1st mini tren cycle progress log

[Smont]

If you Take all the stuff I said and throw it in the trash, I still would say in the situation op is facing having side effects on minor doses, ditch the tren, don't use more drugs to try to use another drug you can't handle

 

[Smont]

There is absolutely nothing that 100-200mg of tren can do that another drug or combination of easier tolerated drugs can't do

 

[Smont]

20mg of sd will do the same as 100-200mg of tren and it will work faster and better. Don't want anything liver toxic, ditch the tren for a higher dose of test and some masteron, keep test the same and add 400-500mg of primo. There's a million ways to skin this cat without 100mg of tren

 

[Smont]

I don't know how to post links, but I found another one where a woman taking 0.5mg 1x per week experiencing mania.

I do want to be a little more clear about what I'm getting at, I'm by no means saying that no1 should ever use caber or that any1 will reach the accumulated dose whatever that was or anything really. My point is just that caber has potential for side effects that are far worse then any steroid is going to cause, and in some cases it can do permanent damage, even tho it may be unlikely. Have you ever seen or heard the commercials for depression medicine where the potential side effects of the medication are severe depression and thoughts of suicide, I wouldn't be so quick to try to fix my depression by taking something that could make me want to kill myself. I'd explore other routes by trying to actually fix what's making me depressed.

So in the case with tren, instead of hopping right to caber we can first try to lower the dose to a point we can tolerate, second we can be realistic and say maybe if I can't handle side effects from such a small amount of this drug then we probably shouldn't use it. Then third and finally maybe we are a competitive bodybuilder or athlete that this is a necessary evil and we may have to use caber, or we are just stubborn and we really want to use tren and to do so we need to use caber. If we weight the risk vs. Rewards and still decided to use it then that's fine, it's our decision, we can do what we want. But think about other more reasonable options before just throwing another drug in the mix.

I have a couple bottels of tren, some prami and some caber kicking around myself. I have nothing planned for it, but I know if I do use it there is a strong possibility I'm going to need prami or caber to do so. For the time being I'd rather not use it, but that may change.

 

[Ironpirate]

I know if you take around 5mg of prami at once there's a strong possibility you will simultaneously hallucinate and vomit

I love prami but most of the guys I talk to cannot even handle 500mcg.

 

[Smont]

I love prami but most of the guys I talk to cannot even handle 500mcg.

I've used up to 1mg daily with no side effects at all, I use to hear a lot of ppl say caber is great, prami no good. Then the total opposite. Who knows, I'm trying to avoid both. I did intentionally go up to 2mg prami to see what would happen and I got sick and started throwing up, lasted about 3 hours, then felt shitty for the rest of the day

 

[Ironpirate]

I've used up to 1mg daily with no side effects at all, I use to hear a lot of ppl say caber is great, prami no good. Then the total opposite. Who knows, I'm trying to avoid both. I did intentionally go up to 2mg prami to see what would happen and I got sick and started throwing up, lasted about 3 hours, then felt shitty for the rest of the day

I remember someone on hear saying they took it at work, passed out and woke up on the floor with a raging hard on and a crowd of coworkers around. I stick to 250mcg or less.

 

[Smont]

I remember someone on hear saying they took it at work, passed out and woke up on the floor with a raging hard on and a crowd of coworkers around. I stick to 250mcg or less.

 

[Smont]

I remember someone on hear saying they took it at work, passed out and woke up on the floor with a raging hard on and a crowd of coworkers around. I stick to 250mcg or less.

The couple times I used research grade I started at 2 drops for 3 days, then 4 drops for 3 days, then 1/4ml or 500mcg, that was good for the time being. I tried to jack up my dienolone dose and had to go to 1mg per day and it wasn't enough to fix the problem, something similar with npp also. at that point I added ralox and put prami back to 500mcg, then added 12.5 exemestane eod.

So basically I had a choice, run deinolone or npp at less then 200 mg or not at all. I can't justify adding 50 things to prevent gyno when I can just drop 19s and pick something else

 

[Jinsun]

There's a million ways to skin this cat without 100mg of tren

But but, then you can't say you've ran tren! : D

I agree though, just skimming through this thread, all the complications and chit bc of 150 tren ... DHB at 200, Primo at 400, npp at 300 (yes I know it's a 19nor but has less sides) ... Fuk trensomnia and fuk gyno. Tren at a low dose sounds good on paper, but if it's causing prolactin gyno and you dont have caber or ralox on hand just cut the tren out.

 

[Smont]

But but, then you can't say you've ran tren! : D

I agree though, just skimming through this thread, all the complications and chit bc of 150 tren ... DHB at 200, Primo at 400, npp at 300 (yes I know it's a 19nor but has less sides) ... Fuk trensomnia and fuk gyno. Tren at a low dose sounds good on paper, but if it's causing prolactin gyno and you dont have caber or ralox on hand just cut the tren out.

I agree but I'm also getting at the fact if I needed to use a bunch of extra stuff to combat gyno on only 150 mg or whatever then why even use tren at all. There's definitely situations that I can see it justified to use the caber or ralox, but on 150 tren your not going to get some crazy results and not to mention the price of caber and raloxefine combined with the tren, that's pretty expensive for what purpose, if you had to spend a extra $100 per month every time I wanted to use a 19nor, add that up. Like a extra 300 per cycle, I'd rather dish out 5g and get gyno surgery and never have to worry about it again

 

[Smont]

Or for a extra 300 you could run gh every cycle

 

[Whisky]

Yeah I think I’m comfortable with my low dose caber use. I just respond better to 19nors than anything else and the sides don’t tend to be an issue.

12.5 asin a week plus .5 caber a week on 600 test and 600 deca had me sitting nice for e and p on my blood work over winter (unfortunately I also don’t respond to lower doses which is a pain in the ass but what can you do but play the hand you’ve been dealt).

I totally agree that one should always balance risk and reward. If using one drug requires loads of supports then maybe switching to something else or dropping the dose is a better solution. With any drug we should always be looking for the minimum effective dose anyway.

 

[Hyde]

Indian Journal of Endocrinology and Metabolism

www.ijem.in

I’ve heard it can cause fibrotic growth/remodeling of the heart from Leo & Longevity, and Vigorous Steve. But this study basically asserts there is no cardiovascular dysfunction seen in 100 patients treated with an average of up to 300mg cumulatively. That’s 1mg/wk for 6 years straight.

You could run 19-Nors for half the year for 12 years at 1mg/wk. 24 years at 0.5mg for 26 weeks per year. And that’s just to get into uncharted total dosage waters; we don’t have evidence that’s unsafe even. We do know 25 years of Tren half the year is unsafe, so this is kind of a moot point. If you use the Caber responsibly only when pushing 19-Nors on blast at measured doses, the Caber is less likely to cause mental or heart issues than the AAS.

I think P5P should be the answer ideally, and prami can be an option, but if you know you do well with Caber I don’t see it being such a foul option.

 

[p1nchharmonic]

10 days in. Not sure how much longer I'm going to keep doing the Tren. Having a bit of unexplained anxiety and not sure if its worth it at this point. My trt is mixed with tren so can't stop until I get back home next wednesday.

 

[SkRaw85]

Tren is love/hate. It will always have a place in my heart though. Tren/trest/test is best ever, change my mind?

 

[Jinsun]

Having a bit of unexplained anxiety and not sure if its worth it at this point.

I've said this at your other thread, but I'll say it again: if you are already an anxiety ridden person, adding tren is a big no no.

Also, looking at your physique, you are far away from needing tren. You're at a point where one would start thinking about using aas. Like first test e/c cycle at 350mg ... Granted, the dose is small, but it would be very much prudent for you to find a productive means of b/c-ing that keeps your mental and physical health in ballance without it affecting your day to day to much. If you are bcing then just up the test a bit. Keep doing that for some time. Then start adding primo. Then GH and higher dose primo/test. Idk ... Lot's of smarter and more SUSTAINABLE ways of going about this imo. You dont need to turn your self in to a lab rat. No need for more then 2 compounds, for quite some time.

 

[Hyde]

I've said this at your other thread, but I'll say it again: if you are already an anxiety ridden person, adding tren is a big no no.

Also, looking at your physique, you are far away from needing tren. You're at a point where one would start thinking about using aas. Like first test e/c cycle at 350mg ... Granted, the dose is small, but it would be very much prudent for you to find a productive means of b/c-ing that keeps your mental and physical health in ballance without it affecting your day to day to much. If you are bcing then just up the test a bit. Keep doing that for some time. Then start adding primo. Then GH and higher dose primo/test. Idk ... Lot's of smarter and more SUSTAINABLE ways of going about this imo. You dont need to turn your self in to a lab rat. No need for more then 2 compounds, for quite some time.

He does not look like a natural that should just begin using steroids. You are either being delusional or condescending. Neither is helpful. Stick to the part about Tren not being worth it for those with anxiety or existing health issues.

 

[Ironpirate]

He does not look like a natural that should just begin using steroids. You are either being delusional or condescending. Neither is helpful. Stick to the part about Tren not being worth it for those with anxiety or existing health issues.

I agree, not Cool at all. He is in great shape and has obviously been putting in hard work.

 

[Jinsun]

Bro's ...

1. He is on cycle, so he looks a lot more pumped then if he went off cycle. Keep that very much in mind. If you take away the shoulder pump from aas, you are looking at a natty physique. Yes, he looks above average, especially abs are interesting, but again, on cycle.

2. Does not need tren to progress at the level he is. Nor does he need anything more then two compounds or just one, in case test higher then 250 isn't a problem.

3. Am not delusional, thank you, just being realistic and trying to get somebody who has major anxiety issues (and was hospitalized for UC two months ago) off the trenbolony sandwich.

4. If you consider this physique a good physique for somebody who cycles all the time, then you are the one who is either delusional, has low standards or is just trying to be overly nice. Either way, you are not helping. And I'm not trying to be argumentative here for no reason, but you're the one who played forum sheriff just now ...

5. It's a good natty physique. In my book. Or it's a: "I just started my first low dose cycle physique".

 

[Hyde]

Bro's ...

1. He is on cycle, so he looks a lot more pumped then if he went off cycle. Keep that very much in mind. If you take away the shoulder pump from aas, you are looking at a natty physique. Yes, he looks above average, especially abs are interesting, but again, on cycle.

2. Does not need tren to progress at the level he is. Nor does he need anything more then two compounds or just one, in case test higher then 250 isn't a problem.

3. Am not delusional, thank you, just being realistic and trying to get somebody who has major anxiety issues (and was hospitalized for UC two months ago) off the trenbolony sandwich.

4. If you consider this physique a good physique for somebody who cycles all the time, then you are the one who is either delusional, has low standards or is just trying to be overly nice. Either way, you are not helping. And I'm not trying to be argumentative here for no reason, but you're the one who played forum sheriff just now ...

5. It's a good natty physique. In my book. Or it's a: "I just started my first low dose cycle physique".

So I’m the forum sheriff because you think you’re so great to decide who gets to cycle?

This guy is 8 goddamn inches shorter than you and maybe 15lbs lighter, and leaner. He definitely has more muscle than you.

 

[Jinsun]

So I’m the forum sheriff because you think you’re so great to decide who gets to cycle?

No, it's not intra narrative related, it's bc you were trying to tell me what to do and what not do. That's all.

 

[Jinsun]

Anyway, Idk, I'm in bad shape body comp wise currently. Been training really sporadically and insomnia is eating away at me. Havent cycled for ages, so I'm below my natty limit atm. Not comparing my self to anybody at this point. And I wasn't comparing myself to op. But if he went off cycle, or at least switched to trt test levels and compared to me after a month, we would look quite similar. And that's with a really shitty year of no sleeping and bad training on my part.

Not that it really matters though, who cares who is bigger or smaller?? I dont see a need for such pubescent dick measuring argumentation. I know you probably saw this line of argument implicit in my critique of his physique, but what you did was pull on the low hanging fruit of counter argumentation and that speaks a lot about your character atm. Is a grown ass man, who is trying to cure his self image issues by sticking oil in his ass, really going to go the "You're smaller then him, you have no say in this matter ..." type of line of argument? Don't be silly.

I know op is having a rough time. With anxiety issues preventing him on having an "optimized" training environment (to say the least), and also that he was hospitalized for UC a short while back. So similar to me, he is really in no place to be cycling, and his body comp is showing it. It's the reason why I'm not cycling. I'm in no place to do so, I'm way below where I can be naturally. Cycling would just unbalance me and I would crash afterwards. And this is basically what op is doing for the time he is present on this forum. It's pathological, he's mental problems are driving his drug use which is really causing him harm and kinda really hindering his life. It's pathological. But sure, let's get back at talking about tren lawl.

Here, I think Steve has a pretty good starting point for cycling here:

I don't expect that everybody looks like this before their first cycle, but I'm just further pointing out how the op's physique isn't much more then "I just started my first cycle" or "am about to".

Ok, this is to energy and consuming. That's it from my behalf. Have a good one.

 

[Whisky]

Anyway, Idk, I'm in bad shape body comp wise currently. Been training really sporadically and insomnia is eating away at me. Havent cycled for ages, so I'm below my natty limit atm. Not comparing my self to anybody at this point. And I wasn't comparing myself to op. But if he went off cycle, or at least switched to trt test levels and compared to me after a month, we would look quite similar. And that's with a really shitty year of no sleeping and bad training on my part.

Not that it really matters though, who cares who is bigger or smaller?? I dont see a need for such pubescent dick measuring argumentation. I know you probably saw this line of argument implicit in my critique of his physique, but what you did was pull on the low hanging fruit of counter argumentation and that speaks a lot about your character atm. Is a grown ass man, who is trying to cure his self image issues by sticking oil in his ass, really going to go the "You're smaller then him, you have no say in this matter ..." type of line of argument? Don't be silly.

I know op is having a rough time. With anxiety issues preventing him on having an "optimized" training environment (to say the least), and also that he was hospitalized for UC a short while back. So similar to me, he is really in no place to be cycling, and his body comp is showing it. It's the reason why I'm not cycling. I'm in no place to do so, I'm way below where I can be naturally. Cycling would just unbalance me and I would crash afterwards. And this is basically what op is doing for the time he is present on this forum. It's pathological, he's mental problems are driving his drug use which is really causing him harm and kinda really hindering his life. It's pathological. But sure, let's get back at talking about tren lawl.

Here, I think Steve has a pretty good starting point for cycling here:

I don't expect that everybody looks like this before their first cycle, but I'm just further pointing out how the op's physique isn't much more then "I just started my first cycle" or "am about to".

Ok, this is to energy and consuming. That's it from my behalf. Have a good one.

I agree with you that OP has other stuff going on. As I raised above he hasn’t (imo) taken enough time off between cycles and bloods being done on cycle don’t allow for trt to really be dialled in

however, physique wise I think he’s in a decent place, imo the odds are that he has put decent work in at the gym BUT as to whether that’s a solid natty physique or a physique where aas is needed is massively dependant on genetics

i don’t have great genetics and regardless of what I did (and for a couple of years I had everything dialled to a tee, I’m a qualified pt but also had a coach etc) and I didn’t get close to that physique

but I know guys who are definitely natty and look better than OP’s physique (that’s not a knock on OP at all, he looks in good shape, just illustrating the massive variation in natural potential between people).

to put it another way, based on his physique in this thread I don’t think you can call it as being a starting point for aas, nor can you obviously call it as needing aas to achieve. Natural potential varies too much. Sure if someone is 25% BF it’s safe to say they can get to 15% natty if diet and training are dialled in but does he need aas for his amount of lean mass - I dunno, only he knows if he’s truly trained hard and consistently naturally for a few years.

I will say he has a better physique than I could have achieved naturally by a fair distance though

 

[p1nchharmonic]

I appreciate the kind words from everyone. I'm not here to defend myself. I will say a couple of things. I'm not super anxiety prone- just commenting that I'm noticing elevated anxiety levels.

I'm certainly not an AAS hyper responder. However, after a solid 2-3 months I definitely look like im on the sauce.

I quit all exogenous testosterone/ hormones january this year, crashed my T and wound up in the hospital for 2 weeks with severe ulcerative colitis. So definitely lost a lot of gains the first 3 months of this year. I'm happy with how I look, just keeping the doses low to get back to where I was before. Less is more for me

 

[p1nchharmonic]

And doc prescribed TRT march of this year. Crashed hormone levels increases inflammatory response in the body which im sure is a big reason as to why I was diagnosed with UC

 

[Hyde]

Anyway, Idk, I'm in bad shape body comp wise currently. Been training really sporadically and insomnia is eating away at me. Havent cycled for ages, so I'm below my natty limit atm. Not comparing my self to anybody at this point. And I wasn't comparing myself to op. But if he went off cycle, or at least switched to trt test levels and compared to me after a month, we would look quite similar. And that's with a really shitty year of no sleeping and bad training on my part.

Not that it really matters though, who cares who is bigger or smaller?? I dont see a need for such pubescent dick measuring argumentation. I know you probably saw this line of argument implicit in my critique of his physique, but what you did was pull on the low hanging fruit of counter argumentation and that speaks a lot about your character atm. Is a grown ass man, who is trying to cure his self image issues by sticking oil in his ass, really going to go the "You're smaller then him, you have no say in this matter ..." type of line of argument? Don't be silly.

I know op is having a rough time. With anxiety issues preventing him on having an "optimized" training environment (to say the least), and also that he was hospitalized for UC a short while back. So similar to me, he is really in no place to be cycling, and his body comp is showing it. It's the reason why I'm not cycling. I'm in no place to do so, I'm way below where I can be naturally. Cycling would just unbalance me and I would crash afterwards. And this is basically what op is doing for the time he is present on this forum. It's pathological, he's mental problems are driving his drug use which is really causing him harm and kinda really hindering his life. It's pathological. But sure, let's get back at talking about tren lawl.

Here, I think Steve has a pretty good starting point for cycling here:

I don't expect that everybody looks like this before their first cycle, but I'm just further pointing out how the op's physique isn't much more then "I just started my first cycle" or "am about to".

Ok, this is to energy and consuming. That's it from my behalf. Have a good one.

^All talk, no walk.

 

[CroLifter]

@Jinsun sorry bro i have to agree with hyde on this one. He doesnt look like a natty. I could never look like that natty. Someone with extreme gen3tics could perhaps. Also he is 31.

As far whether he should use just test, maybe. He could get similar results. However a lower dose of tren is equivalent.


Ultimately its up to him to decide. Worst side from tren i got was extremd body heat to the point where people asked wtf is wrong with me haha

All i can say is if you ditch the tren due to anxiety be aware that mast could causd the samr thing.

Of course primo would be better, but good luck sourcing it.

 

[p1nchharmonic]

@Jinsun sorry bro i have to agree with hyde on this one. He doesnt look like a natty. I could never look like that natty. Someone with extreme gen3tics could perhaps. Also he is 31.

As far whether he should use just test, maybe. He could get similar results. However a lower dose of tren is equivalent.


Ultimately its up to him to decide. Worst side from tren i got was extremd body heat to the point where people asked wtf is wrong with me haha

All i can say is if you ditch the tren due to anxiety be aware that mast could causd the samr thing.

Of course primo would be better, but good luck sourcing it.

Ive gotten rimobolan from domestic supply before, seemed pretty legit

 

[CroLifter]

Ive gotten rimobolan from domestic supply before, seemed pretty legit

Idk do what you think is smartest. I think tren is very versatile. If sides are too much you can always lower the dose and increase other anabolics.

 

[BBiceps]

Ive gotten rimobolan from domestic supply before, seemed pretty legit

I vote for Primo.

 

[p1nchharmonic]

In case anyone is wondering how this is going, I'm two weeks in now and have definitely noticed a big change in my physique. The pumps in the gym are incredible, like nothing I've ever experienced.

Cardio has helped lower stress levels, I think Ill be able to finish out the rest of this vial in the next two weeks. Sleep has been hit or miss some nights, but it honestly doesn't matter

 

[CroLifter]

In case anyone is wondering how this is going, I'm two weeks in now and have definitely noticed a big change in my physique. The pumps in the gym are incredible, like nothing I've ever experienced.

Cardio has helped lower stress levels, I think Ill be able to finish out the rest of this vial in the next two weeks. Sleep has been hit or miss some nights, but it honestly doesn't matter

Just wait till you pick sth up and start inspecting if sth is missing.. Thats the tren.

 

[BennyMagoo79]

In case anyone is wondering how this is going, I'm two weeks in now and have definitely noticed a big change in my physique. The pumps in the gym are incredible, like nothing I've ever experienced.

Cardio has helped lower stress levels, I think Ill be able to finish out the rest of this vial in the next two weeks. Sleep has been hit or miss some nights, but it honestly doesn't matter

I find with Tren, I have to constantly remind myself, "it's just the tren" as it intermittently bends my emotions and drags me down lol. I wont take more than 200mg/week because I can't be bothered having to spend any more energy to manage it.

 

[CroLifter]

I find with Tren, I have to constantly remind myself, "it's just the tren" as it intermittently bends my emotions and drags me down lol. I wont take more than 200mg/week because I can't be bothered having to spend any more energy to manage it.

Short fuse or?

I feel weird on it as i approach 150mg a week. Just wanna be left alone.

 

[SkRaw85]

Roided road rage is the worst on tren

 

[Iwilleattuna]

Seems like everyone demonizes tren. If you’re responsible with it , is it really a problem? Instead of running 200-300 a week, why not 70-100? It seems like a potent enough compound to get something out of low doses. Would you guys agree? Personally, I’d like to save this one for a few weeks from a show.

 

[Iwilleattuna]

how much of these tren side effects are from prolactin, though? Do you guys find keeping it in range keeps mental sides are bay?

 

[Ironpirate]

how much of these tren side effects are from prolactin, though? Do you guys find keeping it in range keeps mental sides are bay?

For me it's the sleep deprivation, makes me wanna slap my momma.

 

[p1nchharmonic]

I definitely have minor issues sleeping, but im able to manage it by avoiding carbs before bedtime and my fav OTC sleep pill doxylamine succinate.

Never experienced "roid rage" to any extent until tren. I notice a lot after the fact the sh*t I say to people that I normally dont say. For example, at the airport I had my small laptop in a bin with my keys and wallet, the TSA guy says "the laptop needs to be in its own bin". I immediately blurted out "thats the stupidest fuckin thing ive ever heard". Usually I just think sh*t like that.

 

[BennyMagoo79]

how much of these tren side effects are from prolactin, though? Do you guys find keeping it in range keeps mental sides are bay?

No, I don't think it's prolactin. I believe it has something to do with its propensity towards progesterone receptor activation in the brain - which is the proposed method of action for its neurotoxicity.

 

[BennyMagoo79]

Seems like everyone demonizes tren. If you’re responsible with it , is it really a problem? Instead of running 200-300 a week, why not 70-100? It seems like a potent enough compound to get something out of low doses. Would you guys agree? Personally, I’d like to save this one for a few weeks from a show.

I think you are right. It's not as great an anabolic agent as people think, but probably shines at smaller doses during a cut thanks to its ability to mitigate cortisol.

 

[Hyde]

No, I don't think it's prolactin. I believe it has something to do with its propensity towards progesterone receptor activation in the brain - which is the proposed method of action for its neurotoxicity.

Agreed. This is one of the reasons why pregnant women get irritable.

That and having another being growing inside you, kicking, robbing your blood sugar, bloating you, making you pee constantly and depriving your sleep of course. But the PR activity definitely drives the hormonal rage too

 

[Smont]

Short fuse or?

I feel weird on it as i approach 150mg a week. Just wanna be left alone.

Have you ever had a conversation with someone on 1000mg of tren. Obviously it's going to not be the same for everyone, but I got one guy in kinda friends with, more of a associate I guess, but when he's on it's very obvious. He's not a asshole or aggressive, there's just a look in his eyes like he's detached from everything other then his workout. Like he's looking at you but not seeing or hearing you. Even if he starts the conversation he's just this giant empty set of eyeballs staring into your soul lol. I've literally waved my hand at him and said you paying attention? And his response is yep, but no change in facial expression. It's odd

 

[p1nchharmonic]

My life rn

 

[Smont]

Fingers crossed they come out good, otherwise I'm just tossing them and just gonna have scrambled egg white and white rice

 

[Smont]

Wrong thread lol

 

[p1nchharmonic]

Quick update: 1 month ago best squat lift was 295x4. Today hit 385x3.

 

[Smont]

Quick update: 1 month ago best squat lift was 295x4. Today hit 385x3.

Only 100 lbs! That's terrible....

 

[Smont]

Jk that's massive progress