Building Back Up

Dustin07 said:
was that he'd be deep into something then someone would pull him into a different project then it would take him hours to circle back to the original project that should have been done in minutes. but once he would get into something, he'd be hyper focused in an OCD/Tism kinda way.
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Holy smokes that’s me lol

The other meme I’ve recently seen online is a guy standing in his room obviously waiting for something, and the caption says “ADD people be like this all day for an event at 5pm” 😂. Too real…
 
GreenMachineX said:
Holy smokes that’s me lol

The other meme I’ve recently seen online is a guy standing in his room obviously waiting for something, and the caption says “ADD people be like this all day for an event at 5pm” 😂. Too real…
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I don't know a lot about either one, only anectodal observations but like if you take my buddy who I have mentioned, big squat. OK bench. 1/2 the time we got to the gym together he annoys the **** out of me (I love him, he actually officiated my wedding so we joke about when he married me, lol). but I'll be hyper focused on the task at hand, thinking about rep schemes, etc on the way to the gym.

he will be going into intense detail about his kitchen remodel, or new tooling setup, or this or that or a deck he's building and I'm like wtf dude. we are headed to the gym now, time to gym focus, but he's laser focused in a tism kinda way on this other thing thats going on in his life.

when his a.d.d. is really strong I see it in how he moves. his squats are squirrely. I saw him take a knee one time with like 405 on his back, I thought he was gonna die then he just stood up with it. I can tell when his a.d.d. is wild cause his head will be way further up the bench (so I'm tea bagging him more than usual on a spot) and his take away goes straight from hooks to chest with no set up etc and then he pins himself. its little stuff like that but we have lifted together for over a decade so I know his quirks and can tell when his meds are off or something tbh. now we do sound like a married couple lol.

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Haven’t weighed in in a few days, and have had one excessively large meal per day (not a gorge though). Other meals would be 800-1000kcal each, so I’m probably quite a bit over in surplus each day. But, I’ve had a few good workouts so far…couple highlights:

DL 405 x 4
Standing OHP 4 x 10/10/10/8 x 115
CG Bench 3 x 8 x 140
Incline Machine Press 3 x 6 x 270
BB Row 3 x 6 x 170

So, consistently higher kcal and my strength goes up fast, but a couple huge binges over a weekend isn’t enough for strength to shoot up.

I might try flat bench press Friday since I haven’t done it in a while and see where I’m at. Hoping for 225 for reps. Maybe I’ll get more than 5 reps on 315 for squat also. Goal is 6-8.
 
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Haven’t done flat barbell press in a couple years, so today gave it a shot…
4 x 5 x 225

Very happy with that given it’s been so long. I’ll keep it up and see where it gets. Hard to do normally since I workout alone most often, and there’s no safety bars on the benches I use.
 
Weight: 219.0 😂

Welp, definitely threw away some results the past week. Definitely some supercompensation and extra bloat though. I’ll probably drop to 215 tomorrow, then start over.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Weight: 219.0 😂

Welp, definitely threw away some results the past week. Definitely some supercompensation and extra bloat though. I’ll probably drop to 215 tomorrow, then start over.
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Well, that is impressive! Just get right back on the horse, and hopefully a lot is water that will flush off next couple days.

A couple low days back to back right now might help a lot to iron things out.
 
Hyde said:
Well, that is impressive! Just get right back on the horse, and hopefully a lot is water that will flush off next couple days.

A couple low days back to back right now might help a lot to iron things out.
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How low would you say below maintenance?
 
GreenMachineX said:
How low would you say below maintenance?
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Well it’s going to be to your tolerance, but the point of the low day is to shed some bloat and force the body to get into some of the recently stored bodyfat for energy needs.

I would restrict the first day more severely since things are absolutely spilled over right now.
 
Hyde said:
Well it’s going to be to your tolerance, but the point of the low day is to shed some bloat and force the body to get into some of the recently stored bodyfat for energy needs.

I would restrict the first day more severely since things are absolutely spilled over right now.
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Good idea. Blew it horribly today though 😂

I’ll pull it together tomorrow. Who starts on a Sunday anyway?
 
FWIW I think Layne switched quite a few years back to doing more frequent cut/bulk/maintenance cycling. like 4-6 weeks of one, then 4-6 weeks of the other with the deficit/surplus only being a couple hundred calories which obviously is completely different than old school mentality of bulk for like 6 months then suffer for 6 months. I bulk for 4-5 days then fast 1-2 so I have taken it even further into the microcycling 😂
 
Dustin07 said:
FWIW I think Layne switched quite a few years back to doing more frequent cut/bulk/maintenance cycling. like 4-6 weeks of one, then 4-6 weeks of the other with the deficit/surplus only being a couple hundred calories which obviously is completely different than old school mentality of bulk for like 6 months then suffer for 6 months. I bulk for 4-5 days then fast 1-2 so I have taken it even further into the microcycling 😂
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This is what I will adopt when I finally hit my goal weight. I never want to get as fat as I am now ever again.

Next out of town trip is between Christmas and New Year’s, so I have 4 weeks to cut hard. I’m at 217 this morning, still quite full and bloated…can I hit 200 by then?
 
GreenMachineX said:
I never want to get as fat as I am now ever again.
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I'm with you here. I am recognizing more and more that I would like to be a leaner machine at this stage in life. the past few years of bulk/cut cycles have gotten harder and harder and I notice when I lose rapid weight, the loose skin needs a little time to tighten back up. If I run ADF for instance I drop weight pretty damn fast and I'll notice that area below the belly button seems saggy for a couple days. nothing serious its not like my 600lb life or something needing surgery, I'm just more aware of it so I don't need to be 60lbs overweight when I'm 60 fighting this ****.

GreenMachineX said:
Next out of town trip is between Christmas and New Year’s, so I have 4 weeks to cut hard. I’m at 217 this morning, still quite full and bloated…can I hit 200 by then?
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not impossible but its going to come down to the old is the juice worth the squeeze.... I know fasting isn't for you, but that month I ran STRICT ADF I had CRAZY good results. these days I only fast on mondays because juice/squeeze. I could easily run a 72hr+ fast I think except fasting on mondays allows me to clean up the weekend and gets me back to a fed state for training earlier in the week so I can lift with my buddy and have dinners with my wife.
 
Dustin07 said:
I'm with you here. I am recognizing more and more that I would like to be a leaner machine at this stage in life. the past few years of bulk/cut cycles have gotten harder and harder and I notice when I lose rapid weight, the loose skin needs a little time to tighten back up. If I run ADF for instance I drop weight pretty damn fast and I'll notice that area below the belly button seems saggy for a couple days. nothing serious its not like my 600lb life or something needing surgery, I'm just more aware of it so I don't need to be 60lbs overweight when I'm 60 fighting this ****.



not impossible but its going to come down to the old is the juice worth the squeeze.... I know fasting isn't for you, but that month I ran STRICT ADF I had CRAZY good results. these days I only fast on mondays because juice/squeeze. I could easily run a 72hr+ fast I think except fasting on mondays allows me to clean up the weekend and gets me back to a fed state for training earlier in the week so I can lift with my buddy and have dinners with my wife.
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Man, the amount of loose skin I have is wretched…enough that even if I got shredded, I’d wear a swim shirt at a pool. That’s just from weighing 272.

The juice is not worth the squeeze…but, gladly, we’ve had to cancel that out of town trip, so other than a couple forced high kcal meals here and there over the next month, our next out of town trip is in February which is always a problem. I should be able to hit 195 easy by then though.

Weight today: 216.8
 
Below was the plan I did over Thanksgiving giving break and I really enjoyed it. Not necessarily the sets/reps, but the exercise structure, and only 3 days.

I am considering doing the program as provided though. It’s the Stronger By Science Strength Reps To Failure (main lifts) and Hypertrophy (auxiliary lifts) combo. My main hesitation is because the first couple workouts are kind of light compared to where I was. For example, yesterday OHP I did 4 sets of 10 of 115, but this calls for 4 sets of 5 of 122.5, plus a last AMRAP set, which to me sounds like the first few are junk volume. I know their programs work for everyone who uses them though.
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I think the weights I’ve plugged in are accurate for everything other than OHP and flat bench or at least close enough.
 
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GreenMachineX said:
Below was the plan I did over Thanksgiving giving break and I really enjoyed it. Not necessarily the sets/reps, but the exercise structure, and only 3 days.

I am considering doing the program as provided though. It’s the Stronger By Science Strength Reps To Failure (main lifts) and Hypertrophy (auxiliary lifts) combo. My main hesitation is because the first couple workouts are kind of light compared to where I was. For example, yesterday OHP I did 4 sets of 10 of 115, but this calls for 4 sets of 5 of 122.5, plus a last AMRAP set, which to me sounds like the first few are junk volume. I know their programs work for everyone who uses them though.View attachment 257025

I think the weights I’ve plugged in are accurate for everything other than OHP and flat bench or at least close enough.
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They’re not junk volume - they are meant to reinforce and train proper technique for greater strength, which allows bigger weights to be used later on for hypertrophy.

The hypertrophy comes from the AMRAP - a single set taken to failure is all you need for a significant hypertrophy stimulus. Most people fail to work that hard, so they lie to themselves about needing more sets/volume because they lack the requisite intensity to reach failure. But if you do 4x5 priming the pattern prior, you not only will get more total reps on the AMRAP vs not doing them, but you did add 20 total reps at weights that constitute work. So you get to add that to your serious AMRAP, which we do know that more total volume is still beneficial for hypertrophy.

So you get stronger, you get to lift to failure, and you have neurological potentiation for that set plus more total volume by doing the 4x5. Win from all angles.
 
I was never a great overhead presser, but a common thing I heard from many with powerful strictpresses was that more work overall generally helped more, moreso than any other lift.
 
Hyde said:
I was never a great overhead presser, but a common thing I heard from many with powerful strictpresses was that more work overall generally helped more, moreso than any other lift.
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my best was only 205 but at bw of about 176-180 and I can say without a shadow of doubt its something I need to work or I lose it quick. its sorta like pull-ups for me. a large percentage of my OHP comes back fairly fast if I work it, but it falls off fairly hard as well.
 
Hyde said:
They’re not junk volume - they are meant to reinforce and train proper technique for greater strength, which allows bigger weights to be used later on for hypertrophy.

The hypertrophy comes from the AMRAP - a single set taken to failure is all you need for a significant hypertrophy stimulus. Most people fail to work that hard, so they lie to themselves about needing more sets/volume because they lack the requisite intensity to reach failure. But if you do 4x5 priming the pattern prior, you not only will get more total reps on the AMRAP vs not doing them, but you did add 20 total reps at weights that constitute work. So you get to add that to your serious AMRAP, which we do know that more total volume is still beneficial for hypertrophy.

So you get stronger, you get to lift to failure, and you have neurological potentiation for that set plus more total volume by doing the 4x5. Win from all angles.
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Gotcha. Well then, I’ll begin next week and use the rest of this week to determine appropriate weights (or just verify what I have is accurate).

Also, pull up volume is low. I’ll probably shoot for 5 sets twice per week…maybe more depending on recovery.
 
Hyde said:
I was never a great overhead presser, but a common thing I heard from many with powerful strictpresses was that more work overall generally helped more, moreso than any other lift.
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More strict pressing itself, or any overhead movement along with strict pressing?
 
Weight: 213.5

Weight coming back down slowly.

Kcal goal on training days is 3k.
Kcal goal on non-training days is 2700.

Trying something different with my daily test cyp…alternating 7mg/8mg daily. 7mg daily and my e2 dips too low, 8mg daily and I start waking up way too early regardless of what time I go to bed. So let’s see what happens with this.
 
Well, that was quick. 2 days in the hole at previously mentioned kcal and training suffered immensely. That, or I’m just wrecked from hard training for a while.

After hitting the DL overwarm/training max single at 405 (which I got for 4 last week) which felt way too hard, doing 3 sets of 5 of 320 cooked me, instead of the prescribed 4 sets of 5, 5th set being AMRAP at 320.

Still finished rows, incline press, curls and Pressdowns though, not quite as intense as planned though.

I guess not every workout can be awesome. Somehow still achieved a pump so I can’t be that far into the hole. I don’t get it.
 
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doesn't mean much but I did mention in Dapack's log that when I was at my top recovery 10 years ago if I threw down a 405+ pull at any rep scheme, I knew I could not pull 400lbs again for at least 2 weeks. Now at 43 my recovery training (xfit) is obviously lower, but my strength is notably higher and I'd say my heavy pulls do better spread out even more, like 3weeks. I end up with a better deadlift day after 2 weeks of light ROM pulling, maybe a deficit day at 225 or something, then once a month pull heavy and I'm shocked at how heavy I can pull.

when I was focused ONLY on deads in like 2023-2024 I pulled heavy this week, light next week, etc and that worked pretty well but I ate in a constant surplus, gained 20lbs, and was focused 100% on only deads and bench. so it again was a juice/squeeze scenario.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Well, that was quick. 2 days in the hole at previously mentioned kcal and training suffered immensely. That, or I’m just wrecked from hard training for a while.

After hitting the DL overwarm/training max single at 405 (which I got for 4 last week) which felt way too hard, doing 3 sets of 5 of 320 cooked me, instead of the prescribed 4 sets of 5, 5th set being AMRAP at 320.

Still finished rows, incline press, curls and Pressdowns though, not quite as intense as planned though.

I guess not every workout can be awesome. Somehow still achieved a pump so I can’t be that far into the hole. I don’t get it.
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Like Dustin said, many people can’t pull a heavy single and pull optimally the next week. This is why you see a heavy/light rotation on deads in so many strength programs. This is also the reason I’ve been doing my deadlift work with weights I can AMRAP for ~8 reps (7-10, with 10 being berserk). I also recommend keeping a solid rep in the tank on any AMRAPs.

Conventional deads just take more out of you. It’s not a calorie thing; you just more directly load the spine.
 
thats where 5/3/1 would kill me after 2 cycles. always trying to up my weekly amrap/final set and I would for 2 or 2 1/2 months until my cns was absolutely fried.
 
Weight: 212.6

Well, that new plan isn’t going to work 😂. I can’t hit everything 3 days per week on a cut. It went great last week when my kcal were above maintenance, but not now.

Otherwise, the RTF bench plan worked kind of well.

Single for 225
4 x 5 x 185, AMRAP 10 x 185

I’ll keep doing it for now.

Tomorrow, Squat RTF.
 
would rotating squats and deads weekly work better for you? like squat this week, deadlift next week? I have shifted a lot of my deadlift days now to be accompanied by overall lower body work (leg press, glutes, adductor etc) instead of all 100% deadlift accessories like I used to do (high intensity RDL's, back extensions, etc).
 
Dustin07 said:
would rotating squats and deads weekly work better for you? like squat this week, deadlift next week? I have shifted a lot of my deadlift days now to be accompanied by overall lower body work (leg press, glutes, adductor etc) instead of all 100% deadlift accessories like I used to do (high intensity RDL's, back extensions, etc).
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Hmmm…if I go back to the 3 day per week, I’ll give that a shot, but just spent the past 30 minutes redesigning the 4 day workout and think I’m onto something…

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Basically, upper/lower, except arms on lower.
 
are you training every other day or like 2 on 1 off?
yeah I need to get back to having a dedicated arms day, those are actually sorta fun I think in a non destructive sorta way. chill pump sesh
 
Dustin07 said:
are you training every other day or like 2 on 1 off?
yeah I need to get back to having a dedicated arms day, those are actually sorta fun I think in a non destructive sorta way. chill pump sesh
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Usually Monday, Wednesday, Friday, Saturday. This plan gives me the option to do 2 on 1 off. One day, I really want to try hitting everything 3x per week though.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Usually Monday, Wednesday, Friday, Saturday. This plan gives me the option to do 2 on 1 off. One day, I really want to try hitting everything 3x per week though.
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You could always stick to the three day split you’re doing, but one week do lighter squats and heavier deads, then the next week do the opposite. Cutting and trying to hit heavy squats and deads in the same week probably isn’t allowing you enough recovery time.
 
sammpedd88 said:
You could always stick to the three day split you’re doing, but one week do lighter squats and heavier deads, then the next week do the opposite. Cutting and trying to hit heavy squats and deads in the same week probably isn’t allowing you enough recovery time.
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That’s true too. Let’s see what happens with this 4 day per week plan though first. My kcal are higher right now than previous cuts.
 
Weight: 212.4

Squats TM 1x315
Squats 4 x 5/5/5/6 x 245
Leg Curls
Smith Shrugs
DB Curls
Skullcrushers

Didn’t get the intended rep count on the AMRAP last set. I don’t think I was actually at failure with 6 reps, but I wasn’t doing well 😂

But, taking this week slower on the cut has been interesting, along with adding honey in my preworkout shake. I’m holding glycogen better, and have slept great several days (“great” for me). Veins are popping in the forearms even at my >20% BF. Delts a little more full and wider than my triceps now (in the gym’s mirrors, FWIW).

Also, loved just doing traps/arms/hams after squats. I wasn’t cooked like I normally am after a lot of pressing and rowing. Triceps felt all the pressing yesterday while doing Skullcrushers, but still hit my targets so unsure about changing that.

Yesterday, added in horizontal pull-ups/inverted rows and that felt great, as if I was missing something in my normal training. The scapular retraction is different with those.
 
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Looks like a great training day overall; glad to hear sleep has been much better too. That definitely helps everything!
 
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Weight: 211.0

No PEM today!

Weight coming down, but I really did a number on myself last week apparently 😂 5 pounds to go to my recent lowest.
 
Weight: 214.0

Went a little overboard like usual on the Sunday meal. Should still be able to lose more this week.

Hit targets on standing OHP only.

1x145
4 x 5/5/5/11 x 112.5

Rekt in everything after that. Slept great last night, but still feel sluggish today.
 
I keep telling my wife she doesn't need to make a big dinner on sundays cause we do all our meal prep and by the time 6pm rolls around I really don't need anymore food. so yesterday she made a huge potroast, mashed potatoes, gravy, and corn for dinner. of which I had more than my share.
 
Dustin07 said:
I keep telling my wife she doesn't need to make a big dinner on sundays cause we do all our meal prep and by the time 6pm rolls around I really don't need anymore food. so yesterday she made a huge potroast, mashed potatoes, gravy, and corn for dinner. of which I had more than my share.
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Yeah, we have our church small group meetings Sunday night…everyone brings a dish to share so it’s always excellent food…so frustrating lol
 
Weight: 213.0

DL TM Single x 395
Work Sets 4 x 5/5/5/5 x 307.5

The heavy single is killing my performance with weights/reps that should be easy. I’ll probably drop it.
 
isn't there a thing... I feel like there are studies... that dig into sleep research indicating that 8hrs is sorta silly since some people need up to 9 and others do better with as low as 6? (something like that).

I think my sweet spot is somewhere between 7-8 but it likely has to be the exact right REM. normally I just shoot for 8 and feel good, but sometimes you snap out of sleep after 7+ and its good. but usually I wake up 10-20 minutes before my alarm feeling great, roll back over in bed and then wake up with my alarm feeling like crap.

maybe the alarm is the problem
 
Dustin07 said:
isn't there a thing... I feel like there are studies... that dig into sleep research indicating that 8hrs is sorta silly since some people need up to 9 and others do better with as low as 6? (something like that).

I think my sweet spot is somewhere between 7-8 but it likely has to be the exact right REM. normally I just shoot for 8 and feel good, but sometimes you snap out of sleep after 7+ and its good. but usually I wake up 10-20 minutes before my alarm feeling great, roll back over in bed and then wake up with my alarm feeling like crap.

maybe the alarm is the problem
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Yeah, rolling over and being another few minutes to be woken up with an alarm is never best.
 
thats awesome man, been a long time since I've seen a great show in a club like that. the rock seen in the Seattle region has ironically basically died.
 
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