AndroHard v3 is here -- Muscle Density, Strength & Aggression - Natural GYNO reversal

Nice to see advice that doesn't get the person to buy more of the product. What dose of nolva would you recommend for pct for 8 weeks AM 8 weeks 1/2 dose AH?
 
oufinny said:
I am thinking that 8 weeks of AndroHard at a full dose sounds like a plan to me. Curious if anyone has considered running it alongside test E at say 500mg/wk? I know that is something I am seriously considering knowing that to get Masteron or something like that it would end up costing about the same and is that much less to inject.
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I (this being completely theoretical of course) am currently on 500mg/wk test-e, and have been seriously considering grabbing some AndroHard to throw on top of it.
 
bigdavid said:
Nice to see advice that doesn't get the person to buy more of the product. What dose of nolva would you recommend for pct for 8 weeks AM 8 weeks 1/2 dose AH?
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Depends on your comfort level. We officially recommend the TRS, especially with the addition of the TCF-1 and the lowered suppression of these products, it is a safe bet for recovery. Others prefer to add a SERM in, which is an alright choice to make as well, really comes down to what you are comfortable with.
 
HereToStudy said:
I (this being completely theoretical of course) am currently on 500mg/wk test-e, and have been seriously considering grabbing some AndroHard to throw on top of it.
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It is very similar to mast/primo so no reason it would not be a great addition to test. It is definitely high on my list of activities in the new year after my elbow is 100%.
 
bill86 said:
hmm... i may have to go with this plan then. my friend just had gyno surgery a couple of months ago and has some epi he doesnt want that he said i could have for free. id like to get the full benefit of AH (so obviously i'd need to run at normal dosage), but am still somewhat hesitant to run for only 4 weeks (despite being my first cycle, i feel like a couple weeks of a mild methyl like epi to kickstart and help stretch the cycle may be beneficial). i'd like to be able to run trs as a solo pct... i guess my logic was that the epi will kickstart the cycle, but my body will return to homeostasis rather quickly after switching to AH with regard to BP and lipids, and while epi is supposed to combat gyno, it actually exacerbated my friends, so the AH would act as somewhat of a pct (poor choice of words, sorry) for the possible gyno effects of the epi, and i'd have an easy transition into a simple TRS PCT after those 4 AH weeks.......... but then, as i said, theres the issue of more suppression because of the kickstart/6 week cycle... guess its a matter of give and take... if you want the best possible results, you run the higher risk of being shutdown, but if you settle for a 4 week cycle (or longer of JUST AH) you don't have to worry as much


thanks for the help!
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Glad you may have gotten some useful info there Bill -- Ending cycles with Andro only would definitely be in your best interest for not only an "easier pct" but also having an active defense against the possibility of delayed onset gyno from kickstarting epi/sd --(assuming you conclude the cycle w/AndroHard)

-Matt
 
MattPorter said:
Glad you may have gotten some useful info there Bill -- Ending cycles with Andro only would definitely be in your best interest for not only an "easier pct" but also having an active defense against the possibility of delayed onset gyno from kickstarting epi/sd --(assuming you conclude the cycle w/AndroHard)

-Matt
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yeah, i would end on AH... i really appreciate all the help and info, im nowhere near as knowledgeable as you guys about these things, so i thought my logic on the AH helping ease into pct might have been just flat out wrong, very happy to know its do-able.
 
bill86 said:
yeah, i would end on AH... i really appreciate all the help and info, im nowhere near as knowledgeable as you guys about these things, so i thought my logic on the AH helping ease into pct might have been just flat out wrong, very happy to know its do-able.
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And it will continue to harden you up which is what the Epi will already start doing. Also, you aren't going to feel too nice after a cycle like that and the AH should help, especially if you are running something like old school dermacrine or transderm as a test base. Actually, I wouldn't even attempt that cycle without one of those due to the lethargy from SD.
 
oufinny said:
And it will continue to harden you up which is what the Epi will already start doing. Also, you aren't going to feel too nice after a cycle like that and the AH should help, especially if you are running something like old school dermacrine or transderm as a test base. Actually, I wouldn't even attempt that cycle without one of those due to the lethargy from SD.
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wait, we might be on different pages. i wasnt going to run sd at all, just 'kickstart' the 4 week AH cycle with 2 weeks of epi (my friend has some left over that he doesnt want, and i wanted to run for 5-6 weeks, so i figured id throw it in there).... would that still be bad psychologically/with regard to lethargy?

i was going to keep it mild, epistane at 10 mg day 1, 20 day 2, 30 throughout, then switch over to AH at full dosage beginning week 3
 
bill86 said:
wait, we might be on different pages. i wasnt going to run sd at all, just 'kickstart' the 4 week AH cycle with 2 weeks of epi (my friend has some left over that he doesnt want, and i wanted to run for 5-6 weeks, so i figured id throw it in there).... would that still be bad psychologically/with regard to lethargy?

i was going to keep it mild, epistane at 10 mg day 1, 20 day 2, 30 throughout, then switch over to AH at full dosage beginning week 3
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Epi is a feel good DS, you will enjoy it, especially in week 2. I would just run it at 30 until you run out even if it overlaps into the AH. Those two together will be a strength stack like you wouldn't believe. Epi makes me crazy strong after the first week, just don't dose too high as you pay for it in the joints. Good man on not using SD, I seriously think that should be left to those with no other options to gain mass, it is brutal.
 
thanks for the help man... i was just worried that the TRS wouldnt suffice if i stacked the epi with AH for very long (already a little on the fence about running the TRS without a serm for a 6 week cycle)

with regard to sd - yeah, this would be my first cycle, so id like to see how my body/brain responds to some mild compounds... i HIGHLY doubt id ever run sd anyway as im a hypochondriac, haha, so id be freaking out about what would be going on with me internally... i have heard decent things about low dose SD pulses, but thats a whole other thread haha (my friend ran sd as his first cycle without proper pct and ended up with gyno... its only on one side and not really noticeable except under certain conditions, but still)
 
So if AH = masteron effect........the AL = anavar/primo type effects? I already assumed AB = deca effect and AM = enanthate/cypionate effect, but I could be wrong. Was curious on the AL......
 
WARBIRDWS6 said:
So if AH = masteron effect........the AL = anavar/primo type effects? I already assumed AB = deca effect and AM = enanthate/cypionate effect, but I could be wrong. Was curious on the AL......
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Everything except AL would be accurate. I'm not sure what would be a good comparison for AL would be.
 
Rodja said:
Everything except AL would be accurate. I'm not sure what would be a good comparison for AL would be.
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haha, that is why I was confused with that one. seems like it's not so harsh as test, but then again didn't compare exactly with anavar or anything super mild like that.... fat burning and cortisol blocking, with some decent anabolic action and low androgenic effect, sort of a combo of a lot of drugs in one application. Hey if it works well it would be in a league of its own I suppose.
 
Rodja said:
Everything except AL would be accurate. I'm not sure what would be a good comparison for AL would be.
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AL as I see it is just a more bio-available form of 11-oxo, and ingredient in it, and probably the only product that has a useful dose 7-keto. It is so bad for oral dosing that 7-keto is only good in AL or as a transdermal and you can never get pure 7-keto powder.
 
oufinny said:
AL as I see it is just a more bio-available form of 11-oxo, and ingredient in it, and probably the only product that has a useful dose 7-keto. It is so bad for oral dosing that 7-keto is only good in AL or as a transdermal and you can never get pure 7-keto powder.
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that makes sense. things don't always need to be compared to actual steroids.
 
WARBIRDWS6 said:
haha, that is why I was confused with that one. seems like it's not so harsh as test, but then again didn't compare exactly with anavar or anything super mild like that.... fat burning and cortisol blocking, with some decent anabolic action and low androgenic effect, sort of a combo of a lot of drugs in one application. Hey if it works well it would be in a league of its own I suppose.
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I did a "ghetto test run" with powder 7keto (400mg) + powder 11-oxo (1200mg) and felt awesome pumps within 2 sets of working out. Was alarmed by the lower back pumps that you would "normally" get from harsher compounds.

Stomach felt tighter within 1 week.

It really made me happy for what AndroLean v3 will bring to the table.

Stacking it with HARD --- Wow, I will have all my competitors on it pre-contest

-Matt
 
How much oral 7-keto are you supposed to take anyways? I bought some just recent, since I avoid stimulants. Wasn't sure what the effective dose was and hadn't researched it yet.
 
MattPorter said:
I did a "ghetto test run" with powder 7keto (400mg) + powder 11-oxo (1200mg) and felt awesome pumps within 2 sets of working out. Was alarmed by the lower back pumps that you would "normally" get from harsher compounds.

Stomach felt tighter within 1 week.

It really made me happy for what AndroLean v3 will bring to the table.

Stacking it with HARD --- Wow, I will have all my competitors on it pre-contest

-Matt
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Oh, you answered the question as I posted it about 7-keto lol.
 
MattPorter said:
The humanetics studies were done on a standard 200mg dose -- but im an extreme person so I of course doubled it:)

-Matt
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don't you always have to double the suggested dosage on most supps? label says 1-2 100mg a day. Maybe I'll split the difference between "suggested" and "maniacal" and take 3 a day. LOL.....
 
MattPorter said:
It would 200mg of 7 & 11 oxo

However that 200 will deliver upwards of 95%! --Not 3-5% like straight powders

-Matt
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AH yes, with the delivery system. :D
Odd question for you Matt, but since there is no AL thread yet and we are on the subject, would you suggest stacking AL with AM? Or would it be better to do AH/AL? Say we take your blast/cruise philosophy into consideration. Go from a blast, to a cruise, then would you suggest a cruise dose of AM and reg dose of AL to Cut up towards the end? Or switch entirely into two full doses of AL and AH and drop the dosage of AM completely?
 
mattrag said:
AH yes, with the delivery system. :D
Odd question for you Matt, but since there is no AL thread yet and we are on the subject, would you suggest stacking AL with AM? Or would it be better to do AH/AL? Say we take your blast/cruise philosophy into consideration. Go from a blast, to a cruise, then would you suggest a cruise dose of AM and reg dose of AL to Cut up towards the end? Or switch entirely into two full doses of AL and AH and drop the dosage of AM completely?
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lol.... lets take a look here --

BLAST on 8 weeks of Mass + (hard or bulk) at 12 softgels total.......
Cruise for 4-8 weeks w/Mass 4 softgels
BLAST on 8 weeks of LEAN + HARD at 12 softgels total

Keep in mind -- you can stack Mass & Lean as the 11-oxo could definitely add to the anabolic effect of the cycle

while keeping you leaner too.

When you "cruise" 3-4 softgels dosed ONCE in the morning should allow LH and FSH to stay normal as 6 softgels proved that (more low/normal)

I might even theorize and say that dosing D-aspartic acid (TCF-1) at night before bed would further keep LH and FSH signaling at a high level.

Replicate an "Hcg" type effect.

-Matt
 
MattPorter said:
lol.... lets take a look here --

BLAST on 8 weeks of Mass + (hard or bulk) at 12 softgels total.......
Cruise for 4-8 weeks w/Mass 4 softgels
BLAST on 8 weeks of LEAN + HARD at 12 softgels total

Keep in mind -- you can stack Mass & Lean as the 11-oxo could definitely add to the anabolic effect of the cycle

while keeping you leaner too.

When you "cruise" 3-4 softgels dosed ONCE in the morning should allow LH and FSH to stay normal as 6 softgels proved that (more low/normal)

I might even theorize and say that dosing D-aspartic acid (TCF-1) at night before bed would further keep LH and FSH signaling at a high level.

Replicate an "Hcg" type effect.

-Matt
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thanks man! That looks great hehe.
 
MattPorter said:
lol.... lets take a look here --

BLAST on 8 weeks of Mass + (hard or bulk) at 12 softgels total.......
Cruise for 4-8 weeks w/Mass 4 softgels
BLAST on 8 weeks of LEAN + HARD at 12 softgels total

Keep in mind -- you can stack Mass & Lean as the 11-oxo could definitely add to the anabolic effect of the cycle

while keeping you leaner too.

When you "cruise" 3-4 softgels dosed ONCE in the morning should allow LH and FSH to stay normal as 6 softgels proved that (more low/normal)

I might even theorize and say that dosing D-aspartic acid (TCF-1) at night before bed would further keep LH and FSH signaling at a high level.

Replicate an "Hcg" type effect.

-Matt
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ok I'm listening

haha
 
Just trying to give people some new things to consider -- so many different ways to approach diet/training/hormones/ ....

-Matt
 
MattPorter said:
Just trying to give people some new things to consider -- so many different ways to approach diet/training/hormones/ ....

-Matt
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You're kinda like "good cop" with all the various push it to the limit suggestions everybody likes, and Rodja is like "bad cop" advising safety first LOL or is it the other way around? hahahahahaha
 
MattPorter said:
lol.... lets take a look here --

BLAST on 8 weeks of Mass + (hard or bulk) at 12 softgels total.......
Cruise for 4-8 weeks w/Mass 4 softgels
BLAST on 8 weeks of LEAN + HARD at 12 softgels total

Keep in mind -- you can stack Mass & Lean as the 11-oxo could definitely add to the anabolic effect of the cycle

while keeping you leaner too.

When you "cruise" 3-4 softgels dosed ONCE in the morning should allow LH and FSH to stay normal as 6 softgels proved that (more low/normal)

I might even theorize and say that dosing D-aspartic acid (TCF-1) at night before bed would further keep LH and FSH signaling at a high level.

Replicate an "Hcg" type effect.

-Matt
Click to expand...

So you think the AH/AM should be fulled dosed for 8 weeks??? lol
 
WARBIRDWS6 said:
You're kinda like "good cop" with all the various push it to the limit suggestions everybody likes, and Rodja is like "bad cop" advising safety first LOL or is it the other way around? hahahahahaha
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I always err on the side of caution and am an advocate of using the least amount you can to get the desired effect.

For example, I have a friend that is convinced that he can't grow on less than 750mg/week of Test E and he's not a mass monster. He's big, but about 230 at 6'3". Meanwhile, I have another friend, who is about the same weight, but only 5'7" and he only uses 400mg/week because he's much more in tune with his training.
 
Rodja said:
I always err on the side of caution and am an advocate of using the least amount you can to get the desired effect.

For example, I have a friend that is convinced that he can't grow on less than 750mg/week of Test E and he's not a mass monster. He's big, but about 230 at 6'3". Meanwhile, I have another friend, who is about the same weight, but only 5'7" and he only uses 400mg/week because he's much more in tune with his training.
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More gear won't help much if diet and training aren't in check. I have got lax on cycles before and it did not amount to much in terms of body composition changes and/or strength gains. It all starts in the kitchen and the weight room, everything else just adds to the cumulative effect of it all.
 
oufinny said:
More gear won't help much if diet and training aren't in check. I have got lax on cycles before and it did not amount to much in terms of body composition changes and/or strength gains. It all starts in the kitchen and the weight room, everything else just adds to the cumulative effect of it all.
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100% agree.
 
O I deff understand that I plan on running the new lean for 8 weeks prob over summer. Just curious about the lean v2 + plus hard v3 since I can get a few bottles of lean v2 now. Messaged Matt Porter a few times and I am going to try out low carbs for the first time in my life. Was planning on bulking but will prob try to get down to lower body fat first by dieting on my own and then add in hard v3/lean v2 for 8 weeks to see how low I can get my bf before slowly bulking after that. My friend brandon (bkx90) as you have seen from his log is having a lot of success with lean v2 so I am inclined to give it a try.
 
bigdavid said:
O I deff understand that I plan on running the new lean for 8 weeks prob over summer. Just curious about the lean v2 + plus hard v3 since I can get a few bottles of lean v2 now. Messaged Matt Porter a few times and I am going to try out low carbs for the first time in my life. Was planning on bulking but will prob try to get down to lower body fat first by dieting on my own and then add in hard v3/lean v2 for 8 weeks to see how low I can get my bf before slowly bulking after that. My friend brandon (bkx90) as you have seen from his log is having a lot of success with lean v2 so I am inclined to give it a try.
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His log and progress are definitely impressive.
 
JudgementDay said:
So you think the AH/AM should be fulled dosed for 8 weeks??? lol
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GUYS! I was just giving a hypothetical as I was asked about "blasting and cruising."

I surely am NOT a pusher of HIGH dose hormones as anyone who knows me knows I have NEVER been on level playing field with

my fellow competitors at ANY show I have done. I have ALWAYS used minimal amounts and milked them for all there worth.

However - after a certain period....you simply must UP THE DOSE -- bottom line. But that is until you stressed all other facets first!

Everyones "blasting" amounts is different as well as "cruising" amounts. For example:

Joe may blast w/ 2grams of testosterone and cruise on 500mg.

Frank may blast on 800mg of testosterone and cruise on 250mg.

It's all relevant to the individual. Same goes for AndroSeries --

HELL YES if you can get great gains with 4 mass + 4 Hards as blasting GREAT! now you can try 5 and 5 next, then 6 and 6 ....

MOVE UP THE LADDER SLOWLY!

More quality in gains

-Matt
 
MattPorter said:
GUYS! I was just giving a hypothetical as I was asked about "blasting and cruising."

I surely am NOT a pusher of HIGH dose hormones as anyone who knows me knows I have NEVER been on level playing field with

my fellow competitors at ANY show I have done. I have ALWAYS used minimal amounts and milked them for all there worth.

However - after a certain period....you simply must UP THE DOSE -- bottom line. But that is until you stressed all other facets first!

Everyones "blasting" amounts is different as well as "cruising" amounts. For example:

Joe may blast w/ 2grams of testosterone and cruise on 500mg.

Frank may blast on 800mg of testosterone and cruise on 250mg.

It's all relevant to the individual. Same goes for AndroSeries --

HELL YES if you can get great gains with 4 mass + 4 Hards as blasting GREAT! now you can try 5 and 5 next, then 6 and 6 ....

MOVE UP THE LADDER SLOWLY!

More quality in gains

-Matt
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Also the COST goes down doing it this way. Sometimes a higher dose does not help and has unwanted side effects as well. Look at test, long ester test a high dose will aromatize into estrogen at a high rate and you will need a hefty dose of AI to combat which will lower your gains potential. High dosing hormones is all well and good but it comes with a price on the wallet and the body. I think PP did a great job making the doses very liberal, like we do at BPS ;), but leaving enough flexibility for any level of user.
 
MattPorter said:
GUYS! I was just giving a hypothetical as I was asked about "blasting and cruising."

I surely am NOT a pusher of HIGH dose hormones as anyone who knows me knows I have NEVER been on level playing field with

my fellow competitors at ANY show I have done. I have ALWAYS used minimal amounts and milked them for all there worth.

However - after a certain period....you simply must UP THE DOSE -- bottom line. But that is until you stressed all other facets first!

Everyones "blasting" amounts is different as well as "cruising" amounts. For example:

Joe may blast w/ 2grams of testosterone and cruise on 500mg.

Frank may blast on 800mg of testosterone and cruise on 250mg.

It's all relevant to the individual. Same goes for AndroSeries --

HELL YES if you can get great gains with 4 mass + 4 Hards as blasting GREAT! now you can try 5 and 5 next, then 6 and 6 ....

MOVE UP THE LADDER SLOWLY!

More quality in gains

-Matt
Click to expand...

As far as my comment I was just joking, making an exaggeration.....It's good that you are inventive and creative with your thinking/cycles. Nobody is forcing anybody to do anything on here, everybody is grown enough to make their own decisions.
 
MattPorter said:
GUYS! I was just giving a hypothetical as I was asked about "blasting and cruising."

I surely am NOT a pusher of HIGH dose hormones as anyone who knows me knows I have NEVER been on level playing field with

my fellow competitors at ANY show I have done. I have ALWAYS used minimal amounts and milked them for all there worth.

However - after a certain period....you simply must UP THE DOSE -- bottom line. But that is until you stressed all other facets first!

Everyones "blasting" amounts is different as well as "cruising" amounts. For example:

Joe may blast w/ 2grams of testosterone and cruise on 500mg.

Frank may blast on 800mg of testosterone and cruise on 250mg.

It's all relevant to the individual. Same goes for AndroSeries --

HELL YES if you can get great gains with 4 mass + 4 Hards as blasting GREAT! now you can try 5 and 5 next, then 6 and 6 ....

MOVE UP THE LADDER SLOWLY!

More quality in gains

-Matt
Click to expand...

I was just asking about it in the sense that people do test cycles of blasting and cruising. And I was wondering if it was possible with the AndroSeries. Im not saying we should, just if it was possible and if so, what would be a sample of this protocol.

Thanks Matt for responding.
 
mattrag said:
I was just asking about it in the sense that people do test cycles of blasting and cruising. And I was wondering if it was possible with the AndroSeries. Im not saying we should, just if it was possible and if so, what would be a sample of this protocol.

Thanks Matt for responding.
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There was a pretty large thread about using AH as a "bridge."
 
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