AndroMass V3 Log
- Thread starter R1balla
- Start date
mattrag
Legend
Yea... well low dose clomid as a fertility booster (or Torem), plus TUCDA for the liver against 17aa methyls lol. Anything hormonal will affect our ability to reproduce.... Liver... meh... it'll heal lol. I would rather not test it though. lol.
mattrag
Legend
Hell yea I'm sure it can. But so can a whole lotta other OTC stuff. That's why most people start off at like 5-10mgs a day. And most take all the precautions too. Like not drinking, taking support supps, and eating food that doesn't stress the liver.
bigdavid
Well-known member
yeah I saw that. We dont know what dose they took and we also can be sure they used absolutely no liver protection. We also dont know how long they used the compound (regardless of what they said). People lie all the time about everything.. not saying Mdrol didnt do it it obv did but they abused the products and had no idea what they were putting in their body.
Eric Potratz
Board Sponsor
This is true most of the time. But there are some guys just dont gain weight, no matter what steroids they take.
I dont think this is necessarily bad diet or training. "Non-responders" is symptomatic trace nutrient deficiency. For instance, AAS increase red blood cell count and hemoglobin, unless individuals are iron deficient. When iron is introduced into the diet, this anabolic effect is restored within days.
Remember, androgens are only turning on the genes in your body to trigger the synthesis of proteins. If a certain element is missing, the synthesis of protein wont happen, including EPO, IGF-1, the insulin signaling elements, etc. My quick fix suggestion is to grab some Trace Mineral Research "Concentrace". Take 5x the recommended dose for a week, then drop to the regular dose. This will give you about 70 trace elements including iron, boron, cobolt, chromium, magnesium, etc., which will light up your anabolic pathways. (fyi, cobolt is often used to elevate red blood cell count in athletes prior to competition)
Give that a shot, and extend this cycle out to 8 weeks. 4 weeks is usually not the optimal amount of time to see a significant amount of growth with natural androgens. Given the minimally suppression nature of Andromass this shouldnt be an issue.
-eric
LiveToLift
Legend
R1balla said:
From everything I've read the liver cannot "heal" itself, just the damaging values can lower back to normal. Also like David said who's knows what these kids were doing with these steroids, dosing etc. not to mention history of liver issues or other drug and alcohol abuse...
mattrag
Legend
Primordial Perf said:
This is very intriguing. Hmm.
Would you recommend doing something like this every three months or so? Like a mineral refers so to speak? I've never heard of this protocol but it makes some sense.
R1balla let us know if you do this. Would be interesting to see if your results change drastically.
mattrag
Legend
That's what I think.... I'm waiting for other board members to run it that are seasoned cycle'rs lol.
We shall see.
R1 Why don't you want to run it for 8 weeks? Shut down? sides?
AZMIDLYF
Legend
A lot can be said for someone with little lifting backround starting out and someone with years behind them. I would say that you are in the latter R1 so things won't come as easily.
AZMIDLYF
Legend
$$$$$$
AZMIDLYF
Legend
Invalid Link Removed
Eric Potratz
Board Sponsor
Sure, thats probably fine, maybe only once a year if your diet is very nutrient rich. (eg, sardines, liver, bone marrow, organic veggies, etc)
-Eric
R1balla
Board Sponsor
this this stuff truly cant put on 6 - 10 pounds for an experienced lifter, why the heavy price tag?
maybe i should just take 20mg dbol the last week lol
mattrag
Legend
R1balla
Board Sponsor
2/6 Monday in the middle of week 3
I decided to change my training routine. I will be doing an A,B workout. I did A workout today.
Incline DB - warmup 75x15 85x12 95x8 100 x 5 50x10 (negatives)
Cable Flys - 3 sets first set 20 reps second set 15 reps third set 12 reps followed by DC stretch
Close Grip Bench - 3 sets 185x12 205x10 225x8
One hand reverse grip cable pull downs - 3 sets high reps (same as cable flys)
At the end, i did 5x5 for leg press.
i feel like i needed to add more volume so i decided to get off of DC for the rest of the cycle. I will still incorporate the DC stretches, and a few rest pauses here and there. alright, now on to andromass
The Good
Im more vascular than I ever have been since starting this product
I look shredded right now. very hard and dry
Aggression is starting to get there, acne has arrived.
The Bad
No strength gains yet
only up 2 pounds still from day 1 ( i weighed in today at 187)
No libido increase
My toco 8 and DAA will be here tomorrow so I will immediately jump on Toco and possibly DAA. not sure yet about that one. if i do, it will be dosed at night before bed.
So far, I am disappointed that i havent gained any real weight, but if you look at the positives from this.......my body looks better than it did before the cycle. just not what i wanted. if i wanted to get harder/leaner, i would have taken a different product. heck, i wouldnt have even gone hormonal.
as far as taking minerals, im not up for that. this should put on mass regardless of what i take. if im eating (which i am) and training hard, it should work.
So far, going an extra few weeks is still undecided. I want to see what i finish at. 50/50 chance right now.
Just a Thought
I have a really fast metabolism, and when i gain, its LBM, hardly any fat. It could be possible that I have lost BF and gained muscle and have a net gain of only 2 pounds so far, but have actually gained more but lost BF at the same time.....thoughts?
I decided to change my training routine. I will be doing an A,B workout. I did A workout today.
Incline DB - warmup 75x15 85x12 95x8 100 x 5 50x10 (negatives)
Cable Flys - 3 sets first set 20 reps second set 15 reps third set 12 reps followed by DC stretch
Close Grip Bench - 3 sets 185x12 205x10 225x8
One hand reverse grip cable pull downs - 3 sets high reps (same as cable flys)
At the end, i did 5x5 for leg press.
i feel like i needed to add more volume so i decided to get off of DC for the rest of the cycle. I will still incorporate the DC stretches, and a few rest pauses here and there. alright, now on to andromass
The Good
Im more vascular than I ever have been since starting this product
I look shredded right now. very hard and dry
Aggression is starting to get there, acne has arrived.
The Bad
No strength gains yet
only up 2 pounds still from day 1 ( i weighed in today at 187)
No libido increase
My toco 8 and DAA will be here tomorrow so I will immediately jump on Toco and possibly DAA. not sure yet about that one. if i do, it will be dosed at night before bed.
So far, I am disappointed that i havent gained any real weight, but if you look at the positives from this.......my body looks better than it did before the cycle. just not what i wanted. if i wanted to get harder/leaner, i would have taken a different product. heck, i wouldnt have even gone hormonal.
as far as taking minerals, im not up for that. this should put on mass regardless of what i take. if im eating (which i am) and training hard, it should work.
So far, going an extra few weeks is still undecided. I want to see what i finish at. 50/50 chance right now.
Just a Thought
I have a really fast metabolism, and when i gain, its LBM, hardly any fat. It could be possible that I have lost BF and gained muscle and have a net gain of only 2 pounds so far, but have actually gained more but lost BF at the same time.....thoughts?
R1balla
Board Sponsor
i have a whole bag of them for school lol although, most are for insulin which i couldnt use lol
R1balla
Board Sponsor
right before my run i was measured at 9% by calipers
bigdavid
Well-known member
go back to that same person (assuming someone else did it for you) and see what number you are now you may have lost a percentage and that would explain the lack of total gain
bigdavid
Well-known member
Keep in mind when you were 17 you didnt have eat as much to gain weight.. I put on tons of weight at that age because the amount I had to eat wasnt that much for each lb of muscle... now I have to eat at least 3500 - 4000 and that is why I have a really hard time getting higher than low 200s. Maybe you just need to eat more even though it seems like your eating a ton I know the feeling.. and it is week 3 so maybe this is when it'll start kicking in more?
R1balla
Board Sponsor
bigdavid said:
My metabolism was even faster at 17 plus i was in football so I was running alot. It's actually slowed down, just now that I'm bigger and wanna gain even more, I must eat more. Again, a ph shouldn't have to rely on your eating. I know it's not a methyl, but still...... You should be able to gain from it alone. I've seen too many people eat like crap and still gain off of epi and hdrol
bigdavid
Well-known member
I understand the frustration for sure.. but a lot of people dont even notice hdrol till week 3 and we dont really know how this new andromass will respond in most people since you are one of the first to take it.. it might be one of those that kicks in a few weeks in who knows
Scuba Steveo
New member
No prohormone can defy the laws of physics. If you're not taking in more calories than you're burning you can still lose weight, or recomp if you're at maintenance. From the fact that you say you are leaner, but only up a couple pounds, it sounds like you are eating just a bit above maintenance. Why don't you bump up the calories for the last couple weeks and see what happens? By taking in more food, you will also have less of a chance of having any of the mineral deficiencies Eric mentioned.
Scuba Steveo
New member
When was the last time you took a PH? If you're at a much more advanced point then it might require some additional tweaking in terms of training and diet, whereas it might not have previously.
4500 cals sounds like a good amount for your size, but maybe it's not be enough. I know since starting my own AM cycle, my resting body temp has gone up significantly, telling me I probably need more calories than I would otherwise. Conversely, I understand SD can cause lethargy, which might have significantly lowered your calorie requirements at the time you took Mdrol.
Eric Potratz
Board Sponsor
I've seen guys use the strongest of the strongest steroids and not gain weight. If you have a deficiency in a vital nutrient it will shut down the entire anabolic process. It's the theory of constraint.
You can have a calorie surplus, but still have a nutritional deficiency. Id highly recommending you supplement with the trace elements to correct any potential deficits.
On the other hand, natural androgens like Test and AM just dont produce results as fast as methyls. They never have. Most guys dont notice a damn thing in the first 3-4 weeks of a test cycle, and if you notice something, you're a good responder who is noticing primarily ionic effects. (swelling of tissue via ion retention and intra-cellular water retention -- not actual muscle growth)
I actually just talked about this on SHR -Invalid Link RemovedEric
R1balla
Board Sponsor
i know its possible, but i have never seen that. and im around juicers all the time. and i know AM and test dont produce as fast, but i would still expect something by now. my friend gave me another bottle, so ill do it for 6 weeks or so, but if you are relating test to AM, and saying you wont see results for 3 - 4 weeks, then do you expect for everybody to purchase two bottles of this?
do you suggest a SERM for anything over 4 weeks?
and i have a question that has been asked in the PP section...why is PP out of stock on each product at nutraplanet?
Got my PP order in today. Ordered a few sustain alpha's, TCF 1 and a few Toco 8. will start toco tonight. may start DAA tonight as well. not sure. i just didnt wanna mess with my levels this much because of my age. ill probably go 6 weeks instead of 8. wanna see how the first bottle goes before i make a decision.
LikeMike
Member
I appreciate your diligence with the log. I imagine it can become difficult to continue a log and stay optimistic when your results thus far have been disappointing. Unless you have some drastic changes soon then I'm going to jump into the hdrol on Saturday and continue for four weeks. Have you thought of trying to salvage the cycle and see some gains by adding a tried and true ph?
R1balla
Board Sponsor
i havent let those thoughts dwell in my mind because i really dont want to go that route. im young and really dont want to do anything harsh, even a "mild" PH like H-drol. i really only wanted to do andro for 4 weeks, and i have been debating even touching it for a long time.
ryansm
Well-known member
Not muscle, just not going to happen...
You have leaned out while staying the same weight all while eating 4500 cals daily? I remember several posts about how ppl were getting leaner on AM and were needing to eat way more than they thought. Why are you worried about fat gain if you are leaner after starting? What were your goals for this cycle...bulk?