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Opinion: Best "Legal" Steroid

halodrol is best for lean mass with minimal sides. primordial performance has the cheapest and best product mg per mg. called turinabol. SD gives more strength but with a lot more sides. i am personally dealing with gyno from it currently.
 
^^I second the halodrol suggestion and specifically PP's Turinabol LV (Invalid Link Removed) b/c it blows away all of the other halodrol clones and you do get more bang for your buck.

Bottom line: IMO, Halodrol is the best legal steroid in terms of benefits/gains:risk/sides ratio. Even epi has more sides than halodrol, and superdrol has a helluvalot more sides than any of them.
 
SD is the best for me, but if ur wondering what u should run, I'd say turinabol lv. If u do that, u wont be sorry... trust us
 
qwerty33;2385321[B said:
]halodrol is best for lean mass with minimal sides. [/B]primordial performance has the cheapest and best product mg per mg. called turinabol. SD gives more strength but with a lot more sides. i am personally dealing with gyno from it currently.
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thats the eact reason im going to run it this summer, looking for solid gains that stick.
cycle may look like this
Turinabol LV 1-6 60mg
Dermacrine Topical week1-6 5pumps
liver juice 1-10
white flood
kre alkalyn
hawthorne if needed
toco8 for cholesterol
need2slin or glycobol
PCT
torem
testopro or isatest
sustain alpha
 
dumbhick3 said:
^^I second the halodrol suggestion and specifically PP's Turinabol LV (Invalid Link Removed) b/c it blows away all of the other halodrol clones and you do get more bang for your buck.

Bottom line: IMO, Halodrol is the best legal steroid in terms of benefits/gains:risk/sides ratio. Even epi has more sides than halodrol, and superdrol has a helluvalot more sides than any of them.
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Hmm this is interesting. I'm currently running sd now and havent had any sides at all except for some lethargy on the weekends when I dont workout. I had abs. horrible sides on epi during cycle and pct. I will never use that again lol
 
Interesting how things can effect people differently. I ran EPI @ 40 and had no sides other than back pumps, which were manageable with taurine.
 
Yea..it is interesting how they affect people differently. Epi gave me no sides running up to 50 in the last week, Methadrol/PPlex no sides except for some very minor lethargy and minor stomach bloat. Couldnt have felt better on the latter...
 
I'd pass on any supplement that could effect eyesight.. Low or high dose- just not worth any kind of risk to me.. I won't even touch clomid for this reason.

I agree with Hdrol, No sides, constant strength gains, harder body composition, slight decrease in BF, slight gain in weight.. was the most pleasant cycle I ever ran
 
MPFit said:
I'd pass on any supplement that could effect eyesight.. Low or high dose- just not worth any kind of risk to me.. I won't even touch clomid for this reason.

I agree with Hdrol, No sides, constant strength gains, harder body composition, slight decrease in BF, slight gain in weight.. was the most pleasant cycle I ever ran
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No vision issues when ran properly.
 
JN230 said:
thats the eact reason im going to run it this summer, looking for solid gains that stick.
cycle may look like this
Turinabol LV 1-6 60mg
Dermacrine Topical week1-6 5pumps
liver juice 1-10
white flood
kre alkalyn
hawthorne if needed
toco8 for cholesterol
need2slin or glycobol
PCT
torem
testopro or isatest
sustain alpha
Click to expand...

Damn bro, nice lookin cycle.

All the stuff that we sell is on sale now. Invalid Link Removed, up to 40% off Everything.

I hope you stocked up during our last sale.:sad6:
 
i've never run p-plex, but i'd say hands down tren. best aggression, nice mass gains, nice recomp effect, best pumps IMO. I love the sh*t
 
I concur with the suggestions about Turinabol LV. I've used it and it's definately a great bang for the buck, with minimal sides. I initially got some back pumps but realized I needed to start with a lower dosage (60mg/pd). After the first week, I bumped it back up to 90mg/pd with no problems, and better results. The strongest I've used was SD, but it's more work managing the sides.
 
Not to hijack you tread, but since we r on the subject what's the best "legal" steroid for body recomp? I've been wanting to start a cycle but ive been having source trouble, so I'm thinking if I keep it legal I might have better luck? Any suggestions? Opinions?
 
perico13 said:
Not to hijack you tread, but since we r on the subject what's the best "legal" steroid for body recomp? I've been wanting to start a cycle but ive been having source trouble, so I'm thinking if I keep it legal I might have better luck? Any suggestions? Opinions?
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I would suggest Invalid Link Removedand Invalid Link Removedfor a recomp.
 
RAZORBACK09 said:
Could Turinabol be stacked with epi or tren?
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It can definitely be stacked with tren.

Some will say you shouldn't stack it with epi....some say you can since they are both mild methyls. However...this cycle would be extremely dry on your joints and you'd probably need to run the h-drol 6 weeks and the epi at least 4 IMO.

H-drol is a class II PH and would really stack well with either epi or tren since they are both class I PHs

H-drol would also be great stacked with something like EQ-plex (bold), 14AD, P-Plex, or a DHT compound (something like AN's The One even though it's discontinued).
 
qwerty33 said:
halodrol is best for lean mass with minimal sides. primordial performance has the cheapest and best product mg per mg. called turinabol. SD gives more strength but with a lot more sides. i am personally dealing with gyno from it currently.
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How did the gyno come about? Was it after cycle or during? If it was during I feel like you weren't using SD and if it was after cycle maybe your PCT wasn't up to par?
 
BigBlackGuy said:
How did the gyno come about? Was it after cycle or during? If it was during I feel like you weren't using SD and if it was after cycle maybe your PCT wasn't up to par?
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Bear in mind that the best cycle and the best pct can still result in gyno months down the road. All depends on how your hormones respond/recover and if you're prone to gyno.
 
Jimbo15 said:
I would suggest Invalid Link Removedand Invalid Link Removedfor a recomp.
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Definitely second this ^^^ For a recomp, I can't really think of a better stack than Invalid Link Removed and Invalid Link Removed, crazy lean gains :)

You read up on other's experiences with Turinabol LV here mate: CLICK HERE

Remember, 40% Invalid Link Removed is on now!
 
UKStrength said:
Definitely second this ^^^ For a recomp, I can't really think of a better stack than Invalid Link Removed and Invalid Link Removed, crazy lean gains :)

You read up on other's experiences with Turinabol LV here mate: CLICK HERE

Remember, 40% Invalid Link Removed is on now!
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I wish I would have known we were coming out with AndroHard a couple months ago, I would have held off on my Dermacrine cycle.
 
UKStrength said:
Definitely second this ^^^ For a recomp, I can't really think of a better stack than Invalid Link Removed and Invalid Link Removed, crazy lean gains :)

You read up on other's experiences with Turinabol LV here mate: CLICK HERE

Remember, 40% Invalid Link Removed is on now!
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I tend to agree with the Turinabol + AndroHard for a recomp. Now if my liver agrees, then it is settled.:tongue2:
 
Jimbo15 said:
This would make a nice stack. You gonna log this?
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If I did, it would just be a simple log, nothing fancy. I anticipate much more frequent trips to the doctor for bloodwork the next time I run a methyl, so I'll be even more pressed for time. But Turinabol is on my list and isn't going away:).
 
dumbhick3 said:
If I did, it would just be a simple log, nothing fancy. I anticipate much more frequent trips to the doctor for bloodwork the next time I run a methyl, so I'll be even more pressed for time. But Turinabol is on my list and isn't going away:).
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If you decide to log this, link us up to it.
 
Jimbo15 said:
I wish I would have known we were coming out with AndroHard a couple months ago, I would have held off on my Dermacrine cycle.
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Same here Jim, I would have added it to my last stack (which was a cutter anyway). Now I've just got to wait a few months to recover then I can hit up the Invalid Link Removed for a big-time lean mass cycle.
 
UKStrength said:
Same here Jim, I would have added it to my last stack (which was a cutter anyway). Now I've just got to wait a few months to recover then I can hit up the Invalid Link Removed for a big-time lean mass cycle.
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I'm finishing up pct this week from a six week dermacrine cycle. I'll probably give it another month before I run androhard.
 
junkyarddogzz said:
No vision issues when ran properly.
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Not true. There are receptors in your eyes that are effected by the drug. This is why eyesight is worsened when on. It should go away afterward, however, once the receptors have cleared.

I don't know why you would post something like that and not define what "ran properly" means. Elaborate please, I'd like to know. :smirk:
 
BigBlackGuy said:
Not true. There are receptors in your eyes that are effected by the drug. This is why eyesight is worsened when on. It should go away afterward, however, once the receptors have cleared.

I don't know why you would post something like that and not define what "ran properly" means. Elaborate please, I'd like to know. :smirk:
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:wt:
 
kickinhigh said:
Sarms S4...I have read that you go night blind...
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That's what I'm sayin, id rather do something tried and true with a predictable outcome rather than buy something that has only been researched for a short time without any long term studies, etc about what sides could be.

Ph ds's can be looked at this way too, but at least we have a clue about its effects and can speculate long term.

My favorite was the now banned ks Trenadrol. Now I like e stane
 
TheDarkHalf said:
It can definitely be stacked with tren.

Some will say you shouldn't stack it with epi....some say you can since they are both mild methyls. However...this cycle would be extremely dry on your joints and you'd probably need to run the h-drol 6 weeks and the epi at least 4 IMO.

H-drol is a class II PH and would really stack well with either epi or tren since they are both class I PHs

H-drol would also be great stacked with something like EQ-plex (bold), 14AD, P-Plex, or a DHT compound (something like AN's The One even though it's discontinued).
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Lol, I have addressed the myth of class I/II steroid distinctions twice today. I should just put the link on my desktop.

This study pretty much put the nail in the coffin on this theory, and supports what I have been saying about the class I/II thoery for about 5 years now (I think its been about that long). [This was posted in 2006]

Anabolic-androgenic steroid interaction with rat androgen receptor in vivo and in vitro: a comparative study. Feldkoren BI, Andersson S. J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol. 2005 Apr;94(5):481-7. Epub 2005 Mar 17.

Anabolic steroids are synthetic derivatives of testosterone and are characterized by their ability to cause nitrogen retention and positive protein metabolism, thereby leading to increased protein synthesis and muscle mass. There are disagreements in the literature in regards to the interaction of anabolic steroids with the androgen receptor (AR) as revealed by competitive ligand binding assays in vitro using cytosolic preparations from prostate and skeletal muscle. By use of tissue extracts, it has been shown that some anabolic steroids have binding affinities for the AR that are higher than that of the natural androgen testosterone, while others such as stanozolol and methanedienone have significantly lower affinities as compared with testosterone. In this study we show that stanozolol and methanedienone are low affinity ligands of the rat recombinant AR as revealed by a ligand binding assay in vitro, however, based on a cell-based AR-dependent transactivation assay, they are potent activators of the AR. We also show that a single injection of stanozolol and methanedienone causes a rapid cytosolic depletion of AR in rat skeletal muscle. Based on these results, we conclude that anabolic steroids with low affinity to AR in vitro, can in fact in vivo act on the AR to cause biological responses.
__________________
William Llewellyn
CEO, Molecular Nutrition
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Invalid Link Removed

Using these erroneous class I/II distinctions (steroid acts mainly through the AR; steroid doesn't act mainly through the AR, etc, which are without basis in vivo where it matters), to construct a stack is not the best approach in my opinion.

I wouldn't stack H-Drol or Turinabol LV with The One or it's clone, D-Plex. D-Plex is pretty toxic IME, esp. at the rec 100mg/day. Not to mention that you are stacking methyls and H-Drol/Turinabol isn't a joke either (liver wise).
 
EatMeat said:
That's what I'm sayin, id rather do something tried and true with a predictable outcome rather than buy something that has only been researched for a short time without any long term studies, etc about what sides could be.

Ph ds's can be looked at this way too, but at least we have a clue about its effects and can speculate long term.

My favorite was the now banned ks Trenadrol. Now I like e stane
Click to expand...

The legality of SARMs is questionable-I don't think they are legal (correct me if I am wrong). They are just not associated with the same criminal penalties as CIII Anabolic Steroids. I don't think S4 is an RX drug (yet, or ever; not sure), but it is probably about as legal as Liqui-Dex and Clomi-Solut (lol). Eyesight does seem to be a common complaint, and I am not interested in being the guinea pig for such little ROI...but I don't like the fact that most of the SARMs S4 is below 90% purity and contains some minor impurities like toluene.:eek5:

I'l stick with my Turinabol LV recommendation; it is still legal for the time-being too.
 
dumbhick3 said:
Lol, I have addressed the myth of class I/II steroid distinctions twice today. I should just put the link on my desktop.



Invalid Link Removed

Using these erroneous class I/II distinctions (steroid acts mainly through the AR; steroid doesn't act mainly through the AR, etc, which are without basis in vivo where it matters), to construct a stack is not the best approach in my opinion.

I wouldn't stack H-Drol or Turinabol LV with The One or it's clone, D-Plex. D-Plex is pretty toxic IME, esp. at the rec 100mg/day. Not to mention that you are stacking methyls and H-Drol/Turinabol isn't a joke either (liver wise).
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Interesting. Maybe it is worth starting a whole new thread about the Class1/Class2 bro science.

I do realize some of the recommendations I gave were for stacking methyls.....really something only an experienced user should do IMO....i've seen some successful cycles with appropriate bloodwork done post cycle and people have come out just fine (although this will not be the case for everyone).

You really think H-drol is really that toxic? I've always been under the impression that it's a fairly mild PH.
 
TheDarkHalf said:
Interesting. Maybe it is worth starting a whole new thread about the Class1/Class2 bro science.

I do realize some of the recommendations I gave were for stacking methyls.....really something only an experienced user should do IMO....i've seen some successful cycles with appropriate bloodwork done post cycle and people have come out just fine (although this will not be the case for everyone).

You really think H-drol is really that toxic? I've always been under the impression that it's a fairly mild PH.
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Stacking methyls is risky no matter what IMO; people do get away with it, but it doesn't mean it's a good idea. Sometimes cholestasis can develop with only minimal changes in liver function as shown by bloodwork (ultrasound reveals billary duct obstruction and similar).

H-Drol/Turinabol LV is probably less liver toxic than equivalent doses of P-Plex and D-Plex for instance, but it is still toxic enough to push ALT over 100 and double AST IME. Some ppl run it with minimal liver dysfunction OTOH. And a few people end up in the hospital. Ask Trauma-he has seen some people in the ER from using H-Drol (and obviously Superdrol). I don't know if they were being stupid with the dose/duration, but it is definitely toxic and moreso for some than others. Also, H-Drol is dosed at 75-100mg/day which increases its toxicity even if its per-mg toxicity is lower than say P-Plex. Its toxicity is probably less, but I always hated the semi-misnomer of "mild methyl" which is often used to describe H-Drol. It is easier on the body than Superdrol, but its hepatic effects are not always mild.

Some will disagree, but I think H-Drol should be treated like the other steroids. Limit the dose and duration and use hepatoprotectants and get bloodwork done and don't stack with another methyl. Even pro-BB'ers rarely stack illegal 17aa orals, and I think a lot of those steroids are less harsh on the liver than the current DS/PH crop. Anavar is the mildest of all on the liver; IM Winstrol cuts down on the toxicity by avoiding 1st pass metabolism; Dianabol is toxic, but not any more so than most of what is being taken today.

This is just my opinion; people will continue to stack methyls and run weak liver support supps and not get bloodwork and so on, but personally I won't do any of that.
 
dumbhick3 said:
Stacking methyls is risky no matter what IMO; people do get away with it, but it doesn't mean it's a good idea. Sometimes cholestasis can develop with only minimal changes in liver function as shown by bloodwork (ultrasound reveals billary duct obstruction and similar).

H-Drol/Turinabol LV is probably less liver toxic than equivalent doses of P-Plex and D-Plex for instance, but it is still toxic enough to push ALT over 100 and double AST IME. Some ppl run it with minimal liver dysfunction OTOH. And a few people end up in the hospital. Ask Trauma-he has seen some people in the ER from using H-Drol (and obviously Superdrol). I don't know if they were being stupid with the dose/duration, but it is definitely toxic and moreso for some than others. Also, H-Drol is dosed at 75-100mg/day which increases its toxicity even if its per-mg toxicity is lower than say P-Plex. Its toxicity is probably less, but I always hated the semi-misnomer of "mild methyl" which is often used to describe H-Drol. It is easier on the body than Superdrol, but its hepatic effects are not always mild.

Some will disagree, but I think H-Drol should be treated like the other steroids. Limit the dose and duration and use hepatoprotectants and get bloodwork done and don't stack with another methyl. Even pro-BB'ers rarely stack illegal 17aa orals, and I think a lot of those steroids are less harsh on the liver than the current DS/PH crop. Anavar is the mildest of all on the liver; IM Winstrol cuts down on the toxicity by avoiding 1st pass metabolism; Dianabol is toxic, but not any more so than most of what is being taken today.

This is just my opinion; people will continue to stack methyls and run weak liver support supps and not get bloodwork and so on, but personally I won't do any of that.
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Good post. You make a good point....no matter how mild something is...if you run enough of it, it will be toxic.

So what then do you consider to be an adequate liver support? I've always preloaded 2 weeks out for my cycles with CEL Cycle Assist....just want to make sure i'm doing what I need to be doing as i've always thought that was enough.
 
In my experience SD has been the strongest overall, with the fasting strength and mass gains, but with pretty harsh sides afterward, and epi being second in line with decent strength gains, and low sides.
 
shizz702 said:
In my experience SD has been the strongest overall, with the fasting strength and mass gains, but with pretty harsh sides afterward, and epi being second in line with decent strength gains, and low sides.
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with the SD don't you feel that you lost a decent amount of the size post cycle?
 
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