TommyTuffGuy
Well-known member
Nattokinase. Wanna break up any existing plaque in the arteries to avoid problems down the line.
Tell Us What You Would Like to See From SNS & CEL (2021 Edition)
- Thread starter sns8778
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sns8778
Board Sponsor
Good idea. That would be a good addition if it would fit price wise.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
Do you happen to know of a form or if there is a form not derived from soy? (I'm allergic to soy protein myself)
TommyTuffGuy
Well-known member
I would have to dig. I am not sure on that.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I know that its derived from Natto, basically fermented soy beans. So I doubt it, but it would be cool if someone had found some way of a non-soy source.
I try to think about allergens when adding things into products. It would be cool to add, but it would also suck to exclude some people from being able to take it.
aaronuconn
Well-known member
What are your thoughts on pregnenolone (~10mg) being included in supplements? I’ve noticed this trend over the last year or so.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I'm not surprised to see it in topicals but have been surprised to see it in some of the things its been in orally.
What were you thinking?
Beau
Well-known member
I believe it is all soy-derived. Nattokinase is an enzyme extracted from Natto (boiled soybeans that have been fermented with a type of bacteria).
poison
Board Sponsor
I highly doubt it. Natto is some insane ****, slimy, fermented whole cooked soybeans. It's like miso, marmite, brewers yeast, and the creature from the black lagoon had a bastard love child. It smells 'ripe', and when you take a bite, these stretchy spiderweb-like strands stay connected between your mouth, your fork, etc.
I like the flavor of natto, and I'm pasty white. I've ordered at Japanese restaurants, and they either say 'eww you don't really want that' or 'no you don't'.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I know thats the natural origin. Was hoping may have been an alternative one by now; but may be one of those things where there just isn't.
My wondering on this is 2 part - one for the product, and second bc I'm allergic to soy protein myself.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I'm so allergic to soy protein that my allergy specialist told me not to even go in an Asian restaurant. I have an anaphylactic allergy to soy protein.
CATdiesel76
Well-known member
I'm always asking everyone in this thread. I enjoy interacting and throwing ideas around.
It had good overall potential for cardiovascular formula idea; but then the citrus bergamot is more towards cholesterol. So that's why I was asking to clarify which idea it was for. Definitely not asking in a bad way; it supports what I said about there are so many directions one could go with projects like this.
For Heart Health, I like your ideas there, but some have to be dosed so high that its hard to use them in formulas together.
When I think of overall heart health, here are some things I think of:
MenaQ7 (Vitamin K)
Garlic (Odorless)
Olive Leaf
MegaNatural BP Grape Seed Extract
Arjuna
Celery (high 3nb content)
Coenzyme Q10
S7 (inexpensive; nitric oxide and blood flow)
I do think of Hawthorn but I tend to associate that more with a blood pressure product.
I wouldn't use Curcumin in a cardiovascular formula because we have something very special coming in terms of a curcumin product very soon
I appreciate the ideas. I like to hear everyone's different ideas bc I like different perspectives.
Like this a lot. I second Nattokinase and also serrapeptase might be worth an add. I’d also prefer ubiquinol over regular COQ10
The BP, heart health, curcumin supplements, and also possible anti aging supps would all be monthly staples for me. Maybe an omega 3 product? Pretty saturated market but I would purchase it especially to have it come from a reputable company.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I haven't seen much on Serrapeptase on cholesterol but will have a look.
In a perfect world, Ubiquinol looks better than CoQ10 but the price is so high it makes it almost impossible to use in a formula with other good ingredients. If you did 100 mg. x a 30 day supply, it contributes over 2.00 per unit to the true raw material cost. Keep in mind Bergamonte and other things we are talking about contribute more than that.
Overall, a lot of the cholesterol ingredients are really expensive. As I get more into this project, I see why many companies just do a Bergamonte, Pantesin, or Red Yeast Rice and don't go all out on a combination product bc a lot of the good ingredients for this are surprisingly expensive.
And thank you, I'm glad to hear that about them being staples.
Blood Pressure Support XT - this will be a great product; very comprehensive.
Cardiovascular health product - I'm waiting on quotes back for finished product cost; the formula I have in mind is wonderful; I'm just not sure if may have to scale it back a little from a cost standpoint. But we'll see.
Curcumin supplement - we have something very unique and special for this. I'm excited about it.
Anti-Aging supplements - I'm definitely open to ideas. The hardest part is how a person defines anti-aging. One person may emphasize healthy hormone production, for the next it may be skin health, or the next it may be cognition. I suspect that there are going to be multiple products under the Health Series that qualify as anti-aging products. But I do want to do one or two specific ones. I know I want to do a capsule and am considering a collagen based product with anti-aging ingredients thrown in. But may just do a separate collagen product and people could just take the capsules with it. Kind of just thinking out loud here.
Beau
Well-known member
That is the same with me, but with shellfish.
CATdiesel76
Well-known member
I get the COQ10 vs. Ubiquinol form pricing considering how much the solo product costs and assumed that was the reason. I’d much rather have all the other ingredients with COQ10 and supplement a single ubiquinol product.
As for Serrapeptase, I’m not aware of effects on cholesterol but I believe it has good studies on preventing plaque buildup as well as reducing existing plaque. I read some studies on it but it’s been awhile
And yes these are all anti aging products to a degree. Maybe a libido product? It would probably sell. As for anti aging I was thinking maybe just a broad product for living longer/quality of life not covered by your other products such as test boosters, curcumin product, etc.
Maybe with things like trans reveratrol, black ginger, things along those lines
aaronuconn
Well-known member
I honestly had no thoughts on it either way. I’ve never tried the ingredient, so was curious what others have experienced at 10mg/day. Was just curious if it’s something you’ve been thinking of incorporating.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I've seen it used in topicals before but just recently started to see it used in other stuff in sports nutrition. Its been available forever as a single ingredient (I remember Twinlabs making it in a glass bottle w white and green label back in the 90's).
I hadn't really put much thought into it honestly other than seeing a formula with it in there and wondering why they did it bc it looked like a random inclusion. I'll try to look into it some more. Let me know if you come up with anything on your end too please.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I'll read up more on Serrapeptase, I've read on it helping with digestion and think I read some on the plague part, but its been awhile. I'll try to look more into it.
We are looking at doing a libido product. We have a lot of great ingredient candidates for this but many of them are either quite expensive for inclusion in a combination product &/or take up a lot of capsule space so they make it hard to include other things.
I would love to hear what everyone would like in a libido product.
Btw.... Pine Pollen that we just released a few weeks ago is great for libido. Great feedback. But the dosage wouldn't allow for it in a formula bc of capsule space.
I like your anti-aging idea. Any certain ingredients you'd like to see?
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I'm loving the interaction in this thread and throwing around ingredient ideas on formulas.
I wanted to get everyone's opinions - when an idea gets brought up and going, would you like me to make a separate thread in the SNS sub section about helping us pick ingredients for specific types of products?
We could still throw around ideas too in this thread. I like that. I just mean if we say okay, the libido product will be a go, start a separate thread to discuss ingredient candidates?
I wanted to get everyone's opinions - when an idea gets brought up and going, would you like me to make a separate thread in the SNS sub section about helping us pick ingredients for specific types of products?
We could still throw around ideas too in this thread. I like that. I just mean if we say okay, the libido product will be a go, start a separate thread to discuss ingredient candidates?
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I had actually thought about having that in a Collagen product if we do one.
I want to do one, just not sure what type to do.
robshef
Member
I like that idea of collagen with hyaluronic acid.
aaronuconn
Well-known member
I think that’s a good idea.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I quoted this post from another thread to be able to discuss in here rather than the Cissus powder thread.
We had considered doing a Humanofort but the issue is that the person/company you license if from wouldn't let us call it Humanofort. So that would put us buying the raws/paying the licensing fee but without being able to use the name. And I don't just meant the name of the product, they don't want it identified anywhere on the bottle, write up, etc. as Humanofort.
You can see how weird of a position that puts us in. So when someone asks us - 'hey, is this Humanofort?', it put us in a weird position as to how to answer that. If we say yes, its going to upset them and they may not let us use the ingredient anymore. But if we say no, we're lying. Which would then lead to someone asking - 'How does yours compare to Humanofort?'
So the whole situation with trying to offer one is a mess bc of how they wanted to go about it. I don't mind not using the branded name on the label or marketing, but I do mind not being able to answer a question honestly if asked.
I started not to post any of this but have been asked so much now that I didn't want anyone to feel like I was just ignoring them and the requests for this ingredient.
alvin1
Well-known member
How come they don t want you to use the name? Because it will decrease their sell? In Canada the only compagny using it can put humanofort on the bottle, this is really a strange situation. Maybe you can make smaller run and add another ingredient to it, like Labrada do it and you can have sell for anabolicminds members that know about the fact that is is real humanofort.
Labrada humanogrowth does not mention humanofort in the front of the bottle, but the ingredient panel say humanofort.
Labrada humanogrowth does not mention humanofort in the front of the bottle, but the ingredient panel say humanofort.
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sns8778
Board Sponsor
I agree that it is a really strange situation. Terribly frustrating.
It's not about whether we add another ingredient to it, that part doesn't matter. I don't care about naming the product itself Humanofort. I'm fine with not putting in on the bottles or even the marketing materials.
I would be fine if I could just honestly give an answer like:
- It's the exact same thing as Humanofort, we just aren't allowed to call it that.
- It's the exact same ingredient, we just can't call it by the Humanofort name. 4
^^^ you would think either of those answers should be fine.
What I'm not okay with is being told that we can't answer if we are asked if it's Humanofort. Think about the situation that puts us in - 1) I don't want to lie. 2) If I tell you it isn't Humanofort, the natural next question is how does it compare to Humanofort. There's no way I could honestly answer that without saying that its the same as Humanofort, we just don't use the branded name. This is where a lot of companies would just throw their own branded name to it and market it as being better than Humanofort or something and move on but thats just not the way we do things.
alvin1
Well-known member
In my view and need, I really like humanofort product, but if it is to complicated to hop around with them I will tell them to F*** up you have other thing to concentrate on. Plus I don t think it would be a great seller as people have their hope to high with it and the study reference use minimun 300 mg per day that make the product to expensive. I use 100 mg per day and it cost me around 30 Canadian dollar. This for me is good price range for the benefit I got from using it. at 300 mg per day it would be 90 per month, at that price I would only be able to use this product, and I dout it can replace what I am using with it at the moment like testbooster and natty anabolic.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
That's kind of where I am but in a nicer way haha. We have so many new products coming out and so many great relationships with branded ingredient suppliers that want us to use their ingredients, its hard to justify the situation with using this.
And, like you said, it is a very high cost ingredient to offer and it may not sell well, especially at first, because in the past some companies really over hyped it and created some unrealistic expectations.
I do like the ingredient though and if we are ever able to offer it and be transparent about it, we likely will. Like I said, I don't care about using the branded name on anything, I just want to be able to answer honestly if asked.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
The new Lean Edge formula is very comprehensive. It contains 15 high end active ingredients including 6 licensed branded ingredients.
MitoBurn is a very expensive ingredient and just wouldn't fit in the formula in terms of price. It may be a good ingredient but was it worth sacrificing 1/2 to 1/3 of the formula to make it fit? No way.
When ingredients are as expensive as MitoBurn, it doesn't allow them much room to really be used in very comprehensive formulas like Lean Edge. So you'll normally either see them by themselves or as an ingredient in simpler less expensive formulas.
I hope that makes sense.
And don't worry, if you like MitoBurn, you'll be happy soon
NutButter
Member
The new Lean Edge formula is very comprehensive. It contains 15 high end active ingredients including 6 licensed branded ingredients.
MitoBurn is a very expensive ingredient and just wouldn't fit in the formula in terms of price. It may be a good ingredient but was it worth sacrificing 1/2 to 1/3 of the formula to make it fit? No way.
When ingredients are as expensive as MitoBurn, it doesn't allow them much room to really be used in very comprehensive formulas like Lean Edge. So you'll normally either see them by themselves or as an ingredient in simpler less expensive formulas.
I hope that makes sense.
And don't worry, if you like MitoBurn, you'll be happy soon
Is mitoburn going to be in Metabolic Xtreme?
sns8778
Board Sponsor
No, it won't be in Metabolic Xtreme. It's kind of the same situation with Metabolic Xtreme in that the formula will be so comprehensive, it will be hard to fit something as expensive as MitoBurn in it without losing a lot of other ingredients.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
A fat burner we've mentioned doing a few times in the past.
The problem with every single version we've had quoted is that its been too expensive to be feasible.
I think we finally have a version that is feasible to do now.
Thermagize XT - The Ultimate 1 Capsule Fat Burning Energizer
Lean Edge - Clinical Strength Stimulant Free Fat Burner
Metabolic Xtreme - Stimulant Fat Burner for Clean Energy and Fat Loss (and great for those that Thermagize XT is too strong for).
We will be using MitoBurn in something though, just not that.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
Optimize-T formula has been complete and its in production.
Anacyclus labels have been done and its in production as well.
cubsfan815
Well-known member
Getting to Pine Pollen and the new Lean Edge... I'm starting to fall way behind on new releases lol
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cubsfan815
Well-known member
Yeah the price on a 2 pack of Trib was hard to pass. I've never really responded to Trib that I know of... but figured why not stack with M-Test and Pine Pollen. Definitely can't hurthaha its hard to keep up
look at that sexy OG trib
sns8778
Board Sponsor
It is definitely too expensive to use in formulas. We had thought about doing it as a single ingredient, but Swanson already offers it so its hard to compete with them on that.
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I like Tribulus for libido purposes. It would make a helluva combination with Pine Pollen for that, specially if already using M-Test. I hope that you have a partner prepared for how I think that stack will go haha.
Jiigzz
Legend
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N2ofusion
Active member
Thank you for acknowledging that. I remember some company on here selling innoslim for $40 a bottle and there was consistently no response when I pointed out that Swanson had it for $15.
alvin1
Well-known member
And if my reading and comprehension skill is correct Shialjit does everything that Robuvit does but at a better price. Am I correct?
sns8778
Board Sponsor
PrimaVie is definitely a better price per dose than Robuvit and in my opinions does a better variety of different things.
I'd have to look back and read over everything again to say it does everything, but if not everything, most.
AndroRage
Well-known member
Is Optimize-T going to be a similar product to M-Test or specifically for libido? Sorry if I missed whats it’s addressed for but sure I read it’s for libido whilst M-Test is more for actual Testosterone boosting?
sns8778
Board Sponsor
I wish I could find where I wrote the very well thought out answer on Optimize-T. I'm normally pretty well spoken but today is one of those days I have a headache so this may come out less articulate than I'd like haha.
M-Test is a great natural testosterone booster for increasing levels of both free and total testosterone as well as supporting libido, improved sense of well-being, and more.
Optimize-T will not just be for libido; it will be a natural testosterone booster and libido enhancer as well.
We started teasing the name Optimize-T years ago but what took us so long to come out with it was that M-Test is such a great and comprehensive natural testosterone booster, that we had to find a way to not compete with it. Even though Optimize-T will be a natural testosterone booster and libido enhancer, it will be completely different than M-Test.
There are so many natural testosterone boosting ingredients that no one product could contain them all, especially not at efficacious dosages. So that's where the products will be distinguished from one another. There will be a slight overlap, but for the most part Optimize-T will contain some things that M-Test doesn't have, just like M-Test will contain some things Optimize-T won't have. Some people will like one better and some will like the other better; and I'd bet that some people will respond to one better, and some people will respond to the other better.
Here's one example I can give of the distinction - KSM66 and Mucuna Pruriens are loved by most people, but there are some people that are very sensitive to them and get sleep from them, so they may not like them. For the people that love them, M-Test contains both at great dosages. But for the people that don't, Optimize-T doesn't have them.
But one cool thing is that they can be stacked if you want to.
I'll drop one more hint on Optimize-T - EVERY single ingredient in Optimize-T is a licensed, branded ingredient
sns8778
Board Sponsor
@The Solution asked in another thread a moment ago about the status of the daily use ergogenic. We have a formula done for that. We had it done, then tweaked something that caused more of a flavor change than expected so we had to redo some flavor samples. I'm still open to ideas though - we could potentially still change it or the ideas could lead to a separate product. The SNS one is going to be VERY comprehensive so we could always look at doing one with less in it as a different product or under CEL.