Primordial Performance + FDA Raid!

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  1. I just want some links. Talking shiit is fun, but I would like some facts. Guess I'll just have to keep looking


  2. Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    K, didn't read all that, no offense, I'm not looking for more hearsay, but links to official info. It has to be out there if it's as you say.
    why are you going to demand proof but not read the entire reply from an ex PP rep who was heavily involved with Eric?
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by R1balla View Post

    why are you going to demand proof but not read the entire reply from an ex PP rep who was heavily involved with Eric?
    its called critical thinking. not taking sides here, but jbryand put up a prety good argument earlier in the thread

  4. Quote Originally Posted by OnionKnight View Post

    its called critical thinking. not taking sides here, but jbryand put up a prety good argument earlier in the thread
    I agree
    Black Lion Representative
    I'm a Brooklyn boy I may take some gettin' use to

  5. Quote Originally Posted by OnionKnight View Post
    its called critical thinking. not taking sides here, but jbryand put up a prety good argument earlier in the thread
    i understand both sides here, but you didnt even read HTS's defense entirely. Its fine if you want the proof, but at least understand where HTS is coming from.
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    K, didn't read all that, no offense, I'm not looking for more hearsay, but links to official info. It has to be out there if it's as you say.
    Keep searching, Ill keep lifting. The implication I have from eric is that this is still very much an investigation into Primordial's activities, so I can't see you finding too much information on an open issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    It was said no one was arrested, even though they were investigating claims of illegal substances supposedly in the products.
    They suspected, but we had submitted for testing prior to the raid and were informed there was no issues, since you are in research mode, feel free to look back and you will find posts where we discussed this (prior to the raid).

    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    I just want some links. Talking shiit is fun, but I would like some facts. Guess I'll just have to keep looking
    Like I said above, enjoy the ride. When you wear yourself out, hit the gym.

    Quote Originally Posted by R1balla View Post
    i understand both sides here, but you didnt even read HTS's defense entirely. Its fine if you want the proof, but at least understand where HTS is coming from.
    He's an attention whore. Always has been, always will be. Let him play his game, my 2c has been stated.
    Just inject.
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  7. LOL
    always good times round heah

    it would be so nice if reps would just worry about their OWN company and company products..
    would not only be a better atmosphere for the consumer, but truth is:

    no matter what, we are all loosely brothers-in-arms in this industry..
    the efforts spent to tear down someone else comes at expense of the industry in general

    the mentality that it's "my company against yours" is small, and in the grand scheme of things speaks volumes of the individual


    enjoy your conspiracy

  8. Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    It was said no one was arrested, even though they were investigating claims of illegal substances supposedly in the products.
    I'm not trying to make this any more complicated, but you do see the twisted motive the FDA could have on this, dont you?

    A large portion of these government agencies' budgets are based on the fines that they dish out. Just like the local governments, they are expected to find illegal stuff going on and to fine those company/organizaitons for profits. This is how they survive from a fiscal standpoint. The more laws, the more fines, the more money they have to pay salaries/raises/increase in power & influence.

    I don't like it because it encourages the government to fabricate situations, much like what has happened to Primordial Perfomance. Sure, it could all be a hoax I guess but when I read about this it didn't surprise me at all. While I don't think PP broke any laws, they were close enough to the line in the sand that the FDA could fabricate a situation and find an opportunity for fines.

    It's just like when I go to court over a ticket, they don't want to do anything more than fine me for the wrongdoing. In fact, if I pay extra, they drop the charges. The feds dont operate any differently. They are no more than an org in an unfair industry trying to make profits, just like companies in the private sector.

    I could be wrong about this particular instance, but I know I'm not wrong about government agencies needing to fine companies for monetary reasons. Our taxes couldn't possibly support the entire budget of the FDA, along with the other 400 agencies in existence.
  9. Re: Primordial Performance + FDA Raid!


    I hear discovery channel is replacing their "Frinding Bigfoot" show with "Finding out what Happened at PP". It premeirs Monday at 8pm EST. I just set my DVR

    Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S™II using Tapatalk 2
    PESCIENCE.COM

    "The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance." - Socrates

  10. Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    I hear discovery channel is replacing their "Frinding Bigfoot" show with "Finding out what Happened at PP". It premeirs Monday at 8pm EST. I just set my DVR

    Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S(TM)II using Tapatalk 2
    Lol I'm setting mine up as we speak
    Black Lion Representative
    I'm a Brooklyn boy I may take some gettin' use to

  11. Quote Originally Posted by R1balla

    why are you going to demand proof but not read the entire reply from an ex PP rep who was heavily involved with Eric?
    Because if I'm curious about what Eric already said, the owner, who I'm sure is also heavily involved with the company, then why read what hts had to say.
    Only thing that needs to be said is, here is the link to official info.

  12. Quote Originally Posted by HereToStudy

    Keep searching, Ill keep lifting. The implication I have from eric is that this is still very much an investigation into Primordial's activities, so I can't see you finding too much information on an open issue.

    They suspected, but we had submitted for testing prior to the raid and were informed there was no issues, since you are in research mode, feel free to look back and you will find posts where we discussed this (prior to the raid).

    Like I said above, enjoy the ride. When you wear yourself out, hit the gym.

    He's an attention whore. Always has been, always will be. Let him play his game, my 2c has been stated.
    I don't doubt your products contained what they claimed. I used them, more so the non hormonal stuff like endoamp max, and Toco 8.
    Attention? I guess, I just wondered something. If I really wanted attention, I would of asked this question on multiple boards, not just here.

  13. Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b
    who wants to call the fda and ask about it?
    I will today.

  14. LOL at a PP rep claiming us poverty reps get 20 bucks worth of sugar a month when PP sells DHEA snake oil.

    Lord, i've seen it all now.

    And not a single link or credible source was posted this day. Nice try Andro Factory.

  15. and let me know about it...

    Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    I will today.

  16. Quote Originally Posted by Rhadam View Post
    LOL at a PP rep claiming us poverty reps get 20 bucks worth of sugar a month when PP sells DHEA snake oil.

    Lord, i've seen it all now.

    And not a single link or credible source was posted this day. Nice try Andro Factory.

    I prefer not to get into another pissing match with SNS as a company, been there, done that, no need to go there again.

    I stated my involvement with the company was beyond the TYPICAL rep position paying $20 in sugar, so either you consider your company typical (I won't comment) or you are getting defensive over nothing. It is also important to
    note I wasn't paid in Andro products, so I am not sure what the comment even means. You can call the andro products whatever you would like, I personally could give a **** about the products at this point since they don't exist. My conversation here is also with those involved whom I know, I don't know you, don't personally want to know you, so I don't really need to address you. If you haven't noticed, you can move on.

    Your comment on price, however, is funny. I could add up every product SNS offers and run it for the 4 weeks stacked, and the results wouldn't compare to Andro-, yet the cost would exceed it. But different thread, different day. This isn't BB.com last i checked.

    I commented on the link to sources earlier and I also have no affiliation to AF (quite the opposite if you are taking notes).
    Just inject.
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  17. Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    I hear discovery channel is replacing their "Frinding Bigfoot" show with "Finding out what Happened at PP". It premeirs Monday at 8pm EST. I just set my DVR

    Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S™II using Tapatalk 2
    what's a dvr?

    is it like my sony betamax?
    WELL DONE IS BETTER THAN WELL SAID

  18. Emailed the FDA, there is a section that deals with supplements, hopefully we hear back soon and this can be put to rest.

  19. I have no dog in this hunt. I've used their products and there were also some aspects of the raid that were strange.

    But make no mistake - FDA and EPA regulate, confiscate, enforce, fine, etc without leaving any public ginger bread trail.

    Non-restricted/non-registered products are the worst. They leave a gray and make up rules and violations as they see fit. People are put out of business constantly and for various reasons, and very few are just. At least with a registered/regulated product they (the business) have a leg to stand on - because it was once approved.

    Registered products are a difficult game too. Most registered products are broken into categories that are governed behind the scenes by Task Forces. Almost every Task Force is head by a corporation that has or had patents in the category. They approve, deny, regulate, fine, etc registrants in the category. Most of this is not public.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by El Hefe View Post
    I have no dog in this hunt. I've used their products and there were also some aspects of the raid that were strange.

    But make no mistake - FDA and EPA regulate, confiscate, enforce, fine, etc without leaving any public ginger bread trail.

    Non-restricted/non-registered products are the worst. They leave a gray and make up rules and violations as they see fit. People are put out of business constantly and for various reasons, and very few are just. At least with a registered/regulated product they (the business) have a leg to stand on - because it was once approved.

    Registered products are a difficult game too. Most registered products are broken into categories that are governed behind the scenes by Task Forces. Almost every Task Force is head by a corporation that has or had patents in the category. They approve, deny, regulate, fine, etc registrants in the category. Most of this is not public.
    Very good post. But I am sure all of this will change with a "Dear Mr. FDA, Me and some bros on a bodybuilding board were debating...." email.
    Just inject.
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  21. I miss sustain alpha endoamp max and toca 8 so much

  22. Quote Originally Posted by HereToStudy
    Very good post. But I am sure all of this will change with a "Dear Mr. FDA, Me and some bros on a bodybuilding board were debating...." email.
    Dang, how'd you know? That's exactly how it starts out!

    But I wonder if they'll even responed.

  23. Quote Originally Posted by jbryand101b View Post
    Dang, how'd you know? That's exactly how it starts out!

    But I wonder if they'll even responed.
    Ok Jbry, knowing what I know about "DA's" from my various work gigs with them over the years, I will tell you that the chances are slim. Especially if the case is open, as I believe is the protocol. There is also this little rule of non disclosure, so unless this is on the public record, you or anyone for that matter may not have access. Just thinking out loud.

    So I am just going to continue to read peacefully, though from my experience with HTS, he is one of the most legit lads around here, and I would take his word if he told me so, just like I would listen to a lot of lads on the SNS side, some like Celly who are buddies.
    MEM->DCA->PHL->MEM
  24. Re: Primordial Performance + FDA Raid!


    Question, how do you know

    Quote Originally Posted by El Hefe View Post
    They leave a gray and make up rules and violations as they see fit. People are put out of business constantly and for various reasons, and very few are just.
    If


    Quote Originally Posted by El Hefe View Post
    But make no mistake - FDA and EPA regulate, confiscate, enforce, fine, etc without leaving any public ginger bread trail.
    Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S™II using Tapatalk 2
    PESCIENCE.COM

    "The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance." - Socrates

  25. this thread better get better or I want my time back..

  26. Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh
    Question, how do you know

    If

    Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S(TM)II using Tapatalk 2
    I know because my company has created and sold many products that have fallen into these categories. I've personally been on the wrong end of this. I can also tell you that none of the instances had anything to do with health or public safety. In our case, it was because we had taken too much market share from someone who had more power and bigger pockets.

    Just to be clear, none of our products are or were health or dietary supplements. But it's the same game and regulatory bodies.

    I also personally know people who have been on or are currently on some of the Task Forces. Those of us who have dealt with them don't refer to them as Task Forces - we call them Cartels.

  27. Excellent thread to read while depositing a big one in the porcelain bank of trust.
    Serious Nutrition Solutions | Online Representative
    Growth Factor XT-GROW! Need Cycle Support? Check out Liver XT.
    Follow SNS on Facebook for more promos!

  28. Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    Question, how do you know



    If




    Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S™II using Tapatalk 2
    Nice argument. My memory goes back to American Cellular Labs when they created the first pro-dienolone product on the market. FDA raided them in April of 2009, then accused them of lacing their Tren-Xtreme with Trenbolone, which was a flat out lie. If the FDA called it for what it was, then there would not have been any laws broken because pro-dienolone was not banned, yet it was still effective and potentially dangerous when used irresponsibly.

    So the FDA called it Tren, as well as busting them out for creating Pheraplex, which was also not a controlled substance at the time either. They called the compounds by whatever they had to "to make it illegal". The feds are dirty, man. They don't serve the public innocently and justly like you want to believe. They want our money, thats it. They are no different from any other corrupt organization out there. Fact is, while ACL might've been unethical in their practices creating fairly powerful steroids for OTC use, they didn't actually break any laws but the Feds are able to get away with crap like this because we aren't really able to stop them anymore if we wanted to.

    They don't send letters to anyone giving them warnings because that means no fines! FDA wants fines, not law-abiding citizens. Even if we all started abiding by the current laws, they'd create more laws to make it harder to live with so that more fines could be found. Otherwise the need for that government agency would disappear or at least be downsized, which none of the FDA employees want. This same logic also applies to all of the government agencies. They have become altogether wortheless yet because they desire the money, they find ways to keep existing.
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