Pre-Intra Workout Drink Formulation

scottyc33

New member
I am thinking about formulating my own pre/intra workout drink mix. What do you think of the following formulation:

Serving Size Grams
Arginine 3
Citrulline Malate 1
BCAA 4
EAA 2
Beta Alanine 2
GABA 1
Creatine 4
Acetyl Carnitine 1
Taurine 1
Total Grams 19.0
 
The citrulline is prob a waste at that amount. I think all the studies that show any benifit are with doses around 6g/day. Beta Alanine I guess 2g is ok if youre taking another 3g sometime throughout the day. You should go for 5g total on workout days and around 2 on off. Everything else is ok, although Arginine was shown to reduce GH during exercise.
 
i personally like the idea of where you are heading with this, intra workout drinks work wonders and go a really long way i feel
 
Your mix seems to cover all bases, but the cit mal is low, and honestly macronutrients such as carbohydrates will do more for muscle gain than anything else, so throw 60g wms in there.

I really like Size-On intraWO, also I like to mix primal eaa, glycergrow, wms and Omega Sports ONE together and it works amazing and the eaa is masked completely by the cherry flavor of ONE.
 
I would leave out the GABA, it's decent before bed. It helps with sleep, not exactly what you want pre workout.
 
naturalguy said:
I would leave out the GABA, it's decent before bed. It helps with sleep, not exactly what you want pre workout.
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yea i would agree with that too unless your on some high dosed stims making you jittery/anxious (which IMO are best to avoid in the first place).
 
naturalguy said:
I would leave out the GABA, it's decent before bed. It helps with sleep, not exactly what you want pre workout.
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I disagree. The research showing gaba increases GH all had subjects dose 3 grams preworkout. When dosed before bed or any other part of the day, there was no increase in GH. So for some odd reason Gaba only increases gh when used within 30 minutes of a workout.
 
Resolve said:
My personal favorite homebrew:

10g 4:1:1 Bcaa
10g Eaa
10g Whey Hydrolysate
5g CreMono
5g BA
5g GMS
3g VitC
80g CHO of choice
Koolaid Powder to taste

Basic, but effective as hell.
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well I wouldnt call that basic by any means, but on paper it does look effective as hell!
 
Resolve said:
Per serving it's cheaper than any brand name intra-workout supp and contains more stuff to boot.
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when exactly do you take this cocktail? this is very similar to my pre-workout drink which is about 30 minutes before i start, but during my workouts i just drink lots of water only
 
Resolve said:
My personal favorite homebrew:

10g 4:1:1 Bcaa
10g Eaa
10g Whey Hydrolysate
5g CreMono
5g BA
5g GMS
3g VitC
80g CHO of choice
Koolaid Powder to taste

Basic, but effective as hell.
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you should consider adding arginine and taurine to your homebrew.... arginine will give you good pumps and taurine is pretty darn cheap plus will help prevent back pumps.

overall looks very good and similar to what i take.
 
Start when I'm heading out the door for the gym. Finish sometime towards the end of my workout. It is usually dissolved in 1.5-2L H2O.

I don't care about pumps when I lift really, and I've got GMS in there as it is, so Arginine is extraneous. Taurine could make a nice addition, but I have found that it just doesn't seem to do enough for me to include it regularly. Like I said, it's basic.
 
Resolve said:
Start when I'm heading out the door for the gym. Finish sometime towards the end of my workout. It is usually dissolved in 1.5-2L H2O.

I don't care about pumps when I lift really, and I've got GMS in there as it is, so Arginine is extraneous. Taurine could make a nice addition, but I have found that it just doesn't seem to do enough for me to include it regularly. Like I said, it's basic.
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I presume you dont take the traditional pre-workout drink, right?
 
My Pre:
1 Scoop Assault
5g Mono
10g Taurine

Intra:
15g BCAA

Post:
1 scoop WPI
5g mono
5g BA


Simple and effective. No bs.
 
just posted this in the articles forum... but what the hey


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During exercise, whole-body and muscle protein synthesis rates increased by 29 and 48% with protein and carbohydrate coingestion.

PeptoPro: Degree of hydrolysis 28-30%

can't beat that
 
Chefdeez said:
I disagree. The research showing gaba increases GH all had subjects dose 3 grams preworkout. When dosed before bed or any other part of the day, there was no increase in GH. So for some odd reason Gaba only increases gh when used within 30 minutes of a workout.
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Not sure what research you are referring to but GABA helps you sleep and also causes a temporary shortness of breath, not exactly things you want pre workout.
 
naturalguy said:
Not sure what research you are referring to but GABA helps you sleep and also causes a temporary shortness of breath, not exactly things you want pre workout.
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For some users this does happen, but not everyone. I'll try to dig up the study I'm referring to, it's on pubmed.
 
I don't have access to the full texts at home but here are the references. You can look them up on pubmed, they are great reads.

1. Acta Endocrinol (Copenh). 1980 Feb;93(2):149-54

Effect of acute and repeated administration of gamma aminobutyric acid (GABA) on growth hormone and prolactin secretion in man.

Cavagnini F, Invitti C, Pinto M, Maraschini C, Di Landro A, Dubini A, Marelli A.

2. J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 1980 Oct;51(4):789-92.

Effect of gamma-aminobutyric acid on growth hormone and prolactin secretion in man: influence of pimozide and domperidone.

Cavagnini F, Benetti G, Invitti C, Ramella G, Pinto M, Lazza M, Dubini A, Marelli A, Muller EE.

3. Medicine & Science in Sports & Exercise: Volume 35(5) Supplement 1 May 2003 p S271

THE EFFECTS OF GAMMA AMINOBUTYRIC ACID ON GROWTH HORMONE SECRETION AT REST AND FOLLOWING EXERCISE

Powers, M E.1; Borst, S E.1; McCoy, S C.1; Conway, R1; Yarrow, J1
 
gaba is shown to increase gh levels prior to bedtime, i have seen its effectivness preworkout however i would dispute that it doesnt cause GH release before bed, since it causes relaxation and helps you reach rem sleep
 
Thanks for the responses so far.
It's interesting how varied they are.

So is citrulline malate an effective NO booster as Arginine?

If so, then maybe I should ditch the Arginine and up the Cit Mal to 5-6 grams?
 
I think your dosages are a little low. My intra-workout drink is:

20g BCAAs
3.6g Beta Alanine
3.4g DiCreatine Malate

Considering the products you listed, I would add:

3g AAKG
1.5g Taurine
3g Citruline Malate
2.5g GABA

I don't know anything about carnitine, so I'm not going to comment on that.
 
Irish Cannon said:
I think your dosages are a little low. My intra-workout drink is:

20g BCAAs
3.6g Beta Alanine
3.4g DiCreatine Malate

Considering the products you listed, I would add:

3g AAKG
1.5g Taurine
3g Citruline Malate
2.5g GABA

I don't know anything about carnitine, so I'm not going to comment on that.
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Hey Irish - this goes back to my question above but why use AAKG if you are already using Citrulline Malate?

Also, 20g BCAA seems like a lot (when compared to suggested dosages of popular pre/intra workout powders).

How did you come up with that dosage?
 
Hey Irish - this goes back to my question above but why use AAKG if you are already using Citrulline Malate?
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Honestly I have no scientific response to that. I just recommended AAKG because I like it a lot better than regular L-Arginine.

Also, 20g BCAA seems like a lot (when compared to suggested dosages of popular pre/intra workout powders).

How did you come up with that dosage?
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BCAAs are usually heavily underdosed (I believe) in intra-workout drinks/powders. I believe in 15g MINIMUM intra-workout, and optimal being 20-40g. The anabolic effect of BCAAs at higher dosages is amazing.
 
International Society of Sports Nutrition's comprehensive position on Nutrient Timing:

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In short, for lifters (they also examine endurance athletes): "Ingesting CHO along, or in combination with PRO, during resistance exercise increases muscle glycogen stores, offsets muscle damage, and facilitates greater training adapations after acute and prolonged periods of resistance training."
 
Irish Cannon said:
Honestly I have no scientific response to that. I just recommended AAKG because I like it a lot better than regular L-Arginine.


BCAAs are usually heavily underdosed (I believe) in intra-workout drinks/powders. I believe in 15g MINIMUM intra-workout, and optimal being 20-40g. The anabolic effect of BCAAs at higher dosages is amazing.
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Here's something I read when first researching BCAA's. There're a lot more out there, but this gives a basic idea of the benefits behind higher BCAA dosage...

Supplementing With BCAAs study entitled, “Combined effects of caloric restric-tion and branched-chain amino acid supplemen-tation on body composition and exercise performance in elite wrestlers.” was published in the International Journal of Sports Medicine (1997) 18 (1): 47-55 by researchers Mourier, Biggard, Kerviler, Roger, Legrand, and Guezennec. In this study, researchers had subjects consume one of four different diets for 19 days. The different diets were:
• low calorie
• low calorie, high-protein
• low calorie,
• low-protein
• low calorie, high-protein supplemented with branched-chain amino acids
Subjects recorded their meals in a journal each day. The subjects who consumed the branched-chain amino acid enhanced diet received their daily intake of BCAAs by ingesting supplemental branched chain amino acids equal to .25 g/kg of bodyweight per day. Prior to and after the study, each subject performed a variety of tests including measurements of aerobic and muscular fitness, percent body-fat, and blood hormone measurements. Results from the study showed the subjects who consumed the high protein diet supplemented with branch chain amino acids lost the greatest amount of both weight and body-fat. The total average weight loss after 19 days was 8.8 lbs and the decrease in body-fat percentage was 17.3%. Even more compelling is the fact that the BCAA supplement group lost the greatest amount of fat from the abdominal and thigh regions - two “stubborn” fat loss areas, often of concern to dieters. Average loss in these areas was an astounding 34.4%!
Even more exciting is the fact that the subjects were elite athletes. Undoubtedly, they were already in great shape. To see such significant changes in highly trained athletes is indeed noteworthy.
Furthermore, these subjects consumed a hypocaloric diet – one in which they ate less than maintenance calories. Still, the diet wasn’t unduly low - 28 calories per kilogram of bodyweight was provided which, in a 140 lb woman, would be 1,782 calories per day. The subjects were highly trained wrestlers and were undoubtedly exercising intensely and burning many more calories than what was allocated to them. You will need to account for your own exercise and level of activity in order to determine what would be hypocaloric for you (please refer to your Beyond Genetic manual). The key point is that these subjects were in a calorie deficit state.
Measurements of blood hormone levels indicated that growth hormone levels increased the most after exercise in the high protein/BCAA group, while thyroid hormone levels decreased the most in the same subjects. And, the fact that their thyroid levels decreased was not detrimental, as it happened in combination with the loss of significant amounts of bodyfat in typical problem areas i.e., hips, abdomen, and thighs. The high protein/BCAA supplement group also lost fat in greater amounts than the other subjects who did not experience as much of a decline in their thyroid hormone levels.
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i dont think one can really over ingest on the BCAA, the anabolic effects that they provide are quite amazing and at the higher doses they still continue to work their magic. especially during workouts adding these anticatabolic compounds to the mix really add a great boost to the workout
 
I have a similar plan. just got some goodies from a bulk supplier. Im taking in 20+ grams of bcaa and simple carbs plus kreatine, and alcar.
I feel leaner already, but maybe its my muscles being fuller with nutrients. time will tell.
btw... i seem to get a slight headace after workout. maybe I should reduce a little on the bcaa??
I also take alcar and beta alanine 15 min before the pre workout mix. maybe its one of those compounds.
 
Yea bcaa`s tastes bad. but im doing a real test of those bcaas now. seen a lot of post on megadose. sip a drikt to training and using most at the workout and empty the rest right after. Also studies backing up this practice. boost test some, increase recovery and so on... time will tell. Another typical effect is loosing fat in the most stubborn areas. lets see if the 8 pack finally show in a few months :)
 
Trening - I've never had a headache from BCAAs and I've used upwards of 40g intra-workout. Haven't heard of anyone else having a problem with that before either.

My guess is you're either going slightly hypoglycemic because of the carbs, or you're reacting adversely to the BA or ALCAR.

Just an update for everyone else - My new pre-intra-workout shake: 2 liter version.

20g EAA
25g 4:1:1 BCAA
10g GMS
5g BA
5g Cre Mono
55-75g Carbs

I begin drinking ~1/2hr prior to lifting and finish shortly before.
 
Its not the beta alanine. maybe its the alcar. will test a little without the alcar and we will se.

Looking solid that shake of yours. but what is gms?
How long have you used this type of pre wo shake and what is your thoughs.
 
Intra-Aid is an awesome product - it's the best pre-formulated intra-workout drink on the market in my opinion. I logged it, and it has my definite thumbsup, but I do think it comes up a little short of optimum. It's lack of BCAAs and the low dose of EAAs is a shortcoming - I countered this by adding BCAAs when using it.

Also, per serving, my formula is much cheaper than Intra-Aid - but you do have to buy the ingredients in bulk, so it has a bit of an initial investment.

Trening - GMS is Glycerol Mono-Stearate, it helps shuttle carbs, aminos and additional water into cells, keeping you better hydrated and facilitating a magnificent pump (better than Arginine IMO).

I've used some form of Intra-workout shake for about 2years, beginning with simply BCAAs and experimenting with different things as time progressed. IMO, Intra-workout nutrition makes more of a difference in training than any other meal time. For instance, if I could only have either an intra- or a post- workout shake, I'd drop the post-workout in a hearbeat. I don't workout without it anymore, it just helps too much with endurance, energy and strength to bypass it.
 
Resolve said:
Trening - GMS is Glycerol Mono-Stearate, it helps shuttle carbs, aminos and additional water into cells, keeping you better hydrated and facilitating a magnificent pump (better than Arginine IMO).
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Isn't this what creatine is supposed to do?
 
Um, no, creatine is a part of the phospho-creatine pathway, helping facilitate atp production. Creatine will be better absorbed and carried into the cell with the inclusion of GMS. Creatine can cause an increase in water intra-cellularly as well, but it does not facilitate the absorption of other molecules, to my knowledge.
 
Resolve said:
Intra-Aid is an awesome product - it's the best pre-formulated intra-workout drink on the market in my opinion. I logged it, and it has my definite thumbsup, but I do think it comes up a little short of optimum. It's lack of BCAAs and the low dose of EAAs is a shortcoming - I countered this by adding BCAAs when using it.
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Thanks for the props brother. To clarify, IA def has BCAAs--all of 'em. Also, the EAAs are in there too along with BA as part of a 10,000mg blend. Most of the lit I'm familiar with says ya don't need much in the way of EAAs--6g or so. All this is on top of the hydrolyzed whey.
 
Resolve said:
Intra-Aid is an awesome product - it's the best pre-formulated intra-workout drink on the market in my opinion. I logged it, and it has my definite thumbsup, but I do think it comes up a little short of optimum. It's lack of BCAAs and the low dose of EAAs is a shortcoming - I countered this by adding BCAAs when using it.

Also, per serving, my formula is much cheaper than Intra-Aid - but you do have to buy the ingredients in bulk, so it has a bit of an initial investment.

Trening - GMS is Glycerol Mono-Stearate, it helps shuttle carbs, aminos and additional water into cells, keeping you better hydrated and facilitating a magnificent pump (better than Arginine IMO).

I've used some form of Intra-workout shake for about 2years, beginning with simply BCAAs and experimenting with different things as time progressed. IMO, Intra-workout nutrition makes more of a difference in training than any other meal time. For instance, if I could only have either an intra- or a post- workout shake, I'd drop the post-workout in a hearbeat. I don't workout without it anymore, it just helps too much with endurance, energy and strength to bypass it.
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Well hell...if urs is cheaper than its a done deal...considering how much stuff u have in it...:notworthy:
 
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