Angry all the time

[suavmcgauv]

Sounds like like you need more dht and the associated gaba response, high e makes me evil, dht suspension makes me chill and on point, could try proviron

 

[Brain5ick]

Really hoping this is a high E issue and this extra adex fixes things. Came home and my girl was in the mood so I piped her down and after about 20 minutes I went to finish and just felt like I started going limp before I got off. Plus there is absolutely no morning wood anymore. When I first started the 200mg and adex this wasn’t an issue, it’s just become one over time.

 

[Brain5ick]

have you noticed a change in how Low E vs High E makes you feel or is it one and the same?

I haven’t had low E except for prior to TRT it was at 6 or 7pg/ml and my joints may have felt a little drier. Also emotionally I just felt kind of numb if that makes sense. Like depression and anxiety but it felt more like a fog I was stuck in rather than an issue I need to deal with. High E for me I had crazy crazy depression and anxiety as well but I felt like it is different. More intrusive thoughts I guess but that’s if it’s really bad. It’s just a different kind of emotional, hard to explain. I don’t have ANY energy with high E, I don’t have much with low E either but I feel like I can push myself to get up and do things with low E.
I guess the emotional sides are the most noticeable for me. High E and I’m kind of manic, low E and I seem kind of emotionless.

 

[Brain5ick]

When I started TRT I could’ve ****ed a plate at the gym. **** was crazy! Morning wood left and right, my girl couldn’t keep me away, now none of that. I’d check out girls and just couldn’t help it, now I just don’t care. THAT IS AN ISSUE. I don’t think me going from 7pg off TRT, then 16pg on 80mg cyp, then 28pg on 100mg of cyp and .5 adex twice a week is warranting my E is low or at least that’s my thinking. I’m gonna call my doc tomorrow and see if he will call in some blood work for me. Til I figure that out I’m just on my own.

 

[Renew1]

When I started TRT I could’ve ****ed a plate at the gym. **** was crazy! Morning wood left and right, my girl couldn’t keep me away, now none of that. I’d check out girls and just couldn’t help it, now I just don’t care. THAT IS AN ISSUE. I don’t think me going from 7pg off TRT, then 16pg on 80mg cyp, then 28pg on 100mg of cyp and .5 adex twice a week is warranting my E is low or at least that’s my thinking. I’m gonna call my doc tomorrow and see if he will call in some blood work for me. Til I figure that out I’m just on my own.

Yeah bro. You need some bloodwork. I agree.

 

[Brain5ick]

this is the first i have heard of someone "leveling out" ... is this common? I would assume that when you first start this its a bit of a juggling act until all the pieces are balanced?

If your bloodwork shows that your E is at a good level, what would be the next possible cause? LH?

No, LH is tanked from HCG and it doesn’t control sexual desire or erections. Maybe prolactin or the other hormone that starts with a P, I can’t think of it off the top of my head. It could also be psychologically, as that may be hard to admit I can’t rule that out at all. I just know I don’t feel like I did when I started but that’s probably because all my hormones were bottomed out then out of nowhere I got a surge of testosterone in my system, so it’s no wonder I’d feel awesome. Maybe after androgen receptor saturation I just don’t get the same effect. I will say this though, I still feel better through all this than I did without any T in my body haha.

 

[Old Witch]

In all, to be honest, I’m very surprised your body is fighting therapy this hard. Most guys don’t have this reaction, high doses of test are given, free test rises, e2 rises some but not majorly, light ai is used, it all works out fine.


For you though... it seems like you need higher AI, and then proviron or some dht to bind up shbg and free some test up.

 

[Brain5ick]

In all, to be honest, I’m very surprised your body is fighting therapy this hard. Most guys don’t have this reaction, high doses of test are given, free test rises, e2 rises some but not majorly, light ai is used, it all works out fine.


For you though... it seems like you need higher AI, and then proviron or some dht to bind up shbg and free some test up.

Well I have SOME news after adding the extra adex. I seemed to sleep much better last night, fell asleep earlier too. Also the acne on my shoulders and arms as well as some on my back has seemed to almost clear up overnight, some is still there but it’s not like super irritated red bumps, just kind of dried up. Still no morning wood or an urgency to plow my ol lady upon waking up but I guess those few things are a plus. Working on getting someone to give me bloodwork rn.

 

[Brain5ick]

OH! I almost forgot, my doctor is also switching me from just cyp to a prop/cyp blend. 160mg cyp and 40mg prop I believe.

 

[bigbeaph]

OH! I almost forgot, my doctor is also switching me from just cyp to a prop/cyp blend. 160mg cyp and 40mg prop I believe.

Your doc changes your protocol often doesnt he? Its be nice if you could at least just get dialed in a little before starting from the beginning again.

 

[Brain5ick]

Your doc changes your protocol often doesnt he? Its be nice if you could at least just get dialed in a little before starting from the beginning again.

Well this was after looking at my last batch of lab work.

 

[Brain5ick]

whats the logic?

does one blend have a different release rale than another?

Yes. So I’ll feel the prop faster and the cyp lasts throughout the week.

 

[Old Witch]

Yes. So I’ll feel the prop faster and the cyp lasts throughout the week.

That’s just going to make it worse. A lot worse. You’re already having symptoms at less than a week. This will probably make those symptoms appear faster.

 

[Old Witch]

I guess it’s a good thing I’m no doctor because I think I’d have had you fixed and out of my office months ago.

 

[Brain5ick]

That’s just going to make it worse. A lot worse. You’re already having symptoms at less than a week. This will probably make those symptoms appear faster.

Less than a week?

 

[Old Witch]

Less than a week?

Yeah you said about the 4th day after you pin, before. That’s the cyp wearing off. Reducing it and adding propionate will make the levels even more disparate.

 

[Brain5ick]

Yeah you said about the 4th day after you pin, before. That’s the cyp wearing off. Reducing it and adding propionate will make the levels even more disparate.

It’s only reducing 20mg of cyp for prop though. Idk I guess we will see. Just got an order to get labs drawn but I have to wait til tomorrow. Nowhere is open today. Maybe I should wait longer though because I pinned today.

 

[Brain5ick]

I’m feeling rather good today, all in all. A little grouchy according to my girl, I’m just coming off of painkillers though so I’m attributing attitude to that.

 

[Zvch]

I’m feeling rather good today, all in all. A little grouchy according to my girl, I’m just coming off of painkillers though so I’m attributing attitude to that.

Have you tried pinning twice a week? Some guys metabolize things differently than others. Even though the half-life is about 8 days, you might need it more often. Splitting it every 3 days might make a big difference.

 

[Brain5ick]

Have you tried pinning twice a week? Some guys metabolize things differently than others. Even though the half-life is about 8 days, you might need it more often. Splitting it every 3 days might make a big difference.

That’s what my doctors thinking was, hence why he’s throwing prop in with my cyp. I already pin twice a week, never done a full cc in one injection. I’ve felt it’s better to split it.

 

[Old Witch]

That’s what my doctors thinking was, hence why he’s throwing prop in with my cyp. I already pin twice a week, never done a full cc in one injection. I’ve felt it’s better to split it.

I’d be thinking the exact opposite, and throw in nebido.

 

[Old Witch]

You already feel good the day you pin, with prop added you’ll feel even better the day you pin. And that’s all.

 

[bigbeaph]

Adding a shot or two of prop seems like a strange "solution" and doesnt make much sense. Here is one thing I've learned from test cycles. If your levels are fluctuating and your having side effects....more frequent injections. I used to get all sorts of test sides. The emotional stuff like you and the physical like crazy acne and gyno. Once I started pinning test e eod it all stopped. Not a hint of gyno, ALMOST no acne (99% improvement), and i feel great....all the time. I actually overreacted or got angry much more prior to starting test again. Need very little a.i. no sign of gyno - havent even opened my nolva box. I know this would suck for many long term, but maybe it's as easy as 20 units on a slin pin every night before bed or something. Just a thought brother, read of many people having success like this too.

 

[Brain5ick]

If this persists I will for sure try eod! Dick worked tonight too! Haha. Again I’m still feeling pretty aggressive... wanting to go off at every little thing, which is kind of an issue... but I’m feeling strong as hell and my joints feel great so it can’t be low E. Surprised at how strong I am especially on a cut... Nips don’t itch anymore, as they were about 2 weeks ago. I’m still not super horny, I just kind of feel average. Not ready to pitch a tent at every hot chick I see lol.
That’s something I think I have a big misconception at. When I started T I was insanely horny and sensitive for awhile and it got better and more intense as I went up in dose. After being on 200mg for awhile I notice the intense sexual urges started to die down. Is this just because I’m used to high test levels now?

 

[Chados]

So I’m only on 200mg of cyp and 1mg of arimidex a week both split doses. I aromatize very quickly apparently and have some E sides now and again but the thing I can’t figure out is I get really pissed all the time now. Can’t tell if it’s E or DHT. For example my buddy at the gym wanted me to spot him while he did a heavy squat and at the bottom of his squat he looked like his back was gonna break and was struggling so I ****ing spotted him. He got upset and told me not to do that because he had it and got an attitude with me and I had to walk off because for some reason, even though it was stupid, I was absolutely ****ing ready to beat him into the ground. That’s not like me! I just let things roll off my back usually and haven’t had a temper in a long time and I notice it as I’m on TRT longer. I could give a hundred other examples at this point.
I’m getting little bouts of anxiety here and there and sometimes have kind of a mood swing into depression although it’s not as frequent as usual. Also still having some ED issues, mainly with going soft towards the end of sex. I’m laying around all day getting sad, anxious, pissy and my dick isn’t working right so I’m getting even more angry about this! Can someone help me? I am not able to get labs until my doc ships it with my test and all later next week. My AI is also mixed in with my test but they sent me .5mg arimidex capsules I can use if needed.
I took a shot of 100mg cyp/.5mg arimidex today as well as 250units of HCG if that helps.

You're the type of person who shouldn't touch steroids, at least at this moment. Not trying to be a dick but it sounds like you have some anxiety problems that gets boosted quite heavily on gear. Chances are you're doing more harm than good and you'll wake up during or after pct with even more anxiety and maybe stop going to the gym due to that.

 

[Chados]

Crazy acne on my back, shoulders, forearms, and all down my legs. Joints feel fine except for a long last shoulder injury. Dude I felt all emotional watching a video of this adopted dog today so yeah lol. The mood swings are wild. If I take .5 adex Monday and Thursday (injection days) how should I implement another .25 or .5?

Just go .25.. The test dosage is so low you'd arguably won't need it even though its very possible you do..

 

[Brain5ick]

You're the type of person who shouldn't touch steroids, at least at this moment. Not trying to be a dick but it sounds like you have some anxiety problems that gets boosted quite heavily on gear. Chances are you're doing more harm than good and you'll wake up during or after pct with even more anxiety and maybe stop going to the gym due to that.

Been through pct on sarms before, I was fine. I’m not worried about running anything, just figuring out my TRT.

 

[Chados]

Been through pct on sarms before, I was fine. I’m not worried about running anything, just figuring out my TRT.

Yeah well do a ostarine cycle and then a tren cycle and come back and tell me the difference its just another Plainfield with aas and sarms. I can't imagine anyone having aggression on sarms. Again not trying to insult you it's not your fault and maybe next year you'll have a great cycle but right now it seems you can't take it very good for whatever reason.

 

[Brain5ick]

Yeah well do a ostarine cycle and then a tren cycle and come back and tell me the difference its just another Plainfield with aas and sarms. I can't imagine anyone having aggression on sarms. Again not trying to insult you it's not your fault and maybe next year you'll have a great cycle but right now it seems you can't take it very good for whatever reason.

Oh dude no, I’m not saying Osta is in any way comparable to Tren or really and other AAS I just mean by ways of suppression from Osta or LGD. Mentally I am not ready for Tren and I’ll be the first to say it. I don’t have enough experience or anything. I feel more aggressive on TRT, not attributable to sarms I’m not on. I’m more worried about getting my mood and and everything taken care of and figuring out how I can manipulate things with test vs AIs ratio. That’s something I definitely would have to figure out before I even go on AAS.

 

[Chados]

Oh dude no, I’m not saying Osta is in any way comparable to Tren or really and other AAS I just mean by ways of suppression from Osta or LGD. Mentally I am not ready for Tren and I’ll be the first to say it. I don’t have enough experience or anything. I feel more aggressive on TRT, not attributable to sarms I’m not on. I’m more worried about getting my mood and and everything taken care of and figuring out how I can manipulate things with test vs AIs ratio. That’s something I definitely would have to figure out before I even go on AAS.

Got you. I've been there myself and I figured there was something behind it that got boosted when taking tren. Anxiety, breakups etc etc. Anything that bothers you even a little while not on gear? I think if you're an extremely happy person you won't experience this. I've only felt sad on tren but I've felt angry with test, just snapping at my cats and silly things like that. It goes away after 2 seconds though and I ask myself why I had to yell for something that silly.

I can imagine someone with more temper than me which isn't hard to find could have some problems not just by not getting to that point but also to control it and not let it take over your personality.

 

[Brain5ick]

Got you. I've been there myself and I figured there was something behind it that got boosted when taking tren. Anxiety, breakups etc etc. Anything that bothers you even a little while not on gear? I think if you're an extremely happy person you won't experience this. I've only felt sad on tren but I've felt angry with test, just snapping at my cats and silly things like that. It goes away after 2 seconds though and I ask myself why I had to yell for something that silly.

I can imagine someone with more temper than me which isn't hard to find could have some problems not just by not getting to that point but also to control it and not let it take over your personality.

That snapping and then realizing how dumb it was is basically where I’m at. When I was younger 16-19 I had horrible anger issues. Yelling all the time, freaking out on people, fighting, even went to jail a few times. As I got older I grew out of that and became a much more calm person and grew up a lot to say the least. I’m a very calm person off of TRT and I’m pretty chill on it but I have moments that make me feel like tearing someone’s face off and I have to tell myself “you’re being ridiculous, it’s not that serious” but it’s pretty persistent here. I’m guessing my attitude while younger was crazy hormones and now I’m slightly back to how things were then haha.

 

[Chados]

That snapping and then realizing how dumb it was is basically where I’m at. When I was younger 16-19 I had horrible anger issues. Yelling all the time, freaking out on people, fighting, even went to jail a few times. As I got older I grew out of that and became a much more calm person and grew up a lot to say the least. I’m a very calm person off of TRT and I’m pretty chill on it but I have moments that make me feel like tearing someone’s face off and I have to tell myself “you’re being ridiculous, it’s not that serious” but it’s pretty persistent here. I’m guessing my attitude while younger was crazy hormones and now I’m slightly back to how things were then haha.

Yeah we all were i guess. The only people I ever feel I want to beat up are people that abuse other individuals verbally or physically. People that looks down on other people etc. I don't care so much about people insulting me because I don't feel I have anything to be ashamed of = I won't take it to heart. When I was a kid I would but now I'm more angry about others getting insulted.

 

[Old Witch]

You're the type of person who shouldn't touch steroids, at least at this moment. Not trying to be a dick but it sounds like you have some anxiety problems that gets boosted quite heavily on gear. Chances are you're doing more harm than good and you'll wake up during or after pct with even more anxiety and maybe stop going to the gym due to that.

He’s on TRT. This isn’t a cycle. There is no pct. He WAS taking less Adex, much less, and feeling very **** just a few days after his pin. Seems his e2 level is best for him between 10-20, rather than 20-30 like most of the rest of men (according to docs). Those are the numbers he had when he said he felt good.

All we want for our man here is to get his free test up higher and keep his e2 between 10-20. He’s got the total test to do it already, just needs more Adex, more frequent injections, and probably a little of something to inhibit shbg as his seems to be running most of his free test away.

This is the data as we know it currently. Welcome to the party, Chados.

 

[Brain5ick]

He’s on TRT. This isn’t a cycle. There is no pct. He WAS taking less Adex, much less, and feeling very **** just a few days after his pin. Seems his e2 level is best for him between 10-20, rather than 20-30 like most of the rest of men (according to docs). Those are the numbers he had when he said he felt good.

All we want for our man here is to get his free test up higher and keep his e2 between 10-20. He’s got the total test to do it already, just needs more Adex, more frequent injections, and probably a little of something to inhibit shbg as his seems to be running most of his free test away.

This is the data as we know it currently. Welcome to the party, Chados.

I’m about to head out and get lab work done in a little bit and should have my results in a day or two so I’ll post it as soon as I have it.

 

[Old Witch]

I’m about to head out and get lab work done in a little bit and should have my results in a day or two so I’ll post it as soon as I have it.

I am interested to see what the numbers look like now. You feeling edgy today or good?

 

[Brain5ick]

I am interested to see what the numbers look like now. You feeling edgy today or good?

Feeling alright today. Went to bed late but woke up early feeling rested. Acne is clearing up and my face isn’t as oily which is awesome. I’m a little stressed but I’m in the middle of a move so that’s normal lol. No depression or other wild mental sides today so that’s a big plus. Had morning wood for the first time in a while too so that’s a good sign. I pinned yesterday morning and had my adex, I normally wouldn’t get lab work done so soon but my doc wants to see more so what my E is at the day after my third dose of Arimidex so I understand that. We will be getting more lab work down the line on a day further away from a shot to check test levels more accurately.

 

[Chados]

He’s on TRT. This isn’t a cycle. There is no pct. He WAS taking less Adex, much less, and feeling very **** just a few days after his pin. Seems his e2 level is best for him between 10-20, rather than 20-30 like most of the rest of men (according to docs). Those are the numbers he had when he said he felt good.

All we want for our man here is to get his free test up higher and keep his e2 between 10-20. He’s got the total test to do it already, just needs more Adex, more frequent injections, and probably a little of something to inhibit shbg as his seems to be running most of his free test away.

This is the data as we know it currently. Welcome to the party, Chados.

My response was that he mentioned sarms and pct. His testosterone will still spike and be higher than what he had before trt which by itself can cause aggression. At this moment we're just speculating.

 

[Old Witch]

My response was that he mentioned sarms and pct. His testosterone will still spike and be higher than what he had before trt which by itself can cause aggression. At this moment we're just speculating.

Well, I’m speculating based on what data I’ve been furnished with via this thread, other threads, and direct PM. I did mention high test itself can cause aggression. I’m more noting the poor erections, mood SWINGS, acne... as a sign of abnormal e2 activity.

 

[Chados]

Well, I’m speculating based on what data I’ve been furnished with via this thread, other threads, and direct PM. I did mention high test itself can cause aggression. I’m more noting the poor erections, mood SWINGS, acne... as a sign of abnormal e2 activity.

Could be both. I mean it's hormones were talking about. I am very tolerant even with tren but if I have some kind of bad feeling before the cycle it can change the whole outcome. I've seen women that doesn't react at all yet they have a million times the normal testosterone levels, I've also seen guys that can't take turinabol. A lot is in the head

 

[Old Witch]

Could be both. I mean it's hormones were talking about. I am very tolerant even with tren but if I have some kind of bad feeling before the cycle it can change the whole outcome. I've seen women that doesn't react at all yet they have a million times the normal testosterone levels, I've also seen guys that can't take turinabol. A lot is in the head

Yep, I did mention early on in the thread that, both high and low test and e2 can cause many of these issues.

 

[Old Witch]

My logic is, we get him to where he seems like he should be and then assess his disposition and health. So first things first, we should agree on a methodology.

 

[Brain5ick]

Got my lab work done, blood pressure was at 116/60 which is more normal for me vs what I had been having at 130/70.

 

[Brain5ick]

Also I guess I should mention I’m pretty damn tired at this point in the day but I’m not sure that’s to be blamed on anything hormonal. We will just see what the labs say.

 

[Chados]

Also I guess I should mention I’m pretty damn tired at this point in the day but I’m not sure that’s to be blamed on anything hormonal. We will just see what the labs say.

That sounds like a crash of estrogen. I believe you've taken too much arimidex as I believe I said earlier to go from 0.5 to 0.25.

 

[MrKleen73]

Lol wut.

Aromatase and 5a Reductase are not the same enzyme. AI does not affect 5aR. You can crash e2 USING dht. If you choose...

Old Witch - Thanks for the correction, as soon as I read your response and saw the 5aReductase my brain clicked, and i remembered the difference. I agree the mistake was laughable to say the least. I do feel like there is some other relation to the process, and that is why I was on that mindset, and will have to go back and look at some of it to see where or how i formed the misconception and drew that relationship from.

Anyway thanks, I don't want to be saying things that are incorrect and sending anyone down the wrong path. So thanks for the correction!

Not really - people choose to get overly invested in what’s going on (and that knowledge can help you get to a more dialed setup faster), but the reality is every individual is just going to have to take some **** and see how they respond, and vary the combo until you feel decent.

Numbers of anything don’t matter if you don’t feel alright, and no matter how bad some numbers may look on paper if someone is happy good luck getting them to stop what they’re doing lol.

Facts

Yeah you said about the 4th day after you pin, before. That’s the cyp wearing off. Reducing it and adding propionate will make the levels even more disparate.

Sounds like it to me.
I thought it was a bit odd to give him a faster ester for that as well.

 

[Old Witch]

That sounds like a crash of estrogen. I believe you've taken too much arimidex as I believe I said earlier to go from 0.5 to 0.25.

I suppose the bloodwork will tell which direction it’s going. Since this is the day it was done, let us remember this. He went from 0.5mg on pinning day only to just this week adding an extra 0.5 on EOD between pins.

 

[Brain5ick]

Calories were ultra low and I didn’t really realize it either so tbh the low energy could be anything. I’ve felt good and energized most of the day, so it could just be the lack of food. Man the day just got away from me and I hadn’t realized I’ve barely eaten.

 

[Thejoggernot]

Lol wut.

Aromatase and 5a Reductase are not the same enzyme. AI does not affect 5aR. You can crash e2 USING dht. If you choose...

I apologize to butt into a thread I don't belong in, but I have to ask/get a straight answer (or I'll go crazy not knowing!).
I know exogenous DHT crashes E2 but that's only because I've read that. I am trying to understand how. Which pathway or what mechanism ?If someone wants to PM me to prevent spamming this good man's thread that would be awesome

 

[Brain5ick]

I apologize to butt into a thread I don't belong in, but I have to ask/get a straight answer (or I'll go crazy not knowing!).
I know exogenous DHT crashes E2 but that's only because I've read that. I am trying to understand how. Which pathway or what mechanism ?If someone wants to PM me to prevent spamming this good man's thread that would be awesome

No that’s a good question. I’d be interested in hearing this as well. I’m guessing it has to do with DHT taking over the aromataze enzyme so estrogen doesn’t have enough to exist. Since testosterone partially turns into estrogen and DHT if DHT took all the enzymes test needs to convert, I guess no estrogen could be produced. That’s just my realm of thinking, not sure if it’s correct though. Also not sure how this could work for exogenous DHT.

 

[hairygrandpa]

I apologize to butt into a thread I don't belong in, but I have to ask/get a straight answer (or I'll go crazy not knowing!).
I know exogenous DHT crashes E2 but that's only because I've read that. I am trying to understand how. Which pathway or what mechanism ?If someone wants to PM me to prevent spamming this good man's thread that would be awesome

Proviron has four distinct uses in the world of bodybuilding. The first being the result of its structure. It is 5-alpha reduced and not capable of forming estrogen, yet it nonetheless has a much higher affinity for the aromatase enzyme (which converts testosterone to estrogen) than testosterone does. That means in administering it with testosterone or another aromatizable compound, it prevents estrogen build-up because it binds to the aromatase enzyme very strongly, thereby preventing these steroids from interacting with it and forming estrogen. So Mesterolone use has the extreme benefit of reducing estrogenic side-effects and water retention noted with other steroids, and as such still help to provide mostly lean gains. Its also been suggested that it may actually downgrade the actual estrogen receptor making it doubly effective at reducing circulating estrogen levels.

Source: https://www.streetdirectory.com/etoday/proviron-all-you-need-to-know-eucolp.html