Smont
Legend
If anything I bet my blood sugar is low
A log with vague goals
- Thread starter Smont
- Start date
Hyde
Legend
Manual labor jobs definitely mess with all training and recovery. You struggle to eat enough, especially when it’s hot, to fuel good training and growth, plus the timing is generally sub-optimal. But beyond that, you have a lot of variables in what can happen at work. The years I was a mechanic, there were many days my shoulders would be shot from a random bolus of overhead work - there was no good pressing to be had that night. And I knew a bodybuilder that never trained deadlifts or their low back much, because he needed it daily on the construction site.
Not saying these aren’t good jobs, but they absolutely work against putting on size and strength. They can very much help with staying leaner & improving conditioning though (and mental toughness).
Not saying these aren’t good jobs, but they absolutely work against putting on size and strength. They can very much help with staying leaner & improving conditioning though (and mental toughness).
Smont
Legend
You couldn't be more right. I definitely am little by little trying to work my way out of these jobs though, I've been doing more work at the gym and a little more work online so I can only have to be doing my own manual labor jobs and I'm not really working for other people anymore at least not for big companies unless someone offers me a really sweet gig. Last night I had 2 ppl show up looking for me by name because they specifically wanted to get in my strength class. I'm actually trying to make it more powerbuilding to give people The Best of both worlds but nonetheless it's the first time I've had people show up at the gym that I don't know who were searching me out so that was pretty cool.
Sometimes I wonder how I would be (size and strength) if I had a more laid back job so I could be more prepared for my gym sessions. Or if I slept more then 5-6hrs a night. I've always done well with the cards stacked against me and probably just because I'm stubborn and I find ways to make s*** work. But I know in another world where I didn't live my life this way I probably do a lot better with all my personal training or my own physique and strength goals.
If everything goes to plan by this time next year I won't be painting or doing manual labor anymore I've got a lot of stuff in the works and I've set myself up to have multiple chances to succeed. I'm not just relying on one thing to happen.
And the worst case scenario I just go back to painting houses. So I might as well take a shot
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Dustin07
Legend
You'd probably be bigger, I imagine, but struggle to stay as lean, I'd bet. I started this company in 2002 so I've been more or less in a desk job for 23 years. Most of my best cuts came with finding 2hrs a day of training. for a long period I would hit the gym at 4-5am for an hour of intense cardio, sweat soup, shower and dress at the gym. then go lift after work or at lunch. or when i was competing, 2 hr sessions after work. its hard to make up for the lost 10 hours of sedentary lifestyle at the desk.
Like if i'm just bulking or strength training I can sit fairly relaxed (although not necessarily mentally) and eat all day. then lift for my needed 40-60 minute training session. get a heavy squat/bench in or whatever. rest. but getting lean is so much more work when you sit all day.
Dustin07
Legend
wild, I had no idea that was even legal! I sent the link to my wife. she has developed an incredible green thumb. when we first got together I was the one saving all the plants lol. but I've shifted all my focus to the reef tank now and she has really done a good job with her garden as long as I set up the watering system for her lol
Smont
Legend
Reef tank! How big we talking
Dustin07
Legend
Salt water tanks seem like a ton of work. Id imagine Id probably get obsessed like I do with everything
my new system is a Mariner 100, so it's a 100g display with a 30g sump down below. so.. really about 120-125 gallons total since I keep space in the sump for overflow emergencies.
it definitely can be as much work as gardening... but I like it cause here in the PNW when it's dark by the time I get home from work, the reef is still lit up and it gives me indoor gardening for 9 months of the year basically lol.
Smont
Legend
Mind sending some pictures? Sounds cool
gphagan1
Legend
Man that sounds like you had a close call with dehydration….glad it didn’t lead you to a heat stroke. Even though it seems like you hydrated plenty, obviously your body was going through fluids, sodium, and electrolytes quicker than you could get it in. One of the bad things with heat exhaustion is how quickly it can sneak up on you and get you before you realize. Be careful and stay safe brother, and hopefully you can stay hydrated enough between your work schedule and training to not go through that again.
Smont
Legend
Id imagine Id be 20-30lbs heavier and look more like I use to when I always thought that bigger meant more muscle. But, knowing the things I know now I think I would be able to push myself up 20 to 30 lb heavier and still staying fairly lean. GH has made me understand a few things too. On GH everything seems to work better
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1HP
Well-known member
I made it through my first full sugar fast day yesterday, lost 0.5 kg (weight didn’t budge on 12 days of sugar dieting). Well being continuous to increase, HRV keeps going up, RHR keeps going down with an absolute low (for me) of 49 this morning (!).
Interesting recent study, perhaps partially related:
Objective: To examine how daytime dietary intakes influence sleep quality on the following night using multiple days of self-reported diet monitoring and objective sleep measured under free-living conditions.
Methods: Participants were younger US adults with average habitual sleep duration between 7 and 9 hours per night. Diet was assessed using the Automated Self-Administered 24-Hour Dietary Assessment Tool. Sleep was measured using wrist actigraphy. Sleep fragmentation index was used for objective assessment of sleep quality.
Results: Thirty-four participants (age: 28.3±6.6years, BMI: 24.1±3.9 kg/m2, 82.3% males, 50.0% racial/ethnic minority) provided 201 paired diet-sleep data. Greater daytime intakes of fruits and vegetables (β-coefficient (SE)=-0.60 (0.29), P=.038) and carbohydrates (-0.02 (0.007), P=.022), but not added sugar (P=.54), were associated with lower sleep fragmentation index. Trends toward associations of higher intakes of red and processed meat (P=.10) with more disrupted sleep, as well as higher fiber (P=.08) and magnesium (P=.09) intakes with less disrupted sleep, were observed.
Conclusions: Higher daytime intakes of fruits and vegetables and carbohydrates that align with a healthy diet were associated with less disrupted nighttime sleep. A 5-cup increase (from no intake) in fruits and vegetables, meeting dietary recommendations, was associated with 16% better sleep quality. These findings suggest that diets rich in complex carbohydrates, fruits, and vegetables may promote better sleep health.
pmid 40506285
Interesting recent study, perhaps partially related:
Higher daytime intake of fruits and vegetables predicts less disrupted nighttime sleep in younger adults
Abstract
Background: Higher-quality diets are associated with better sleep quality in observational studies. However, a better understanding of this association is needed given that dietary modifications could represent a novel and natural approach to achieve better sleep.Objective: To examine how daytime dietary intakes influence sleep quality on the following night using multiple days of self-reported diet monitoring and objective sleep measured under free-living conditions.
Methods: Participants were younger US adults with average habitual sleep duration between 7 and 9 hours per night. Diet was assessed using the Automated Self-Administered 24-Hour Dietary Assessment Tool. Sleep was measured using wrist actigraphy. Sleep fragmentation index was used for objective assessment of sleep quality.
Results: Thirty-four participants (age: 28.3±6.6years, BMI: 24.1±3.9 kg/m2, 82.3% males, 50.0% racial/ethnic minority) provided 201 paired diet-sleep data. Greater daytime intakes of fruits and vegetables (β-coefficient (SE)=-0.60 (0.29), P=.038) and carbohydrates (-0.02 (0.007), P=.022), but not added sugar (P=.54), were associated with lower sleep fragmentation index. Trends toward associations of higher intakes of red and processed meat (P=.10) with more disrupted sleep, as well as higher fiber (P=.08) and magnesium (P=.09) intakes with less disrupted sleep, were observed.
Conclusions: Higher daytime intakes of fruits and vegetables and carbohydrates that align with a healthy diet were associated with less disrupted nighttime sleep. A 5-cup increase (from no intake) in fruits and vegetables, meeting dietary recommendations, was associated with 16% better sleep quality. These findings suggest that diets rich in complex carbohydrates, fruits, and vegetables may promote better sleep health.
pmid 40506285
1HP
Well-known member
Smont
Legend
It wasn't pleasant lol. I had mostly fluid and electrolytes today because of what happened to me the other day at work. Had a protein shake also and some fruit before the gym even though I didn't work out I just put my guys through a workout (I did take my SLU with my growth hormone before the gym though to kind of simulate exercise at least in my mind that's what I'm doing lol. I want to dig into that topic a little bit at some point too but anyways I just got home from my class and I haven't eaten dinner yet but I'm typically heavier in the evening than I am in the morning and I'm 185 on the dot right now. I have veins in my stomach lol.Your first full sugar fast day? I’ve tried but just getting too damn hungry in the evening
But I also feel tired and weak. I really think I'm bottomed out on how lean I want to be. If I had a specific date or something to shine for it might be worth digging a little deeper but I feel like I need to start eating more food again.
I'm thinking about only doing the sugar fast on Monday next week, but stay at 2,800-3000 calories and 250gm of protein on the other days.
I don't feel like I can comfortably maintain less than 190 lb without feeling weak and tired.
200lb is my sweet spot for comfort and leanness
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Smont
Legend
A table spoon of salt I believe is about 6,850-7000 mg of sodium. So I'm thinking I'll start with a teaspoon in the morning before work which is about 2,300 mg I think, and then another teaspoon pre-workout and then salt my dinner
Smont
Legend
From yesterday afternoon to today I definitely had over 10gm tho. I could always just eat 1 meal a day at Chili's lol.
Fun fact Chili's 6-piece Nashville Hot Chicken crispers has almost 7,000 mg of sodium
Smont
Legend
So given the way that SLU is mimicking the internal effect of exercise. It shouldn't cause any of the external effects like sweating or feeling tired or weak none of those things should happen it's supposed to just mimic the internal effects of exercise as far as I'm aware.
I feel like timing it with growth hormone or someone who was on oral steroids could time their orals with it I would assume having your orals and GH with SLU and a protein and carbs meal would be more beneficial then taking them separately.
I know SLU isn't mimicking an hour long chest and shoulders workout or leg day, or anything like that
, but given how it works, I have to guess that maybe on rest days taking gear and food with it would do a lot more than taking it on an empty stomach or taking it separately from your anabolics.
I'm guessing though
I feel like timing it with growth hormone or someone who was on oral steroids could time their orals with it I would assume having your orals and GH with SLU and a protein and carbs meal would be more beneficial then taking them separately.
I know SLU isn't mimicking an hour long chest and shoulders workout or leg day, or anything like that
, but given how it works, I have to guess that maybe on rest days taking gear and food with it would do a lot more than taking it on an empty stomach or taking it separately from your anabolics. I'm guessing though
manifesto
Well-known member
MrKleen73
Legend
Before actually deciding what weight you are going to feel best at, I think you should probably go back to regular eating style and maintain there for 2 weeks and see if you feel better getting in good balanced nutrition. You absolutely are dealing with some major nutritional deficits that could make you not feel well, and absolutely effect hydration levels which can make you feel like ****. Just a thought, but I wouldn't make any assumptions based on how you feel now because there is no way you are getting everything you need from this diet. Is it effective? Absolutely, but I think there is going to need to be some serious tweaking for this diet to work with someone who works as much and as physically as you do. The demands you put on your body are far from normal, even for those of us who workout intensly on a regularl basis.
When I look at the lables for salt you are getting 480mg of sodium per 1/4 teaspoon, or 1.2g of salt. So that would be a lot closer to 4000mg for 10g of salt.
Just me, I sent you a PM about where you want me to send it, and what apps I had to do so.
Very interesting, as you mentioned and what it says here, you won't get any hypertrophy from it, but it looks like it would make leaning up easier, and also help with strength endurance and cardio. Not a bad plan to try to use that to benefit like a GDA that releases fat to be burned in the blood stream at the same time. That being said though, I would think if you considered it, that it might be better to take in the morning before your long day of work to make the body think it has done even more work than it has then use the gear or GH when you do the full meal for a better supercompensation effect. Just another thing to think about.So given the way that SLU is mimicking the internal effect of exercise. It shouldn't cause any of the external effects like sweating or feeling tired or weak none of those things should happen it's supposed to just mimic the internal effects of exercise as far as I'm aware.
I feel like timing it with growth hormone or someone who was on oral steroids could time their orals with it I would assume having your orals and GH with SLU and a protein and carbs meal would be more beneficial then taking them separately.
I know SLU isn't mimicking an hour long chest and shoulders workout or leg day, or anything like that
I'm guessing though
View attachment 253684
Hyde
Legend
The tub of Morton non-iodized salt I use every day for hyrdration is 590mg sodium for 1/4 tsp. So I took 3/4 preWO and 1 full tsp in my half-gallon intra. ~1800 preWO to hydrate from sleep as well as frontload for the humidity, then 2400 intra to help restore and use all the water (which has 100g carbs in it as well, plus taurine, creatine & 100mg magnesium).
1HP
Well-known member
Did you add creatine and/or increase your dosage of Elite ATP? My 3rd bottle just ran out but have a six-pack incoming from the 4th of July sale. Thinking if worth it trying a higher dose. Laziness compels me to ask before trying
Hyde
Legend
I keep the ATP Elite at 3 caps daily, but since I’m a little bigger than the average person I add some extra creatine HCL and MCC on training days to help offset the extra demand/usage. Just a scoop of each from SNS in the intra. Some off days I’ll take a couple scoops of HCL in the evening if I want it and have training coming in the morning.Did you add creatine and/or increase your dosage of Elite ATP? My 3rd bottle just ran out but have a six-pack incoming from the 4th of July sale. Thinking if worth it trying a higher dose. Laziness compels me to ask before trying
MrKleen73
Legend
Yeah, the label I was looking at was iodized salt. I am sure many of them are slightly different, I just tend to round to 500 to get a rough estimate when grabbing a different source. I have different salts in different places. Himalayan at my desk and home, iodized in the break room, sea and kosher salt at home. I just tend to mix and match based on what is convenient near me.
Hyde
Legend
Well I thought it was worth mentioning that different salt products can have pretty different concentrations - what I took today would be 770mg less total sodium if I measured it out of what you had at that 480 per 1/4tsp. I know Pink Himalayan is definitely lower per volume.
Smont
Legend
Here's what's left on the chopping block.
2x methylene blue (I'm actually thinking about keeping one because I just realized that at the doses we're using the risk for interactions is very very low. The doses I was taking at 2 to 5 mg are pretty insignificant in comparison to the 1 mg per kilogram dosing guidelines
2x methylene blue (I'm actually thinking about keeping one because I just realized that at the doses we're using the risk for interactions is very very low. The doses I was taking at 2 to 5 mg are pretty insignificant in comparison to the 1 mg per kilogram dosing guidelines
sammpedd88
Well-known member
Send you a PM
Smont
Legend
Got you soon as I get home
1HP
Well-known member
How are your sugar diet experiments going?
I started supplementing towards supporting increases in FGF21 to see if it enhances effectiveness. For me sugar fasting appears to be effective, more so than full or intermittent fasting and I’m stonger and feel much better on it.
Main goal is to increase effectiveness of the sugar diet relative to sugar fast + protein refeed days.
I’m now taking Omega 3, PQQ, Spermidine, EGCG, Astaxanthin with breakfast, Berberine with breakfast and dinner, adding Resveratrol, curcumin, NMN later on.
Supplements That Can Increase FGF21
Resveratrol Activates SIRT1 and AMPK → increases FGF21 in liver
Curcumin Activates AMPK and reduces inflammation → increases FGF21
Omega-3 fatty acids Activates PPARα → increases hepatic FGF21 expression
Berberine Activates AMPK, mimics fasting → increases FGF21
PQQ Induces mitochondrial biogenesis → may increase FGF21
EGCG Activates AMPK → mild increase in FGF21
Spermidine Induces autophagy, mimics fasting → potential increase in FGF21
NR / NMN Boosts NAD⁺, activates SIRT1 → may increase FGF21
Astaxanthin Mitochondrial stress, PPAR activation → possible increase in FGF21
Best FGF21-Stimulating Supplements by Confidence Level
High confidence: Resveratrol, Berberine, Omega-3s, Curcumin
Moderate confidence: PQQ, Spermidine, EGCG, NR/NMN
Experimental: Astaxanthin, other fasting mimetics
I started supplementing towards supporting increases in FGF21 to see if it enhances effectiveness. For me sugar fasting appears to be effective, more so than full or intermittent fasting and I’m stonger and feel much better on it.
Main goal is to increase effectiveness of the sugar diet relative to sugar fast + protein refeed days.
I’m now taking Omega 3, PQQ, Spermidine, EGCG, Astaxanthin with breakfast, Berberine with breakfast and dinner, adding Resveratrol, curcumin, NMN later on.
Supplements That Can Increase FGF21
Resveratrol Activates SIRT1 and AMPK → increases FGF21 in liver
Curcumin Activates AMPK and reduces inflammation → increases FGF21
Omega-3 fatty acids Activates PPARα → increases hepatic FGF21 expression
Berberine Activates AMPK, mimics fasting → increases FGF21
PQQ Induces mitochondrial biogenesis → may increase FGF21
EGCG Activates AMPK → mild increase in FGF21
Spermidine Induces autophagy, mimics fasting → potential increase in FGF21
NR / NMN Boosts NAD⁺, activates SIRT1 → may increase FGF21
Astaxanthin Mitochondrial stress, PPAR activation → possible increase in FGF21
Best FGF21-Stimulating Supplements by Confidence Level
High confidence: Resveratrol, Berberine, Omega-3s, Curcumin
Moderate confidence: PQQ, Spermidine, EGCG, NR/NMN
Experimental: Astaxanthin, other fasting mimetics
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Smont
Legend
I've actually been eating pretty loose recently and not really training hard and then today I went ham in the gym and I was a bit bloated in the belly but big and very pleased with how I looked. Haven't seen myself well rested and full of food in a while.
But I'm planning on just doing the 2 days per week like I had mentioned before. Il be back on that tomorrow. I don't want to stay under 190 at the moment. I need a break lol. I can definitely get leaner and loose more weight but I was definitely getting to the point where I'm not comfortable. It was far beyond my normal setpoint. I also definitely don't think I lost any muscle during all of this, I may have even added some.
But I'm planning on just doing the 2 days per week like I had mentioned before. Il be back on that tomorrow. I don't want to stay under 190 at the moment. I need a break lol. I can definitely get leaner and loose more weight but I was definitely getting to the point where I'm not comfortable. It was far beyond my normal setpoint. I also definitely don't think I lost any muscle during all of this, I may have even added some.
Smont
Legend
Today I did a full body cross training workout, I winged it, but it was tough.
Rotator cuff warm ups and incline db flys mostly in the stretch position to get loose.
Bench 3x5
Back, legs and biceps circuit. 3 rotations, 10 reps each, 10 seconds between exercises
Trap bar deadlift
Chest supported dumbbell rows
Hack squat
Seated hammer curl
3 Straight Sets of 12-20+ each
Incline db press
Close grip bench
Side laterals superset with front raises
Rope press down
Rested 15min and then ran 2.1miles in a big loop that ended back at the gym
Rotator cuff warm ups and incline db flys mostly in the stretch position to get loose.
Bench 3x5
Back, legs and biceps circuit. 3 rotations, 10 reps each, 10 seconds between exercises
Trap bar deadlift
Chest supported dumbbell rows
Hack squat
Seated hammer curl
3 Straight Sets of 12-20+ each
Incline db press
Close grip bench
Side laterals superset with front raises
Rope press down
Rested 15min and then ran 2.1miles in a big loop that ended back at the gym
1HP
Well-known member
Curiously I have gained strength, while also noticing stronger DOMS, maybe there’s some kind of increased adaptation response? I cannot find anything other than the high sugar intake and FGF21 provide some protection against catabolism.
LeanEngineer
Legend
Solid workout with cardio to finish it off!
Smont
Legend
I felt great, I was thinking about doing a second workout in the evening but I kinda hit everything so I didn't know what else to do lol.
Today I feel good too, no complaints
1HP
Well-known member
Thinking about it some more it’s could also just be from the increased workout intensity, perhaps recovery is compromised, however, would it be more or less compromised then for example IF? ..
Yesterday (Sunday) I had a rest day but today I still have relatively strong DOMS from both my Friday and Saturday workouts.
I do have plenty of X-gels stocked, I could add them as an experiment, but that could be counter productive to assessing the impact of the sugar diet, and/or diet induced inflammation levels.
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Smont
Legend
Mark bell reposted a old Rich Piana video where for a month rich only ate rice 5 times a day and having a piece of meat for dinner. (10 cups of rice = 2000 calories and like a pound of meat) Rich said it made him feel good in and out of the gym. Lots of energy, good pumps. Said he didn't feel like it affected muscle games at all, but he also brought up the point that if he had done it for a long time or if he continues to do it much longer he doesn't know if that will change and it probably would.
It's hilarious that's all the same thoughts we're having right now. Rich accidentally kinda ate like this as a short experiment.
It's hilarious that's all the same thoughts we're having right now. Rich accidentally kinda ate like this as a short experiment.
1HP
Well-known member
I just keep thinking this can’t be right lol
Goes against decades of learning/programming.But then I thought, ah screw it. I’m over 50, let’s live a little. Maybe this is my midlife crisis, some people buy Harleys, I’m just hoarding marshmallows. At least my teeth are shaking, even if my life isn’t.
Hyde
Legend
I directly mentioned this Rich Piana video about rice only all day at the start of all this talk here, probably in this very thread.
Nac
Well-known member
80g of protein per day, in his last meal. Fawk n ell.
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