Unanswered 10mg vs 20mg superdrol should I do it?

ItalOne

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In the sense of sparing the organ, it’s not going to do anything. For recovery(post cycle), OR for helping with that run-down nauseas feeling, it could be useful.
I totally agree, I haven’t used any form of liver support since 2013, and saw no difference at all, with labs/liver enzymes, the liver just did what it’s supposed to do. Lately I’m going to try it so I can just make it through a oral run by helping bile ducts. We’ll see if it helps.
Idk I heard people make great points on why to take it while ON cycle. But I’ve also talked to doctors and specialist that think it’s useless for that purpose. I trust a physician over a supplement rep any day, and I’ve seen more bloodwork that proves it doesn’t lower alt/bulb anymore then drinking a lot of water.
 
Matthersby

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Idk I heard people make great points on why to take it while ON cycle. But I’ve also talked to doctors and specialist that think it’s useless for that purpose. I trust a physician over a supplement rep any day, and I’ve seen more bloodwork that proves it doesn’t lower alt/bulb anymore then drinking a lot of water.
Totally Doesn’t do **** for L enzymes. I’ve tested it out for that alone back in the day.
 
Matthersby

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Are you just taking it for funsies??
No MrKleen has a viable theory that while my enzymes are perfectly in range, Tudca may be beneficial at holding off that lethargic nauseous feeling I’m getting in the first damn week of orals. I haven’t been able to get to week 2 with Var, Msten, and now Winny. I’m not even trying to run adequate doses and day 6 my appetite disappears and I can’t stay awake no matter how much caffeine I pound. I need to be able to use orals to compete, so I’ve gotta try everything.
 
Renew1

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No MrKleen has a viable theory that while my enzymes are perfectly in range, Tudca may be beneficial at holding off that lethargic nauseous feeling I’m getting in the first damn week of orals. I haven’t been able to get to week 2 with Var, Msten, and now Winny. I’m not even trying to run adequate doses and day 6 my appetite disappears and I can’t stay awake no matter how much caffeine I pound. I need to be able to use orals to compete, so I’ve gotta try everything.
If TUDCA succeeds in doing that, that means that it is doing what we hope it is doing in the liver. It helps me in that regard. Hope it helps you too, brother.
 
Smont

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Assuming anyone has phera anymore... oh how I wish I tried it when I could have.

And the SD comments, 10mg goes a long way with HRT but I see nothing about a strong liver support like TUDCA as a mandatory addition along with NAC.
Are you saying nac and TUDCA are necessary, cus there not.
 
Smont

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Tudca is be no means mandatory. I find Tudca more useful After running harsh orals.
This. I find all liver support more beneficial off cycle. I have done multiple cycles years back with and without liver supps and it made no difference on bloodwork. Zero
 
Smont

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TUDCA has a lot of benifits tho. It's not just a liver supp.

Nothing is mandatory. There are no rules to taking steroids either. There are lots of things you should do but nothing you have to do. Some guys run tren solo and have zero sides. Most everyone would say you can't run tren solo. Some guys have terrible problems on trt test doses when most guys have no problems on test up to 500mg.

It's one big guessing game outside of what you read and hear and if it works for you then no1 can argue what your doing is wrong.
 
Matthersby

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TUDCA has a lot of benifits tho. It's not just a liver supp.

Nothing is mandatory. There are no rules to taking steroids either. There are lots of things you should do but nothing you have to do. Some guys run tren solo and have zero sides. Most everyone would say you can't run tren solo. Some guys have terrible problems on trt test doses when most guys have no problems on test up to 500mg.

It's one big guessing game outside of what you read and hear and if it works for you then no1 can argue what your doing is wrong.
Then it always comes down to personal trial and error. I haven’t bothered with liver support since 2013. But, and this is a BIG but, if Tudca actually does help with bile ducts and much more importantly, if the lethargy and nausea I experience are DUE to bile ducts because I know they aren’t due to elevated enzymes/bilirubin/liver strain, than it may be beneficial.
I’ll try anything at this point.
It will be nice to use orals again.
 
Ironpirate

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TUDCA has a lot of benifits tho. It's not just a liver supp.

Nothing is mandatory. There are no rules to taking steroids either. There are lots of things you should do but nothing you have to do. Some guys run tren solo and have zero sides. Most everyone would say you can't run tren solo. Some guys have terrible problems on trt test doses when most guys have no problems on test up to 500mg.

It's one big guessing game outside of what you read and hear and if it works for you then no1 can argue what your doing is wrong.
I like that comment because i have people tell me all the time "you gotta do this" or "you gotta run test with it bro" i like trest better personally but the truth is what works for me most likely won't work for anyone else. I have tested out tudca and blood work as well and i dont use it anymore at all, i just try to limit my oral use or use small doses.
 
Jinsun

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Then it always comes down to personal trial and error. I haven’t bothered with liver support since 2013. But, and this is a BIG but, if Tudca actually does help with bile ducts and much more importantly, if the lethargy and nausea I experience are DUE to bile ducts because I know they aren’t due to elevated enzymes/bilirubin/liver strain, than it may be beneficial.
I’ll try anything at this point.
It will be nice to use orals again.
UDCA helps in preventing liver damage. We all know how it works. Point is, that you don't need it for most of your cycles, because there wont be no liver damage, with or without a choleostatic agent. So at this point, it's just marketing.

But mind us, this is all bro science. We have no real scientific evidence to back this up. All in all, if it helps to reduce bile, then if money is not a problem, take it.
 
MrKleen73

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Oh wow do I remember that!
I was so mad when they deleted my log too!!!! I didn't even care about the infraction, I was upset at the loss of documentation!!!! I got it sponsored and since they didn't sponsor here the deleted it all. I asked if I could possibly get it from them for the documentation but the answer was no... I understand why, but it still sucked. Lots of good info and convo in that one.

UDCA helps in preventing liver damage. We all know how it works. Point is, that you don't need it for most of your cycles, because there wont be no liver damage, with or without a choleostatic agent. So at this point, it's just marketing.

But mind us, this is all bro science. We have no real scientific evidence to back this up. All in all, if it helps to reduce bile, then if money is not a problem, take it.
Yeah for me and my understanding, TUDCA and UDCA is more about opening up the bile ducts a bit so toxins can actually be flushed not it changing any of the markers of liver stress. The toxins make you feel like chit. I wouldn't say mandatory, because nothing is but it sure makes for a more pleasant experience for me anyway. As far as when it is more beneficial I would think that is going to be pretty personal depending on sensitivity to sides. Some with rock hard livers who take longer to get sides wouldn't need it until post cycle depending on the product. Me I am a side magnet, 2 weeks on 20mg of SD drinking 2 gallons of water a day still has me pissing weak coffee colored urine and feeling like hell.

If it is placebo then I will take it and hold onto my ignorance for that alone. ;)
 
Matthersby

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I was so mad when they deleted my log too!!!! I didn't even care about the infraction, I was upset at the loss of documentation!!!! I got it sponsored and since they didn't sponsor here the deleted it all. I asked if I could possibly get it from them for the documentation but the answer was no... I understand why, but it still sucked. Lots of good info and convo in that one.


Yeah for me and my understanding, TUDCA and UDCA is more about opening up the bile ducts a bit so toxins can actually be flushed not it changing any of the markers of liver stress. The toxins make you feel like chit. I wouldn't say mandatory, because nothing is but it sure makes for a more pleasant experience for me anyway. As far as when it is more beneficial I would think that is going to be pretty personal depending on sensitivity to sides. Some with rock hard livers who take longer to get sides wouldn't need it until post cycle depending on the product. Me I am a side magnet, 2 weeks on 20mg of SD drinking 2 gallons of water a day still has me pissing weak coffee colored urine and feeling like hell.

If it is placebo then I will take it and hold onto my ignorance for that alone. ;)
Off your recommend, this is the only reason I’m taking it, as a potential side reducer. I feel like my thinking is not coming across clear on text. I have a clear understanding of the liver and how it works, however until we spoke, no one can give me a valid reason why I can’t eat by the end of week 1, and can’t stay awake on ANY oral, since February. If this can get me 4 weeks, I’ll use it every time, because I’m desperate to find a way to use orals again.
 
MrKleen73

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Off your recommend, this is the only reason I’m taking it, as a potential side reducer. I feel like my thinking is not coming across clear on text. I have a clear understanding of the liver and how it works, however until we spoke, no one can give me a valid reason why I can’t eat by the end of week 1, and can’t stay awake on ANY oral, since February. If this can get me 4 weeks, I’ll use it every time, because I’m desperate to find a way to use orals again.
It works that way for me. If the toxins can't clear they get into the blood and blech. Also that means any toxins not just cycle related.
 
AntM1564

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Not to hijack and turn this into a source thread, but where the hell are you guys seeing legit SD? I used Radian and they are out, but I am skeptical if it was legit. If I have to question it, it probably was. They are out of stock of everything. I swear it is easier to find a good source for injectables than PHs.
 
AntM1564

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Not to hijack and turn this into a source thread, but where the hell are you guys seeing legit SD? I used Radian and they are out, but I am skeptical if it was legit. If I have to question it, it probably was. They are out of stock of everything. I swear it is easier to find a good source for injectables than PHs.
 
Matthersby

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Not to hijack and turn this into a source thread, but where the hell are you guys seeing legit SD? I used Radian and they are out, but I am skeptical if it was legit. If I have to question it, it probably was. They are out of stock of everything. I swear it is easier to find a good source for injectables than PHs.
UK supp companies (half are bunk) or underground labs. Just about every big black market steroid source can get raws to make them. Dragon Geneza Bulldog, any lab on Professional Muscle, the list is long.
 
LondonerTWBULLY

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I used tudca on first sdrol cycle with ocs and my second sdrol cycle I only used ocs and had bad acid reflux every night so I’ll use tudca if n when I use sdrol again I’ve managed to put on so much muscle in a short space of time I think it must of been muscle memory too as I got pneumonia and lost 3 stone in 2016 but was tracing hard before hand but only got back in training 3 months ago and have transformed my body and I’m now the biggest I’ve ever been and haven’t taken anything in over a month:) before n after pics below
 

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LondonerTWBULLY

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Not to hijack and turn this into a source thread, but where the hell are you guys seeing legit SD? I used Radian and they are out, but I am skeptical if it was legit. If I have to question it, it probably was. They are out of stock of everything. I swear it is easier to find a good source for injectables than PHs.
There are Rohm Labs Methyl MST Superdrol 50mg x 60 tabs. Each tab contains: 25mg superdrol 25mg winistrol but seems very dosage to me as I struggle with lethargy by week 3ish on 20mg
 
LondonerTWBULLY

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It works that way for me. If the toxins can't clear they get into the blood and blech. Also that means any toxins not just cycle related.
I tend to drink an extra shake or 2 when appetite isn’t big try mutant mass it’s very nice tasting and has a variety of proteins
 
Sheriff Morri

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Not to hijack and turn this into a source thread, but where the hell are you guys seeing legit SD? I used Radian and they are out, but I am skeptical if it was legit. If I have to question it, it probably was. They are out of stock of everything. I swear it is easier to find a good source for injectables than PHs.
So you have tried radians super-d10?? Few guys in here says one of their batches a few months ago was bunk. I bought from their last shipment and have them sitting there.
 
Sheriff Morri

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I used tudca on first sdrol cycle with ocs and my second sdrol cycle I only used ocs and had bad acid reflux every night so I’ll use tudca if n when I use sdrol again I’ve managed to put on so much muscle in a short space of time I think it must of been muscle memory too as I got pneumonia and lost 3 stone in 2016 but was tracing hard before hand but only got back in training 3 months ago and have transformed my body and I’m now the biggest I’ve ever been and haven’t taken anything in over a month:) before n after pics below
So what was in your cycle along with the superdrol???
 
Outofbody

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Awesome thread. The different for me between 10mg or 20mg is projectile vomiting at 20mg but still better gains so go for 20!!!!!
 

BBiceps

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I emailed them as you suggested but they won’t take it back. Not a major issue as it’s only £30 and I should have done my research a bit better.
Yeah, not a major loss like you said but it still sucks when you’re excited to take something and already planned a cycle to break PR’s... 😢
 
Sheriff Morri

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Yeah, not a major loss like you said but it still sucks when you’re excited to take something and already planned a cycle to break PR’s... 😢
Absolutely mate. Sorted some atomic pharma (Taylor made) var instead. Still shite that they sell bunk gear and yet constantly sell out.
 
LondonerTWBULLY

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So what was in your cycle along with the superdrol???
First sdrol cycle with max lmg and second sdrol cycle was with triendiene and epistane I also bridged first cycle with mk677 which helped recovery, I’m running a testosterone,masteron prop cycle in November and gonna take adex @.5 eod just in case(may add Turinabol too?)
 
Sheriff Morri

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First sdrol cycle with max lmg and second sdrol cycle was with triendiene and epistane I also bridged first cycle with mk677 which helped recovery, I’m running a testosterone,masteron prop cycle in November and gonna take adex @.5 eod just in case(may add Turinabol too?)
So they were oral only cycles or do you pin also???
 
Sheriff Morri

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I used tudca on first sdrol cycle with ocs and my second sdrol cycle I only used ocs and had bad acid reflux every night so I’ll use tudca if n when I use sdrol again I’ve managed to put on so much muscle in a short space of time I think it must of been muscle memory too as I got pneumonia and lost 3 stone in 2016 but was tracing hard before hand but only got back in training 3 months ago and have transformed my body and I’m now the biggest I’ve ever been and haven’t taken anything in over a month:) before n after pics below
Amazing results mate.
 
LondonerTWBULLY

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So they were oral only cycles or do you pin also???
Yes they were oral only cycles because my first and only cycle in 2012 (tren,test p,masteron p and dbol) I got gyno and took me ages to get rid, I never researched properly and paid the price n it took me 7 years to completely rid(or so small can’t feel it) so I’m going to run test p,masteron and tbol with adex .5 eod in November as I feel I’ll get great gains without the letharthy and feeling like death by week 3 with superdrol
 
Matthersby

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First sdrol cycle with max lmg and second sdrol cycle was with triendiene and epistane I also bridged first cycle with mk677 which helped recovery, I’m running a testosterone,masteron prop cycle in November and gonna take adex @.5 eod just in case(may add Turinabol too?)
I like the idea of SD with LMG. LMG stacks so well with strong dht’s and you can run it high too with no sides other than water retention and bp. With epi it was super effective. Alongside 10-15mg SD it would be a monster bulking oral combo.
 
Mathb33

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Little update guys, decided not to recomp/try to lose a few lbs and I just kept my **** at +300-400 calories not particularly clean so I remained a fat ****. I just thought about everything and I’ll just bulk more and start cutting and shredding in March. Ended up gaining 11 lbs. I would say overall I felt quite good the whole time except some random anxiety week 4. As I promised I’ll add a few pictures even though my BF hasn’t been that high for quite some time. Edit : *pictures are before workout*
 

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cstallion

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Medfit RX! I’ll be honest i ran msten last time i felt like you.. day 5.. dead. Ran m1a like 3 months later and was COMPLETLY FINE. might be msten we can’t tolerate lol. Last time i used AL i wasn’t impressed and had the worst sides ever. I remember old witch used them and had to stop their DMZ day 15 of something. I good buddy of mine couldn’t complete his cycle of dmz either on like day 20, gave him my DMZ from another source and he finished his cycle with it. I know AL is legit I’m not doubting it, just wouldn’t my choice personally.
Currently on day 2 on MSTEN and feel like **** lol!!!
 
Renew1

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Little update guys, decided not to recomp/try to lose a few lbs and I just kept my **** at +300-400 calories not particularly clean so I remained a fat ****. I just thought about everything and I’ll just bulk more and start cutting and shredding in March. Ended up gaining 11 lbs. I would say overall I felt quite good the whole time except some random anxiety week 4. As I promised I’ll add a few pictures even though my BF hasn’t been that high for quite some time. Edit : *pictures are before workout*
Good job, my friend. It looks like it treated you pretty well.
 
ItalOne

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Little update guys, decided not to recomp/try to lose a few lbs and I just kept my **** at +300-400 calories not particularly clean so I remained a fat ****. I just thought about everything and I’ll just bulk more and start cutting and shredding in March. Ended up gaining 11 lbs. I would say overall I felt quite good the whole time except some random anxiety week 4. As I promised I’ll add a few pictures even though my BF hasn’t been that high for quite some time. Edit : *pictures are before workout*
Bruiser brigade! Your looking strong bro, nice definition in the chest and delts!
 
NoAddedHmones

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I was so mad when they deleted my log too!!!! I didn't even care about the infraction, I was upset at the loss of documentation!!!! I got it sponsored and since they didn't sponsor here the deleted it all. I asked if I could possibly get it from them for the documentation but the answer was no... I understand why, but it still sucked. Lots of good info and convo in that one.


Yeah for me and my understanding, TUDCA and UDCA is more about opening up the bile ducts a bit so toxins can actually be flushed not it changing any of the markers of liver stress. The toxins make you feel like chit. I wouldn't say mandatory, because nothing is but it sure makes for a more pleasant experience for me anyway. As far as when it is more beneficial I would think that is going to be pretty personal depending on sensitivity to sides. Some with rock hard livers who take longer to get sides wouldn't need it until post cycle depending on the product. Me I am a side magnet, 2 weeks on 20mg of SD drinking 2 gallons of water a day still has me pissing weak coffee colored urine and feeling like hell.

If it is placebo then I will take it and hold onto my ignorance for that alone. ;)
TUDCA doesn't "open up bile ducts". Using an example of a cholestatic like a methylated hormone which impedes intestinal secretion of bile acids from the liver and causes a "build up" effect, of harmful hydrophobic bile acids which act like a detergent to break down lipids etc, these types of bile acids directly cause cell death in hepatocytes, TUDCA and UDCA are highly hydrophilic bile acids which compete against these bad bile acids and do not possess a toxic effect on these cells. So in effect you are altering the ratio of harmful : protective bile acids in the liver.

So it makes sense to use TUDCA concurrent with a methylated compound to protect liver cells during this period.
 
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Matthersby

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Little update guys, decided not to recomp/try to lose a few lbs and I just kept my **** at +300-400 calories not particularly clean so I remained a fat ****. I just thought about everything and I’ll just bulk more and start cutting and shredding in March. Ended up gaining 11 lbs. I would say overall I felt quite good the whole time except some random anxiety week 4. As I promised I’ll add a few pictures even though my BF hasn’t been that high for quite some time. Edit : *pictures are before workout*
Big ol muscle sammich. You look substantially bigger.
Isn’t that SD awesome at just slabbing muscle in all the areas we want? It always seems to pile on your Delts/Traps, makes you wider with bigger arms, and even adds more upper chest. It’s just a gnarly body recomper, like it knows where we want more muscle.
 
Jinsun

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TUDCA doesn't "open up bile ducts". Using an example of a cholestatic like a methylated hormone which impedes intestinal secretion of bile acids from the liver and causes a "build up" effect, of harmful hydrophobic bile acids which act like a detergent to break down lipids etc, these types of bile acids directly cause cell death in hepatocytes, TUDCA and UDCA are highly hydrophilic bile acids which compete against these bad bile acids and do not possess a toxic effect on these cells. So in effect you are altering the ratio of harmful : protective bile acids in the liver.

So it makes sense to use TUDCA concurrent with a methylated compound to protect liver cells during this period.
This, exactly.
 
MrKleen73

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TUDCA doesn't "open up bile ducts". Using an example of a cholestatic like a methylated hormone which impedes intestinal secretion of bile acids from the liver and causes a "build up" effect, of harmful hydrophobic bile acids which act like a detergent to break down lipids etc, these types of bile acids directly cause cell death in hepatocytes, TUDCA and UDCA are highly hydrophilic bile acids which compete against these bad bile acids and do not possess a toxic effect on these cells. So in effect you are altering the ratio of harmful : protective bile acids in the liver.

So it makes sense to use TUDCA concurrent with a methylated compound to protect liver cells during this period.
Awesome, thanks for the clarification! I knew it had to do with bile and a build up of harmful toxins or something but had the MOA wrong obviously. Thanks for the very clear correction on that!
 

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My wife just started at this endo and i had her ask him if he prescribed peptides and such yesterday at her visit. He said yes, so he is getting a new patient. Yeah I know there are plenty of sources out there but so many are faked... Hell I am sure he would do HGH but I don't have the cash for that! Plus I have been wanting to take my TRT to someone who will really dial it in for me.
What exactly does one have to do to get an endo to prescribe peptides? Seems like a rare thing to get just because theyre cool.
 
Matthersby

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What exactly does one have to do to get an endo to prescribe peptides? Seems like a rare thing to get just because theyre cool.
They are easy enough to source legally, it would be more of a headache finding any physician progressive enough to prescribe them.
 

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They are easy enough to source legally, it would be more of a headache finding any physician progressive enough to prescribe them.
kinda what I would’ve thought. I’m just trying to think of what you’d have to be able to convince them of.
 
Iwilleattuna

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Sorry to derail , but do you guys experience Gyno on sd or dmz? I’ve researched the two and it seems like rebound Gyno can happen. If so , how long after discontinuing and how do you guys battle it. Kind of weird that it’s dry but can do this. Can it accompany water retention ?
 

BBiceps

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What exactly does one have to do to get an endo to prescribe peptides? Seems like a rare thing to get just because theyre cool.
If you find the right Dr it’s as easy as just ask, friend of mine got some without even asking, he went for TRT and was offered peptides as well. Look around and I’m sure you find a Dr that will give you.
 

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