Blood work after a year and 5 cycles of M1T later...

[Jayhawkk]

Had the ekg done as well. All normal.

 

[motiv8er]

Jayhawkk,
You are your own man by all means but...

I feel like you are a Professional Russian Roulette player. It's not that you haven't been fortunate in your matches, but you stand to gain so little with so much to lose. I have 3 grams of M-1-t that I've been sitting on for 2 years. Haven't touched the shite. Many other ways I'd like to go.

If you died right now I'd want you buried in my back yard, I wouldn't have rats for decades to come. Get the picture.

M-1-t is a like Japan in 1945, sure it won the war. And we are still paying for it. Look at Iran, Iraq, Syria.....

Be careful bud, IMO it isn't worth it.

 

[brogers]

Hey dude if you decide to use anabolics again, do yourself (and your body) a favor and run injectable test. You'll feel great, make good gains, and it doesn't mess with your liver values.

 

[Astue]

Nice one liner you have there...I would have a response but it doesn't seem you're worth the time.

I don't care if I'm worth your time. I think you got my point that you are loosing extra time as it is. Just about everyone has told you the reality of your mistakes, but you don't care to listen. My comment of the magic pill is that you have the same tired old story as anyone who isn't mature enough and dosn't learn about what they are doing first. You have taken, clen, t3, slin, ephedra and you still find it necassary to take your chances with M1t. Obvioulsy nothing is working for you and you can't accept the fact that the drugs are only tools and not a crutch. You can make posts about what you do or don't do all you want. We will never know the reality from the **** storm. Take account for the lazy effort you put towards your diet. You can say I don't know anyting about your diet, but I don't have to know you personally to see it's the same mistakes so many have made in the begining. It's just that obvious. I don't know what you meant by your post where you state you don't eat chicken anymore. But if you don't eat chicken, I garuntee you that your not serious enough about your training to take supplements responsibly.

 

[THETEST]

I did not hear about PCT - you need liver care ALL thru the cycle, and help bringing natural Test back, and liver enzymes down during PCT - did you do any of that? You need a ton of milk thistel my friend - and some other stuff too - what are your test levels. Mine dropped from 700 to 29!!!

 

[WantingBig]

Hi,

i've been working out steadily for over 4 years and i'm naturally super lean and now i'm cut. But my goal is to get big, which was the reason i started M1T about a month ago @ 10mg/d, because without the help of supplement, my workout doesn't seem to go anywhere anymore. i have a question.

At the first week, i was very energetic. Strength up LOTS, muscles pumped up. The only problem for me was i couldn't sleep well. And then i was travelling during the holiday season, so i stopped for about 2 weeks. Then when I started again about 2 weeks ago, the effect is different. I've been feeling very tired and want to sleep a lot. I read that it's a side effect of M1T. But now comes the question:

If it makes you sleepy and tired, how is it helping you to train intensively at the gym?

Thanks in advance for your answers.
WB

 

[motiv8er]

What do you know about M1T?

 

[WantingBig]

I've read a lot on the internet about M1T. I know it's bad but I've spent years trying to gain weight and get bigger. It's just not working. Sure I gained a lot in strength and I'm lean and cut, but my weight stays the same. I know it may just not be possible for me since my body can only do so much, and I should be happy about what I have, but I still wanted to see if I could actually have a breakthrough. I learned that M1T is the most powerful orally-taken prosteroid and it doesn't look like it'll kill me instantly, so I thought i'd give it a try. I've gained 3 pounds in a month, not sure if it's the M1T or the new Creatine I'm using. 3 pounds for me was a BIG gain! I'm not sure if I'd continue after I finish this bottle but I'd for sure be very careful having read all that.

Tiredness decreases the performance at the gym. Isn't that contradicting to what it's supposed to do? Do you know?

WB

 

[wastedwhiteboy2]

I hope you are not taking m1t for a month. and if you are and only gained 3lbs after taking it for a month you are not eating enough. I know what its like to be a hard gainer but 3lbs is not very much for a anabolic like m1t.

 

[motiv8er]

Hypoglycemic induced lethargy is one possible culprit. Pea sized nuts in your throat could be another. What does your PCT look like? What does your nutrition program look like? What does your rest program look like? Please answer me those and we'll see if we can assist you.

 

[swole210]

Hypoglycemic induced lethargy is one possible culprit. Pea sized nuts in your throat could be another. What does your PCT look like? What does your nutrition program look like? What does your rest program look like? Please answer me those and we'll see if we can assist you.

I would dare to say that pct is non existing, nutrition and rest program are very weak. 3lbs in a month from something like M-1t points a finger at these things! By the way Wantingbig, how old are you?

 

[WantingBig]

Thanks very much for your replies, WWB2, motiv8er, and swole210. I should have joined the dicussion forum years ago but I'd been happy about the strength and muscularity I was getting until now that I get to a stage where I need a breakthrough in my workout.

It's been only 2 weeks into my first cycle of M1T @ 10mg/d. (I bought it a little over a month ago and ON for 1 week before I went on a vacation where I stopped for about 2 weeks. Then I restarted it about 2 weeks ago.)

I haven't gone on a PCT yet, but I have bought bottles of Iron-Tek 17-Alpha OXO Nolone, which is supposed to help my own test production during post cycle. I should find some Milk Thistle to save my liver as well.

As to my nutrition program...I use CellMass Creatine 2 times/day (once upon waking, once immediately after workout). I eat breakfast (normally 2 eggs, a banana, and a glass of milk), lunch (varies), and dinner (also varies). I drink milk instead of water in the office, eat small snacks in between meals. And also i drink Protein shakes (~20g of protein) after workout. People who don't workout think i eat a lot. People who workout think i don't eat enough. I think I do eat a lot considering how small my stomach is, but maybe not enough protein? (I developed gout when I first started working out by protein usage, so I've not been taking a lot of it. But i noticed that I can take more protein now without having my toes hurt. Might have been the M1T?) What kind of nutrition program do you have?

My workout program is normally 3 days at the gym for chest, back, and legs, off 1 or 2 days. I sometimes subsitute a day of back or leg workout by swimming for an hour. I sleep ~8 hours/day.

I just turned 31. I stand 5'7, weight 123 (altho people often guess me ~135, but i'm light...hate it!!).

Also I found some answers to my question about being tired from using M1T. It looks like you need to counter the side effect by taking 4-ad or any testosterone, and keep your carb intake high. Since taking other testosterone introduces other side effect, I think for now I'll just keep my carb intake higher?

Thanks again for your help. My goal is to gain 10 pounds, something I never believe or had stopped believing.

WB

 

[motiv8er]

I don't know where to start.

M1T is anabolic rat poison. It is the heroin of oral AAS.

For nutrition you started with a creatine product, you are not ready.

I needed to hear about whole oats and eggs for breakfest. I needed to hear about whole wheat sandwiches at lunch. If I take 5 mgs of M1T for a week, I gain 10 lbs of various substances. I weigh 222lbs at 12% bf.

You need to stop altogether, start "PCT." You need to start studying in the nutrition section. I am on a maintence diet of about 4000 cals. I eat about 80% clean most of the time. My food bill might be close to 600-700 dollars a month.

I may consume up to 60 grams of nattie fiber a day. You can judge your carb sources by their fiber content.

You are test depleted, you are hypo. You have elevated liver and cholesteral right now. I suggest you STOP ALTOGETHER!!

I'd be happy to show you some better things you SHOULD BE doing. Steriods are the worst thing you can do right now.

Best of luck.

 

[WantingBig]

Thanks for the suggestion. I think you're right. I've been reading a lot about steroid since I started M1T and found out that i really don't know much about it.

Since it's been 2 weeks, i think i'm going to make it a short cycle and start PCT, during which i can study more about drugs and nutrition. The amount of gain i got doesn't seem to match the amount of risk i'm taking. If i'm doing steroid, i should do it right to at least show respect to my liver and testies.

If you don't mind, what are the better things should i be doing?

Thanks!
WB

 

[WantingBig]

Oh...i started from Creatine for my nutrition program because it is the first thing i eat in the morning The first dose should be taken 8 hours before the workout on an empty stomach.

 

[swole210]

Oh...i started from Creatine for my nutrition program because it is the first thing i eat in the morning The first dose should be taken 8 hours before the workout on an empty stomach.

Hey Wantingbig, what up! Well its good that you are taking the advice of some here, and stopping the M-1t right away. Make sure you get on a Pct pronto! As for that Irontek stuff...I do not know anything about it, but I wil go out on a limb, and say drop it! Opt for products from some of the board sponsers here. Things such as Designers Rebound XT(or any otther ATD product), Designers ActivaTe, some DHEA, one of the natty test boosters like Deisel Test, or Vitrex( I like these 2 but there are others), ZMA, a good multi vitamin & mineral, and EFA's. These are all things to help get your "Boys" back up and running again, and get yo r natural test back up. Something like Designers Lean Extreme, would also benefit you, as it would reduce your cortisol levels, which will be raised after comming off the M-1t, and you don't want that! For your liver help, I would be looking for things like Milk Thistle, NAC(N-Acetyl-Cysteine), and Alpha Lipoic Acid. You can get these in all in one type products, from companies like Anabolice Extreme(Perfect Cycle) or Now Foods, which the sponsers of this site carry in their stores. For heart/lipids help, I would suggest Hawthorn Berry, Red Yeast Rice, Carlic extract, and with Red yeast rice, I would also take CoQ10. I know it sounds like a lot, but You dont have to take all of these things. Do some searches here on these topics, and also visit the board sponser's stores, and you can find a lot of these things in combinations as one. As for nutrition... you need to eat more!! Like motiv8tersaid, carbs high in fiber, and you need to get more protein in! That one shake w 20 gm of protein pwo and those two eggs in the morning will NOT do it. I am sure you get a little more protein in ( you mentioned you drink a lot of milk) in you other two meals, but you need to get more in. Try 3 shakes, and make them at least 30 gm of protein each. If serving size is one scoop for20 gm of protein, take 1 1/2 scoops. I allways take 2 scoops usaully 3x day, but since you are lighter, take 1 1/2 scoops 3 x day. I am sure I left out a lot of other things, but I am all of these knowledgable guys on this board, who are willing to help out, will pick up what I left out, and perhaps even offer better advice. But I hope I at least got you going in the right direction, and back to a speedy recovery from the M-1t, and on your way to big gains! Hope this helps out bro!:cheers:

 

[DR.D]

Some good advice Swole! Be careful with the Vitex during PCT though. It lowers LH levels in the end and should really be reserved for "prolactin/progesterone gyno" IMO. Good stress on the protein too, it takes a lot, just like you suggested.

 

[WantingBig]

Thanks all for all the great support!! This is like a brotherhood that I can really relate to and get idea from. There's still so much for me to read and learn, especially all the drugs with looong names, besides where I can get them.

But I'm actually starting to believe that someday I will gain that 10 pounds I always wanted and even more hehehe....

On the side note, it seems like my "boys" are running ok cuz my libido's been no less, except that I'm too tired to do anything after a day of work and a hard workout

 

[DR.D]

Haha, there's lots of nice fellas here for sure. Not too much flaming and good, free exchange of ideas.

 

[kwyckemynd00]

...

Its all nutrition.

Hire a GOOD nutritionist to get you bulking up.

You "aren't" eating very much, at all. I'd say, for YOU, you should be looking at around 3000k/cals per day to gain size. That's about 500cals/meal.

Don't worry about getting fat, its not going to happen if you have the self control to eat "right". E.G. Chinese average 1kcals more than americans do every day, but, they don't have the processed carb + sat'd fat meals we do 3x/day. And, american's get about 7% of their protein from animal meat, whereas they get about 70% from animal meat. Just an example as to how excessive calories won't make you fat if the content is right (which I didn't get "at first").

If you can't afford the $250 for someone like Bobo (board owner, owner of http://www.flanutrition.com ) to work with you, read the "Massive Eating" articles in the below link, and as much information as you can on the entire nutrition page by Dr. John Berardi: http://johnberardi.com/articles/nutrition/index.htm

 

[swole210]

Some good advice Swole! Be careful with the Vitex during PCT though. It lowers LH levels in the end and should really be reserved for "prolactin/progesterone gyno" IMO. Good stress on the protein too, it takes a lot, just like you suggested.

Thanks Dr.D! By the way, good info on the Vitex, I did not know this! Is there enough of it in the Vitrix By Nutrex to make a big difference in this area though? I might have missplelled it above, but I meant to say Vitrix By Nutrex, I don't know if this will change your opinion on it doc .

 

[DR.D]

Thanks Dr.D! By the way, good info on the Vitex, I did not know this! Is there enough of it in the Vitrix By Nutrex to make a big difference in this area though? I might have missplelled it above, but I meant to say Vitrix By Nutrex, I don't know if this will change your opinion on it doc .

I don't know how much or how strong the concentration actually is in Vitex. I got a bottle of it too but it doesn't say the actual ratios! I got it for my wife to stack with some black cohosh (another antigonadotropic) but saw it had all the other stuff in it that does the opposite! So I don't know what effect would win, increased or decreased LH.

If used in short bursts, like 1wk on 1wk off it may increase LH. If taken longer, I'd bet it will reduce LH and test levels.

 

[swole210]

I don't know how much or how strong the concentration actually is in Vitex. I got a bottle of it too but it doesn't say the actual ratios! I got it for my wife to stack with some black cohosh (another antigonadotropic) but saw it had all the other stuff in it that does the opposite! So I don't know what effect would win, increased or decreased LH.

If used in short bursts, like 1wk on 1wk off it may increase LH. If taken longer, I'd bet it will reduce LH and test levels.

Thanks Doc:thumbsup:!

 

[swole210]

Thanks Doc:thumbsup:!

By the way theDoc, just wanted to say that I wish you could have chimed in on that discussion that Big Cat and some others were having on here on pct protocols. Man he was really going against what you advise. He was confusing the **** out of me! I asked for you to come in and give your opinion on some things, and he came out blasting you! I am glad the thread got closed for that reason, but I waished it had stayed open a little longer so you could shime some light. Thanks again Dr.D

 

[motiv8er]

WantingBig, glad you were open to suggestion. Good luck around here, I think you'll find some answers.

:burger:

 

[jmh80]

Hey Wanna,
Check out my pics thread. I came from not much more than what you weight (140 lbs or so) to 170 lbs. today.

You just need to learn to eat more. And don't be neurotic (read: a woman) about gaining fat. I think that was/is my biggest hinderance.

 

[Goat]

Jay - The question was asked previously but you never answered, what were your gains?

 

[jmh80]

Goat - I can't help but laugh at your s/n because of the old Indian guy in 40 Year Old Virgin that would ALWAYS end a conversation in "go **** a goat".
:rofl:

 

[DR.D]

By the way theDoc, just wanted to say that I wish you could have chimed in on that discussion that Big Cat and some others were having on here on pct protocols. Man he was really going against what you advise. He was confusing the **** out of me! I asked for you to come in and give your opinion on some things, and he came out blasting you! I am glad the thread got closed for that reason, but I waished it had stayed open a little longer so you could shime some light. Thanks again Dr.D

Yeah, BC really hates me. According to him, I should be "shot and sterilized" for suggesting DHEA during PCT! Poor guy is really clueless though. I don't think he's ever done a steroid in his life (maybe a few PH cycles only) but he thinks he knows everything and you can't tell him he wrong! LOL.. Oh well. God bless him.

 

[Goat]

Goat - I can't help but laugh at your s/n because of the old Indian guy in 40 Year Old Virgin that would ALWAYS end a conversation in "go **** a goat".
:rofl:

I used to get a lot of that, fortunatley I have shed that nickname finally IRL.

 

[swole210]

Yeah, BC really hates me. According to him, I should be "shot and sterilized" for suggesting DHEA during PCT! Poor guy is really clueless though. I don't think he's ever done a steroid in his life (maybe a few PH cycles only) but he thinks he knows everything and you can't tell him he wrong! LOL.. Oh well. God bless him.

I think you are right about all that Doc. I really don't know too much about him, since i do not frequent BB.com, but I remember when he first started giving steroid advice, and recall him stating he never had done any yet. I think I'll stick with your advice any day Doc, thanks!

 

[motiv8er]

Jayhawkk,
You are your own man by all means but...

I feel like you are a Professional Russian Roulette player. It's not that you haven't been fortunate in your matches, but you stand to gain so little with so much to lose. I have 3 grams of M-1-t that I've been sitting on for 2 years. Haven't touched the ****e. Many other ways I'd like to go.

If you died right now I'd want you buried in my back yard, I wouldn't have rats for decades to come. Get the picture.

M-1-t is a like Japan in 1945, sure it won the war. And we are still paying for it. Look at Iran, Iraq, Syria.....

Be careful bud, IMO it isn't worth it.

So Jayhawwk,

Are you still planning on using M1T?!?!

Congrats on the new modship, you've come a long way baby. Remember, I've been trying to save your life from the beginning.

 

[CEDeoudes59]

i remember this thread, glad you are in good health JHawk

 

[jmh80]

Yeah - I think I flamed him somewhere in here.

It was resurrected during the first quiz he put out for points.

 

[Jayhawkk]

Alive and very healthy with perfect values across the board. One of those learning experiences for sure. The main reason why I stuck around and supported the board so much. The people here basically saved me from my own stupidity.

 

[Zombie]

Alive and very healthy with perfect values across the board. One of those learning experiences for sure. The main reason why I stuck around and supported the board so much. The people here basically saved me from my own stupidity.

i take my hat off , it takes a really big person to say that.

 

[CEDeoudes59]

now look at you, you are a mod, you've come a long way baby
hahah

avoid orals, pin, use GH, stay your prayers - live forever.

 

[bpmartyr]

See, this goes to show ya that there IS hope for me after all.

 

[DR.D]

See, this goes to show ya that there IS hope for me after all.

I vote for BPM for mod-hood!

 

[kwyckemynd00]

now look at you, you are a mod, you've come a long way baby
hahah

avoid orals, pin, use GH, stay your prayers - live forever.

So...does that mean I should not make that anadrol I've been staring at for a few months?

 

[DR.D]

So...does that mean I should not make that anadrol I've been staring at for a few months?

That's crazy talk man! He just said "avoid" orals, not eliminate them totally.

Kwyckemynd00 for super-MOD!

 

[kwyckemynd00]

Alrighty then! That's what I'm talkin' about Doc. I can always count on you to talk me into doing something I probably shouldn't :rofl:

Call me Dr. Anadrol, MD.

No, but really...I'm about to take it forthe first time, EVER. I need to stop eating the junk though, b/c if hte blood pressure I get from it is as bad as Dbol or worse, that makes me very uncomfortable. lol.

 

[ReaperX]

I just got done reading this thread. Jayhawkk, in the thread you mentioned that everything came back to normal healthy ranges.



However, you have stated other times (more recently), that they are still elevated ?

 

[Jayhawkk]

Yeah, I stay high normal when on absolutely nothing. If I stay on a couple of helpful supps/herbs I can stay normal/normal range.

Doctors say it isn't anything to concern myself over but considering i'm 33 it worries me that i'll have issues when in my 40's and 50's if I make it that far.

 

[Frank Reynolds]

Yeah, I stay high normal when on absolutely nothing. If I stay on a couple of helpful supps/herbs I can stay normal/normal range.

Doctors say it isn't anything to concern myself over but considering i'm 33 it worries me that i'll have issues when in my 40's and 50's if I make it that far.

When you say high/normal, do you know your exact numbers for Alt/ast?

Thanks-

 

[ReaperX]

Also too when you say you stay on supps/herbs, which ones do you mean by that ?

 

[Jayhawkk]

I'll have to look when I get home but it's pretty close to the high levels off whatever scale they use.

When I got my normal readings I was on

Multi-V
Iron
Cycle Support
Poseidon
Fish Oil