Are calories all thats important while bulking? simple question

[matthewmmcc]

hey all, so i was talking to my brother about bulking ect, and he says weight gain and loss is purely based on calories. so i posed the question, apart from obvious health and hunger reasons, could one lose weight drinking only something like olive oil as long as it was under maintenance? he said yes! so does eaten fat have anything to do (apart from it being high calorie) with fat gain? if my body needs 3000 calories to bulk, is there any difference (in finishing body composition, not health purposes!) between 3000 from fat and 3000 from protein? please dont reply saying not to do 3000 from fat, of course i wouldnt do that as id have no carbs or protein, i just want to know if its going to make a difference to my body fat while bulking if i eat plenty of fat to help hit my daily calorie number thanks for any insights here!

 

[Resolve]

It is a very common misconception that fat consumed automatically contributes to fat-gain. It is far more complicated than that: total calories and macronutrient ratios have a LOT to do with body composition.

To be brief though - yes a high fat diet can be very effective for fat-loss. Check out the Cyclic Ketogenic Diet or the Anabolic diet to learn more.

In your case, since you're bulking, yes, adding in additional fat can and will help you bulk. However, I would recommend increasing your calories in fairly cautious increments. Say 200 cals at a time. That way, you won't overdo things, which is when you start to gain fat.

 

[matthewmmcc]

thanks for the info, i looked it up and searched around and i know now that its
Calories IN<Calories OUT=lose weight
Calories IN=Calories OUT=maintain weight
Calories IN>Calories OUT=gain weight

 

[Resolve]

Pretty much. But remember that what you eat impacts whether the weight you gain/lose is fat or muscle.

 

[Jiigzz]

Pretty much. But remember that what you eat impacts whether the weight you gain/lose is fat or muscle.

This. 3000kcals is 3000kcals. This would just mean that you would need to consume 333.33g of fat OR 750g of either protein or CHO however they both will provide 3000kcals.

As resolve said, a diet high in fat CAN help you achieve WEIGHT loss. People often restrict CHO when trying to cut BF% as CHO gets used first and foremost as fuel for muscular work or brain fuel etc. etc., cutting down on CHO intake will mean that your body will start catabolizing fat and certain amino acids for energy and thus achieving fat loss.

But yeah, Resolves first response is on point. You start putting on fat mass once your body simply has no need for the extra macros and and so it stores them as fat. This can happen for protein, CHO or fat, however all three have important roles in the body, so fat storage is last on the list unless you start eating in excessive calorie excess.

 

[ThunderHumper]

Body fat = stored glucose. Not the fat u eat. And if u were to do that with allcfat, you would lose muscle mass and gain fat. This is because withou any protein, your muscles wont repair(yes they need protein to repair even if u dont lift). When muscles begin breaking down, daily requirement goes down with them. So staying at 3k cals will make u gain weight. You'll also lose water weight initially because fat is hydrophobic so it will "push it all out" to keep it simple

Just remember this after your trivial question. Diet and calories are very important. Easily more than exercise or any supplement

 

[Jiigzz]

Body fat = stored glucose. Not the fat u eat. And if u were to do that with allcfat, you would lose muscle mass and gain fat. This is because withou any protein, your muscles wont repair(yes they need protein to repair even if u dont lift). When muscles begin breaking down, daily requirement goes down with them. So staying at 3k cals will make u gain weight. You'll also lose water weight initially because fat is hydrophobic so it will "push it all out" to keep it simple

Just remember this after your trivial question. Diet and calories are very important. Easily more than exercise or any supplement

No it isn't. The body can only store a very little amount of glucose in the form of glycogen in the liver, blood and muscles. This is not called body fat.

 

[ThunderHumper]

Was trying to keep it simple. Should of used "enerfy" instead of glucose. Basically excess glucose is turned intontriglycerides and stored in adipose tissue as fat. When yoi eat below maintenance, your body breaks down the triglycerides into 1 glycerine and 3 fatty acid molecules. Both are used for energy via krebs cycle

http://ezinearticles.com/?How-Fat-Is-Burned:-Turning-Fat-into-Energy,-Carbon-dioxide-and-Water!&id=76031

 

[matthewmmcc]

Just remember this after your trivial question. Diet and calories are very important. Easily more than exercise or any supplement

Don't be so condescending as to call my question trivial. I was basically asking if ingested fat has an effect on stored fat/body composition, as I'm reasonably inexperienced in the nutritional field of bodybuilding. You don't call a noob's question trivial, it's important to them, maybe not to you, but to them

 

[pyrobatt]

Fats don't make you a fat ass,but keep it to 30% or lower of your caloric intake.Let me explain

Fats are needed to keep you healthy,the good fats can actually help you lose weight and gain it(muscle) and are great as calorie sources in your shakes or on eggs in the form of olive oil.Peanut butter is also a great source of them,(almond nut butter if your on the shorter /lighter side)
Protein is needed to build muscle and keep muscle.Even while dieting you need protein,even more so in my \opinion when dieting to keep the muscle.
Carbs are energy,for cutting or dieting you can choose to go very low or limit them.They can indirectly cause fat gain in excess via insulin and fat storage.For bulking I recomend starting at .5 grams of carbs per lb of bodyweight to acess your needs.working your way up to 1, then 1.5 and so on.I know there are ALOT of people who are carb sensitive on these fourms and don't even know it.

This comes up to a ratio of macronutrients you get from your calories.High protien won't kill you so here

Mine looks like this
50%pro30% carbs and 20% fat ajust a ratio for your needs.Your body. For the carb sensitve I suggest protein over fat because if your an american like I am.Saturated fat is everywhere and trace trans fat's are too.AKA like .01% un fortunatly so fats must stay at or below 30% of your intake in my opinion.

Hope I helped

 

[matthewmmcc]

Fats don't make you a fat ass,but keep it to 30% or lower of your caloric intake.Let me explain



Hope I helped

You did help, thank you! but as far as bulking goes, if eating fat doesnt affect your body compostion, is the only thing stopping me from getting 50 percent of my cals from fat, the fact that it would cause damage to my health? eg heart, arteries ect

 

[pyrobatt]

You did help, thank you! but as far as bulking goes, if eating fat doesnt affect your body compostion, is the only thing stopping me from getting 50 percent of my cals from fat, the fact that it would cause damage to my health? eg heart, arteries ect

50% from fat dose have some health risk,They all can't be mono/poly fats and you can bet alot of sat/atleast 1g trans from trace would be there.A better question is where would the 20-30 % you pulled come from?Protien?You need to have ample supply of that for repairing and building.Carbs?You need them for energy and muscle fullness in the form of glycogen.50% fat is more of a ketogenic diet plan,cause I personally wouldn't go below 40% protien cause I am 222 lbs.It would have to come from carbs,and I don't do well on a low carb diet.Some do though,your choice.I say try it for a week.If it dosen't work for ya?Go to something else.A week of trying a diet won't hurt your progress in the long run,may even help it because you mite find your right diet.

 

[matthewmmcc]

50% from fat dose have some health risk,They all can't be mono/poly fats and you can bet alot of sat/atleast 1g trans from trace would be there.A better question is where would the 20-30 % you pulled come from?Protien?You need to have ample supply of that for repairing and building.Carbs?You need them for energy and muscle fullness in the form of glycogen.50% fat is more of a ketogenic diet plan,cause I personally wouldn't go below 40% protien cause I am 222 lbs.It would have to come from carbs,and I don't do well on a low carb diet.Some do though,your choice.I say try it for a week.If it dosen't work for ya?Go to something else.A week of trying a diet won't hurt your progress in the long run,may even help it because you mite find your right diet.

thanks man im not actually considering 50 percent from fat im just trying to understand the science of it all! im on 3500 cals at the moment for two weeks to see what happens, experimenting just like you said...repped, for being plain helpful really

 

[Jiigzz]

Was trying to keep it simple. Should of used "enerfy" instead of glucose. Basically excess glucose is turned intontriglycerides and stored in adipose tissue as fat. When yoi eat below maintenance, your body breaks down the triglycerides into 1 glycerine and 3 fatty acid molecules. Both are used for energy via krebs cycle

This.