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Yet another Prime dissapointment

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suncloud said:
not implying you, or saying anything like that. i saw a different name in a link than the OP, and i thought THEY had two accounts, much like some of the reps that were bashing USPL have had. in fact, one of the reps has been suspiciously absent, since around the time of the prime bashing. not that i believe in conspiracy theories, but its an amazing coincidence :)
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no worries..bro!..i wasnt' responding to you,only to that theory of multiple accounts!..
 
Keep in mind that the prerequisite of a phantom account is not necessary for a REP to bash and or slander his competition anonymously. Nothing encourages them or prevents them from doing so but their integrity or lack thereof.
 
MrTexas1982 said:
Dude I use your products faithfully, Why do you guys attack like this. Based on everything I read here, and other boards, the majority of opinions i've seen on prime are negative. By saying 50/50 i was giving you guys favor. Like the log were in, its from a non responder. The annon section is (was anyway) full of non responders. From what I've read, the same 4 or 5 guys jump in on every "non responders" PRIME thread and say it worked as advertised, an that the user did something wrong. You guys act like bullies when it comes to your products. Sad because like i said, i like them, even though they don't live up to the outrageous claims in your advertising.
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It doesn't matter what the product is. No matter the product(supps, computers, cars etc) this always happens:
1. People having problems with the product post all over the place about how this product sucks or didn't work for them etc.
2. Most people NOT having problems don't bother to say or post anything because they don't care to take the time although there are still some that do.

The result is that it looks like there are way more problems or non responders in the case of supplements than there actually are.
 
eatingisfun said:
...No matter the product(supps, computers, cars etc) this always happens:
1. People having problems with the product post all over the place about how this product sucks or didn't work for them etc.
2. Most people NOT having problems don't bother to say or post anything because they don't care to take the time although there are still some that do.

The result is that it looks like there are way more problems or non responders in the case of supplements than there actually are.
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:goodpost: This is the same argument I used in earlier post (#16) to challenge the 50/50 ratio.
 
I must say: I find it odd that the Anonymous threads on PRIME received 100+ replies in a mere few hours, but my thread requesting nothing but honest results has received only three replies.
 
Mulletsoldier said:
I must say: I find it odd that the Anonymous threads on PRIME received 100+ replies in a mere few hours, but my thread requesting nothing but honest results has received only three replies.
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where's the fun in a thread with only honest results? boring........:yawn:
 
strategicmove said:
:goodpost: This is the same argument I used in earlier post (#16) to challenge the 50/50 ratio.
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Some of the people who posted that it was good will change their tone in a PM. I've gotten,"ehhh, it was ok but I'm not sure", "My workouts are better, but when I'm not in the gym I feel sluggish", "dude, I don't want your free Prime. The stuff sucks ass," ... though there are good logs on it.

Too many factors have to be considered. It's not the supplement to end all supplements and it is not a steroid replacement. When taking all of this into consideration:

1. There are people who hate Prime just due to the ludacris writeup.
2. There are people who post that they like it, when they don't even care for it enough to take the pills.
3. There are a lot of people that kiss a lot of butt for the USP free give-aways.
4. The population of people here on the board that use Prime, I can almost be certain that if it's worked for them that they'd post up. Reasons being: a) it's so new b) it's VERY expensive c) there's a lot of debate going on these boards with USP Labs
5. There are people who don't have the best diet for them, but either way when you introduce a new variable into the equation (in this case, a mighty-hailed supplement) somethings should change.
6. Miscellaneous things....

But atleast from what I've drawn from my time on the boards (quite too much time) is that from this consensus:

5% of users are blown away

10% are very impressed

10% are happy with their purchase and nothing more

10% are not upset that they spent around 60 dollars for this

20% Thought they felt/saw something, but nothing more than placebo

35% of the users are displeased and chalk it up to being a 'non-responder'

10% of the users have not gotten anything positive from the product and have some minor discrepencies with it

************
I've sifted out the people who didn't even use it and I didn't take into account the anonymous section.

Again, take it for what it is. I'm fairly good with quantitative methods and whatnot, but then again I do have some character defects that can excuse my findings ;)
 
Hank Vangut said:
where's the fun in a thread with only honest results? boring........:yawn:
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All I know that even with the extreme sabatoge effort by other companies PRIME is climbing ranks at NutraPlanet top sellers.....

This hate as become obviously transparent and is now working in reverse by fueling our sells.

The consumer are studying the detailed feedback and turning a blind eye to the one liners.
 
Hank Vangut said:
wow fog! you spend a lot of time analyzing usp products.
are you sure you don't work for them?
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LOL! What it is Hanky!

It's pretty much just an honest regurgitation of a tally that I took of how happy people were with it. I had 4 free bottles of Prime and wanted to see if it actually worked decent and what it's good for before I cracked one open and started taking it. ;)
 
I was the first person to voice on this board a lack of results with Prime. I harbor no ill feelings whatsoever. I was the one who did not respond--that is not USP Labs fault. I haven't responded to some of the most popular supplements out there. In reality, if we were all responders to just about everything than I guess we would all be 250lb gorillas minus the body fat.

I was the one who chose to buy 4 bottles at the inner circle release. Now that I think about it, no matter what the ad copy or the anticipation for a product, no one should ever buy 4 bottles of anything they have never tried before. That gaff is on me.

Because so many people respond so well to USP products, I am always going to watch their product line.

There are pharmaceuticals people don't respond too. Actual drugs. So we have to expect with all of our individual bio chemical differences that supplements are a crap shoot. If you are not willing to roll the dice and take a risk, then stay away from supplements. I'm at the point where I look at it like a salesman: it may take 20 NOs before you get a YES.
 
Force of Green said:
Some of the people who posted that it was good will change their tone in a PM. I've gotten,"ehhh, it was ok but I'm not sure", "My workouts are better, but when I'm not in the gym I feel sluggish", "dude, I don't want your free Prime. The stuff sucks ass," ... though there are good logs on it.

Too many factors have to be considered. It's not the supplement to end all supplements and it is not a steroid replacement. When taking all of this into consideration:

1. There are people who hate Prime just due to the ludacris writeup.
2. There are people who post that they like it, when they don't even care for it enough to take the pills.
3. There are a lot of people that kiss a lot of butt for the USP free give-aways.
4. The population of people here on the board that use Prime, I can almost be certain that if it's worked for them that they'd post up. Reasons being: a) it's so new b) it's VERY expensive c) there's a lot of debate going on these boards with USP Labs
5. There are people who don't have the best diet for them, but either way when you introduce a new variable into the equation (in this case, a mighty-hailed supplement) somethings should change.
6. Miscellaneous things....

But atleast from what I've drawn from my time on the boards (quite too much time) is that from this consensus:

5% of users are blown away

10% are very impressed

10% are happy with their purchase and nothing more

10% are not upset that they spent around 60 dollars for this

20% Thought they felt/saw something, but nothing more than placebo

35% of the users are displeased and chalk it up to being a 'non-responder'

10% of the users have not gotten anything positive from the product and have some minor discrepencies with it

************
I've sifted out the people who didn't even use it and I didn't take into account the anonymous section.

Again, take it for what it is. I'm fairly good with quantitative methods and whatnot, but then again I do have some character defects that can excuse my findings ;)
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I question the sanity of anyone that believes you did a quantitative analysis beyond Inny meeny minny mo.
 
USPLabs said:
I question the sanity of anyone that believes you did a quantitative analysis beyond Inny meeny minny mo.
Characters flaws like in crying on instant messenger about your insufficienies as a man?
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Don't antagonize him, Jacob.
It does nothing for you, or him.
Let's let this just fade.
 
USPLabs said:
I question the sanity of anyone that believes you did a quantitative analysis beyond Inny meeny minny mo.
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LOL, can one cry on AOL's instant messager? You make me cry Jacob... but all happy tears :)

As a man, I find myself quite sufficient. I'm not sure exactly what you're talking about.

Like I said though, it's an honest headcount from a member that spends a lot of time looking over news on recent products.
 
USPLabs said:
I question the sanity of anyone that believes you did a quantitative analysis beyond Inny meeny minny mo.
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Sir, the obnoxiousness of that statement makes you my hero.

We're sitting here refreshing our computers to see what comes next. Don't we have jobs to do or lives to live?
 
paulg said:
Sir, the obnoxiousness of that statement makes you my hero.

We're sitting here refreshing our computers to see what comes next. Don't we have jobs to do or lives to live?
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If truth presents it self as obnoxiousness so be it....
 
paulg said:
...
We're sitting here refreshing our computers to see what comes next. Don't we have jobs to do or lives to live?
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Somehow, this is part of life! :D
 
USPLabs said:
PM administration of this board and ask this question"

"Admin has there been NUMEROUS reports of IPs being tracked to other company reps that opened a shill account to attack USPlabs"
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What does this have to do with the portion of my post that you quoted? I've heard along with the majority of this board all about the reps setting up "shill" accounts. But guess what, the average member pays exactly zero attention to the USP bashing threads, so why you would flip a gear when it's obvious that you are successful anyways is beyond me. It's like middle school all over again.

Just a thought, but Mullet and Strategic had pretty much closed up the discussion in this thread until you re-opened it.
 
I stay away from any supplement(s) that is/are this controversial. I like me some egg yolks, BCAA, whey, multivitamin over all this stuff anyways. Cause I'm a siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiimplllllllllleeeeeeeeeeeeeee kiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiind of maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan.

Enough about Prime. There are a whole host of possibilities on this stuff. Here are a few:

1. There really are super ingredients in it. But USP is selling half real/half bunk product because the owner(s) is/are a flash-in-the-pan operation that want to make a mill and bounce.
2. The ingredients are super for some, and there are non-responders. The product is what it says it is, but it doesn't hold the disclaimer that states: This product may not work for you, due to some mechanism(s) we cannot understand. We are sorry. We should look into/fix why it doesn't work for you and many others empirically, but we don't.
3. Some people catch a placebo effect, and some are more self-aware and do not.

I hope that number 2 is the case. And if it is, USP should find a solution to make it beneficial for as many as possible, so as to serve the customer/end this controversy.
 
Manimalia said:
And if it is, USP should find a solution to make it beneficial for as many as possible, so as to serve the customer/end this controversy.
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If someone could figure out why someone responds to certain compounds while others don't, they'd probably win the Nobel Prize.
 
My Prime experience has been both positive and negative, in as much as I don't think I am getting what i really wanted out of it but instead ended up with something different yet as important.

what i haven't gotten is strength gains beyond what I expected from just my routine. My workouts are based on 4week waves at various percentages of 1RM, peaking at week3 and a deload week4. I have these realistically planned out 3months at a time, adjusting as needed, and so far I have kept pace with my goals.

what I have gotten out of it is the best friggin recovery I have ever had, and my pain threshold intra-sets has increased considerably. This is most noticeable on squat day and the days following it; what used to be close to crippling soreness for 2-3 days has turned into mild discomfort. while this hasn't helped with strength, it helps with intensity and the ability to deliver more power during my sets.

this benefit alone has been enough so far for me to continue taking it, and plan to do so for the length of this 3month wave.
 
USPLabs said:
I question the sanity of anyone that believes you did a quantitative analysis beyond Inny meeny minny mo.
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Jacob, I am a personal friend of Kyle's (Force of Green) and he's told me everything that goes on everyday. I'll be the first to say that he's not a cry baby. Your posting track record is really immature. You probably realize this when you take a minute to recap on what you wrote, but unfortunately you can't take back what's been said. Just grow up a little bit and present yourself as what you are; The CEO/owner of a company. Your candor makes me weep.
 
My theory on Prime is this. I had a positive experience from it so, past that I don't really care what anybody else has to say about it. Was I picking up and pressing buildings, no. Can I now get on stage with the Olympians, no but I did experience an increase in strength,energy, recovery and overall well being so, I feel that it's a beneficial product. If it works for you great, if it doesn't, don't buy anymore and move on, simple enough.

:bruce3:
 
Fastone said:
My theory on Prime is this. I had a positive experience from it so, past that I don't really care what anybody else has to say about it. Was I picking up and pressing buildings, no. Can I now get on stage with the Olympians, no but I did experience an increase in strength,energy, recovery and overall well being so, I feel that it's a beneficial product. If it works for you great, if it doesn't, don't buy anymore and move on, simple enough.

:bruce3:
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I am glad you got results Fastone. Is the underlined statement a fair resemblence of what an adaptogen should/would do? We're talking about a product with a sale tag of over 55-60 dollars... and that's for the minimum required, effective dose. Relora is 11-13 dollars for a month of effective results and has had it's effectiveness documented time and time again. You will get an increase in well-being, endurance, and muscle mass along with great sleep enhancement.

I don't know... I'm just wondering if mediocrity is worth the price tag. I'm leaving personal issues out and just debating from now on.
 
rxp1997 said:
My Prime experience has been both positive and negative, in as much as I don't think I am getting what i really wanted out of it but instead ended up with something different yet as important.

what i haven't gotten is strength gains beyond what I expected from just my routine. My workouts are based on 4week waves at various percentages of 1RM, peaking at week3 and a deload week4. I have these realistically planned out 3months at a time, adjusting as needed, and so far I have kept pace with my goals.

what I have gotten out of it is the best friggin recovery I have ever had, and my pain threshold intra-sets has increased considerably. This is most noticeable on squat day and the days following it; what used to be close to crippling soreness for 2-3 days has turned into mild discomfort. while this hasn't helped with strength, it helps with intensity and the ability to deliver more power during my sets.

this benefit alone has been enough so far for me to continue taking it, and plan to do so for the length of this 3month wave.
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Failed to mention this: I have been on a cut for the last month, eating at maintenance and using Recreate/DCP, so far have lost 8lbs. Could explain why there has been no surge in strength; this is my first time really trying to cut (have "recomped" in the past), so I dont know how my training would respond....
 
Force of Green said:
I am glad you got results Fastone. Is the underlined statement a fair resemblence of what an adaptogen should/would do? We're talking about a product with a sale tag of over 55-60 dollars... and that's for the minimum required, effective dose. Relora is 11-13 dollars for a month of effective results and has had it's effectiveness documented time and time again. You will get an increase in well-being, endurance, and muscle mass along with great sleep enhancement.

I don't know... I'm just wondering if mediocrity is worth the price tag. I'm leaving personal issues out and just debating from now on.
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You are going off on tangents left and right here. If you would like to write an editorial piece on cost effectiveness of supplements across the industry do so elsewhere and be sure to capture a representation of the entire industry.
 
rxp1997 said:
Failed to mention this: I have been on a cut for the last month, eating at maintenance and using Recreate/DCP, so far have lost 8lbs. Could explain why there has been no surge in strength; this is my first time really trying to cut (have "recomped" in the past), so I dont know how my training would respond....
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You are cutting, but recovery is the best its ever been....

A huge testimonial for PRIME!
 
rxp1997 said:
My Prime experience has been both positive and negative, in as much as I don't think I am getting what i really wanted out of it but instead ended up with something different yet as important.

what i haven't gotten is strength gains beyond what I expected from just my routine. My workouts are based on 4week waves at various percentages of 1RM, peaking at week3 and a deload week4. I have these realistically planned out 3months at a time, adjusting as needed, and so far I have kept pace with my goals.

what I have gotten out of it is the best friggin recovery I have ever had, and my pain threshold intra-sets has increased considerably. This is most noticeable on squat day and the days following it; what used to be close to crippling soreness for 2-3 days has turned into mild discomfort. while this hasn't helped with strength, it helps with intensity and the ability to deliver more power during my sets.

this benefit alone has been enough so far for me to continue taking it, and plan to do so for the length of this 3month wave.
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I'm just quoting rxp1997 because this exerts is an amazing testimonial for PRIME>

rxp1997 said:
Failed to mention this: I have been on a cut for the last month, eating at maintenance and using Recreate/DCP, so far have lost 8lbs. Could explain why there has been no surge in strength; this is my first time really trying to cut (have "recomped" in the past), so I dont know how my training would respond....
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B5150 said:
You are going off on tangents left and right here. If you would like to write an editorial piece on cost effectiveness of supplements across the industry do so elsewhere and be sure to capture a representation of the entire industry.
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I think overall, the industry is doing better than it ever has.
 
Force of Green said:
I am glad you got results Fastone. Is the underlined statement a fair resemblence of what an adaptogen should/would do? We're talking about a product with a sale tag of over 55-60 dollars... and that's for the minimum required, effective dose. Relora is 11-13 dollars for a month of effective results and has had it's effectiveness documented time and time again. You will get an increase in well-being, endurance, and muscle mass along with great sleep enhancement.

I don't know... I'm just wondering if mediocrity is worth the price tag. I'm leaving personal issues out and just debating from now on.
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I would just say if you check around as I did, the price isn't as prohibitive as you might think. Also as I stated on another thread, I would imagine that most of us have blown 40 -60 dollars on a weekend of frivolous fun and frolic at some point in our lives. With today's economic climate I would hope not too many times.:rofl:

:bruce3:
 
pata320 said:
Hey Mullet, did you use Prime for your PCT for your testosterone/trenbolone cycle? You started that right after the guys in Thundergod's thread called you scrawny. Maybe when you were getting those great Prime workouts, it may have gotten some help from injectible testosterone enanthate and trenbolone?
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Hahahahaaha, good stuff

:djparty:
 
Force of Green said:
I am glad you got results Fastone. Is the underlined statement a fair resemblence of what an adaptogen should/would do? We're talking about a product with a sale tag of over 55-60 dollars... and that's for the minimum required, effective dose. Relora is 11-13 dollars for a month of effective results and has had it's effectiveness documented time and time again. You will get an increase in well-being, endurance, and muscle mass along with great sleep enhancement.

I don't know... I'm just wondering if mediocrity is worth the price tag. I'm leaving personal issues out and just debating from now on.
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Relora= Bwnage! Here's a link to Relora info if anyone wants to know anything of it:

Invalid Link Removed

Relora is my PRIME. I have been taking it for about a month now, and I feel I am indeed less stressed and sleep like a baby. And I even feel a slight bit of well-being, like I've had a glass of wine or something most of the time.(taking GABA that is in White Flood as well). Love the Relora. Hmmm, well-being, hormonal optimization, enhanced sleep/recovery........for 12 bucks or so, for about two months+worth AND backed by science. And the best part is, it works for everyone!
 
pata320 said:
Jacob, I am a personal friend of Kyle's (Force of Green) and he's told me everything that goes on everyday. I'll be the first to say that he's not a cry baby. Your posting track record is really immature. You probably realize this when you take a minute to recap on what you wrote, but unfortunately you can't take back what's been said. Just grow up a little bit and present yourself as what you are; The CEO/owner of a company. Your candor makes me weep.
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I would think this thread had moved past comments of this nature. Unfortunately, several hours later, it has not. Everybody in this thread is guilty of a certain degree of immaturity and lacking relativity at some point, so to levy objective comments one way or another seems imprudent. I think we should stay on topic (PRIME, hate or not) and keep personal attacks of this nature to a minimum. If you do not feel you can contribute in this manner, in this thread, the Anonymous forum is a great avenue.
 
strategicmove said:
It is regrettable that PRIME has not matched your expectations. Considering that you are still taking PRIME, though, it might help, if you could clarify the part of your comment I highlighted above. If I have not mixed up anything, PRIME appears to have made a difference in your strength gains!
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No you have it mixed up, prime has made no significant difference in my strength gains. IMO if someone is not consistently seeing improvments in his log book then he needs to reconcider his workout/ diet. I have been making strength improvements at the same rate that I did off prime. My bf I would have to say(just eyeballing) is slightly more but I doubt that has to do with prime as I have cheated a bit more lately, and as far as mass(it wasn't my main goal) I gained .3-.5 lbs in all this time. Such a small increment could have been by not taking a **** or simply from the fat that I noticed I gained.
 
DreamWeaver said:
I know I plan my routines for some progression, in my case Prime has enhanced that progression it seems he's saying in his case it has not. Myself I would have made some gains in strength but never have I made gains like I am now. Coupled with the fact that gains are hard to come by at my age as well.

I do feel there is a possiblity that he may have misjudged the effect on said progression however, maybe not, a lot has to do with experience.
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No I train to gain strength slowly and steadily all year and can understand where if I was older it would be harder to gain. But thus far after tweaking my strength program to my personal level of recovery, for about 6 months, I've beeing seeing relatively consistent progress for about 5 months now. Before that I was recovering from a neuromuscular/spinal disorder.
 
bslick69b said:
you cant expect to be benching 2-plates and expect to throw on another in no time!..wheres the work-out routines with the gradual increase in weight?..there is no magic pill?,im not undermineing your workout ethics but you have to meet it half way!..i have a friend who swears by this product, he is even doing an un-sponsored log!(not a free product)this guys, strenght and size is through the roof!..he claims that reason for this,are his clean receptors,which varies from person to person!..and if it does not work for you,then you must try something else,typical case of trial and error!..but i really doubt that you can blame the product,unless you can find an accurate yea!/nea! vote statistic that points in that direction!..but im sorry to hear of your disappointment with the product!
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I don't remember ever writing anything about my expectations on prime? I never expected the gains that they advertised but even a quarter of that would have been awesome. And I never blamed the product or company for anything I just stated that it did nothing. But yeah bro you're right that in the supplement industry you gotta by trial and error.
 
MrTexas1982 said:
Come on dude, I never felt the negativity once. I just thought of it as an entertaining conversation between bros. But I too apologize, and to prove how sorry I am, I'm going to run a 2 month SD cycle with no PCT. Hows that. :drunk:
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:rofl: that will definately prove you're sorry. I think you'd look cute with teh gynoz.
 
I read on the back of my NADH bottle that for best results, visualize what you want out of the product and repeat it to yourself over and over, several times. Maybe that applies?
 
USPLabs said:
why is it hype? How is it Hype? When many are reporting exactly what the advertisement reads.

Just because it does not work for you does not mean its hype just means it did not work for you.
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It's hype because it's heavily advertised in a musletechish manner even in magazines with misleading phrases such as "Prime as strong as DBOL". And the the vast majority of people whom it worked for as advertised were coincidentally sponsored or released obviously scripted testimonials before the product was released.

I mean I have heard from some(far and few inbetween) that it has worked for as advertised. But even most of those who gave favorable reviews/logs will tell you that it's not nearly as effective as a mild steroid, and quite a few others have said it was not effective at all.

Personally I wasn't expecting steroid-like effects, as that would be foolish, but atleast a relatively(compared to millions of ineffective products out there) effective strength boost. But I didn't recieve that and I don't blame the company for my decision to spend money on it, but the fact still remains that it was a wasted 100$, and some people might want to know about that, so that's why I made this thread.
 
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