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Coop's Corner #1: Forskolin + B-agonists

kbayne said:
Id go with 50mg with your thermo doses.
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2nd this...though I believe coop has posted in the past that spilt up vs spread out won't affect effectiveness, at least from a fat loss standpoint...when I ran forsk for 12 weeks, I dosed 100mg all in one shot, preWO, didn't notice any change once I spilt it up to 50/50.....
 
Wow. That's nuts. It's half life has to be very small.

schizm said:
2nd this...though I believe coop has posted in the past that spilt up vs spread out won't affect effectiveness, at least from a fat loss standpoint...when I ran forsk for 12 weeks, I dosed 100mg all in one shot, preWO, didn't notice any change once I spilt it up to 50/50.....
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schizm said:
2nd this...though I believe coop has posted in the past that spilt up vs spread out won't affect effectiveness, at least from a fat loss standpoint...when I ran forsk for 12 weeks, I dosed 100mg all in one shot, preWO, didn't notice any change once I spilt it up to 50/50.....
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Interesting. I only used it once (8 weeks I believe), but just split up the dosing. Next time I use it I'll try doing a larger bolus.

I do still have 1 bottle laying around.
 
mr.cooper69 said:
Today's topic is how forskolin synergizes with B-agonists in actual humans for the purpose of fat loss.
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Hi Coop, what is your take on this study?
Caffeine inhibits forskolin-stimulated cyclic AMP accumulation
Abstract
Caffeine potently inhibited forskolin-stimulated cyclic AMP accumulation in slices of rat cerebral cortex. The IC50 for this inhibition was 21 ± 2.9 μM, and 200 μM caffeine almost completely blocked the forskolin response. Theophylline which is a behavioural stimulant mimicked the effect of caffeine. However, there was only a slight inhibition of the forskolin response by theobromine and IBMX (3-isobutyl-1-methylxanthine), both of which lack behavioral stimulant effects.
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I was planning to take forskolin along with A-T2 and my pre-workout coffee. Any idea if I should waive this option, or just shift caffeine consumption?
 
MaXopA said:
Hi Coop, what is your take on this study?


I was planning to take forskolin along with A-T2 and my pre-workout coffee. Any idea if I should waive this option, or just shift caffeine consumption?
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That appears to be inhibiting cAMP at the cerebral cortex (outer layer of the brain) but I think we're mostly concerned about cAMP activity in muscle and fat cells.
 
This thread makes me want to add some more forsk to my ABE run... Already been fighting the temptation to throw in alpha t2....
 
MaXopA said:
Hi Coop, what is your take on this study?


I was planning to take forskolin along with A-T2 and my pre-workout coffee. Any idea if I should waive this option, or just shift caffeine consumption?
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What are your goals? This is a very specific pathway/brain region. if your goal is fat loss, it certainly will not matter
 
mr.cooper69 said:
What are your goals? This is a very specific pathway/brain region. if your goal is fat loss, it certainly will not matter
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my goal is actually kind of a recomp with a slight increase of lean mass. Would A-T2 + caffeine + forskolin be okay in this case?
 
i know this might be far fetched, but ever since I started taking forskolin, my sex drive has shot through the roof (in comparison to previous sex drive) I wake up with spontaneous erections and feel like im 18....only thing I introduced in my supps recently was forskolin 95 and pure grape seed extract which I take like 1g of.

Is there a correlation between forskolin and increased sex drive?
 
heavyweight83 said:
i know this might be far fetched, but ever since I started taking forskolin, my sex drive has shot through the roof (in comparison to previous sex drive) I wake up with spontaneous erections and feel like im 18....only thing I introduced in my supps recently was forskolin 95 and pure grape seed extract which I take like 1g of.

Is there a correlation between forskolin and increased sex drive?
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How much forskolin are you taking?
 
aaronuconn said:
I think that stack would be better utilized where fat loss is the main objective.
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ok we are all aware that building muscle / burning fat, etc mostly comes down to the caloric balance at the end of the day. but don't you think the aforementioned stack could be a good addition to a leangains / intermittent fasting approach, even if I am on a slight caloric surplus?

Probably I will be completely wrong, but have a look at the following:

- I fast from midnight to 2 PM, so the body heavily relies on fat as a source of energy from some point on.
- I work out at 6 PM. I eat a maximum of 20% of my daily calorie intake (that's roughly 800 kcal) till I work out, consisting only of fat and protein, no carbs at all (ok a few grams healthy fiber), in order to keep the body in the fat / protein energy mode.
- I consume 80% of the rest calories post-workout till I go to bed at midnight, mainly HIGH-GI foods which will drop insulin levels very fast, thus enhancing growth hormone release during the night and allow a faster activation of the fat burning machine.

My theory:
Caffeine and A-T2 are usually taken during the first half of the day when working out in the evening, so this would fall within my fasting, low-carb and low calorie window. Yohimbine + Caffeine + Fasting + Low-Carb + Low-Calories = WIN because insulin levels, calories available are low and the body needs lots of energy for the workout, as far as you're training like a madman, which most of us do.

Waiting for your opinion, so please don't hold back as I'm not afraid to hear things like "your theory is bull****" as long as your claims are backed by objective information.
 
MaXopA said:
ok we are all aware that building muscle / burning fat, etc mostly comes down to the caloric balance at the end of the day. but don't you think the aforementioned stack could be a good addition to a leangains / intermittent fasting approach, even if I am on a slight caloric surplus?

Probably I will be completely wrong, but have a look at the following:

- I fast from midnight to 2 PM, so the body heavily relies on fat as a source of energy from some point on.
- I work out at 6 PM. I eat a maximum of 20% of my daily calorie intake (that's roughly 800 kcal) till I work out, consisting only of fat and protein, no carbs at all (ok a few grams healthy fiber), in order to keep the body in the fat / protein energy mode.
- I consume 80% of the rest calories post-workout till I go to bed at midnight, mainly HIGH-GI foods which will drop insulin levels very fast, thus enhancing growth hormone release during the night and allow a faster activation of the fat burning machine.

My theory:
Caffeine and A-T2 are usually taken during the first half of the day when working out in the evening, so this would fall within my fasting, low-carb and low calorie window. Yohimbine + Caffeine + Fasting + Low-Carb + Low-Calories = WIN because insulin levels, calories available are low and the body needs lots of energy for the workout, as far as you're training like a madman, which most of us do.

Waiting for your opinion, so please don't hold back as I'm not afraid to hear things like "your theory is bull****" as long as your claims are backed by objective information.
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If yiure eating 800 calories, your insulin levels are elevated. Even if it's purely protein. Lean gains / IF protocol calls for 40-80 calories max during your fasting period. And any type of carb, fiber or not, is going to spike insulin rendering the yohimbine fairly ineffective. This is all just my opinion. Low carbing is great for fat loss, sure. But your approach/ use of the word fasting is a little flawed schematically.
 
chedapalooza said:
If yiure eating 800 calories, your insulin levels are elevated. Even if it's purely protein. Lean gains / IF protocol calls for 40-80 calories max during your fasting period. And any type of carb, fiber or not, is going to spike insulin rendering the yohimbine fairly ineffective. This is all just my opinion. Low carbing is great for fat loss, sure. But your approach/ use of the word fasting is a little flawed schematically.
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He's using the workout in the afternoon IF plan. Unless I'm wrong his feeding window is probably still ~8 hours he just doesn't workout fasted.

Looks like a solid plan to me and my views on some fat burners during bulks surely differs from how most view them. :o
 
chedapalooza said:
If yiure eating 800 calories, your insulin levels are elevated. Even if it's purely protein. Lean gains / IF protocol calls for 40-80 calories max during your fasting period. And any type of carb, fiber or not, is going to spike insulin rendering the yohimbine fairly ineffective. This is all just my opinion. Low carbing is great for fat loss, sure. But your approach/ use of the word fasting is a little flawed schematically.
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I'm not directly IF-ing but Carb-Backloading, which can be defined as an evolution of IF. You say insulin stays elevated, so have you got any data on how long insulin remains elevated within the human body when ingesting 50g Fat and 50g Protein? If not, I have: Invalid Link Removed

I'm eating even less than the amount used in the study, since I only have 40g F - 40g P as intact food 3h before training. Analyzing this diagram anybody can tell that the impact on insulin when coingesting pro/fat is nothing but negligible after 3 or more hours.

Thoughts?
 
MaXopA said:
I'm not directly IF-ing but Carb-Backloading, which can be defined as an evolution of IF. You say insulin stays elevated, so have you got any data on how long insulin remains elevated within the human body when ingesting 50g Fat and 50g Protein? If not, I have: <img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=97942"/>

I'm eating even less than the amount used in the study, since I only have 40g F - 40g P as intact food 3h before training. Analyzing this diagram anybody can tell that the impact on insulin when coingesting pro/fat is nothing but negligible after 3 or more hours.

Thoughts?
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Still pointless to use yohimbine in presence of insulin for fat mobilization. If u want Y to be effective u need to work out fasted after taking it and go about your day fasted after taking it..... I'm not interested in charts of insulin levels from fat and protein ingestion. Everyone responds to food intake differently as well so it's kind of a moot point on two level. Especially for use of yohimbine
 
I remember seeing someone say that Y is still effective if taken immediately before your workout/cardio even in a fed state... Outside of activity is where it would be ineffective in a fed state from that statement. I can't remember who said that though, but I think it was someone who knows their stuff lol. I think I am developing Alzheimer's!!
 
houstontexas said:
I remember seeing someone say that Y is still effective if taken immediately before your workout/cardio even in a fed state... Outside of activity is where it would be ineffective in a fed state from that statement. I can't remember who said that though, but I think it was someone who knows their stuff lol. I think I am developing Alzheimer's!!
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It won't be USELESS, but wouldn't one want to maximize their purchase? It would be far more effective not eating until after your Y is taken and work out is performed. That's all. No big deal
 
mr.cooper69 said:
Here's the basic rundown:

A activates B. B activates C. C activates D. D activates fat burning.

A B-agonist increases levels of A. More A means more B. More B means more C.

Forskolin further increases levels of C. So you have way, way more C, which activates D. D activates way, way more fat burning.
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Sounds like the way to total rippedness!
 
He's saying that if you are not about to workout you need to be fasted for AT-2 to be optimized.

On a workout day just before workout you don't need to worry as much about some amount of insulin effecting the efficacy of Yohimbe as Coop explained a few times now
 
Driven2lift said:
He's saying that if you are not about to workout you need to be fasted for AT-2 to be optimized.

On a workout day just before workout you don't need to worry as much about some amount of insulin effecting the efficacy of Yohimbe as Coop explained a few times now
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perfect, I think that I'm all set then. Would you mind posting Coop's reference? Unfortunately it seems that the search function doesn't like me at all lol
 
MaXopA said:
perfect, I think that I'm all set then. Would you mind posting Coop's reference? Unfortunately it seems that the search function doesn't like me at all lol
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Exercise causes a release of Epinephrine, which in turn inhibits insulin release.

To break it down, Epinephrine binds to adrenergic receptors, and the one we're looking at in regards to insulin inhibition is the alpha-2 adrenergic receptor.
 
Driven2lift said:
He's saying that if you are not about to workout you need to be fasted for AT-2 to be optimized.

On a workout day just before workout you don't need to worry as much about some amount of insulin effecting the efficacy of Yohimbe as Coop explained a few times now
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This^^
 
aaronuconn said:
Exercise causes a release of Epinephrine, which in turn inhibits insulin release.

To break it down, Epinephrine binds to adrenergic receptors, and the one we're looking at in regards to insulin inhibition is the alpha-2 adrenergic receptor.
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for a layman like me this basically means all the fuss about training fasted in order not to inhibit A-T2 is a bit exaggerated? If so, that sounds fine.

On non-workout days I always fast till 2-3 PM and go for a maximum of 30g usable carbs with the rest being fat and protein. So in this case I am supposed to take the first dose F-95 / A-T2 / Caffeine as soon as I get up, just as I would do on training days. But what about the second dose on off-days, should I rather leave it out since I'm ingesting foods till I go to bed?
 
Just had a quick question. Anything wrong with doing 8 weeks of alphamine followed by 8 weeks of ec stack? I world be taking forskolin throughout
 
No it will still have benefits. Don't worry and overthink it still take that dose. :)
 
Dope deal on AT2/Forskolin on NP!
 
How long did it take to get used to the high dosage of forslean 75mg-100mg, been a weeks and still get bubble gut effect.
 
chainsaw said:
How long did it take to get used to the high dosage of forslean 75mg-100mg, been a weeks and still get bubble gut effect.
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give it 2 weeks. I bolus 150mg of it at once and have zero issues, maybe had some issue the first week but it could have been the stimulant usage too. A good pre workout always makes me make a trip to the bathroom within minutes ;)
 
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