what is happenning with Thermolife?

lronFist said:
That's not what is happening. Maybe you should investigate the patents he has before criticizing them?

The only patent he "bought up" was the DAA patent from Patrick Arnold, who is his friend.

He patented amino acid nitrates de novo (and even before the popular beetroot juice studies).

He has every right to enforce those patents.
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legally yes, ethically and morally maybe not...
 
thebigt said:
legally yes, ethically and morally maybe not...
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In your world, there would be no patents.

Also in this world, no one would take the time and effort (nor capital investment) to introduce new/novel/innovative products.

In this world we would be stuck with arginine, HMB, CEE, and nothing else.

Your world sucks bro.
 
lronFist said:
In your world, there would be no patents.

Also in this world, no one would take the time and effort (nor capital investment) to introduce new/novel/innovative products.

In this world we would be stuck with arginine, HMB, CEE, and nothing else.

Your world sucks bro.
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how would you know...you are not welcome in my world!!!
 
Patents are important and are part of the original Constitution. Without the ability to enforce and monetarily profit there would be no desire to research, develop and implement new technologies that benefit our daily lives. Pharmaceuticals in particular.
 
jamesm11 said:
Patents are important and are part of the original Constitution. Without the ability to enforce and monetarily profit there would be no desire to research, develop and implement new technologies that benefit our daily lives. Pharmaceuticals in particular.
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new technologies....in the last 2 decades technology has put money in the pockets of the wealthy and put working men out of work. my world was a better place before cell phones made teenage girls out of grown men!!!

as to pharmaceuticals, how many cures are there today that weren't around 20 years ago?.....treatments yes, cures no....why? because the profits are in treatments not in cures!!!
 
thebigt said:
new technologies....in the last 2 decades technology has put money in the pockets of the wealthy and put working men out of work. my world was a better place before cell phones made teenage girls out of grown men!!!

as to pharmaceuticals, how many cures are there today that weren't around 20 years ago?.....treatments yes, cures no....why? because the profits are in treatments not in cures!!!
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Cure what. Give me an example.

I work in translational research, so allow me to guide you through the mysterious world of science and medicine.
 
lronFist said:
Cure what. Give me an example.

I work in translational research, so allow me to guide you through the mysterious world of science and medicine.
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ok, what cures? medicine has a treatment for damned near everything, but where are the cures?

like i said the profit is in ongoing treatments not in cures. lol, not even for the common cold, more profit in selling cold 'remedies'.

now imagine if the field of science and medicine were legitamately in the business of health 1st, profits 2nd...cancer would be long gone!!! but as we all know, profits come 1st...so instead of a cure we get cancer 'treatments'.
 
thebigt said:
ok, what cures? medicine has a treatment for damned near everything, but where are the cures?

like i said the profit is in ongoing treatments not in cures. lol, not even for the common cold, more profit in selling cold 'remedies'.

now imagine if the field of science and medicine were legitamately in the business of health 1st, profits 2nd...cancer would be long gone!!! but as we all know, profits come 1st...so instead of a cure we get cancer 'treatments'.
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Well, the common cold is a rhinovirus, which is not pathogenic. The symptoms are caused by the bodies innate immune reaction. The only way to "cure" the common cold would be to diminish the bodies immune response. Do you understand why this is not possible?

The vast majority of cancers are caused by acquired genetic defects & deficiencies. We do not have the technology to correct these mistakes with any reliability, although we are definitely a lot closer then we were a decade ago.

Keep in mind that funding from the government (i.e. NIH) goes to academia, whom would like nothing more then to win a nobel prize or become famous for their research. Profiteering is much more limited in these circumstances, and mostly involves private market laboratories.
 
Touey said:
lol why is that t
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because in my world men held phone conversations to 2 minutes or less-occassionally 3 but never more, and used to gripe about women and girls constantly on the phone. in todays world men gossip on the phone like little teenage girls used to do. there seems to be a lot of role reversing these days...men doing thing females used to do and women doing things men used to do.....i liked it better when men were men and women were women!!!
 
If you honestly think the researchers at Yale/Harvad/MIT/USC are holding out on the cures to anything then you definitely do not understand the cut throat nature of academia.
 
thebigt said:
because in my world men held phone conversations to 2 minutes or less-occassionally 3 but never more, and used to gripe about women and girls constantly on the phone. in todays world men gossip on the phone like little teenage girls used to do. there seems to be a lot of role reversing these days...men doing thing females used to do and women doing things men used to do.....i liked it better when men were men and women were women!!!
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that posting really did make me laugh
 
lronFist said:
Well, the common cold is a rhinovirus, which is not pathogenic. The symptoms are caused by the bodies innate immune reaction. The only way to "cure" the common cold would be to diminish the bodies immune response. Do you understand why this is not possible?

The vast majority of cancers are caused by acquired genetic defects & deficiencies. We do not have the technology to correct these mistakes with any reliability, although we are definitely a lot closer then we were a decade ago.

Keep in mind that funding from the government (i.e. NIH) goes to academia, whom would like nothing more then to win a nobel prize or become famous for their research. Profiteering is much more limited in these circumstances, and mostly involves private market laboratories.
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cold...isn't chemotherapy a form of diminishing the bodies immune system? isn't aids caused by the bodies innate immune system? they seem to have a handle on aids these days...

cancer...as far as profiteering goes, is it out of the realm of possibilities that some brilliant young man in a lab coat stumbled upon a way to correct genetic defects and deficiencies...but the fda would not approve because the pharmaceutical industry makes too much money treating cancer in the traditional way...or even the company the brilliant young man in the lab coat works for squashed the cure...much the same as big oil would be against alternatives to petroleum?
 
lronFist said:
If you honestly think the researchers at Yale/Harvad/MIT/USC are holding out on the cures to anything then you definitely do not understand the cut throat nature of academia.
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yes, but research requires funding....and the 'funders' control rights to the findings. if the finding is not to the funders liking.... plus the finding have to be submitted to the fda, and we all know who controls the fda!!!
 
thebigt said:
cold...isn't chemotherapy a form of diminishing the bodies immune system? isn't aids caused by the bodies innate immune system? they seem to have a handle on aids these days...

cancer...as far as profiteering goes, is it out of the realm of possibilities that some brilliant young man in a lab coat stumbled upon a way to correct genetic defects and deficiencies...but the fda would not approve because the pharmaceutical industry makes too much money treating cancer in the traditional way...or even the company the brilliant young man in the lab coat works for squashed the cure...much the same as big oil would be against alternatives to petroleum?
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You want to diminish the immune system for a cold? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. The next time you have a cold, ask your doctor to put you on methotrexate.

AIDS is caused by a virus that effects CD4 cells, which is not part of the innate immune system.

Honestly, you have no clue how medicine or science works, which is why you have these lamebrain ideas.

Cancer is caused by unique defects in the genetic code (absence of DNA repair mechanisms, uninhibited proliferation processes, et cetra x 1000000). No one is going to "stumble" upon a unifying cure to intersect all of the pathological processes that cause cancer. My god. Do they not teach science anymore?
 
thebigt said:
yes, but research requires funding....and the 'funders' control rights to the findings. if the finding is not to the funders liking.... plus the finding have to be submitted to the fda, and we all know who controls the fda!!!
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The findings aren't submitted to the FDA you ****ing tarbucket! They are sent to PEER review!
 
lronFist said:
You want to diminish the immune system for a cold? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. The next time you have a cold, ask your doctor to put you on methotrexate.

AIDS is caused by a virus that effects CD4 cells, which is not part of the innate immune system.

Honestly, you have no clue how medicine or science works, which is why you have these lamebrain ideas.

Cancer is caused by unique defects in the genetic code (absence of DNA repair mechanisms, uninhibited proliferation processes, et cetra x 1000000). No one is going to "stumble" upon a unifying cure to intersect all of the pathological processes that cause cancer. My god. Do they not teach science anymore?
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hey...i watched nova at least 5 times this year!!!
 
lronFist said:
If you honestly think the researchers at Yale/Harvad/MIT/USC are holding out on the cures to anything then you definitely do not understand the cut throat nature of academia.
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This, I worked in the technology transfer office at a major university while in law school. The professors can't wait to throw their research out there. Causes quite a hassle for us actually. Really hard for the universities to get their patents.

And if they do in fact license their discoveries about 66-85% goes to the professor and their academic program for more research. The remainder goes to the general university itself
 
jamesm11 said:
This, I worked in the technology transfer office at a major university while in law school. The professors can't wait to throw their research out there. Causes quite a hassle for us actually. Really hard for the universities to get their patents.

And if they do in fact license their discoveries about 66-85% goes to the professor and their academic program for more research. The remainder goes to the general university itself
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so everyone in the legal and medical professions are just honest hardworking folks with nothing but the best intentions...it's good to know that all that stuff about corrupt practices and illegal misdeeds they tell us about on the news is just just made up nonsense!!!

boy am i relieved!!!!
 
thebigt said:
so everyone in the legal and medical professions are just honest hardworking folks with nothing but the best intentions...it's good to know that all that stuff about corrupt practices and illegal misdeeds they tell us about on the news is just just made up nonsense!!!

boy am i relieved!!!!
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I don't think you're getting the point. It's not necessarily best intentions that motivate an individual. There are financial and professional incentives to make research public. A cure for cancer would bestow rock star status to the discoverer and very likely enormous financial gain. You seriously think someone is going to sit on a discovery like that?
 
tony soprano said:
I don't think you're getting the point. It's not necessarily best intentions that motivate an individual. There are financial and professional incentives to make research public. A cure for cancer would bestow rock star status to the discoverer and very likely enormous financial gain. You seriously think someone is going to sit on a discovery like that?
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not willingly, no....a lot of financial incentive to maintain the status quo!!!

let me elaborate a little...my mistrust of business runs so deep that i think there is no level they won't sink to for more money, and this includes the business of medicine.
 
thebigt said:
ok, what cures? medicine has a treatment for damned near everything, but where are the cures?

like i said the profit is in ongoing treatments not in cures. lol, not even for the common cold, more profit in selling cold 'remedies'.

now imagine if the field of science and medicine were legitamately in the business of health 1st, profits 2nd...cancer would be long gone!!! but as we all know, profits come 1st...so instead of a cure we get cancer 'treatments'.
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Like ironfist, I'm fairly immersed in the literature on both the common cold and cancer, and statements like this make me rage! The complexities behind curing various illnesses would blow your mind. People often cite the amount of time and money that goes into pharm research as a reason for why they must be withholding a cure...but when you learn the facts, you realize that no amount of time or money can create a feasible way to cure these illnesses.
 
mr.cooper69 said:
Like ironfist, I'm fairly immersed in the literature on both the common cold and cancer, and statements like this make me rage! The complexities behind curing various illnesses would blow your mind. People often cite the amount of time and money that goes into pharm research as a reason for why they must be withholding a cure...but when you learn the facts, you realize that no amount of time or money can create a feasible way to cure these illnesses.
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ok, so i pose the same question to you then...what have they cured in the last 20 years, not treatments but cures?

medicine is not exempt from the corruption that business has become.
 
thebigt said:
ok, so i pose the same question to you then...what have they cured in the last 20 years, not treatments but cures?

medicine is not exempt from the corruption that business has become.
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I will sit this out. Not because I don't have an answer, but because all it will do is create drama, which no one wants.
 
mr.cooper69 said:
I will sit this out. Not because I don't have an answer, but because all it will do is create drama, which no one wants.
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thanks, i need to lighten up, starting to see corruption everywhere.
 
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