why"?

I'll also use a product that may have a portion of it prop blended - If I don't G.A.S. about anything in the blend, but the rest of what I care about is properly dosed and disclosed. I believe the Hydromax and FRAC in Ergonine is that way - but I don't care about those and assume it's pixie dusted.
 
Jiigzz said:
So some companies we can trust the prop blends they use are well dosed and others we can't? Yep, welcome to my side of the fence.
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For me, this is the case. I don't mind some SNS prop blends either. I trust companies that not only have been around for a long time, but have a history of stuff that actually works. Prop blend from a company that came out of nowhere? Insta pass.
 
Understand when you want to argue about supporting moral and ethical companies, that more than 50% of companies in the industry have had some sort of judgement or significant issue happen to them. I'd wager most could take a snapshot of their supplement cabinet and I could name at least 1 company that has had a legal issue come against them. A LOT of lawsuits never make it public and it's mind blowing how many companies have been hit with significant issues.
 
The_Old_Guy said:
I want dsade to add Glycyrrhetinic Acid to EvoMuse's SuperNova.

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I stared at it for a while before deciding that the E. Kansui was enough. Interesting that they are (were....2005) tying sub-q thigh fat to 11b-HSD levels.

I was planning on putting it in the Cellulite Supernova, for other reasons.
 
dsade said:
I stared at it for a while before deciding that the E. Kansui was enough. Interesting that they are (were....2005) tying sub-q thigh fat to 11b-HSD levels.

I was planning on putting it in the Cellulite Supernova, for other reasons.
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didn't PA have this really nasty td out years ago that stained everything it touched that contained that stuff along with formestane?....all I know is it was the worst PA product I ever used---it didn't last very long
 
thebigt said:
didn't PA have this really nasty td out years ago that stained everything it touched that contained that stuff along with formestane?....all I know is it was the worst PA product I ever used---it didn't last very long
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Skulpt. Yeah, I almost made the same mistake by ordering Emodin. Instead we cyclodextrin complexed it and used it in Ammo.


From what I understand, Trump bought out PAs entire stock of Skulpt.
 
dsade said:
Skulpt. Yeah, I almost made the same mistake by ordering Emodin. Instead we cyclodextrin complexed it and used it in Ammo.


From what I understand, Trump bought out PAs entire stock of Skulpt.
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yup...that's the stuff....ruined a lot of clothes with that stuff and it wasn't all that effective....worst lemon PA ever put out, imo.
 
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