HRT+Olympus Labs+ Letrone+OTHERS!

chedapalooza said:
No sir. Straight shots of good tequila.. Had a corona too.. First beer in months .. IIFYM lol
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I can't do tequila.. Lol I know what you mean though. I was cutting throughout this summer and had to drink vodka most nights. Beer will always be my true love.
 
chedapalooza said:
No sir. Straight shots of good tequila.. Had a corona too.. First beer in months .. IIFYM lol
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IIFTM for the win indeed haha!

Indulged in some craft beer myself. Plus a good buddy of mine and I brew our own.
 
kboxer7 said:
IIFTM for the win indeed haha!

Indulged in some craft beer myself. Plus a good buddy of mine and I brew our own.
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I'm going to the brand new concert at ommegang brewery in Cooperstown NY next weekend... It's gonna be my first carb up since like may... Had it planned all summer; gonna be tons of amazing craft beers on sample and draft. Defuse+recompadrol ftw
 
chedapalooza said:
Current supps:

OL LJ100
Anabeta original
AS cistamax,
Ursobolic 12 caps daily,
OL elim1nate 1 cap daily
OL Ep1c Unleashed
AS Forskolin 50mg
PES shift
Original usp c20
EC (2 x daily)
OL conqu3r DGE pre workout
I force KNO3
2 caps USP powerfull at bed
AP for fasted training

Staples/General health
Ubiquinol 200mg daily
Fish oil 2-4g daily
Orange triad multi
L tyrosine 1000mg daily
SAM e 200mg daily
Alcar 1000-1500mg daily
ZMA nightly

It's quite the laundry list and I have acquired a huge stash over time. It was great to start out my cut but the low t and metabolism crash has stalled me out...
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Have you ever considered what this laundry list of supplements is doing to your endocrine system?
 
David Dunn said:
At what? Homeostasis doesn't require a bathtub of supplements! I'm not going to call you ignorant but...
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He is trying to raise his Test levels. Of course homeostasis doesn't require a ton of supplements, but is this really much different than a PCT? He has a SERM, a couple natural test boosters, and an OTC AI.
 
rascal14 said:
He is trying to raise his Test levels. Of course homeostasis doesn't require a ton of supplements, but is this really much different than a PCT? He has a SERM, a couple natural test boosters, and an OTC AI.
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Question is are these effective? The fact OP is on Clomid treatment and last blood result suggests not. Therefore if not effective should OP still be on all the t boosters and ais. My feeling is cut back to one or two and measure progress.
 
ucheoma said:
Question is are these effective? The fact OP is on Clomid treatment and last blood result suggests not. Therefore if not effective should OP still be on all the t boosters and ais. My feeling is cut back to one or two and measure progress.
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This was the point I was trying to make. I apologize for miscommunicating and using "ignorant".
 
I am slowly reducing it. To basics. I'll feel more comfortable doing so once I know my levels are at a point that I can function without all the extra helpers
 
chedapalooza said:
I am slowly reducing it. To basics. I'll feel more comfortable doing so once I know my levels are at a point that I can function without all the extra helpers
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Do you feel youre levels would have been even lower without the t boosters? Not convinced myself. I think the x factor is your diet
 
ucheoma said:
Do you feel youre levels would have been even lower without the t boosters? Not convinced myself. I think the x factor is your diet
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No way to know. Food is king... I think I seriously over trained and I know that's not a term to take lightly but I am THAT GUY... I just do everything in extremes or not at all. It's a learning process mentally as much as physically
 
Refreshing candour. Not trying to preach but do consider cutting back a bit on the supps as part of your new resolve. If nothing else youll be saving a bundle
 
ucheoma said:
Refreshing candour. Not trying to preach but do consider cutting back a bit on the supps as part of your new resolve. If nothing else youll be saving a bundle
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Yes I consider it. Will I? I'm not sure. I don't want to sound like a dick either but the money isn't an issue, it's my hobby.. I spend money on quality food and supplements lol I don't waste it on much else
 
Man hunger is astounding the last two days... I'm at 1900 calories and I'm not supposed to increase to 2000-2100 until the 24th on this reverse diet. It must be the test increasing and increasing my hunger? It's like nothing can satisfy me
 
chedapalooza said:
Man hunger is astounding the last two days... I'm at 1900 calories and I'm not supposed to increase to 2000-2100 until the 24th on this reverse diet. It must be the test increasing and increasing my hunger? It's like nothing can satisfy me
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Feed the beast!
 
Just tryin to do the reverse diet right; I gain fat so easy. I'm happy to be steady in the 50g cho range and 60-80g Fat.. Just slow and steady

In other news, did some t spine work today and it made a huge world of difference. Reallly helped relieve lower back and hip pressure...

Killed my workout went super high volume and worked across all rep ranges reverse pyramid .. Felt great.

Next week is a planned off week (I take one full week off every 10-12 weeks or so) So I'm trying to hit it extra hard this week so I can soak up all the calories next week while remaining relatively inactive..
 
Prepared to say that I am holding more water (in a good way) I am looking fuller and more 'powerful' not as flat as before with zero changes to diet training and supplements aside from being on clomid for 11 days now EOD... My delts and arms are filling out nicely and my skin looks and feels more healthy and plump for lack of a better word ...stength endurance mood and energy all on the steady rise. And sleep is starting to become easier to fall asleep and feeling more rested upon waking/ waking up earlier
 
I will monitor the water retention and if it gets to a point where it becomes a negative physique wise or comfort wise, I may add in the letrone early. Gonna TRY not to before first draw which is only about 10 days away... So I'm sure I'll live.
 
Today was my 7th doSe of 25mg... I can really feel the water and almost hot flash like feelings/flushed look around the clock... Holding water in chest and lower belly like a mofo. Not sure if I feel like dealing with another week or two of this before first check and might hop on letrone.... It will definitely skew my labs tho I'm assuming in RE to e2 levels. This is a tough decision and also makes me hesitant to add ghar1ne will e2 is causing so much water retention..
 
Now that I consider the options, my next dose which will be Monday, I'm going to drop to 12.5mg EOD and monitor how I feel and look. If my energy and mood can stay consistent and I can keep e2 from climbing (anecdotally) any higher, then I'll roll with 12.5mg EOD until first blood check. That way I won't have to jump on letrone before getting a baseline e2
 
chedapalooza said:
No way to know. Food is king... I think I seriously over trained and I know that's not a term to take lightly but I am THAT GUY... I just do everything in extremes or not at all. It's a learning process mentally as much as physically
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Unfortunantly in the situation you have found yourself in there is no way to have you cake and eat it to. If you have watched layne's videos on metabolic damage and reverse dieting the you should concede that there needs to be a period of pain (gain in body weight) as you look to repair your system.

All these attempts to correct you hormone balance are in vein and are merely a bandaid for an underlying issue. There is a reason they are at where they are my friend and no supp or even drug is going to fix the root of the problem.

You got to step back and ask yourself, is "your" definition of aesthetics really worth the long term problems which have arisen. And again in a years time if you do step up to the plate and repair fix your underlying problems i can guarantee you that you will be in a hugely better position
:)
 
NoAddedHmones said:
Unfortunantly in the situation you have found yourself in there is no way to have you cake and eat it to. If you have watched layne's videos on metabolic damage and reverse dieting the you should concede that there needs to be a period of pain (gain in body weight) as you look to repair your system.

All these attempts to correct you hormone balance are in vein and are merely a bandaid for an underlying issue. There is a reason they are at where they are my friend and no supp or even drug is going to fix the root of the problem.

You got to step back and ask yourself, is "your" definition of aesthetics really worth the long term problems which have arisen. And again in a years time if you do step up to the plate and repair fix your underlying problems i can guarantee you that you will be in a hugely better position
:)
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Definitely I agree. When u get really lean (to a point that isn't healthily maintainable) lots happens physically AND Mentally. Once I broke out of the mindset that was keeping me in a bad place, I feel much better now. I am glad that I am up 7 pounds in two weeks. It's only water and glycogen retention. I am fuller and still lean.

I can attest to feeling better and looking better on more calories. Last year at this time I was the same body fat and eating 200g carbs a day minimum. But I understand and have watched that layne video, so I am increasing carbs 25g a day every two weeks. Currently at 50-60g daily. Next week goes up to 75-80g.
 
Obviously that isn't a full look at the big picture but test is up. He isn't the urologist so he didn't check the other important factors
 
chedapalooza said:
Obviously that isn't a full look at the big picture but test is up. He isn't the urologist so he didn't check the other important factors
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Even so, I'm happy to see you trending in the right direction!
 
Not trying to be a hypochondriac but look at this crap... Invalid Link RemovedInvalid Link RemovedInvalid Link Removed

My CK is really high... Indicates muscle wasting/damage

I really knew I was over training but that's high af..
 
Just the estrogen sides r a bit annoying.. Always that warm puffy itchy feeling under the skin.. Like subq water is being held everywhere. Chest is slightly itchy. Hopefully a few days at 12.5mg EOD will alleviate this a bit whilst still helping test to rise
 
Have any of u heard of Dan Green the power lifter? I looked up one of his Main programs and it's great Bc he includes some high volume and high frequency bodybuilding / hyper assistance work.

I put together I routine based off his program and based off my physique goals (I don't power really after doing so for years of football ) but I like to include heavy squats, presses, and rows.. And trying to return to deads after my injury last summer. I'm gonna post the routine and would love feedback. Planning to start it next week
 
Example:
Week 1

Monday 1 squats back bis rear delts
Tuesday hiit
Wed 2 shoulders tris
Thursday hiit
Friday 3 back shoulders legs bis

Week 2

Monday 4 shoulders back tris
Tuesday Hiit
Wednesday 5 back bis rear delts
Thurs hiit
Friday 1 squats back bis rear delts

So on

(1)
Squat 3x5
Paused squat 3x5
Good morning 3x6-8
Pull-ups 5x5 weighted
V grip pulldown 4x10-12
BB curls 3-5x 8-10
Hammer preacher db 3x10-12
Face pulls 3-5x15,12,10,8,15
Rope crunches, hanging leg raises

(2)
Standing military press 3x5
Wide grip military standing presses paused 3x5-8
CG bench/CG floor press 3x5
Paused CG bench/floor skull crusher 3x5
Seated DB press 3x10-12
Seated Mil BB press BTN 3x10-12
Svend Press 3-5x10-20
OH tricep ext 3-5x 8-10
Tri pushdowns / rope pd 3-5x 10-12

(3)
Front squat 3x5
BB Rows / pendlay 5x6-8
UH lat 4x10-12
leg curls 4x10-12
Side db laterals 5x10-20
Upright rows ss shrugs 5x10-20
Alt DB curls 3-5x 10-12
Farmer walks/ suit case walks, Hyperextensions, ab rollouts, side planks, decline crunch, prowler push + pull

(4)
Paused standing military press 3x5
Speed standing military press 3x5 (50%)
Paused wide grip standing military press 3x6-8 (60%)
T bar row 5x 8-10
Full ROM db lateral raise 5x10-20
Face pulls 3x20
Chest cable low to hi raise 3-5x10-20/ neutral grip inc DB press 3x5
V handle tricep pushdown/ bench dips 3-5x10-20

(5)
Trap dead 3x5
Single leg DB / convential Deadlift / squat (if I can't do these deads) 3x5
Romanian dead 3x6-8
Pull-ups 2 sets each grip (overhand, underhand, neutral) body weight x max reps
Kroc rows 3-5x10-12
BB Pullovers 4x10-12
Rear delts DB raises 5x10-20
Cable BB curls 4x10-12
Leg raises? Rope crunch, Russian twists
 
warpyfunch said:
Gotcha. Misunderstood. Thought you already had your pre-letrone numbers.

So how many weeks will you be running clomid+letrone concurrently before testing again?
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I will get my baseline draw on Monday the 24th after 3 weeks weeks on clomid (2 weeks at 25mg EOD, and 1 week at 12.5mg EOD)

I'll have to see where everything is at at that point.

Then based off the above I will either stay at 12.5mg EOD + letrone
Or go back up to 25mg EOD+letrone

My goal is to get test above 800 and keep e2 below 40.

I imagine this would take roughly an additional 3-4 weeks at the appropriate dosing (TBD). I imagine being on some dose combo of clomid and letrone for at least 3-4 weeks before beginning to taper the clomid and continuing the letrone.. So all in all, about 6-8 weeks.
 
i believe the jury is still out as to whether letrone is suicidal or competitive. will you be doing followup bloods after coming off the letrone eventually to see if there's the type of rebound you'd get from a competitive ai?
 
warpyfunch said:
i believe the jury is still out as to whether letrone is suicidal or competitive. will you be doing followup bloods after coming off the letrone eventually to see if there's the type of rebound you'd get from a competitive ai?
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Most definitely

It's also easy to tell anecdotally tho too.. If it's not suicidal, the e2 side's usually come on rather quickly and uncomfortably ... If it's suicidal it's much more gradual or not at all but yes I'll have solid labs for all of it
 
So I've Had three doses at 12.5mg this week.. Estro sides are way down now today. My last 25mg dose was Saturday the 15th.

I feel like I miss the extra fullness in arms and shoulders, but the water, hot/itchy feeling was getting overwhelming in chest and stomach...

With that being said, I am planning on getting first labs done early next week Monday or Tuesday. And I will most likely go back to 25mg eod dosing since I will be resuming normal training next week. I think the 25mg eod plus regular training AND letrone is gonna be hella fun! I can feel a slight drop off in energy as well having lowered to 12.5mg eod.

So I'll probably cruise at 25mg eod with letrone and then get checked again at the end of September which will give us all a nice idea of how well the letrone worked at suppressing e2 sides from clomid.
 
chedapalooza said:
So I've Had three doses at 12.5mg this week.. Estro sides are way down now today. My last 25mg dose was Saturday the 15th.

I feel like I miss the extra fullness in arms and shoulders, but the water, hot/itchy feeling was getting overwhelming in chest and stomach...

With that being said, I am planning on getting first labs done early next week Monday or Tuesday. And I will most likely go back to 25mg eod dosing since I will be resuming normal training next week. I think the 25mg eod plus regular training AND letrone is gonna be hella fun! I can feel a slight drop off in energy as well having lowered to 12.5mg eod.

So I'll probably cruise at 25mg eod with letrone and then get checked again at the end of September which will give us all a nice idea of how well the letrone worked at suppressing e2 sides from clomid.
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Just curious... any reason for dosing 25mg EOD rather than 12.5mg everyday?
 
I read a lot of logs and Studies that used the 25mg eod so I just went wit with had proven results. I figured a daily administration might cause more estrogen sides
 
The water retention all but disappeared after a week at 12.5mg eod but I decided to go back to 25mg eod now that I'm back at regular training. Will be starting letrone first week of sept and running 1 cap for 60 days
 
First draw (4 weeks) was today. Will have results sent directly to me via the quest app within 5 business days so sometime next week. I'll be starting letrone regardless next Thursday September 3rd and running one cap a day (tentatively) for 60 days to bring me to the end of October. Then I'll look to cycle off the ai's for a while if all looks well.

A second round of blood is already Ordered for September 28 (second draw) so everything is right on schedule !
 
chedapalooza said:
First draw (4 weeks) was today. Will have results sent directly to me via the quest app within 5 business days so sometime next week. I'll be starting letrone regardless next Thursday September 3rd and running one cap a day (tentatively) for 60 days to bring me to the end of October. Then I'll look to cycle off the ai's for a while if all looks well.

A second round of blood is already Ordered for September 28 (second draw) so everything is right on schedule !
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Right on track!
 
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