who is using Trenavar?

[vidapreta]

I know back in the day, the old M14-Add or whatever it was called, was said to convert to dianabol but when I used it....it didn't feel like dianabol to me.

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[chocolatemilk]

interesting on the diols being superior prohormones... makes sense when comparing them at the 17 in terms of ar binding

conversion percentages are indeed BS but either products or reactants can be favored due to things like Gibbs free energy involved, catalyst, reversible or irreversible etc so it's not all random amounts of conversions. Ball park estimates can be made by studying metabolites using HPLC

 

[chocolatemilk]

i think the enzymes can become depleted after time. idk i took the original osmo 4-androstenedione and felt it good the first couple of times i took it but after repeated dosing the effects seemed to dissapear.

ligand binding induces conformational changes to proteins... for most enzymes shape returns after reaction

my body always seems to find a way to get used to everything i take

 

[jbryand101b]

The same for me with 4 androstenediol, 600mg at first was great, but after a week or two, I find I have to greatly incase the dosage. I felt this way also when I ran andromass.

Update, I'm leaning out like a mo fo, and getting bigger from trenavar, stay tuned, next week will have 3 week half way point pics up.

 

[Whacked]

Nice

 

[jason79]

hd has little, if any at all, conversion to oral turinabol. choco milk knows this, as anyone else with half a brain (and is familiar with steroids), also understands this is what he meant with his post.

hd is and should be thought of as an oral actice methylated steroid, and not a pro hormone to turinabol. it does not need to conver in order to bind (however weakly) to the androgen receptor. it's long half life makes up for the weak binding abilities though.

How do you, choc milk and "anyone else with a brain" know this though? All anyone knows for sure is you swallow hdrol at a certain dose for a certain duration of time and you'll see an increase in strength and lean mass along with other obvious anabolic/androgenic effects. I don't think anyone knows if those effects are mediated by the parent molecule, OT, or some other active metabolite. All anyone has is conjecture. I understand that conjecture is fine, but people shouldn't go around posting it as if it's absolute fact. That's all I'm saying. IOW, don't accept all the message board dogma as fact. Often it isn't.

 

[jason79]

well Pa and others used to claim that the diol products exhibited supperior conversion to the 3 ketone via the 3hsd enzyme. was everybody wrong and these compound exhibited anabolic activity as is? i know the old 4-androstenediol didn't really feel like test to me. something different about it. i used to make kits out of the base and pinn it everyday. i put on some mass but not like regular test does.

AFAIK the figures that PA (and others) put out a long time ago were based upon studies done on the riginal androstenedione and 4-AD. Diones and diols of different androgens, that act as potential precursors to different androgens, might have different % conversion. It might be less or more depending on how the differences in molecular structure (compared to andro as a standard for the sake of this convo) shift the equilibrium.

 

[chocolatemilk]

How do you, choc milk and "anyone else with a brain" know this though? All anyone knows for sure is you swallow hdrol at a certain dose for a certain duration of time and you'll see an increase in strength and lean mass along with other obvious anabolic/androgenic effects. I don't think anyone knows if those effects are mediated by the parent molecule, OT, or some other active metabolite. All anyone has is conjecture. I understand that conjecture is fine, but people shouldn't go around posting it as if it's absolute fact. That's all I'm saying. IOW, don't accept all the message board dogma as fact. Often it isn't.

i remember reading a study showing most oral turinabol metabolites being 3-oh

and what do you realistically think a charged substituent right next to the 3-oh will do to enzyme binding? think sterics. think 2a methyl protecting 3-keto reduction on superdrol.

i could tell you the major metabolites of halodrol, but i'm not going to pay for that study as i cant access it free from my school

 

[vidapreta]

i remember reading a study showing most oral turinabol metabolites being 3-oh

and what do you realistically think a charged substituent right next to the 3-oh will do to enzyme binding? think sterics. think 2a methyl protecting 3-keto reduction on superdrol.

i could tell you the major metabolites of halodrol, but i'm not going to pay for that study as i cant access it free from my school

I usually just read the back of the bottle.


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[vidapreta]

LOL

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