12 good reasons a keto diet blows!!

[jlinteris]

Zir,

I'm not sure if you're familiar with Layne Norton, but he is one of the few people that is both a scholar and in the industry. He has his pro card and, I believe, has the highest PL'ing total in his weight class (IPF). His main area of research is leucine and mTOR and he received his PhD for this work.

Not even close to highest IPF total... however he is impressively strong. I read his work. His discussions on supplementing with leucine and isoleucine at different stages during the day makes a lot of sense. Certainly someone whose information I would trust.

 

[JudoJosh]

I'll post in bold below...



Br

Thanks for your response bud :fing02:

I used to be a big pusher of the Keto diet as I had used it for about 6 months and saw a transformation of my body. I was telling everyone how awesome this diet was.. well that was until I started reading on Paleo diet and specifically the book Protein Power. I then started to tweak my diet more along the guidelines of "The Diet Solution" by Derek Charlebois and have experienced that same amount of weight loss as when I was keto. My attention shifted to that beyond simply weight loss but the general health benefits that are obtained through food. My new concern is primarily my health and the weight loss is just a side added benefit. I don't think carb should be completely eliminated from anyones diet, especially for extended periods of time or lifestyle diets.

 

[ZiR RED]

Thanks for your response bud :fing02:

I used to be a big pusher of the Keto diet as I had used it for about 6 months and saw a transformation of my body. I was telling everyone how awesome this diet was.. well that was until I started reading on Paleo diet and specifically the book Protein Power. I then started to tweak my diet more along the guidelines of "The Diet Solution" by Derek Charlebois and have experienced that same amount of weight loss as when I was keto. My attention shifted to that beyond simply weight loss but the general health benefits that are obtained through food. My new concern is primarily my health and the weight loss is just a side added benefit. I don't think carb should be completely eliminated from anyones diet, especially for extended periods of time or lifestyle diets.

Ha, I think I read one of the first versions of that back in high school. That and then optimal sports nutrition by Michael Colgan were the two first nutrition books I ever read.

Sprint performance and health/longevity are my two main dietary/training goals. A major downfall I see in the bodybuilding population (as far as nutrition is concerned) is the overlooking of the importance of variety in nutrition and focus on minimally processed whole foods to obtain an optimal ratio of micro and phyto nutrients.

Br

 

[Rodja]

Not even close to highest IPF total... however he is impressively strong. I read his work. His discussions on supplementing with leucine and isoleucine at different stages during the day makes a lot of sense. Certainly someone whose information I would trust.

It's actually APA and he set the DL record and did a token BP at the event. He was still nursing his pec injury during that meet (1525 total at 220).

 

[CoorsLight126]

I call bull**** on every reason you posted. You should have a listen to Dr. Scott Connelly, and you'll hear the true scientific evidence for why what you are saying is complete and utter nonsense. Nevermind the countless practical trials that have been done by me and others on keto diets of countless variety, but take a look at as you said what our ancestors really ate. You think they were eating 400 grams of carbs a day EVER??? (even 100 grams would have been hard to come by) ... If you believe that I have a few bridges I want to sell you in Brooklyn and San Francisco. Early humans ate what they were intended to eat... proteins and fats along with the VERY few natural grains (sprouted grains), fruits, and roots that were naturally growing. Modern agriculture has drastically changed the actual nature of grains to the extent that they do not even remotely resemble their naturally occurring varieties.

BEAST

yea yea yea, ancestors. Ancestors,ancestors, ancestors. They also were not lifting 300 lbs and growing our current size either. I guess our ancestors didn't drink 2 gallons/day of Crystal light either? But I still see guys drinking that instead of water and coming down to 3-4% bodyfat. But our ancestors didnt do it. I brought my last guy into his show at 2.9% bodyfat and his carbs were at 300 grams/day the entire diet. Keto just isn't necessary for 90% of people unless they are genetically endomorphs or obese. Its stupid, your training your ass off, doing cardio, now your going to take out all of your muscles primary energy source. I still stand by my 12 reasons keto diets SUCK

 

[JudoJosh]

yea yea yea, ancestors. Ancestors,ancestors, ancestors. They also were not lifting 300 lbs and growing our current size either. I guess our ancestors didn't drink 2 gallons/day of Crystal light either? But I still see guys drinking that instead of water and coming down to 3-4% bodyfat. But our ancestors didnt do it. I brought my last guy into his show at 2.9% bodyfat and his carbs were at 300 grams/day the entire diet. Keto just isn't necessary for 90% of people unless they are genetically endomorphs or obese. Its stupid, your training your ass off, doing cardio, now your going to take out all of your muscles primary energy source. I still stand by my 12 reasons keto diets SUCK

Any idea how much a animal carcass weighs? Or the distance they had to travel?

You could have made an argument that our ancestors were way more active then us but not that they weren't strong.

Hauling back kills across miles and miles sounds pretty strong to me :dunno:

 

[soontobbeast]

i love these guys that talk about ''primal man''. and hauling pterodactyls across miles. LOL!

dudes, the flinstones isn't real. yall are acting like you had a camcorder and recorded that **** the way you are talking about it. or maybe you are the guy from land of the lost? you don't know **** about what people did back then. or how muscular they were.

:lmao:

 

[Rodja]

i love these guys that talk about ''primal man''. and hauling pterodactyls across miles. LOL!

dudes, the flinstones isn't real. yall are acting like you had a camcorder and recorded that **** the way you are talking about it. or maybe you are the guy from land of the lost? you don't know **** about what people did back then. or how muscular they were.

:lmao:

You always lack an intelligent rebuttal. We have a general idea of what the Paleolithic man looks like advanced replication techniques.

In case you were curious, they did haul back large animals (e.g. wildebeasts). You really need to do some more research and stay away from FLEX magazine.

 

[soontobbeast]

You always lack an intelligent rebuttal. We have a general idea of what the Paleolithic man looks like advanced replication techniques.

In case you were curious, they did haul back large animals (e.g. wildebeasts). You really need to do some more research and stay away from FLEX magazine.

nothing in this thread warrants an intelligent rebuttal.


I'm not exactly dealing with brainiacs, obviously.

 

[Rodja]

nothing in this thread warrants an intelligent rebuttal.


I'm not exactly dealing with brainiacs, obviously.

Then why chime in at all? It seems ironic that you would openly flame this thread, but offer nothing substantial to the conversation.

 

[jlinteris]

Then why chime in at all? It seems ironic that you would openly flame this thread, but offer nothing substantial to the conversation.

dude I see this guy trolling over the website. I wouldnt give him anymore of your time.

 

[rjp3900]

...although there was greater fat loss in the low carb in males (8lbs vs 4lbs) there was also a greater lean mass loss (2.5lbs vs less than .5lbs).... So that directly refutes greater lean mass retention on a ketogenic diet.

Does "lean mass" or "fat-free mass" not include water, glycogen, bone, blood, etc.? The study didn't say, "muscle loss." Of course a keto diet is going to affect your lean mass. I'd think you'd be down pounds of glycogen in the least.

 

[JudoJosh]

i love these guys that talk about ''primal man''. and hauling pterodactyls across miles. LOL!

dudes, the flinstones isn't real. yall are acting like you had a camcorder and recorded that **** the way you are talking about it. or maybe you are the guy from land of the lost? you don't know **** about what people did back then. or how muscular they were.

:lmao:

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Anderson, J.K. (1985). Hunting in the Ancient World. Berkeley, CA: University of California Press.

Eaton, S.B., Shostak, M., and Konner, M. (1988). The Paleolithic Prescription: A Program of Diet and Exercise and a Design for Living. New York: Harper and Row.

Garnsey, P. (1999). Food and Society in Classical Antiquity. New York: Cambridge University Press.

:think:

 

[bla55]

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Anderson, J.K. (1985). Hunting in the Ancient World. Berkeley, CA: University of California Press.

Eaton, S.B., Shostak, M., and Konner, M. (1988). The Paleolithic Prescription: A Program of Diet and Exercise and a Design for Living. New York: Harper and Row.

Garnsey, P. (1999). Food and Society in Classical Antiquity. New York: Cambridge University Press.

:think:

Some good links there, very nice reading.

I will say, though, I'm surprised someone "wasted" time answering to that dumbnuts.

 

[JudoJosh]

Some good links there, very nice reading.

I will say, though, I'm surprised someone "wasted" time answering to that dumbnuts.

It wasn't really a waste of time I had those on hand already. Even though "nothing in any of his comments warranted an intelligent response" I figured I would share those.

That response is actually pretty common when you speak with someone about a paleo lifestyle.

The problem is they base their idea of what a caveman looks like based off the images of cartoons like Flintstones or basically a fat man with long hair and a club. They forget that there are people in the world that devote their lives to anthropology and have a pretty good idea of what primitive lifestyle was like, although it is a lot of theory but that is all of science.

I mean its common sense, all tribes have hunter gather members and they are the strongest ones. These men go out into the woods/jungle/etc and hunt down animals for food.

How much do you think a lion weights? or a zebra? or antelope? And how do you think they get it back to the tribe? U-haul? They would have to carry/drag it back. I don't think you need studies to put that together it is sort of common sense that the hunter gathers were pretty strong people.

Also one of those studies takes a look at a hunter gather tribe where the woman are actually the ones that go out and hunt and bring back the kills. Can you imagine the thighs on them ladies! :naughty:

 

[jlinteris]

It wasn't really a waste of time I had those on hand already. Even though "nothing in any of his comments warranted an intelligent response" I figured I would share those.

That response is actually pretty common when you speak with someone about a paleo lifestyle.

The problem is they base their idea of what a caveman looks like based off the images of cartoons like Flintstones or basically a fat man with long hair and a club. They forget that there are people in the world that devote their lives to anthropology and have a pretty good idea of what primitive lifestyle was like, although it is a lot of theory but that is all of science.

I mean its common sense, all tribes have hunter gather members and they are the strongest ones. These men go out into the woods/jungle/etc and hunt down animals for food.

How much do you think a lion weights? or a zebra? or antelope? And how do you think they get it back to the tribe? U-haul? They would have to carry/drag it back. I don't think you need studies to put that together it is sort of common sense that the hunter gathers were pretty strong people.

Also one of those studies takes a look at a hunter gather tribe where the woman are actually the ones that go out and hunt and bring back the kills. Can you imagine the thighs on them ladies! :naughty:

Well maybe they just cut the meat into manageable 3lb pieces and make 400 trips? ha

 

[CoorsLight126]

every one of these arguments ends being the same thing. People start arguing and posting up studies to prove a point "See I told you so" whats wrong with using myself as a study? All of these new peptides and everything, we are the guinea pigs!! Screw primal man, all i know is I can eat moderate carbs and take my fat intake really low and get shredded. I dont give a **** what primal man did, I'm the T-1000 damnit!!!

 

[JudoJosh]

every one of these arguments ends being the same thing. People start arguing and posting up studies to prove a point "See I told you so" whats wrong with using myself as a study? All of these new peptides and everything, we are the guinea pigs!! Screw primal man, all i know is I can eat moderate carbs and take my fat intake really low and get shredded. I dont give a **** what primal man did, I'm the T-1000 damnit!!!

Absolutely nothing, and I agree to some extent we all should be trying things on ourselves to see how we react to them and not base everything 100% off of studies.

BUT I think you should have more of an understanding of the functions of the body before making statements such as you don't need fat intake.

Not everything is about body composition, you can be shredded and still have high cholesterol, still have gut issues, still have a weak immune system, still have inflammation, etc. Not to say that you personally have those problems just speaking in general. Someones outside appearance isn't evidence of their internal health.

 

[Rodja]

every one of these arguments ends being the same thing. People start arguing and posting up studies to prove a point "See I told you so" whats wrong with using myself as a study? All of these new peptides and everything, we are the guinea pigs!! Screw primal man, all i know is I can eat moderate carbs and take my fat intake really low and get shredded. I dont give a **** what primal man did, I'm the T-1000 damnit!!!

Basic scientific principles: n=1 and your "study" is not reliable.

Also, you keep harping on the aesthetic end and completely disregard the health aspect.

 

[ZiR RED]

What would be really interesting is to sample the digestive, pancreatic, and liver enzymes of societies who still live primitively (ie: hunter/gatherer types) and compare them to more modern farming societies...say the amish since they eat very little processed foods. We could then see if there is any adaptation by the digestive/endocrine system to process the difference in domestication of grains and high grain consumption.

Br

 

[Rodja]

What would be really interesting is to sample the digestive, pancreatic, and liver enzymes of societies who still live primitively (ie: hunter/gatherer types) and compare them to more modern farming societies...say the amish since they eat very little processed foods. We could then see if there is any adaptation by the digestive/endocrine system to process the difference in domestication of grains and high grain consumption.

Br

I'd love to see that.

 

[MrKleen73]

Now that would be interesting. This thread has become a great learning tool.

 

[Tymba]

Since this threads start, delete everyone who's running f****** Tren while arguing this. And then see who's left

F****** idiots

 

[nicksox15]

You just bumped a six year old thread to say that?

 

[Tymba]

I was mostly mad I got a random notification pushed to my phone about it, like why did you cover up one of my text messages as I was typing to tell me about a six year old thread lol

 

[MrKleen73]

You just bumped a six year old thread to say that?

No doubt and it isn't even a complete thought. Just a random post talking about Tren which has nothing to do with keto dieting... Not even sure if he is pro, or against keto from this post.