What's the latest on Betaine TMG?

[Madevilz]

I've tried standalone Betaine TMG once about 7-8 years ago. I am not sure if I benefited from it since I was on AAS (been natty for 4 years now), so I really was only taking it for the health benefits. Ive seen a couple of positive recent studies on body composition such as the female soccer players one, unsure if that would apply to me though. Examine says that the effect on performance is the same as creatine, so it's not worth taking both at the same time, thoughts?

Does anyone still add Betaine to their stack? At what dose?

 

[Resolve10]

I take 2.5g daily pretty much non stop.

FWIW examine doesn’t say it isn’t worth taking if you take creatine only that if using it for its osmolytic or cell swelling benefits it may not improve those over creatine alone.

Betaine has other potential benefits to healthy like being a methyl donor and potential other mechanisms for performance benefits that combined with it’s low cost warrants it’s use in my case.

 

[Jeremyk1]

I take 2.5g daily pretty much non stop.

FWIW examine doesn’t say it isn’t worth taking if you take creatine only that if using it for its osmolytic or cell swelling benefits it may not improve those over creatine alone.

Betaine has other potential benefits to healthy like being a methyl donor and potential other mechanisms for performance benefits that combined with it’s low cost warrants it’s use in my case.

Yeah exactly this. May not be noticeable for most, but there’s a huge potential for health and performance benefit and it’s dirt cheap.

 

[rodefeeh]

A lot of PWOs that I've had lately contain Betaine. And since it is really cheap, I bought some bulk Betaine to make sure I get at least 2.5g daily. And I'm with you @Madevilz I don't really notice much from it. I've read about a lot of the great health benefits that @Resolve10 spoke of. Creatine is still king for me when it comes to strength.

FYI, I'm currently using Nutrex Warrior and Vicious Labs Daft Pump with 2.5g and 2g Betaine respectively.

 

[sns8778]

We make a Betaine Anhydrous standalone (temporarily OOS though) and we also will be putting it on the upcoming daily use ergogenic product.

I think that Betaine Anhydrous is a great ingredient for health, performance, and body-composition purposes but think that it is one that has to be used daily for best results and that for physique improvements, its something that you would get small, slow, but consistent results over time - which is not a bad things because those can add up. It's just not something dramatic that you'll start taking and see a huge difference in the mirror in a month or two type of thing.

 

[djbombsquad]

We make a Betaine Anhydrous standalone (temporarily OOS though) and we also will be putting it on the upcoming daily use ergogenic product.

I think that Betaine Anhydrous is a great ingredient for health, performance, and body-composition purposes but think that it is one that has to be used daily for best results and that for physique improvements, its something that you would get small, slow, but consistent results over time - which is not a bad things because those can add up. It's just not something dramatic that you'll start taking and see a huge difference in the mirror in a month or two type of thing.

What about dmg? Over tmg?

 

[Brocodeout69]

I take 3 grams of TMG (trimethylglycine or betaine) daily. I actually use the baseline series produced by @sns8778.

I take it for a variety of reasons.

First, for the reasons detailed by @Resolve10 in his post, i.e. athletic performance. And as @Jeremyk1 said for health purposes.

Second, I also take it as I take Nicotinamide mononucleotide (NMN), via the anti-aging protocol endorsed and formulated by Dr. David Sinclair. When NMN is used by cells to create NAD+, a molecule pivotal for health, nicotinamide is formed. This molecule needs to be disposed of. In order to do so, a methyl group is placed on nicotinamide so it can be secreted by the kidneys. TMG provides methyl groups (TMG consists of three methyl groups per TMG molecule) and fills this role for my purposes.

Thirdly, I've taken various forms of exogenous carnitine over the years and TMG not only helps the body produce carnitine, but supplementation also causes an increase in carnitine metabolites in muscle.

Relatedly, l-carnitine and betaine function as osmoprotectants to suppress inflammatory responses.

I've also just started taking injectable (IM & subq) l-carnitine @ 300 mg daily, along with subq MIC B12, and alongside the oral betaine dosing I've experienced a huge increase in athletic performance, vascularity and weight loss. I'm on day three of this protocol and I'm down literally 2.8 lb with no change to my diet, lifestyle or exercise frequency.

 

[sns8778]

What about dmg? Over tmg?

Betaine Anhydrous (TMG) and Dimethylglycine (DMG) are similar but different ingredients.

The research that is typically discussed in the physique community on enhanced body-composition related to Betaine Anhydrous and not to Dimethylglycine and wouldn't directly translate over to it.

Nothing against DMG, I had a friend that was a marathon runner for many years that used and swore by it for endurance, and I think that it has some good health applications, but I don't think its interchangeable with Betaine Anhydrous.

 

[sns8778]

I take 3 grams of TMG (trimethylglycine or betaine) daily. I actually use the baseline series produced by @sns8778.

I take it for a variety of reasons.

First, for the reasons detailed by @Resolve10 in his post, i.e. athletic performance. And as @Jeremyk1 said for health purposes.

Second, I also take it as I take Nicotinamide mononucleotide (NMN), via the anti-aging protocol endorsed and formulated by Dr. David Sinclair. When NMN is used by cells to create NAD+, a molecule pivotal for health, nicotinamide is formed. This molecule needs to be disposed of. In order to do so, a methyl group is placed on nicotinamide so it can be secreted by the kidneys. TMG provides methyl groups (TMG consists of three methyl groups per TMG molecule) and fills this role for my purposes.

Thirdly, I've taken various forms of exogenous carnitine over the years and TMG not only helps the body produce carnitine, but supplementation also causes an increase in carnitine metabolites in muscle.

Relatedly, l-carnitine and betaine function as osmoprotectants to suppress inflammatory responses.

I've also just started taking injectable (IM & subq) l-carnitine @ 300 mg daily, along with subq MIC B12, and alongside the oral betaine dosing I've experienced a huge increase in athletic performance, vascularity and weight loss. I'm on day three of this protocol and I'm down literally 2.8 lb with no change to my diet, lifestyle or exercise frequency.

Great post. Slightly off subject, but since you mentioned NMN, I wanted to let you know that we will likely be doing an NMN product at the beginning of the year, if not by the end of this year.

As you probably know but many don't, the reason that more legit brands don't do NMN products is because of the vast number of under-dosed or outright fake NMN products on the market. There are brands that no one has ever heard of that claim to sell NMN and are selling it at prices that you couldn't even make one with legit raws for. So that's led a lot of brands to not bother making one, and its the main reason why it took me this long to want to.

But, I am very interested in anti-aging and longevity ingredients and have been considering delving more into that side of the market and possibly even creating a sub-series or differently named company (still part of SNS overall) dedicated to it. For a long time I viewed the outright fraud and mistreatment of customers in that side of things as a deterrent to even wanting to fool with it, but the last couple of months I've been more driven to want to tackle that head on with education and information and try to help people and provide products that they can depend on being what they're supposed to be in that market space.

 

[poison]

Are you still releasing an NMN product, @sns8778 ?

 

[sns8778]

Are you still releasing an NMN product, @sns8778 ?

I had been considering it but then the FDA statement on it happened, and since then had been trying to see how that was going to play out. Right now, it seems like its kind of in limbo and going to be like the NAC thing that's going to take awhile to get resolved, so we could do one if enough people are interested.

 

[poison]

I'm definitely interested!

 

[sns8778]

I'm definitely interested!

I was hoping to get more discussion and ideas like that in the Anti-Aging and Longevity thread that I had posted awhile back, but didn't get as much participation in there as I had hoped.

I remember that you posted in it some; but for anyone else interested in participating in it, here's a link:

Anti-Aging & Longevity Ingredient Discussion - Master Thread - AnabolicMinds.com

I wanted to start a thread dedicated to anti-aging and longevity ingredient discussion. I've talked to several people about doing a thread like this and it seems to be one that a lot are interested in and encouraged me to do, so hopefully everyone will enjoy and we can all discuss some cool...

anabolicminds.com