Young Liberals are Killing America

Jerry said:
As a liberal, shouldn't you know this?
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I'm actually not a liberal. I don't identify with any one party. But last I heard in a democracy people end up deciding who pays the taxes and how much (by voting for people who represent their views), so I guess that we're all entitled to an opinion.

Jerry said:
So everyone else has to fork the bill for irresponsible parents? No thanks.
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Absolutely. That's because kids cannot defend themselves from stupid parents. It's why we have social services.

We pay taxes to support prisons which house people who couldn't keep their lives straight. We do this because we don't want these people on the streets. Maybe we should pay taxes to support kids whose parents fvcked up, because we don't want those kids to end up in prison.


Jerry said:
And the general public shouldn't have to pay for those few who can't budget their own checkbook. Thats the problem..people think their entitled...they are not.
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True, but why are so many people incapable of balancing their own checkbooks?


Jerry said:
The majority do not. If you can't afford having a baby and can't afford paying for its health care and needs, don't have it. Its unfair to expect the general public to foot the bill because of peoples bad, irresponsible or selfish choices.
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I think that we're limiting who the discussion is about. There are people who have enough money when the kid is born, but then encounter some bad luck. This "bad luck" might be, for example, getting laid off because of a poor economy.

I will say that I am now convinced that the subset of people who can afford healthcare but choose not to is troublesome. I remember my friend who worked at a collection agency tell me a story about people living in trailers paying their satellite bill while letting their kids run around in horrible clothes.
 
ShakesAllDay said:
I am mostly in agreement with you guys. My late-night point was really based on compassion for those that had zero choice that they were born from a mother trying to sit on her ass and collect a check. I'm totally against the government forcing people to give up their hard-earned money to others.

The tough part is how do we help those types of people that really 'need' it and not those trying to milk the teet.

I wish there were some way to sterilize the milking bastards from the get-go.
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Compassion for children with no choice is definitely warranted no matter what political views one holds. A close friend of mine decided she DID NOT WANT government hand outs, got good grades in school, was one of 3 people from her high school to go on to college, and now has a great job on Wall Street. She did this ON HER OWN. She now makes close to 6 figures.
 
ShakesAllDay said:
I am mostly in agreement with you guys. My late-night point was really based on compassion for those that had zero choice that they were born from a mother trying to sit on her ass and collect a check. I'm totally against the government forcing people to give up their hard-earned money to others.

The tough part is how do we help those types of people that really 'need' it and not those trying to milk the teet.

I wish there were some way to sterilize the milking bastards from the get-go.
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i agree with this 100%. I honestly feel like some people are definitely dealt a much tougher hand than others, but our country is made so anyone can succeed, there is definitely opportunity and assistance available...there's just too many kids born into environments where people who should be their role models make it seem otherwise. much easier to complain and take what you can get for free than it is to work

also agree with shakes and easy...why the hell would you have a kid when you can't even support yourself? how can that possibly turn out well? :think:
 
Polynomial, if you do not mind me asking, what is your experience dealing with large groups of adults/children/teenagers living in housing projects and on welfare? You seem to have such a strong opinion on it you must work in or with loads of inner-city people?
 
SureShot said:
We are now stooping to name calling? Please do not get your liberal panties in a bunch. You keep saying over and over again you do not like the original title of the thread. So i propose a change to it: LIBERALS are killing America. To sum up my final thoughts on the subject:The attitude that young liberals (like yourself) carry into their later years is hurting our country. Your constant justification of others being supported through taxes and government programs proves to me that you have not held a real job, have not experienced first hand what it is like to have your hard earned money used for those who DO NOT work hard. Are you one of those college wonder kids that will just continue going to school and learning about underfunded cancer research instead of DOING something about it?
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I moved here from a post-communist country when I was 12. I worked from cleaning up bathrooms at a swimming pool to busting my ass and getting a programming job when I was 16. I graduated college in 2.5 years so that I didn't have to pay more bills, and now I'm doing the same with grad school where I pay fees for scholarships of students who do not work nearly as hard as they should. And no, my single parent is not rich, not even well off. I worked all through college to pay my bills.

And yes, I always try to see how I can contribute to things like cancer research with my own research or money.

So no, it's closed minded people like you who resort to dividing this country into 'liberurls' vs 'rest' that are hurting America. And I don't believe in supporting people who are capable of working but choose not to. But I do believe that there are many people who are not capable of helping themselves that need our help.
 
Polynomial said:
And I don't believe in supporting people who are capable of working but choose not to. But I do believe that there are many people who are not capable of helping themselves that need our help.
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And I guess thats why i'm all for local, community based programs, where you deal with individuals to help them. But the federal government isn't capable of being selective in a reasonable way, and between loads of beaurocracy and layers of waste as well as corruption and fraud, it doesn't seem like it truly works.
 
SureShot said:
Polynomial, if you do not mind me asking, what is your experience dealing with large groups of adults/children/teenagers living in housing projects and on welfare? You seem to have such a strong opinion on it you must work in or with loads of inner-city people?
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No, just a few that make it to the fine university that I teach at.

I think I know what you're getting at: I've seen a woman on a Razr cell phone look funny at the pharmacist when she was told that her kid's medication would cost $4. You know what she did? She walked away. Did that piss me off? Hell yes. But should this kid suffer because of that? No.
 
The worst part is the viscous cycle... a lot of these kids learn this type of behavior from their parents. Maybe it will never end until we find an island to ship all these shetbags off to.

warnerve said:
i agree with this 100%. I honestly feel like some people are definitely dealt a much tougher hand than others, but our country is made so anyone can succeed, there is definitely opportunity and assistance available...there's just too many kids born into environments where people who should be their role models make it seem otherwise. much easier to complain and take what you can get for free than it is to work

also agree with shakes and easy...why the hell would you have a kid when you can't even support yourself? how can that possibly turn out well? :think:
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Polynomial said:
So no, it's closed minded people like you who resort to dividing this country into 'liberurls' vs 'rest' that are hurting America.
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"I hate the Republicans and everything they stand for"

Howard Dean - Chairman of the Democratic National Committee



It goes both ways.
 
I believe that to be one of the toughest things... the selectivity. I think a lot of people take an all or none approach (basically what the gov't is doing w/ wellfare).

A person starts out wanting to help others, but the system is so bass-ackwards that it disheartens them and then they don't want to help anybody.

EasyEJL said:
And I guess thats why i'm all for local, community based programs, where you deal with individuals to help them. But the federal government isn't capable of being selective in a reasonable way, and between loads of beaurocracy and layers of waste as well as corruption and fraud, it doesn't seem like it truly works.
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ShakesAllDay said:
The worst part is the viscous cycle... a lot of these kids learn this type of behavior from their parents. Maybe it will never end until we find an island to ship all these shetbags off to.
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That truly is the saddest part, out of their 6 children they have, probably 4 or 5 of them will end up in the same boat, and 1 or 2 will break out.
 
EasyEJL said:
That truly is the saddest part, out of their 6 children they have, probably 4 or 5 of them will end up in the same boat, and 1 or 2 will break out.
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1 or 2? That many? You must be giving them the benefit of the doubt. I would say, oh maybe 0.5. :lol:
 
ShakesAllDay said:
The worst part is the viscous cycle... a lot of these kids learn this type of behavior from their parents. Maybe it will never end until we find an island to ship all these shetbags off to.
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yes, that's the problem. there really is a large culture out there that actually promotes going against social norms and mores, where it is desirable to commit crimes and make money illegally. kids are exposed to it at a young, impressionable age, and this is combined with a situation where young men oftentimes have no positive male role model.
 
Polynomial said:
Yes, and I do what I can to stop it both ways. I think we all should. :)
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Then statements like this:

"I will say though that I've never met a young conservative who didn't use liberal-hating as a way of escapism from his own self-esteem issues."


...don't help. :)
 
I didn't read this whole thread, I'm not really into politics, but this reminds me of that member here: MuscleGuyinNY.

-20 yrs old scrapper
-Impregnated a girl
-Criminal record
-Can't get a job (but still thinks fast food jobs are beneath him).



.........................would be fall into this category of 'young liberal' ? lol.
 
warnerve said:
yes, that's the problem. there really is a large culture out there that actually promotes going against social norms and mores, where it is desirable to commit crimes and make money illegally. kids are exposed to it at a young, impressionable age, and this is combined with a situation where young men oftentimes have no positive male role model.
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This reminds me: a lot of college kids now feel that cheating is fine. A friend of mine had a discussion about this since the rates of cheating have increased drastically, and he suggested (he's 36, by the way) that kids now feel a lot more entitled to good grades, and don't feel any remorse for cheating. Sure enough, couple weeks later some study came out where kids say that cheating is just OK, because everyone else is doing it and because it's what they need to succeed.
 
Polynomial said:
This reminds me: a lot of college kids now feel that cheating is fine. A friend of mine had a discussion about this since the rates of cheating have increased drastically, and he suggested (he's 36, by the way) that kids now feel a lot more entitled to good grades, and don't feel any remorse for cheating. Sure enough, couple weeks later some study came out where kids say that cheating is just OK, because everyone else is doing it and because it's what they need to succeed.
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ugh. I hate "ethics of the moment". Without personal integrity you have nothing. Damn I hate the gen i ers. or whatever they are called now.
 
Polynomial said:
Well, I haven't. I guess maybe not until now? :)
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I'm 34.


And I could have reversed it:

"I will say though that I've never met a young "liberal" who didn't use Bush-conservative-republican bashing as a way of escapism from his own self-esteem issues."


Accurate? Maybe but given my experience of getting through my 20's I think it has less to do with party affiliation and more to do with youth. Young people are generally insecure and easily influenced by an extreme..right or left. Considering left is the more anti-authority, anti-establishment, rebellious ideology, young people often flock to it.


Either way, it doesnt help.
 
Jerry said:
I'm 34.


And I could have reversed it:

"I will say though that I've never met a young "liberal" who didn't use Bush-conservative-republican bashing as a way of escapism from his own self-esteem issues."


Accurate? Maybe but given my experience of getting through my 20's I think it has less to do with party affiliation and more to do with youth. Young people are generally insecure and easily influenced by an extreme..right or left. Considering left is the more anti-authority, anti-establishment, rebellious ideology, young people often flock to it.


Either way, it doesnt help.
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Sometimes I think it is even easier than that. To some young adults being a 'democrat' and 'liberal' is merely a trend at best.

Seems like the people who are like this wear blazers with tight jeans and chuck taylor shoes. Topped off with black dark rimmed glasses, while carrying their starbuck's coffee.

It reminds me of a low rent Jude Law.
 
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