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Test Boosters VS the Real Deal:

SeniorXJ

Member
-Ok so heres the skinny, im working on 3 goals of increasing testosterone, cardio output, & fat loss, & comparing them to the real deal compounds. This thread will cover the testosterone alone:

-About me, im 35 yrs old, 6 foot 250lbs & i have low-t due to AAS abuse 7 yrs ago. Given that recent bloods were done on placebo at 127, then afterwards on DAA it was 302! Not the greatest numbers, but it made a difference. So now, im back on DAA & Erase & would like to kick in one more test booster such as, Anabeta, Endosurge, Powerfull, T-911, Trib, Long Jack, ZMA, etc, but i cant decide.

-Now for the math; 2 bottles of DAA costs $40 bucks & lasts 90 days. Two bottles of Erase costs $60 bucks & will last 90 days, totaling $100 plus whatever supp i add to it.

-Moving to the dark side, i can get 40ml of test-e for $144 & run it for 20 weeks at 500mgs. The good part is ur getting the test cheaper, more of it, & u'll get way better results! The down side is side effects, needles, it requires PCT, & its not exactly legall.

I'll make seperate threads for my other goals, so please chime in & give me ur feedback & advice here!!
Thanks,
SeniorXJ
 
Philshred said:
When you say AAS abuse what do you mean exactly? Thank you
Click to expand...

Is there a reason u felt the need to post this 3 times in a row???

Its quite simple really, over the course of several years, say age 25 thru 28, i did alot of cycles with them growing in size & strength each time.
 
What is your goal here?

To get gains or trying to improve your natural testosterone production?
 
Jonbero said:
What is your goal here?

To get gains or trying to improve your natural testosterone production?
Click to expand...

Basically to get back in shape both cardiovascular & strength wise except this time i need to gain the strength without gaining size & actually loose weight. (im 250 at 6' & want to get to 230). Since my test levels run low, its a staple to take somethin to raise my test levels. I

m basically deciding whether to max out on the supps or go for another cycle. The docs gave me such a hard time with TRT that it just wasnt worth the headache as they start u off with that crappy androgel, then transdermal patches, & when they finally gave me an inject, it was 100mgs of test-e every 3 weeks which is just ridiculouse.

The thing that has me tossed is that i can get the real deal for cheaper with 10 times the results, BUT at 35 yrs old, i need to keep a good hold on my health so the supps are a better choice with that aspect in mind. I just started another run on DAA & Erase & want to add in another supp to the stack & see how it goes but am tossed as to what. Im leaning towards either TitaniumXL for the testofen, or a good extract of long jack & trib.

For cardio i have agmatine & plan to add in Beta Alanine & COP, plus i have No-Xplode on hand which covers the Citrulline Malate & creatine supps.
 
JudoJosh said:
Option 3 - Clomid
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, clomid everyday for 20 weeks sounds like a great cycle idea... um NO!! Clomid is only run post cycle to restart ur HPTA system & is NOT prescribed or recomended by anyone for TRT, plus i hate the stuff as it gave me bad mood swings back in the days!!
 
SeniorXJ said:
Oh yeah, clomid everyday for 20 weeks sounds like a great cycle idea... um NO!! Clomid is only run post cycle to restart ur HPTA system & is NOT prescribed or recomended by anyone for TRT, plus i hate the stuff as it gave me bad mood swings back in the days!!
Click to expand...


Cheap, safe and proven to be effective

Clomiphene Citrate Effects on Testosterone/Estrogen Ratio in Male Hypogonadism

Aim. Symptomatic late-onset hypogonadism is associated not only with a decline in serum testosterone, but also with a rise in serum estradiol. These endocrine changes negatively affect libido, sexual function, mood, behavior, lean body mass, and bone density. Currently, the most common treatment is exogenous testostosterone therapy. This treatment can be associated with skin irritation, gynecomastia, nipple tenderness, testicular atrophy, and decline in sperm counts. In this study we investigated the efficacy of clomiphene citrate in the treatment of hypogonadism with the objectives of raising endogenous serum testosterone (T) and improving the testosterone/estrogen (T/E) ratio.


Methods. Our cohort consisted of 36 Caucasian men with hypogonadism defined as serum testosterone level less than 300 ng/dL. Each patient was treated with a daily dose of 25 mg clomiphene citrate and followed prospectively. Analysis of baseline and follow-up serum levels of testosterone and estradiol levels were performed.


Results. The mean age was 39 years, and the mean pretreatment testosterone and estrogen levels were 247.6 ± 39.8 ng/dL and 32.3 ± 10.9, respectively. By the first follow-up visit (4–6 weeks), the mean testosterone level rose to 610.0 ± 178.6 ng/dL (P < 0.00001). Moreover, the T/E ratio improved from 8.7 to 14.2 (P < 0.001). There were no side effects reported by the patients.


Conclusions. Low dose clomiphene citrate is effective in elevating serum testosterone levels and improving the testosterone/estadiol ratio in men with hypogonadism. This therapy represents an alternative to testosterone therapy by stimulating the endogenous androgen production pathway.
Click to expand...


But it has no potential for HRT use and no one would even consider it for long term right?


1. Outcomes of clomiphene citrate treatment in young hypogonadal men

Study Type - Therapy (case series) Level of Evidence 4 What's known on the subject? and What does the study add? Hypogonadism is a prevalent problem, increasing in frequency as men age. It is most commonly treated by testosterone supplementation therapy but in younger patients this can lead to testicular atrophy with subsequent exogenous testosterone dependency and may impair spermatogenesis. Clomiphene citrate (CC) may be used as an alternative treatment in these patients with hypogonadism when maintenance of fertility is desired. This study shows that CC is a safe and efficacious drug to use as an alternative to exogenous testosterone. Not only have we validated previous findings of other papers but have proven our findings over a much longer period (mean duration of treatment 19 months). This prospective study is the largest to date assessing both the objective hormone response to CC therapy as well as the subjective response based on a validated questionnaire.


OBJECTIVE: •  To prospectively assess the andrological outcomes of long-term clomiphene citrate (CC) treatment in hypogonadal men.


PATIENTS AND METHODS: •  We prospectively evaluated 86 men with hypogonadism (HG) as confirmed by two consecutive early morning testosterone measurements <300 ng/dL. •  The cohort included all men with HG presenting to our clinic between 2002 and 2006 who, after an informed discussion, elected to have CC therapy. CC was commenced at 25 mg every other day and titrated to 50 mg every other day. The target testosterone level was 550 ± 50 ng/dL. •  Testosterone (free and total), sex hormone binding globulin, oestradiol, luteinizing hormone and follicle stimulating hormone were measured at baseline and during treatment on all patients. Once the desired testosterone level was achieved, testosterone/gonadotropin levels were measured twice per year. •  To assess subjective response to treatment, the androgen deficiency in aging males (ADAM) questionnaire was administered before treatment and during follow-up.


RESULTS: •  Patients' mean (standard deviation [sd]; range) age was 29 (3; 22-37) years. Infertility was the most common reason (64%) for seeking treatment. The mean (sd) duration of CC treatment was 19 (14) months. •  At the last evaluation, 70% of men were using 25 mg CC every other day, and the remainder were using 50 mg every other day. •  All mean testosterone and gonadotropin measurements significantly increased during treatment. •  Subjectively, there was an improvement in all questions (except loss of height) on the ADAM questionnaire. More than half the patients had an improvement in at least three symptoms. •  There were no major side effects recorded and the presence of a varicocele did not have an impact on the response to CC.


CONCLUSION: Long-term follow-up of CC treatment for HG shows that it appears to be an effective and safe alternative to testosterone supplementation in men wishing to preserve their fertility.
Click to expand...


But who would be crazy enough to do a clomid only cycle and also be kind enough to post blood work? - Invalid Link Removed


So yea your right, clomid is a horrible option for helping you naturally restore testosterone levels. Best to stick with more proven effective products like....
 
SeniorXJ said:
Oh yeah, clomid everyday for 20 weeks sounds like a great cycle idea... um NO!! Clomid is only run post cycle to restart ur HPTA system & is NOT prescribed or recomended by anyone for TRT, plus i hate the stuff as it gave me bad mood swings back in the days!!
Click to expand...

How about triptorelin?
 
SeniorXJ said:
Basically to get back in shape both cardiovascular & strength wise except this time i need to gain the strength without gaining size & actually loose weight. (im 250 at 6' & want to get to 230). Since my test levels run low, its a staple to take somethin to raise my test levels. I

m basically deciding whether to max out on the supps or go for another cycle. The docs gave me such a hard time with TRT that it just wasnt worth the headache as they start u off with that crappy androgel, then transdermal patches, & when they finally gave me an inject, it was 100mgs of test-e every 3 weeks which is just ridiculouse.

The thing that has me tossed is that i can get the real deal for cheaper with 10 times the results, BUT at 35 yrs old, i need to keep a good hold on my health so the supps are a better choice with that aspect in mind. I just started another run on DAA & Erase & want to add in another supp to the stack & see how it goes but am tossed as to what. Im leaning towards either TitaniumXL for the testofen, or a good extract of long jack & trib.

For cardio i have agmatine & plan to add in Beta Alanine & COP, plus i have No-Xplode on hand which covers the Citrulline Malate & creatine supps.
Click to expand...

I don't recommend Testofen, it raises your testosterone but its also highly estrogenic. Longjack and tribulus both are good for getting a libido boost but they wont do jack for your testosterone levels. From the natural stuff, Erase & DAA are good stuff and if you want to add something in there I'd recommend looking into Anabeta and Endosurge.

I'm sure you know that no matter how good natural products you get you can't compare it to the real deal, its down to whether getting gains or your health is more important to you at this point.
 
Well, one of the downsides you listed for test is that it requires PCT. Most of the test boosters you listed are included in a PCT anyway, and running AAS without PCT is probably how you got in the predicament in the first place. If you don't want to drop a lot of cash, stick with the boosters and skip the AAS. If you're cool dropping more cash, run some test and then the boosters as PCT. As far as which booster to throw in there, DAA, erase and anabeta was a monstorous stack for me.

SeniorXJ said:
-Ok so heres the skinny, im working on 3 goals of increasing testosterone, cardio output, & fat loss, & comparing them to the real deal compounds. This thread will cover the testosterone alone:

-About me, im 35 yrs old, 6 foot 250lbs & i have low-t due to AAS abuse 7 yrs ago. Given that recent bloods were done on placebo at 127, then afterwards on DAA it was 302! Not the greatest numbers, but it made a difference. So now, im back on DAA & Erase & would like to kick in one more test booster such as, Anabeta, Endosurge, Powerfull, T-911, Trib, Long Jack, ZMA, etc, but i cant decide.

-Now for the math; 2 bottles of DAA costs $40 bucks & lasts 90 days. Two bottles of Erase costs $60 bucks & will last 90 days, totaling $100 plus whatever supp i add to it.

-Moving to the dark side, i can get 40ml of test-e for $144 & run it for 20 weeks at 500mgs. The good part is ur getting the test cheaper, more of it, & u'll get way better results! The down side is side effects, needles, it requires PCT, & its not exactly legall.

I'll make seperate threads for my other goals, so please chime in & give me ur feedback & advice here!!
Thanks,
SeniorXJ
Click to expand...
 
SeniorXJ said:
Is there a reason u felt the need to post this 3 times in a row???

Its quite simple really, over the course of several years, say age 25 thru 28, i did alot of cycles with them growing in size & strength each time.
Click to expand...

Sorry man, posted from my phone and it was telling me that there was a network error every time. Thanks for answering though
 
Jonbero said:
I don't recommend Testofen, it raises your testosterone but its also highly estrogenic. Longjack and tribulus both are good for getting a libido boost but they wont do jack for your testosterone levels. From the natural stuff, Erase & DAA are good stuff and if you want to add something in there I'd recommend looking into Anabeta and Endosurge.

I'm sure you know that no matter how good natural products you get you can't compare it to the real deal, its down to whether getting gains or your health is more important to you at this point.
Click to expand...

This. One think I will note is that Longjack has been shown to be a mild testosterone booster and also an ergogenic in humans.
 
Two things that haven't been clearly defined/explained (unless I didn't read closely enough)

1. What was abuse? Did you not do PCT, cycle too long, ??? I know you said you did several cycles but a lot of people do that and are just fine.

2. Why not do TRT?
 
mr.cooper69 said:
This. One think I will note is that Longjack has been shown to be a mild testosterone booster and also an ergogenic in humans.
Click to expand...

Doesn't it depend on where you get it from to? Always heard there is alot of bunk stuff out there when it comes to this.
 
You are correct my friend! I was in the middle of a heavy cycle shooting a sust amp ED, 1000mgs of deca, & a-bombs when all of a sudden i get shooting pains close to my liver. Now im back & forth to the doc & hospital & they finally find out that my gaul bladder had stopped working & i went straight into surgery to remove it. I had my girl sneaking in my shots but it got to risky & i had to stop cold turkey due to the constent blood work being done therefore no PCT was done.

Moving on, Anabeta seems like a popular choice, but im not familiar with its compounds. Earlier i mentioned gettin TitaniumXL for the Testofen & i have the mindset that Erase will counter act the estrogen sides "IF" i even get sides which i never got during cycles except for a little acne when using the real deal over 7 yrs ago.

Just to make the thread clear, Im asking just how much these test boosters physically work so i can stay away from AAS. The reason im asking to compare to the real deal is because back in the day they didnt have all these test supps, (except for 1-AD), so i have no idea on how much they can raize test levels. Ive been doing alot of research & figured id start this thread to get feedback from users of these test supps.

J19891 said:
Well, one of the downsides you listed for test is that it requires PCT. Most of the test boosters you listed are included in a PCT anyway, and running AAS without PCT is probably how you got in the predicament in the first place. If you don't want to drop a lot of cash, stick with the boosters and skip the AAS. If you're cool dropping more cash, run some test and then the boosters as PCT. As far as which booster to throw in there, DAA, erase and anabeta was a monstorous stack for me.
Click to expand...
 
PrepNwa23 said:
Doesn't it depend on where you get it from to? Always heard there is alot of bunk stuff out there when it comes to this.
Click to expand...

You are 100% correct as i have experience with herbs & know that a good quality herb is all in the proccess of extracting the extract. Also depends on where the plants grow since they need optimal conditions to grow like tropical islands & such.
 
PrepNwa23 said:
Doesn't it depend on where you get it from to? Always heard there is alot of bunk stuff out there when it comes to this.
Click to expand...

SeniorXJ said:
You are 100% correct as i have experience with herbs & know that a good quality herb is all in the proccess of extracting the extract. Also depends on where the plants grow since they need optimal conditions to grow like tropical islands & such.
Click to expand...

Senior is right. Other factors like the part of the plant may also be dependent on the season it is extracted (see roots in summer vs winter).
 
I've never run any AAS personally, so I cant say. I know I have noticable gains from the supps I've used, but from what I understand they're not going to be in the same league as AAS. Comparing DAA to something like tren or superdrol would probably be like comparing asprin to heroin or the caffeine in a can of mountain dew to meth.

SeniorXJ said:
You are correct my friend! I was in the middle of a heavy cycle shooting a sust amp ED, 1000mgs of deca, & a-bombs when all of a sudden i get shooting pains close to my liver. Now im back & forth to the doc & hospital & they finally find out that my gaul bladder had stopped working & i went straight into surgery to remove it. I had my girl sneaking in my shots but it got to risky & i had to stop cold turkey due to the constent blood work being done therefore no PCT was done.

Moving on, Anabeta seems like a popular choice, but im not familiar with its compounds. Earlier i mentioned gettin TitaniumXL for the Testofen & i have the mindset that Erase will counter act the estrogen sides "IF" i even get sides which i never got during cycles except for a little acne when using the real deal over 7 yrs ago.

Just to make the thread clear, Im asking just how much these test boosters physically work so i can stay away from AAS. The reason im asking to compare to the real deal is because back in the day they didnt have all these test supps, (except for 1-AD), so i have no idea on how much they can raize test levels. Ive been doing alot of research & figured id start this thread to get feedback from users of these test supps.
Click to expand...
 
Yeah i know theres deff no way supps can match up to aas, but if a stack of todays test boosters can get my test levels into decent numbers, then id do a supp stack instead. The kicker here is that if im spending more money on stacking the supps just to get decent test levels, then id go with the real deal. Hopefully u guys can catch where im goin with this now...
 
SeniorXJ said:
Yeah i know theres deff no way supps can match up to aas, but if a stack of todays test boosters can get my test levels into decent numbers, then id do a supp stack instead. The kicker here is that if im spending more money on stacking the supps just to get decent test levels, then id go with the real deal. Hopefully u guys can catch where im goin with this now...
Click to expand...

So we are weighing the difference between TRT and DAA for testosterone levels?? :)
 
....take your daa eat clean and drop the adipose tissue... Rome wasn't build in a day brah..good luck with however you decide to work it... I'm in for this thread.. I'm a T2 diabetic with 289 test levels... would love to hear feedback from you're original post, there are great folks on AM you'll get your answers. just ordered my first jug of daa by the way..
 
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