I'm on Phosphatidic acid Ya'll

Danes said:
I can bet 1000$ phospholipids (800mg)in KING v2 is nothing than soy lecithin powder. Soy Lecithin contains 4-7% PA. Which means 32mg-56mg PA per serving
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One of the, if not the, biggest selling point of concentrated PA supplements is how concentrated they are (typing that out seems obvious), so it seems logical that if Activator was even more concentrated than Mediator, that'd be a major selling point. I'm not saying that this is necessarily the case, and love to be convinced otherwise.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
One of the, if not the, biggest selling point of concentrated PA supplements is how concentrated they are (typing that out seems obvious), so it seems logical that if Activator was even more concentrated than Mediator, that'd be a major selling point. I'm not saying that this is necessarily the case, and love to be convinced otherwise.
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And that is 100% correct!!
If activator was 50% PA they would ofcourse "brag" of it. But since its plain Soy lecithin powder, they drop %.

People automaticaly believe its 750mg PA per serving as standard dose(like V1) and other PA Products. Very ****ty and tactical by Cutler Nutrition
 
Danes said:
And that is 100% correct!!
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Right now, if someone is looking for a PA supplement, the following is my recommendation:

-Soy lecithin (de-oiled and preferably standardized for a high phosphatide content). This lecithin is going to have 4-8% PA (based on multiple studies/papers, COAs, product specifications/info sheets, correspondence with producers/distributors of lecithin, etc). To ensure you are getting 750mg PA, calculate your dose with 4% (low range), so take 18.75g of the lecithin (about 2.5tbsp).

If you want to have (absolute) certainty you're getting 750mg PA, the next best option is TR1UMPH. It also has some nice extras that you may or may not need/want depending on what else you already take.

TR1UMPH also has the advantage of being powdered and flavored, which should make it much more enjoyable/tolerable than the granules are.

The only time I'd recommend a concentrated PA supplement are:
-Fasted training
-Very limited calorie diet
-Upset stomach from granules/powder
-Maximum convenience (caps)
-Money is a complete non-issue
 
muscleupcrohn said:
Right now, if someone is looking for a PA supplement, the following is my recommendation:

-Soy lecithin (de-oiled and preferably standardized for a high phosphatide content). This lecithin is going to have 4-8% PA (based on multiple studies/papers, COAs, product specifications/info sheets, correspondence with producers/distributors of lecithin, etc). To ensure you are getting 750mg PA, calculate your dose with 4% (low range), so take 18.75g of the lecithin (about 2.5tbsp).

If you want to have (absolute) certainty you're getting 750mg PA, the next best option is TR1UMPH. It also has some nice extras that you may or may not need/want depending on what else you already take.

TR1UMPH also has the advantage of being powdered and flavored, which should make it much more enjoyable/tolerable than the granules are.

The only time I'd recommend a concentrated PA supplement are:
-Fasted training
-Very limited calorie diet
-Upset stomach from granules/powder
-Maximum convenience (caps)
-Money is a complete non-issue
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Was just going to ask you what you thought about TR1UMPH.. But you answered that perfectly!! Cant wait for the release. The flavors are unreal!!
 
muscleupcrohn said:
Right now, if someone is looking for a PA supplement, the following is my recommendation:

-Soy lecithin (de-oiled and preferably standardized for a high phosphatide content). This lecithin is going to have 4-8% PA (based on multiple studies/papers, COAs, product specifications/info sheets, correspondence with producers/distributors of lecithin, etc). To ensure you are getting 750mg PA, calculate your dose with 4% (low range), so take 18.75g of the lecithin (about 2.5tbsp).

If you want to have (absolute) certainty you're getting 750mg PA, the next best option is TR1UMPH. It also has some nice extras that you may or may not need/want depending on what else you already take.

TR1UMPH also has the advantage of being powdered and flavored, which should make it much more enjoyable/tolerable than the granules are.

The only time I'd recommend a concentrated PA supplement are:
-Fasted training
-Very limited calorie diet
-Upset stomach from granules/powder
-Maximum convenience (caps)
-Money is a complete non-issue
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Tr1umph is very good product . No doubt about that.not only does it provide a good dose of PA but there are many other goodies which makes Tr1umph a VERY solid product :)

PA caps are also good when traveling too
 
I to have been using King V2 as a staple for months now and mainly because of the price. I took a break and used muscletech phosphamuscle for two bottles..I have been seeing kingv2 for 20 to 25 dollars a bottle and the price does make it attractive. However after reading dane post I spent some cash and ordered Tr1umph. I look forward to using it and especially with the free lj100 I get with it. After I use it for a month or so I will post my experience with it. Thanks Dane much appreciated
 
Starting back on PA after a break. My plan is 15g in morning pre-workout drink.

Any advantage to adding another 15g to my post-workout protein shake? Or just a waste of extra 15g?

Thanks.
 
Shin Sprints said:
Starting back on PA after a break. My plan is 15g in morning pre-workout drink.

Any advantage to adding another 15g to my post-workout protein shake? Or just a waste of extra 15g?

Thanks.
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I do 15g before and after. Better recovery and muscle fullness IMO
 
SuppJunkie said:
I to have been using King V2 as a staple for months now and mainly because of the price. I took a break and used muscletech phosphamuscle for two bottles..I have been seeing kingv2 for 20 to 25 dollars a bottle and the price does make it attractive. However after reading dane post I spent some cash and ordered Tr1umph. I look forward to using it and especially with the free lj100 I get with it. After I use it for a month or so I will post my experience with it. Thanks Dane much appreciated
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Any time bro :)
 
Shin Sprints said:
Starting back on PA after a break. My plan is 15g in morning pre-workout drink.

Any advantage to adding another 15g to my post-workout protein shake? Or just a waste of extra 15g?

Thanks.
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EDIT. I like it pre + post from my personal experience.

Check out Tr1umph for PA and much more.
 
Shin Sprints said:
Starting back on PA after a break. My plan is 15g in morning pre-workout drink.

Any advantage to adding another 15g to my post-workout protein shake? Or just a waste of extra 15g?

Thanks.
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There is a study as mentioned in some of the earlier threads that PA and leucine boosted mTOR but blunted muscle protein synthesis (MPS) if ingested within 3 hours of each other in rodents (so the carryover is questionable). Since Resistance training itself boosts MPS, I would assume any antagonism between PA and Leucine (whey) would be overwhelmed and what you get is massive mTOR boost and increased MPS. Of course all we have are anecdotal information...

Also another to note, the MPS was greater in rodents who took Whey alone than PA alone...So I wonder if simply a whey shake (leucine) pre and post workout would provide the same MPS results? Anyways again these are rats who are not resistance trained :) and muscle protein synthesis is not everything.
 
AKM007 said:
There is a study as mentioned in some of the earlier threads that PA and leucine boosted mTOR but blunted muscle protein synthesis (MPS) if ingested within 3 hours of each other in rodents (so the carryover is questionable). Since Resistance training itself boosts MPS, I would assume any antagonism between PA and Leucine (whey) would be overwhelmed and what you get is massive mTOR boost and increased MPS. Of course all we have are anecdotal information...

Also another to note, the MPS was greater in rodents who took Whey alone than PA alone...So I wonder if simply a whey shake (leucine) pre and post workout would provide the same MPS results? Anyways again these are rats who are not resistance trained :) and muscle protein synthesis is not everything.
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Given the results of the original PA study, and resulting lean mass gains, it is theorized (and probable) that protein gets diverted and used for satellite cell differentiation into muscle tissue.

Hence why leucine induced MPS in existing muscle tissue was "blunted" in the PA + whey group.
 
For those of you who take/have taken Cutler King... I see it has 4800IU of D3 in it. I usually take 5000IU of D3 daily anyone, I guess I can just stop that while Im on King... or is it a different type of D3? (sorry I know that probably sounds stupid, just want to check).

I workout in the morning. So thinking something like my creatine drink and King when I wake, with say a banana. Head to the gym and then have my Xfactor.
 
SpongeTom said:
For those of you who take/have taken Cutler King... I see it has 4800IU of D3 in it. I usually take 5000IU of D3 daily anyone, I guess I can just stop that while Im on King... or is it a different type of D3? (sorry I know that probably sounds stupid, just want to check).

I workout in the morning. So thinking something like my creatine drink and King when I wake, with say a banana. Head to the gym and then have my Xfactor.
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Yeah I would drop your 5000IU while taking King, there's no need to be taking that much. The D3 in King is cholecalciferol, which is a standard form, so you should be fine
 
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but do you guys think that taking 2-4 tbsp of Fearn's SL and using Focus XT would be way too much choline?
 
ws65 said:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but do you guys think that taking 2-4 tbsp of Fearn's SL and using Focus XT would be way too much choline?
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If you're running to the toilet post dosing, then yes.
 
No, not running to the toilet as I'm not taking either yet, lol...I have both and was worried about too much choline...if it is then the Focus XT will not be used
 
ws65 said:
No, not running to the toilet as I'm not taking either yet, lol...I have both and was worried about too much choline...if it is then the Focus XT will not be used
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FXT is hit or miss with GI issues for people. No way to know for sure without trying it.

I'm typically good on FXT as long as I use the stim free (the combo with caff gets me).

On the other hand, I can pound 5 tbsp of SL (which has more choline) and no problem. Likely because it is digested a lot slower.
 
My pre workout was a rounded scoop of FXT and three tablespoon SL and I had no issues.
 
ws65 said:
No, not running to the toilet as I'm not taking either yet, lol...I have both and was worried about too much choline...if it is then the Focus XT will not be used
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What flavor are you using? I think I recall people having GI issues with some of the flavors but not others. I am running PA+FXT right now with no GI issues luckily.
 
Hello,
I have been stalking this thread for a loong time, read it to about page 40, but can anyone tell me how to not **** out my intestines competely when doing SL granules? Is there any way like enzymes or something? Some tips please, I am very pleased with the pumps and increased performance but after 1-2 days on it must live in the bathroom:).
TY
G
 
BigGGG said:
Hello,
I have been stalking this thread for a loong time, read it to about page 40, but can anyone tell me how to not **** out my intestines competely when doing SL granules? Is there any way like enzymes or something? Some tips please, I am very pleased with the pumps and increased performance but after 1-2 days on it must live in the bathroom:).
TY
G
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You're only option would be a concentrated product probably. Maybe you could take smaller doses more often? Sort of like loading Sodium Bicarbonate for those with gastro issues with it?
 
Small doses more often? But shouldnt it be taken max 2 hours PWO? else I thought it would have no effect?I take it with my shake, might this be the mistake? Should I try a solid meal with the granules?
Ty again
 
BigGGG said:
Small doses more often? But shouldnt it be taken max 2 hours PWO? else I thought it would have no effect?I take it with my shake, might this be the mistake? Should I try a solid meal with the granules?
Ty again
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In an ideal world where you don't crap your brains out, sure. But we're trying to make granules work for you with gastro issues. In Wilson's study, he dosed 450mg with Breakfast, and 300mg with Dinner, on Non-Training Days.
 
BigGGG said:
Hello,
I have been stalking this thread for a loong time, read it to about page 40, but can anyone tell me how to not **** out my intestines competely when doing SL granules? Is there any way like enzymes or something? Some tips please, I am very pleased with the pumps and increased performance but after 1-2 days on it must live in the bathroom:).
TY
G
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Some people do not digest SL well. If you're liking the results of the PA found in Lecithin Granules, you may want to consider taking a PA supplement. Something like OL Tr1umph or Muscletech Phosphamuscle will give you the same amount of Phosphatidic Acid as the granules, but without the bathroom issues. Its obviously a more expensive route to take, but it'll fix your problem.
 
Either concentrated product or sunflower lecithin are worth trying. Sunflower worked just as well for me without the stomach issues.
 
john.patterson said:
Some people do not digest SL well. If you're liking the results of the PA found in Lecithin Granules, you may want to consider taking a PA supplement. Something like OL Tr1umph ..
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Isn't Triumph just finely ground granules (which, by the way, my latest cans of Fearns are a lot more fine than the old "balls")? I wouldn't think that would make much of a difference?
 
The_Old_Guy said:
Isn't Triumph just finely ground granules (which, by the way, my latest cans of Fearns are a lot more fine than the old "balls")? I wouldn't think that would make much of a difference?
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You're correct, for some reason I thought it was just PA. In that case, disregard the Tr1umph recommendation. Something like Phosphamuscle or Micro-PA might help his problem
 
john.patterson said:
You're correct, for some reason I thought it was just PA. In that case, disregard the Tr1umph recommendation. Something like Phosphamuscle or Micro-PA might help his problem
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I'd still give Triumph a shot - you get 900'ish milligrams and it's combined with other stuff, which may aid digestion/processing. Then take 1 Tbs of granules with dinner. He could also try grinding his own granules into a fine powder and having it with his (hopefully) pre-resistence training meal.
 
The_Old_Guy said:
I'd still give Triumph a shot - you get 900'ish milligrams and it's combined with other stuff, which may aid digestion/processing. Then take 1 Tbs of granules with dinner.
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I agree. I am using Tr1umph now and I feel that I digest it much easier than the granules. Never had any bathroom issues with granules, but I feel like the Tr1umph digests better. And for the price, he might as well give Tr1umph a shot
 
Anyone think that SL was adding midsection bodyfat? I love PA but get the impression SL was adding abdominal fat (not just bloat). My waist also got hella thick when I was bulking with 3-4 servings of SL per day (gained muscle too though).
 
Justlooking5 said:
Anyone think that SL was adding midsection bodyfat? I love PA but get the impression SL was adding abdominal fat (not just bloat). My waist also got hella thick when I was bulking with 3-4 servings of SL per day (gained muscle too though).
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I always got more vascular. BUT, I always ran it on a recomp.

Tr1umph has ergogenics designed to aid in preventing fat gain...just some food for thought : )
 
Justlooking5 said:
Anyone think that SL was adding midsection bodyfat? I love PA but get the impression SL was adding abdominal fat (not just bloat). My waist also got hella thick when I was bulking with 3-4 servings of SL per day (gained muscle too though).
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Normally I would say that's not really possible, but I experience the same thing from SL. I still like using it but I do notice it does seem to add a little abdominal fat (lower abs and low back love handle area).
 
ELROCK said:
Normally I would say that's not really possible, but I experience the same thing from SL. I still like using it but I do notice it does seem to add a little abdominal fat (lower abs and low back love handle area).
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Same thing I was thinking ... "why would it add more fat than a typical 150 cals of fat would for me?" but it seems to, lower back and and abdominal area.
 
F lol hopefully I don't get fatter on Tr1umph as well. How long did it take you guys to notice? I think it's giving me upset stomach sometimes also.
 
rascal14 said:
F lol hopefully I don't get fatter on Tr1umph as well. How long did it take you guys to notice? I think it's giving me upset stomach sometimes also.
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No worries, we designed Tr1umph to actually aid in fat loss despite the SL....

1. Stearoyl Vanillylamide in Tr1umph works on TRPV1 receptors in the adrenal glands to release adrenaline, which in turn increases metabolic rate by acting on β-adrenergic receptors on fat cells.

2. Alpha-GPC causes a slight increase in GH and a minor increase in fat oxidation

3. LCLT may increase fat loss via beta-oxidation, and increases the strength of the beta-oxidation pathway with exercise

4. Betaine - slight increase in IGF-1


I'm sure I'm missing something here but I'm at the gym knocking out a good back session ; )
 
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