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Can Boosting Immune System Stop Covid-19?

justhere4comm said:
Invalid Link Removed
No, he's quoted. It's dangerous to go on national television and tout this to people.

I would say this about anyone doing so.
I provided a quote, and a response by the Pres. of the AMA.

I'm sorry, you seem upset and tangental regarding my support for legalizing all drugs, and are using my words as such to show it's ok for the President of the United States to say it's ok to take them to treat a condition it was not tested for. There is a vast difference in meaning.

I wanted to use Marijuana for my mother and father's cancer so they could stop taking the Morphine which was causing horrible side effects and a quality of life that was unacceptable, and it was prescribed by Doctors. Again, a big difference.

We are in a pandemic, and it's a serious problem that requires serious people.

It's clear I think the President is a reckless and selfish person that has not once done anything without some sort of angle to profit himself, and it is also my opinion he is pushing this drug for selfish reasons. He doesn't care about life and death because he is a Malignant Narcissist. Not capable of empathy.

Why can't you see it is what troubles me more?
He deserved to be impeached and removed from office. The evidence was clear and the GOP failed their oath.

Edit.
I think Pence would have done the right thing! Early, and we'd probably be in a better place.
Click to expand...
I typically stay out of all this political stuff, and so that’s not my angle in this post, but some of your posts just come off as hateful and not helpful. I think we all want what’s best for our country and it’s people, so can’t we just figure that out without trash talking or name calling?

And this goes for everyone. Both sides come off as hateful while digging there heels in against the opposite group regardless of issue (except HIT4ME, maybe a few others but HIT4ME is always level headed that I’ve seen).
If we all could make an agreement to truly ask ourselves “is what I’m about to post actually helpful?” before we post, we might be able to see the opposite person’s point of view a little clearer and actually accomplish something.
 
This thread took a baffling turn overnight it seems.

Hydroxychloroquine is of course potentially dangerous. It's a drug for a reason. I don't think anyone is saying go take it for the hell of it, but I think people that are diagnosed positive for Covid-19 should certainly have the option to use it because the results look promising.

I don't understand the double standard of thinking recreational drug use should be legalized but then saying that a potentially life saving drug in some cases should not be taken.

It baffles me how this has become about politics. Sadly, I think we live in an age where bashing everything Trump does is just the norm. This is an unprecedented event and there's not like there is/was a playbook of exactly what to do or how to handle it. In hindsight, almost any situation could be handled better but when going through it, people (including Presidents) have to make the best decision they can with the information they have at the time. For example, if they had done some type of quarantine before cases starting popping up to prevent things, there would have been conspiracy theories abounding and people throwing a fit. But now that they waited, people say they waited too long. It's a no win situation and most of the time people manage to bash or praise almost any decision based on their want to further their desire to like or dislike politician XYZ.

And I absolutely agree with what GreenMachineX posted in that people should ask themselves 'Is what I'm about to post actually helpful?'. I've always tried to ask myself that before posting ever since I've been a member here (10+ years).
 
HCQ is a malaria drug primarily (also used for Lupus and other autoimmune diseases) for decades and millions of doses. All drug have side effects but this is a well studied and tolerated drug. The course is 5 days for Covid at fairly low doses. But the leftists, TDS’ers will bash it because of Trump. Sick stuff to be honest. I see this crap all over Reddit and the /coronavirus thread has turned into /politics (which is all TDS’ers)....its a sad state of affairs.
 
BBiceps said:
My cousin is recovering from corona, felt like death for 10-12 days but feeling a lot better now and recover more for every day. He’s 40, in great shape, eats well and working out a lot, but, he runs a nightclub in Miami...

Social distances is the best way to avoid getting sick, so guys, please be careful and avoid contact with other ppl as much as you can. Stay safe!
Click to expand...
Wow,
That's really great news in this situation. Stay home, be safe!
 
dallasboy22 said:
HCQ is a malaria drug primarily (also used for Lupus and other autoimmune diseases) for decades and millions of doses. All drug have side effects but this is a well studied and tolerated drug. The course is 5 days for Covid at fairly low doses. But the leftists, TDS’ers will bash it because of Trump. Sick stuff to be honest. I see this crap all over Reddit and the /coronavirus thread has turned into /politics (which is all TDS’ers)....its a sad state of affairs.
Click to expand...
What does TDS mean?
 
HIT4ME said:
But how do you take the stance all drugs should be legal and then bash a president for pushing an unproven treatment that SCIENTISTS have proposed will work - to be used by doctors (per your article - he is pushing HEALTH OFFICIALS to make it available). By your logic and mine, we should all have access anyway so what is the harm in Trump making it more accessible to professionals?
Click to expand...

I agree with you, but the President really needs to clarify that people should trust and work with their physicians. There are a lot of people that trust the President more than medical experts, so they're going to turn to other ways to access the drug if their doctor tells them that they either don't have COVID-19 or the drug isn't right for them. We've already seen it in this forum where people will set up online loopholes to get the drug without the correct medical supervision and that's where trouble can occur. Personally I'm fine with people taking whatever they want and the consequences are on them, but these aren't people that are going to typically search for scientific data to backup their choice.
 
GreenMachineX said:
I typically stay out of all this political stuff, and so that’s not my angle in this post, but some of your posts just come off as hateful and not helpful. I think we all want what’s best for our country and it’s people, so can’t we just figure that out without trash talking or name calling?

And this goes for everyone. Both sides come off as hateful while digging there heels in against the opposite group regardless of issue (except HIT4ME, maybe a few others but HIT4ME is always level headed that I’ve seen).
If we all could make an agreement to truly ask ourselves “is what I’m about to post actually helpful?” before we post, we might be able to see the opposite person’s point of view a little clearer and actually accomplish something.
Click to expand...

Thank you for calling me level headed and I appreciate that - but I will also admit I've gone too far at times too. No one is perfect, I get that.

And I'm not trying to bash Justhere4comm - I DO value his input and he has had some really helpful stuff he has posted on here. He seems to me to be a very caring person and while we are on opposite ends of the political spectrum - that's cool. It's good to have those discussions and people disagreeing is fine.

But it just boils down to blaming and hating Trump - and I am hoping he can see that.

I mean, the main point here is I was trying to point out that Hydroxychloroquine may not be working. This isn't an idea that Trump came up with. It has little to do with Trump other than he heard it was being hypothesized as a possible help and he pushed to get it approved for use in the face of no other solutions. We all know it's unproven. We wouldn't even be using it in hospitals right now without his support because the FDA isn't about to fast-track things. As the article stated, in a derogatory manner toward Trump, it quotes a doctor saying, "this is highly unusual". Well, feck yeah. Are we only going to take the "normal actions" for this highly unusual situation while people are dying? Should we not be trying things because they may not work? Hydroxychloroquine is unproven, sure. It has side effects, sure. It also has clinical data in humans and years of use showing us how to manage those issues and what to expect for safety margins in humans.

But ultimately, whether it works or does not - what really does that have to do with Trump?

Aleksandar37 said:
I agree with you, but the President really needs to clarify that people should trust and work with their physicians. There are a lot of people that trust the President more than medical experts, so they're going to turn to other ways to access the drug if their doctor tells them that they either don't have COVID-19 or the drug isn't right for them. We've already seen it in this forum where people will set up online loopholes to get the drug without the correct medical supervision and that's where trouble can occur. Personally I'm fine with people taking whatever they want and the consequences are on them, but these aren't people that are going to typically search for scientific data to backup their choice.
Click to expand...

Dang. You agree with me? That's not even any fun! haha.

And what really sucks is I agree with you too - I think the president can say some stupid stuff, or at least he could say things better so his actual meaning is communicated better. And I think anyone listening to Trump for medical advice over their doctors is pretty foolish.

One of the issues with humans too, is we all know what we know but have no clue what we don't know. This makes us all think we are smarter than we are - and I can agree that if we think we are experts in Covid because we read it in the paper, and everyone is saying HCQ is working - then there are going to be people who do dumb things.

Resolve10 said:
Still working on this, but find myself thinking it through in my head a lot lately then just moving on. :)
Click to expand...

You are probably better than I am. GreenmachineX raises an excellent point and I have tried to practice this as well, but practice is the key word. I could be a lot better too. I have had times where I have typed out really long posts and then realized...what's the point? Which is one of the benefits of me being so long winded - it takes me enough time to write a post that sometimes it's just long enough for me to realize it isn't necessary. But...I'm pretty slow other times. haha.

Still, I don't think he means that every post has to have meaning - some of the benefit of this board is the brotherhood and just being able to talk.
 
Our blood centers are putting this message out:
(Check with yours to see if they are doing something similar)

Please share! 🩸

If anyone knows anyone who has tested positive for Covid-19 AND has recovered please let me know! SunCoast Blood Centers is in search of donors who have FULLY RECOVERED from the virus. We can create convalescent plasma for treatment of other local critically ill patients!

Transfusing the convalescent plasma that contains antibodies into a person still fighting the virus can provide a boost to the patient’s immune system and potentially help them recover. Early indications are promising for this to be and effective treatment in the most critical cases of COVID-19 infections.

If you know anyone have them contact me, [email protected]
 
I laugh seeing how the abuse of supplements, lol , now carries over to crazy pointless dosing of vitamins. That is the entertainment, not the politics.
 
mase1 said:
I laugh seeing how the abuse of supplements, lol , now carries over to crazy pointless dosing of vitamins. That is the entertainment, not the politics.
Click to expand...
Please describe the abuse of vitamins you see in here...

All we are trying to do is give our immune systems a fighting chance against this thing...
 
HIT4ME said:
Thank you for calling me level headed and I appreciate that - but I will also admit I've gone too far at times too. No one is perfect, I get that.

And I'm not trying to bash Justhere4comm - I DO value his input and he has had some really helpful stuff he has posted on here. He seems to me to be a very caring person and while we are on opposite ends of the political spectrum - that's cool. It's good to have those discussions and people disagreeing is fine.

But it just boils down to blaming and hating Trump - and I am hoping he can see that.

I mean, the main point here is I was trying to point out that Hydroxychloroquine may not be working. This isn't an idea that Trump came up with. It Still, I don't think he means that every post has to have meaning - some of the benefit of this board is the brotherhood and just being able to talk.
Click to expand...
mase1 said:
I laugh seeing how the abuse of supplements, lol , now carries over to crazy pointless dosing of vitamins. That is the entertainment, not the politics.
Click to expand...
Are you referring to the vitamin C megadosing and getting vitamin D levels optimal?
 
GreenMachineX said:
Are you referring to the vitamin C megadosing and getting vitamin D levels optimal?
Click to expand...

He certainly can't be talking about Vitamin D - it's not a vitamin...so we can eliminate that from his targets.
 
I realize supplement site that is why I laugh. I love the supplements as much as anyone. Carry on with your regiment if that keeps you feeling safer.
 
mase1 said:
I realize supplement site that is why I laugh. I love the supplements as much as anyone. Carry on with your regiment if that keeps you feeling safer.
Click to expand...
Guess I don't get the joke. People in a supp forum talking supps haha? What's your plan doc?
 
Actually science has not shown a healthy immune system to be the main problem. It is underlying health conditions and age. The obvious issues being obesity and diabetes. Unfortunately carrying alot of muscle mass is also a concern. The younger patients that have been very sick or died by me appear to be juiced up. I'm in south Florida.
 
mase1 said:
Actually science has not shown a healthy immune system to be the main problem. It is underlying health conditions and age. The obvious issues being obesity and diabetes. Unfortunately carrying alot of muscle mass is also a concern. The younger patients that have been very sick or died by me appear to be juiced up. I'm in south Florida.
Click to expand...

Actually, using that logic, science has shown that obesity and diabetes aren't the main or obvious issues either. Contact with the virus is.
 
Thank you for bringing that logic to the table. You are correct life span for either obese/ diabetic/ juice head is lower regardless of virus.
 
So diet, exercise and healthy choices increase your chances for favourable outcomes but yet you find it funny people are discussing how to improve those odds?
 
mase1 said:
Thank you for bringing that logic to the table. You are correct life span for either obese/ diabetic/ juice head is lower regardless of virus.
Click to expand...

Ummm, you missed something I think...haha
 
ironkill said:
So diet, exercise and healthy choices increase your chances for favourable outcomes but yet you find it funny people are discussing how to improve those odds?
Click to expand...
I do not think anyone is even taking about health lifestyle and choices. Whole point I have always enjoyed the posts of check out my supplement stash, now it has become check out my vitamin/ mineral/ greens/ probiotic stash. Having fun, I want everyone to be safe and return to normalcy. Maybe sitting here being thankful as a exercise physiologist I did not go the hospital route. But thankful for those on the healthcare team.
 
Taking supps that have shown to minimize illness or reduce recovery time doesn't equate to a healthy lifestyle. Now I'm laughing. Anyway stay safe dude
 
Its funny you go on vacation to a tropical environment with mosquitoes and your doctor prescribes you hydroxycloriquine, but if your dying of COVID-19 its dangerous and reckless to take it. Pathetic
 
Its funny you go on vacation to a tropical environment with mosquitoes and your doctor prescribes you hydroxycloriquine, but if your dying of COVID-19 its dangerous and reckless to take it. Pathetic
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Go for it!
I'm all for anyone that wants to take it, should be able to take it.
Trump should take it, he's the President and should protect himself right?

Ignore this.
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justhere4comm said:
Go for it!
I'm all for anyone that wants to take it, should be able to take it.
Trump should take it, he's the President and should protect himself right?

Ignore this.
Invalid Link Removed
Click to expand...
Your doing it again man. You want Trump to take the medicine for lethal side effects? Seriously?
 
GreenMachineX said:
Your doing it again man. You want Trump to take the medicine for lethal side effects? Seriously?
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You've helped me make my point.
No. I don't want anyone to take it.

I support anyone who wants to however.
Down vote me all you want. You guys realize that doesn't mean anything right?
 
justhere4comm said:
You've helped me make my point.
No. I don't want anyone to take it.

I support anyone who wants to however.
Down vote me all you want. You guys realize that doesn't mean anything right?
Click to expand...
Just stop being snotty man. Your delivery on most of your posts is terrible and just causes others to throw up defenses. I know your intelligent, and I know you know it doesn’t work. Do you want people to see your point of view? If so, then don’t insinuate for the president to take a medicine and have lethal side effects as an example. Again, ask yourself if what your about to post is helpful. Banter is one thing, your choices are something different.
 
GreenMachineX said:
Just stop being snotty man. Your delivery on most of your posts is terrible and just causes others to throw up defenses. I know your intelligent, and I know you know it doesn’t work. Do you want people to see your point of view? If so, then don’t insinuate for the president to take a medicine and have lethal side effects as an example. Again, ask yourself if what your about to post is helpful. Banter is one thing, your choices are something different.
Click to expand...

Funny, but posters like 567 don't even raise your eyebrows... 'pathetic'.
I, on the other hand seem to attract the intense ire. (Mob rules I guess).
 
justhere4comm said:
Funny, but posters like 567 don't even raise your eyebrows... 'pathetic'.
I, on the other hand seem to attract the intense ire. (Mob rules I guess).
Click to expand...
Actually, his post is along the same lines and not helpful either, but he’s not talking about having a man die by taking a drug. Do you not see the difference?

Do you really need me to call out everyone who posted an inappropriate post? Well, that’s me too! I’ve posted horrible things over the years, tons of things that weren’t helpful and even hurtful. But there’s also another difference. Your voice is louder, and you have far more posts around here than him. So, again, I’ll ask, do you want any of us to see your point of view?
 
GreenMachineX said:
Actually, his post is along the same lines and not helpful either, but he’s not talking about having a man die by taking a drug. Do you not see the difference?

Do you really need me to call out everyone who posted an inappropriate post? Well, that’s me too! I’ve posted horrible things over the years, tons of things that weren’t helpful and even hurtful. But there’s also another difference. Your voice is louder, and you have far more posts around here than him. So, again, I’ll ask, do you want any of us to see your point of view?
Click to expand...

I've made it more than clear, I don't want anyone taking a drug that may kill them.
That was my point, which you seem to be side-stepping in order to paint some kind of point.

I was responding to someone that could not care less about my post.
A secondary realization here is: I'm the only voice here saying something contrary to popular opinion. Stockpiling the drug by the government seems a bit pretentious and rushed. Why?

In a tertiary realization, my wife just expressed her hospital is in trials for that; another drug; and the plasma replacement therapy which is more promising than any drug treatment. She's in charge of administering tests and results for the area.

Maybe my emotions are a bit wound up as well because I constantly worry for her.
I'm not sure. A little sensitive as you are I'm sure, along with others in here.

Let's just leave it at that for now.
Regards
-M
 
@justhere4comm Not sidestepping nor painting a picture; that was truly how your post came off (or how I misinterpreted). Not that I believe you really wanted him dead, but it came off pretty rough and the after post just seemed like coverup, and if I’m wrong about that, I apologize.

Moving on to this...
Invalid Link Removed

and...

Invalid Link Removed

I haven’t finished the first link, but the discussions about ascorbic acid are very interesting. The second discusses that maybe more red blood cells are the answer, but better for everyone to read themselves so I don’t misquote.

Also calling @HIT4ME
 
There are cardiac sides that are considered too dangerous for seriously ill patients.

A small trial finds that hydroxychloroquine is not effective for treating coronavirus. (April 3)
Invalid Link Removed


Coronavirus: "we have already had to stop treatment" of hydroxychloroquine-azithromycin at the CHU in Nice
(April 7)
Invalid Link Removed

Professor Émile Ferrari heads the cardiology department at the Pasteur hospital in Nice. He returned to the hydroxychloroquine-azithromycin association in the context of severe forms of Covid-19.

The CHU de Nice, like other establishments, is testing the hydroxychloroquine-azithromycin combination in patients hospitalized with severe forms of Covid-19. How are these patients followed from a cardiological point of view?
"We have set up a 7/7 and H24 monitoring method; all the Covid sectors of the Nice University Hospital send us the patient's ECG [electrocardiogram, ed] recordings. We interpret them live and report anomalies to them which predispose to toxicity. And which then require a cessation of treatment. "

Has this ever happened?
"Yes, from the start of the trial. Thanks to this ECG follow-up, we highlighted the major risks of a very serious accident in a patient, and the treatment was immediately stopped."

How is this toxic risk on the heart explained?
"The cells of the heart have a spontaneous electrical activity, which makes it possible to generate the cardiac contraction. This activation happens a little like an alternating current with a phase of contraction and a phase of recovery. These phases are ordered and successive. or certain conditions can desynchronize these phases. It can then cause chaos, a big disorder in the electric current of the cells of the heart with a risk of "short circuit"; the heart rate is racing, it is disordered, which does not allows the heart muscle to be more efficient. The subsequent drop in blood flow then causes dizziness, malaise, syncope ... up to cardiac arrest which are the translation of serious arrhythmias. "

Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin are widely prescribed despite these risks ...
"When hydroxychloroquine is given on its own, the cardiac risk is very low. On the other hand, the antibiotic (azithromycin) which is systematically prescribed in combination with hydroxychloroquine in the anti-Covid protocol also favors these anomalies. The cardiological risk is then potentiated, a fortiori, if there are other associated drugs which have the same undesirable effect, if the oxygenation of the blood is not done well or even if the potassium in the blood is low. Also, these drugs, if prescribed, must be with a monitoring of the ECG at D0 and D2 minimum. "

Your personal opinion on this cocktail?
"It is true that Covid-19 kills, but the remedy should not be more harmful than the disease itself in patients whose spontaneous evolution is favorable and in particular in ambulatory patients."


Pr Emile Ferrari, head of the cardiology department of the Nice University Hospital. Photo DR

Who to believe?
hydroxychloroquine is made by a small pharma company in France.

--

I hope they come up with something promising soon because the mortality rate in the USA
I've sen it go to 2.4 to 2.7, and now 3.2% with 400k infected and 12,800 deaths. This entire
stay at home process appears to be taking it's own toll on many.
 
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GreenMachineX said:
@justhere4comm Not sidestepping nor painting a picture; that was truly how your post came off (or how I misinterpreted). Not that I believe you really wanted him dead, but it came off pretty rough and the after post just seemed like coverup, and if I’m wrong about that, I apologize.

Moving on to this...
Invalid Link Removed

and...

Invalid Link Removed

I haven’t finished the first link, but the discussions about ascorbic acid are very interesting. The second discusses that maybe more red blood cells are the answer, but better for everyone to read themselves so I don’t misquote.

Also calling @HIT4ME
Click to expand...
That ascorbic acid discussion link also mentions that quercetin might mess up ascorbic acid effectiveness. I found this:
Invalid Link Removed
Am I reading this right, that quercetin might in fact be a negative for megadosing vitamin C?

@HIT4ME
 
GreenMachineX said:
That ascorbic acid discussion link also mentions that quercetin might mess up ascorbic acid effectiveness. I found this:
Invalid Link Removed
Am I reading this right, that quercetin might in fact be a negative for megadosing vitamin C?
Click to expand...

I don't believe that study has a relationship to mega dosing Vitamin C, but if one is a healthy rat; non-diabetic, then it may be more advisable to take the vitamin C on an empty stomach, and an hour or so before any supplementation with quercetin.

Unless the concern is hyperglycemia in which case it would be a non-issue.
 
What about the Lupus expert, Dr. Daniel Wallace...he says the drug is safe...s

So why should we listen to the liberal media CNN, MSNBC, and all those clowns..?
 
They will say anything to make Trump look bad...its fvcking disgusting
 
I hope they come up with something promising soon because the mortality rate in the USA
I've sen it go to 2.4 to 2.7, and now 3.2% with 400k infected and 12,800 deaths. This entire
stay at home process appears to be taking it's own toll on many.
Click to expand...
When the serology tests are finished and the infected ends up being in the millions you will see the death rate drop big time. A good chunk of the deaths classified as Corona deaths are from other causes but because the person tested positive that is counted.

If I get covid and have a bad case I'll be taking z-pack which i have taken many times and hydroxycloriquine which is taken by the millions each year. Not a political decision. Its sick people are rooting for this drug to fail
 
Invalid Link Removed

  • How is his seeing 800 patients since September of 2019 mean anything?
  • How many since January 2020? Is it vastly different? Why did he reference 2019?
  • Patient 1 wasn't until much later than that in the USA. January 15, I believe.
  • Is he saying they were exposed but did not get it?
  • Or, if they were exposed, they would not get it?
  • There is a fallacy in his thinking, and it is a false correlation.
I can't take this seriously. Especially after the trials in France have stopped due to cadiac issues.
 
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Yes, so should we listen Anderson Copper and Wolf Blitzer....or the world renown Lupus doctor?
 
justhere4comm said:
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That's the video I found too and isn't him saying it's safe. We don't know the safety because the trials haven't been run yet. It also takes a proven medication away from lupus patients, which Dr. Wallace did comment on:

"An estimated 70 to 80 percent of lupus patients in the U.S. are taking hydroxychloroquine, Dr. Daniel J. Wallace, a board-certified rheumatologist and co-founder of a lupus foundation in Los Angeles, Lupus LA, told Fox News. He said many of his patients are also experiencing difficulty in getting the much-needed medication.

“There are backorders of Plaquenil. Many of my patients who get a three-month supply are now only given a one-month supply. Among those who are getting any at all, they’re not always getting their full order,” he said.

In LA specifically, “Pharmacies are back-ordering and there are a few pharmacies that are putting some of the drugs aside for patients who are good patients and know they have lupus," he added. "For those with new prescriptions, I have been asked by a few pharmacies to write a note to document that a patient really has lupus."


So no, don't get medical advice from CNN or MSNBC, but also don't get it from Fox either. Listen to physicians and researchers who don't spend their time on television speaking outside of their expertise.
 
justhere4comm said:
I've made it more than clear, I don't want anyone taking a drug that may kill them.
That was my point, which you seem to be side-stepping in order to paint some kind of point.

I was responding to someone that could not care less about my post.
A secondary realization here is: I'm the only voice here saying something contrary to popular opinion. Stockpiling the drug by the government seems a bit pretentious and rushed. Why?

In a tertiary realization, my wife just expressed her hospital is in trials for that; another drug; and the plasma replacement therapy which is more promising than any drug treatment. She's in charge of administering tests and results for the area.

Maybe my emotions are a bit wound up as well because I constantly worry for her.
I'm not sure. A little sensitive as you are I'm sure, along with others in here.

Let's just leave it at that for now.
Regards
-M
Click to expand...

As always, I hope your wife continues to be well and stays safe brother.

I am not sure what your issue is exactly - lots of drugs have these issues, and that is why we have safety studies and medical supervision.

No one is saying it is 100% safe without any risk. Even Trump isn't saying that. He is saying in the extreme case that someone has this untreatable disease, with no other options, it is worth a shot.

It sounds questionable and I think we all hope they find something sooner than later.

GreenMachineX said:
@justhere4comm Not sidestepping nor painting a picture; that was truly how your post came off (or how I misinterpreted). Not that I believe you really wanted him dead, but it came off pretty rough and the after post just seemed like coverup, and if I’m wrong about that, I apologize.

Moving on to this...
Invalid Link Removed

and...

Invalid Link Removed

I haven’t finished the first link, but the discussions about ascorbic acid are very interesting. The second discusses that maybe more red blood cells are the answer, but better for everyone to read themselves so I don’t misquote.

Also calling @HIT4ME
Click to expand...

I haven't had enough time to dig into the first one but the second study was linked on another thread and it seems to be entirely conjecture with no references, etc. It is interesting and who knows if it is right or wrong - but it is hypothesis with no evidence that I am aware of.

Still - the scientific method needs hypothesis to get started.

justhere4comm said:
There are cardiac sides that are considered too dangerous for seriously ill patients.

A small trial finds that hydroxychloroquine is not effective for treating coronavirus. (April 3)
Invalid Link Removed


Coronavirus: "we have already had to stop treatment" of hydroxychloroquine-azithromycin at the CHU in Nice
(April 7)
Invalid Link Removed

Professor Émile Ferrari heads the cardiology department at the Pasteur hospital in Nice. He returned to the hydroxychloroquine-azithromycin association in the context of severe forms of Covid-19.

The CHU de Nice, like other establishments, is testing the hydroxychloroquine-azithromycin combination in patients hospitalized with severe forms of Covid-19. How are these patients followed from a cardiological point of view?
"We have set up a 7/7 and H24 monitoring method; all the Covid sectors of the Nice University Hospital send us the patient's ECG [electrocardiogram, ed] recordings. We interpret them live and report anomalies to them which predispose to toxicity. And which then require a cessation of treatment. "

Has this ever happened?
"Yes, from the start of the trial. Thanks to this ECG follow-up, we highlighted the major risks of a very serious accident in a patient, and the treatment was immediately stopped."

How is this toxic risk on the heart explained?
"The cells of the heart have a spontaneous electrical activity, which makes it possible to generate the cardiac contraction. This activation happens a little like an alternating current with a phase of contraction and a phase of recovery. These phases are ordered and successive. or certain conditions can desynchronize these phases. It can then cause chaos, a big disorder in the electric current of the cells of the heart with a risk of "short circuit"; the heart rate is racing, it is disordered, which does not allows the heart muscle to be more efficient. The subsequent drop in blood flow then causes dizziness, malaise, syncope ... up to cardiac arrest which are the translation of serious arrhythmias. "

Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin are widely prescribed despite these risks ...
"When hydroxychloroquine is given on its own, the cardiac risk is very low. On the other hand, the antibiotic (azithromycin) which is systematically prescribed in combination with hydroxychloroquine in the anti-Covid protocol also favors these anomalies. The cardiological risk is then potentiated, a fortiori, if there are other associated drugs which have the same undesirable effect, if the oxygenation of the blood is not done well or even if the potassium in the blood is low. Also, these drugs, if prescribed, must be with a monitoring of the ECG at D0 and D2 minimum. "

Your personal opinion on this cocktail?
"It is true that Covid-19 kills, but the remedy should not be more harmful than the disease itself in patients whose spontaneous evolution is favorable and in particular in ambulatory patients."


Pr Emile Ferrari, head of the cardiology department of the Nice University Hospital. Photo DR

Who to believe?
hydroxychloroquine is made by a small pharma company in France.

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I hope they come up with something promising soon because the mortality rate in the USA
I've sen it go to 2.4 to 2.7, and now 3.2% with 400k infected and 12,800 deaths. This entire
stay at home process appears to be taking it's own toll on many.
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Yeah, it does seem like we in the US are getting hit hard, which is one thing to hypothesize before it happens when you see the risks, but to see it actually happening is sobering.

GreenMachineX said:
That ascorbic acid discussion link also mentions that quercetin might mess up ascorbic acid effectiveness. I found this:
Invalid Link Removed
Am I reading this right, that quercetin might in fact be a negative for megadosing vitamin C?

@HIT4ME
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This is interesting but I am not sure we can draw too much from it for actual use - once vitamin C is absorbed it gets quickly metabolized. Being a non-competitive inhibitor, perhaps the slowed absorption would actually create a longer presence in circulation because it slows metabolism. But this is just me trying to come up with good and bad...I would have to find more studies if they exist. It could be good or bad though ultimately. Interesting enough that I will try to research it as I have time.
 
manifesto said:
Yes, so should we listen Anderson Copper and Wolf Blitzer....or the world renown Lupus doctor?
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You found one physician who isn't an expert in virology and he said none of his patients have had COVID-19 yet. Great, but ask him if he believes in clinical trials. He works at Sinai so I can probably guess his answer.
 
HIT4ME said:
No one is saying it is 100% safe without any risk. Even Trump isn't saying that. He is saying in the extreme case that someone has this untreatable disease, with no other options, it is worth a shot.
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That's simply not true. Trump has said that it could be used as a preventative measure, which is being echoed on Fox by Dr. Oz.
 
justhere4comm said:
I can't take this seriously. Especially after the trials in France have stopped due to cadiac issues.
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Do you happen to know how long patients were on drug in that trial? It's concerning, but might not be an issue with COVID-19 patients who only need to take it acutely.
 
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