Dosing Guide for Popular PH/DS

[EricMM]

Jebrook it's been a long time since the OP was updated, but I'm seeing 1-testosterone/dihydroboldenone around and there's also some YouTubers talking about it. Therefore, I'd consider it relevant to add this compound as a designer steroid as that's how it was introduced to market. What say you, sir?

1-Testosterone is dose dependent on really two factors. First would be your clearing rate. That's not something you can really test unless you have a good DNA kit. I won't really pop for one but I know I am a fast clearer. Meaning I need a high dose at a lot of frequency.

Remember that 1-AD (the original) was dosed at 300-600mg per day. I do think that 1-DHEA with the enhancements of delivery can be lower than that, but that is where the bar is set. So, what I suggest as a minimum is 150-200mg per day for liposomal delivery. For the 6,7 DHB I would say 300mg per day is the minimum.

Some people do well at this level and others need more. Try to dose it at least 2 times per day but 3 is better.

Here are some things I would HIGHLY suggest you take with any modern PH.

1) Forskolin - 10% 300mg per day minimum. This upregulates just about every enzyme in the body and should work well with both 3bHSD and 17bHSD (two enzymes involved in conversion).

2) Longjack - I really just like this as a supplement to keep test levels up and to help with sex drive.

A few things to think about is lethargy (feeling tired) and from what I can tell that's simply due to the very anabolic nature of 1-Testosterone in target tissues. This is usually cured by increasing the food intake. So, make sure you are eating 4-6 meals a day with a min of 20g of protein at each meal.

 

[EricMM]

I get what you are saying, however I am currently ending a gyno battle and both test and bold aromatize. The last thing I need is for it to come back week 1 of my cycle. Having said that, I will give it 1 week on just triump,test,bold to see how I feel. If I dont see the need for the epiandro, I will save it for later or some other cycle.

Besides that, I have my suspicions that my body is naturally low on DHT and relatively high on test and estrogen. The epiandro is something I got to test this theory out. Yes, doing it in the middle of an already stacked cycle isnt really objective at all. Which is why I am waiting at least a week or more to introduce it if I feel the need.

If your argument holds true for my case then I will know it and there will be no need for the epiandro. Futhermore, If I do end up running the epiandro and I notice sides from too much dht or too low estro, I will either cut it out or lower the dose significantly.

I have found that the best thing to take for gyno is 17-Pro Andro. This seems to really reduce the E receptor density and dried up any gyno that I was experiencing. I was getting it bad and I was taking Arimistane, DIM and a small dose of Nolvadex. None of them did the job like 17-Pro Andro.

 

[hazard12]

I have found that the best thing to take for gyno is 17-Pro Andro. This seems to really reduce the E receptor density and dried up any gyno that I was experiencing. I was getting it bad and I was taking Arimistane, DIM and a small dose of Nolvadex. None of them did the job like 17-Pro Andro.

I will keep that in mind! Luckily I have been able to kill it by 95% with exemestane and raloxifene already. It will probably be completely dead by the time my cycle begins but I will still keep an eye out. If things get hairy Ill grab a bottle of this instead of using ralox again. I dont wanna keep running it forever, theres always weird sides after running anything new for a while haha

 

[saywutrly]

I'm sure I can make dat happen cap'n.
I should make sure all the new andros are on there as well.

Good call there. I'm sure there's a lot of folks looking for information on those.

 

[yates84]

I have found that the best thing to take for gyno is 17-Pro Andro. This seems to really reduce the E receptor density and dried up any gyno that I was experiencing. I was getting it bad and I was taking Arimistane, DIM and a small dose of Nolvadex. None of them did the job like 17-Pro Andro.

Nolva, yes. 17 pro andro, hell no.

 

[yates84]

1-Testosterone is dose dependent on really two factors. First would be your clearing rate. That's not something you can really test unless you have a good DNA kit. I won't really pop for one but I know I am a fast clearer. Meaning I need a high dose at a lot of frequency.

Remember that 1-AD (the original) was dosed at 300-600mg per day. I do think that 1-DHEA with the enhancements of delivery can be lower than that, but that is where the bar is set. So, what I suggest as a minimum is 150-200mg per day for liposomal delivery. For the 6,7 DHB I would say 300mg per day is the minimum.

Some people do well at this level and others need more. Try to dose it at least 2 times per day but 3 is better.

Here are some things I would HIGHLY suggest you take with any modern PH.

1) Forskolin - 10% 300mg per day minimum. This upregulates just about every enzyme in the body and should work well with both 3bHSD and 17bHSD (two enzymes involved in conversion).

2) Longjack - I really just like this as a supplement to keep test levels up and to help with sex drive.

A few things to think about is lethargy (feeling tired) and from what I can tell that's simply due to the very anabolic nature of 1-Testosterone in target tissues. This is usually cured by increasing the food intake. So, make sure you are eating 4-6 meals a day with a min of 20g of protein at each meal.

Lol you are gonna keep test levels up on cycle? I'm sure a natty supp will over power something that hormonally breaks the hpta.

 

[saywutrly]

Lol you are gonna keep test levels up on cycle? I'm sure a natty supp will over power something that hormonally breaks the hpta.

I was going to say something about this as well, bro. Someone clearly has more money than experience. That, or everything being said is a subtle advertisement.

 

[AnabolicGuru]

I dont know if you have gathered any new information on Methyldiazirinol, but I will be running it soon and would love to see some more info on it. There doesn't seem to be much out there besides low doses (35-45/day) and people rarely report effects that make it stand out. I was advised to run it with my recomp cycle by someone with years of experience both personal and with clients so I am pretty set on my choice but having some more info on what to expect and how to maximize profit would be nice!

It's very mild even at higher dosages from my experience with it

 

[saywutrly]

I will keep that in mind! Luckily I have been able to kill it by 95% with exemestane and raloxifene already. It will probably be completely dead by the time my cycle begins but I will still keep an eye out. If things get hairy Ill grab a bottle of this instead of using ralox again. I dont wanna keep running it forever, theres always weird sides after running anything new for a while haha

Letro and nolva are what you want for gyno if nothing else is working, brother. Raloxifene and torem are newer and easier on the body but the best SERM for gyno is nolva.

 

[hazard12]

It's very mild even at higher dosages from my experience with it

Awesome! This is probably why the guy guiding me suggested 80mg/day right off the bat. What were your dosages? How long did you run it for? Any cycle supports?

 

[EricMM]

It's not simply about natural test levels completely. I think there are factors in LJ that help with libido and well being.

As for the 17Pro. I don't like Nolvadex as a "Go To" due to the lowered igf1 levels. I think it's a good idea to have it on hand for emergency purposes but I like to have just about everything on hand

 

[hazard12]

Letro and nolva are what you want for gyno if nothing else is working, brother. Raloxifene and torem are newer and easier on the body but the best SERM for gyno is nolva.

Yeah I have letro saved up for an emergency situation. Luckily exemestane and ralox was all I needed. I rather go with the milder route first and see if it works before throwing in the NUKES, you know what I mean? I will definitely keep a stock of SERMS and AIs on hand given my gyno history.

 

[Admin]

Someone clearly has more money than experience. .

Funny since he designed all the new DHEA's. I don't think you could get more of an ironic statement than this.

 

[EricMM]

Awesome! This is probably why the guy guiding me suggested 80mg/day right off the bat. What were your dosages? How long did you run it for? Any cycle supports?

No, don't just start hammering Nolvadex my friend. See what works for you. Try 20 and see what feels right is my suggestion.

 

[yates84]

It's not simply about natural test levels completely. I think there are factors in LJ that help with libido and well being.

As for the 17Pro. I don't like Nolvadex as a "Go To" due to the lowered igf1 levels. I think it's a good idea to have it on hand for emergency purposes but I like to have just about everything on hand

Ralox then, works just as good as nolva with no lowering of igf

 

[hazard12]

No, don't just start hammering Nolvadex my friend. See what works for you. Try 20 and see what feels right is my suggestion.

Oh no you got me wrong haha. We are talking about 2 different things for 2 different purposes at 2 different stages here. the 80mg/day was the methydiazirinol dose im taking the first 6 weeks of my upcoming cycle. I wouldnt run nolva past 40, maybe 60 for a couple of days if I was desperate. For now Im content with my 60/60/30/30 ralox and 12.5mgED exemestane. It got rid of my gyno in about a month, no sides and feel great.

 

[Admin]

Ralox then, works just as good as nolva with no lowering of igf

Still lowers it, just not as much, and even then it measured serum levels, not IGF within skeletal muscle.

 

[EricMM]

Oh no you got me wrong haha. We are talking about 2 different things for 2 different purposes at 2 different stages here. the 80mg/day was the methydiazirinol dose im taking the first 6 weeks of my upcoming cycle. I wouldnt run nolva past 40, maybe 60 for a couple of days if I was desperate. For now Im content with my 60/60/30/30 ralox and 12.5mgED exemestane. It got rid of my gyno in about a month, no sides and feel great.

Lol Ok good. People just start taking everything under the sun for no reason. I see guys taking cabergoline just because and all sorts of nonsense. 80mg of Nolvadex is a **** ton.

 

[Jebrook]

Awesome! This is probably why the guy guiding me suggested 80mg/day right off the bat. What were your dosages? How long did you run it for? Any cycle supports?

I ran Triumph starting at 80 and tapering all the way up to 120 mg over 7 weeks. I quit a week early due to feeling like ass. I also stacked 4 andro, Epiandro, and S11. The run was okay but it totally thrashed my liver and lipids. Exercise due caution on dose and length. 60-80 would be best IMO. I saw no benefits going higher. For support, I used a full dose of ACP, 1 gram TUDCA total, and half dose cycle assist and everything was still f*kt afterwards. It may be considered overall mild but length and dose are big factors as well as stacking multiple compounds.

 

[EricMM]

I ran Triumph starting at 80 and tapering all the way up to 120 mg over 7 weeks. I quit a week early due to feeling lik ass. I also stacked 4 andro, Epiandro, and S11. The run was okay but it totally thrashed my liver and lipids. Exercise due caution on dose and length. 60-80 would be best IMO. I saw no benefits going higher. For support, I used a full dose of ACP, 1 gram TUDCA total, and half dose cycle assist and everything was f*kt afterwards. It may be considered overall mild but length and dose are big factors as well as stacking multiple compounds.

That is a **** load of dimethazine. What were the gains like? Yeah it's going to bring some pain with it. Lol

 

[yates84]

That is a **** load of dimethazine. What were the gains like? Yeah it's going to bring some pain with it. Lol

Who said anyrhing about dmz? I'm confused...

 

[EricMM]

Isn't that what's in Triumph?

 

[hazard12]

Methyldiazirinol

 

[EricMM]

Gotcha. Same thing pretty much...still a high dose. Plus a SARM on top of it

 

[EricMM]

Can't imagine the lipid and BP sides on that...

 

[Jebrook]

That is a **** load of dimethazine. What were the gains like? Yeah it's going to bring some pain with it. Lol

Triumph is actually Methyldiazarinol(think IL Triumphalis). For DMZ I stick to 45 mg and 4-5 weeks. I wanted to try a cycle with a moderate to mild compound and push the dose excessively high to see what the high dosing is all about that many guys claim to do. Gains were okay for 4 weeks then slowed to a stop basically cause my orgains were under duress. That cycle just proved to me that the lowest effective dose is the best strategy no matter what the compound is.

 

[yates84]

Can't imagine the lipid and BP sides on that...

The right supps can offset that. Suprised you don't use epicatechin in your cycle support, lowers bp and also is an indirect myostatin inhibitor. Its one of my go to cycle support supps.

 

[hazard12]

The right supps can offset that. Suprised you don't use epicatechin in your cycle support, lowers bp and also is an indirect myostatin inhibitor. Its one of my go to cycle support supps.

Dude yes...I havent seen that many people stacking hormonals with natty anabolics with cool effects lile epi...it boggles my mind...why not go about anabolism by tackling as many regulatory systems as possible while improving your hormonal run...Anyways, thats what ill be doing

 

[yates84]

Dude yes...I havent seen that many people stacking hormonals with natty anabolics with cool effects lile epi...it boggles my mind...why not go about anabolism by tackling as many regulatory systems as possible while improving your hormonal run...Anyways, thats what ill be doing

I've been doing this for a long time bro so have lots of cool little tricks and ideas. Feel free to hit me up if you ever need any direction.

 

[Jebrook]

Gotcha. Same thing pretty much...still a high dose. Plus a SARM on top of it

If you're referring to my run, yes it was a silly high dose. That was intentional though so I could make inferences from the pre/postcycle/post pct bloods. Just for clarification for others reading or those that don't know all the compound terminology and names we fling around, I stacked 3 ph's and 1 designer. I didn't use any SARMs in this run:

Methyldiazarinol-80-120 mg
4 andro-220 up to 440 mg
Epi-Andro-1000 mg
11-Keto-250-500 mg

So, pretty high doses of 4 mild ph/ds. I knew high doses and a combo of 4 compounds would cause lots of stress but honestly I was surprised by how much. It was a good run for what I learned if not the gains.

 

[yates84]

Who's ran phera before? Trying to figure out if I should start at 20 or 30mg

 

[wesb2387]

Who's ran phera before? Trying to figure out if I should start at 20 or 30mg

40-50mg for 4-6 weeks is money

I'd personally start at 30mg though

 

[yates84]

40-50mg for 4-6 weeks is money

I'd personally start at 30mg though

Hell yeah, repped.

 

[wesb2387]

I looooved phera

 

[yates84]

I looooved phera

Hope I do too because I've got tons of it. Running it with IM trest ace

 

[wesb2387]

Hope I do too because I've got tons of it. Running it with IM trest ace

Ha I'll take it if you don't like it?

 

[Jebrook]

Hope I do too because I've got tons of it. Running it with IM trest ace

If you don't wanna go up to 40-60 mg you can offload some on me and I would. Sounds like a mucho fun run:head:

 

[hazard12]

Ha I'll take it if you don't like it��

Yeah right!? Phera is one of those mythical beasts I let run past me as I watched with a tear streaming down my cheek...

 

[yates84]

Yeah right!? Phera is one of those mythical beasts I let run past me as I watched with a tear streaming down my cheek...

I jumped on that fukers back, about to go for a ride lol

 

[hazard12]

I jumped on that fukers back, about to go for a ride lol

HAHAH enjoy the ride man, link me up if you do a log! I am really curious to see how it treats ya. I have some Sup3r-2 which is supposed to be like super mild phera but I dont have enough experience to even know how to go about stacking mild phera with something else.

 

[Admin]

The right supps can offset that. Suprised you don't use epicatechin in your cycle support, lowers bp and also is an indirect myostatin inhibitor. Its one of my go to cycle support supps.

For some, but for most, there really isn't a natty supplement that is going to counter certain compounds. You could take all the supplements in the world but try Anavar and/or Winstrol and anything highly androgenic for a lengthy time and you will destroy your lipids. As long as the effects aren't long term, they will return to normal and everything should be fine.

 

[yates84]

For some, but for most, there really isn't a natty supplement that is going to counter certain compounds. You could take all the supplements in the world but try Anavar and/or Winstrol and anything highly androgenic for a lengthy time and you will destroy your lipids. As long as the effects aren't long term, they will return to normal and everything should be fine.

Yep, agreed. I end up on lisinopril on longer heavier cycles. Still try to offset the side effects as much as possible via natural means. Lol on too many drugs as it is. My lipids are well back in range after 4 or 5 weeks post cycle. Not bad for an old man

 

[EricMM]

Who's ran phera before? Trying to figure out if I should start at 20 or 30mg

30 is a nice dose and it does work well but I do know the sides are pretty nasty. Particularly the lipids. Make sure you have fish oil supplements and other ingredients like a good coq10 unbiquinol to offset the lipid issues.

Always keep that heart in good health.

 

[EricMM]

My lipid lowering looks like this%

Life extension Pomegranate Extract

High Gamma Vitamin E 200mg

Triple Strength Fish Oil - 4 Soft gels a day

Coq10 200mg

 

[yates84]

30 is a nice dose and it does work well but I do know the sides are pretty nasty. Particularly the lipids. Make sure you have fish oil supplements and other ingredients like a good coq10 unbiquinol to offset the lipid issues.

Always keep that heart in good health.

Definitely, I always try and keep health my main priority. On on cycle supplement lineup is pretty strong and this is the firat oral I have ran in almost a year. Coq10, nac, and cialis are staples for me on and off cycle.

 

[yates84]

My lipid lowering looks like this%

Life extension Pomegranate Extract

High Gamma Vitamin E 200mg

Triple Strength Fish Oil - 4 Soft gels a day

Coq10 200mg

Coq10 is also good for bp support. Best of both worlds

 

[Toren]

30 is a nice dose and it does work well but I do know the sides are pretty nasty. Particularly the lipids. Make sure you have fish oil supplements and other ingredients like a good coq10 unbiquinol to offset the lipid issues.

Always keep that heart in good health.

Interesting seeing your name pop up on the forum here. I still have your "What are you on?" book, from over a decade ago.

 

[Toren]

yates84, good to see your name popping up around here again! Sup dude?

 

[yates84]

yates84, good to see your name popping up around here again! Sup dude?

Back from the dead! You know I would never leave you guys, right? Hope everything is 100% for you, my friend.

 

[Toren]

Back from the dead! You know I would never leave you guys, right? Hope everything is 100% for you, my friend.

All good in the hood. Have been mostly MIA here myself in recent months....but a new cycle on the horizon has my anabolic mind turning again.