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Subcutaneous Testosterone Injections Study

JanSZ,

All those you mentioned, except B12.
Peptides and test mainly.

If it aint broken, dont fix it.
As for blood tests, nope.
Maybe later, when I feel any discomfort.

BigLibido
 
JanSz said:
What is that you are injecting?
Have you been doing blood tests while employing this device, any conclussions?

I am interested in injecting
testosterone
HCG
B12
.
.
Click to expand...

Injects oil: That is very interesting!

Do you ever get any bruising?

Any tenderness in muscle afterwards?

My hCG has a red sticker that states to never shake etc. The pharmacy printed patient info also states this. Perhaps hCG fragments work just as well.
 
Zero Tolerance said:
I just contacted the company asking what procedure is done to avoid injecting the liquid into a vein. With regular needles, we aspirate to make sure no blood makes it's way into the vial. I don't know what the alternative method would be with the Pharmajet product. I hope to have a response shortly...
Click to expand...
What was the company's response?

It seems to me that this device is mainly for vaccinations and the like. I haven't been able to locate a retailer, either.
 
Titleist said:
What was the company's response?

It seems to me that this device is mainly for vaccinations and the like. I haven't been able to locate a retailer, either.
Click to expand...
Sorry. I forgot to reply here...

The injection is a one way injection, in that once you release the trigger, the injection happens in less than 1/3 of a second. One can never aspirate, as in a needle injection. If one injects straight into the area to be injected, one gets a deeper injection. If you pinch up the tissue The depth of penetration varies slightly depending on the tissue site, the amount of fatty tissue and the denseness of the muscle. However, the FDA requirement is that an IM injection must be at least 15mm of penetration. We do achieve that. The other NF injectors have a much higher force and in our opinion, do create tissue damage and can penetrate a vein. Obviously, this is not good, painful and is damaging to the patient. I can say this because the FDA required us to test against several other NF technologies. We have not penetrated the veins with our PharmaJet technology, again because we use the appropriate spring power. Another factor is that the injectable tends to spread and fan out into the tissue rather than be deposited into a bolus of liquid as a needle injection.
Click to expand...
 
Has anybody found out more information in regards to the pharmajet and it's ability to inject Test and HCG? I am very interested in SubQ injeections.
 
allenc74 said:
Has anybody found out more information in regards to the pharmajet and it's ability to inject Test and HCG? I am very interested in SubQ injeections.
Click to expand...

Going on third year, I use Ultrafine II U-100 Insulin Syringe 31 Gauge 3/10cc 5/16inch
for all my shots, (T, HCG, B12)

I do not call those shots SubQ or any other name.
I keep one hand in my pocket, the shot is done with the other hand.
I push needle (90-45) degree to skinn surface until tip of syringe makes 1/4-1/2 inch dimple, then I push on plunger until it stops, no aspirations.
I shoot everywhere.
I avoid any surface veins.
I do EOD schedule, one day (T + HCG) next day free of shots.

It takes 2 minutes to fill up syringe, sometimes I pre-fill few syringes ahead of time, if I know I will have a morning rush.
.
.
 
JanSz said:
Going on third year, I use Ultrafine II U-100 Insulin Syringe 31 Gauge 3/10cc 5/16inch
for all my shots, (T, HCG, B12)

I do not call those shots SubQ or any other name.
I keep one hand in my pocket, the shot is done with the other hand.
I push needle (90-45) degree to skin surface until tip of syringe makes 1/4-1/2 inch dimple, then I push on plunger until it stops, no aspirations.
I shoot everywhere.
I avoid any surface veins.
I do EOD schedule, one day (T + HCG) next day free of shots.

It takes 2 minutes to fill up syringe, sometimes I pre-fill few syringes ahead of time, if I know I will have a morning rush.
.
.
Click to expand...

I guess I am just a little cautious about SubQ. I am a bigger guy (still muscular) but I don't know how the Test will absorb in fattier areas.

I was recently on two androderm patches and was finally getting some results but had bad skin reactions to the adhesive. Then the doc pulled me off for four weeks to run some additional test. During the first week i had some withdrawals but now at almost four weeks am back to the way I was prior to TRT. I am going in on Monday to do a LOT of bloodwork to finally get the answers that I needed from the beginning.

I also have Vitamin D problems and Hoshimotos.
 
When I did test cyp, now on adrogel, I started doing subq. I liked it much better. E3D, 30mg each shot. I felt great and actually better by 1) lowering my dose, on 80mg/week, I was at the top of range; and 2) by having more consistent levels by 2x week shots.
 
techlogik said:
When I did test cyp, now on adrogel, I started doing subq. I liked it much better. E3D, 30mg each shot. I felt great and actually better by 1) lowering my dose, on 80mg/week, I was at the top of range; and 2) by having more consistent levels by 2x week shots.
Click to expand...

do you use hcg? did you need arimidex?
 
rick055 said:
do you use hcg? did you need arimidex?
Click to expand...

Have allergic reactions to HCG....I wish I could. Might try another round again and freeze the reconstituted needles and see if the age, over 4 weeks was the problem. That is when I would have problems it seems after a new batch.

Just on test mono..nothing else at this time.

I did use about .15ml of liquid anastrozole every other day. My E2 came in right around 30. Without it I was at around 40 E2 on the ultra level.
 
My doc is unsure about the use of HCG with TRT. She believes that it is only to be used for infertility problems and not to assist with TRT of a person with normal fertility. She did say that we could research it and see if we can find some proven facts that it helps. My main reason for wanting it is to avoid testicular atrophy and shrinkage but it also has a number of other bennefits. Any advise would be greatly appreciated.
 
allenc74 said:
My doc is unsure about the use of HCG with TRT. She believes that it is only to be used for infertility problems and not to assist with TRT of a person with normal fertility. She did say that we could research it and see if we can find some proven facts that it helps. My main reason for wanting it is to avoid testicular atrophy and shrinkage but it also has a number of other bennefits. Any advise would be greatly appreciated.
Click to expand...

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I recently started TRT (100mg cyp week) and was surprised when my doc instructed me to do it subQ. But after researching it some (and finding this thread) it seems to be gaining more popularity. This is my first time doing TRT and self injecting so if anyone has any advice i would love to hear it.
 
DrakeC said:
I recently started TRT (100mg cyp week) and was surprised when my doc instructed me to do it subQ. But after researching it some (and finding this thread) it seems to be gaining more popularity. This is my first time doing TRT and self injecting so if anyone has any advice i would love to hear it.
Click to expand...

What were the specifics of your docs instructions?

Is it like injecting into belly fat when you're on HCG?

What size needles, etc?

Where is your doc from?
 
I am also having a hard time convincing my doc to try SUBQ injections for TRT. She is concerned that it will not be as effective and get absorbed into the fat.
 
I took approximately 550mg of testosterone cypionate injected subcutaneously per week (daily injections into stomach fat) from January through April along with HCG at 250iu twice per week in March and April. My TRT doctor found my test to be at 1500 in a recent blood test. Yes, I was taking too much. In any event, this proved to me (personally) that subcutaneous testosterone injections are fine. I had NO irritation, no black and blues, no oil buildup - nothing. It was perfect and I never had to worry about having my legs or ass chopped into to fish out an abscess...
 
Zero Tolerance said:
I took approximately 550mg of testosterone cypionate injected subcutaneously per week (daily injections into stomach fat) from January through April along with HCG at 250iu twice per week in March and April. My TRT doctor found my test to be at 1500 in a recent blood test. Yes, I was taking too much. In any event, this proved to me (personally) that subcutaneous testosterone injections are fine. I had NO irritation, no black and blues, no oil buildup - nothing. It was perfect and I never had to worry about having my legs or ass chopped into to fish out an abscess...
Click to expand...
hi ZT,

Was your blood test taken while still "on", or had you cycled-off for awhile? I ask because I've seen some charts ( admittedly for Test-E, but I shouldn't think that would make a difference ) which would indicate that 550mg of Test-C/wk ought to have put you around 3100 or so.
 
Yes. I was still on...

sarcazmo said:
hi ZT,

Was your blood test taken while still "on", or had you cycled-off for awhile? I ask because I've seen some charts ( admittedly for Test-E, but I shouldn't think that would make a difference ) which would indicate that 550mg of Test-C/wk ought to have put you around 3100 or so.
Click to expand...
 
rick055 said:
What were the specifics of your docs instructions?

Is it like injecting into belly fat when you're on HCG?

What size needles, etc?

Where is your doc from?
Click to expand...

Sorry for the late reply.

He has me injecting into the side of the glute, other places are fine but i dont have much fat elsewhere.

Using 25g needles, you dont even feel it. Sorry, no experience with HcG to compare with.
 
Right, but the strange thing is that on 550mg it should have been over double that, especially if you were pinning everyday, it shouldn't have deviated/fluctuated too much.
 
Gutterpump said:
Right, but the strange thing is that on 550mg it should have been over double that, especially if you were pinning everyday, it shouldn't have deviated/fluctuated too much.
Click to expand...
Oh, I didn't realize that. My HRT doctor freaked out like I was the highest reading he'd ever seen - which I seriously doubt. He's got a LOT of bodybuilders (mostly cops, it seems) in his office all the time...
 
allenc74 said:
I am also having a hard time convincing my doc to try SUBQ injections for TRT. She is concerned that it will not be as effective and get absorbed into the fat.
Click to expand...

Well, you just go get yourself some 31ga insulin needles and start doing it...I don't know of really any docs that would say subq is what to do. Some of us have just tried it, liked it and not had any issues.
 
I have started SubQ Test E injection E3D. I have noticed that I get a red welt that last about three days. There is no pain or any other irritation. I do not know what my levels are since I just started a few weeks ago. I am looking forward to getting my labs done and starting a HCG protocol. I am interested in what types of HCG people are using. My insurance only covers Ovidrel. Is anybody using this for TRT?
 
Keep pressure on the injection site for 20 seconds or so and there will be no indication of the injection. No swelling, redness or anything else.
 
allenc74 said:
I have started SubQ Test E injection E3D. I have noticed that I get a red welt that last about three days. There is no pain or any other irritation. I do not know what my levels are since I just started a few weeks ago. I am looking forward to getting my labs done and starting a HCG protocol. I am interested in what types of HCG people are using. My insurance only covers Ovidrel. Is anybody using this for TRT?
Click to expand...

I am using 31Ga 5/16" long needles
now third year

I shoot everywhere.
But if I shoot into my thighs it hurts for about 3 days.
So after few tries I do not do thighs.
Everywhere else, no pain after 2-3 seconds.

You may have sensitive area, figure it out, stay away from it.

When I started on B12 injections, they have to be really shallow or B12 gets wasted quickly.
First few days I would do my shots too shallow, I would get little red dot.
That is very dense B12, 15mg/mL lots of color.
If shoot too deep, pee is red, another waste.

Testosterone and HCG is best to shoot real straight.
I use one hand and press the needle until I have about 1/4" indentation,
then press on plunger.

.
 
longrob said:
Jan,
Not trying to hijack this thread, but can I ask about B12? I am trying B12, but I do not seem to get any energy boost. I am using 1/2" needles and shooting straight in. I bought 1000 micrograms in a 30ml vial, and am using 25 ius per week. How much B12 are you using?
Click to expand...

Right now I am not using B12

Previously I used

College Pharmacy
719-262-0022
script required
-------------
1 Methylcobalamine 15mg/cc 30cc vial
10 refills
-------------

$59.11
$25.00 shipping

it is shipped cold, you have to wait at home to sign for it,
and put it in refrigirator.

I used 25units=0.25cc shots EOD

it will last 240 days
they say shelf life=180 days
I used till the end

You have to use very short needle (5/16") and inject shallow.

It is too deep if you piss red
It is to shallow if you get red marks on your glutes.
Inject 20-30 degree angle to skin, I use just one hand, other hand in my pocket.

If you can't manage that, divide and inject daily.

.
 
What type of HCG are people using? It appears that my insurance covers Ovidrel (with a $5000 lifetime payout). Has anybody used this?
 
I injected 1ml primo and 1ml masteron into different areas of my stomach and it hurt. There are no visible lumps, but when I touch the areas, it is really sore and it has been 2 days already. I'll try some other sites tomorrow.
 
injected 1ml into each thigh and it didn't burn this time. Burns a little if I apply pressure to the site, but nothing like when I injected into the abdomen. I also pinched the skin up and injected straight in (at 90deg angle), rather than at an angle like last time.
 
findnemo said:
I injected 1ml primo and 1ml masteron into different areas of my stomach and it hurt. There are no visible lumps, but when I touch the areas, it is really sore and it has been 2 days already. I'll try some other sites tomorrow.
Click to expand...

Shoot for areas in the lower half, below the navel, I find it's the best there.
Some areas can be killer though for some reason?? Like a big pinch even once it's in...I've guessed I hit or went through a surface vein, but I just keep shooting though, don't like to waste anything.
 
Gutterpump said:
Sounds complicated..how does depth effect how it absorbs and gets utilized?

If this is true for b12, wouldn't it be true for test?
Click to expand...

The answer is in testing,

then one can write nice theories why that happened.

I tested my testosterone and it is always very proportional to size of shots that I am using.

I am talking about EOD injections.

Weekly injections and transdermals are always a crap shoot.
==================================================================


About B12

if what you are injecting is deep red in color
(I am talking about B12 15mcg/mL or higher)
and
when you inject in certain way
the pee is red
but if you inject another way
the pee is not red

what is so complicated about?
==========================================================

Red color reminds me of

red beats and gastric juice.

Get few pounds of (small) red beets.
Get a juicer, make juice.

Drink 8oz of that juice.

Observe your stool.

If it is red, not enough gastric acids.

Eat (Betaine HCL)


Specially important for people who have heartburn.

Most often heartburn is due to low gastric juices (not high as always told by doctors).

.


.
 
I mean injecting at the perfect depth, can go too shallow or too deep? sounds like there's a lot of chance for waste if you are always guessing.

Yeah I shoot test subQ twice per week around the navel and things seem stable. E2 is a little high though.
 
Perhaps use smaller dose B12 and inject deeper would be best so that it's not wasted. Perhaps increase dose until urine color turns red, then back off.
 
Zero Tolerance said:
Never inject a full ML/CC of oil subcutaneously...
Click to expand...

Zero, sounds like you had a bad experience, or were you just responding to nemo?
I inject 0.25ml T-Cyp twice a week SC with 30 ga short pins now for the last year. Works great. I always use my thigh (no pain like JanSz) and pull the skin tight. This seems to eliminate any leakage.
-Rob
 
longrob said:
Zero, sounds like you had a bad experience, or were you just responding to nemo?
I inject 0.25ml T-Cyp twice a week SC with 30 ga short pins now for the last year. Works great. I always use my thigh (no pain like JanSz) and pull the skin tight. This seems to eliminate any leakage.
-Rob
Click to expand...
Hi Rob.. No, actually - but I've tried injecting .5 ML/CC and there was some discomfort and quite a bit of pink with itchiness.. I can't imagine it being okay to inject twice that amount without any issues.... I almost always inject into subcutaneous fat around my navel...
 
Zero Tolerance said:
Hi Rob.. No, actually - but I've tried injecting .5 ML/CC and there was some discomfort and quite a bit of pink with itchiness.. I can't imagine it being okay to inject twice that amount without any issues.... I almost always inject into subcutaneous fat around my navel...
Click to expand...

Like JanSz, I am not using a true SC type of injection of pulling a fold of skin up and injecting into the pocket. I just pull the skin tight and push the pin to a depth of 1/4 inch or so, and inject my T-Cyp.
 
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