TRT dosage question

[Mward97]

If I'm switching from Clomid to TRT what would be the optimal dosing schedule for me to achieve the following.

Total Test: 1150ng/dL
Free Test 90% -200% of reference range
E2: Around 22. I've heard 22 is optimal but is this number in reference to the standard E2 test or the Ultra-sensitive E2 test?
DHT:75-100% reference range

Stats I'm young, 200lbs, 6ft tall, 14% bodyfat, incredibly active.

On Clomid 50mg EOD my peak day(4 hours after Clomid tablet) total test was 860ng/dL. Trough is probably much lower. Prior to Clomid my total test was around 415ng/dL.

If I'm going to use HCG, Testosterone, and either arimidex or exemestane as an AI, what are your guys suggestions for dosing?

What would the following protocols likely put me at?

250mg HCG sub Q/EOD
50mg Test Prop Intra muscular EOD
0.25mg Arimidex ED

Or
250mg HCG sub Q/EOD
75mg Test Cyp Intra muscular on Mondays and Thursday's
1.5mg arimidex

Will these protocols put me near the numbers I want to get? Or way above it? Or way below those numbers? If I were to choose one of these protocols which one would be better and what would give steadier blood levels of all those hormones?

Also I'll probably also be taking DHEA.

 

[sammpedd88]

If I'm switching from Clomid to TRT what would be the optimal dosing schedule for me to achieve the following.

Total Test: 1150ng/dL
Free Test 90% -200% of reference range
E2: Around 22. I've heard 22 is optimal but is this number in reference to the standard E2 test or the Ultra-sensitive E2 test?
DHT:75-100% reference range

Stats I'm young, 200lbs, 6ft tall, 14% bodyfat, incredibly active.

On Clomid 50mg EOD my peak day(4 hours after Clomid tablet) total test was 860ng/dL. Trough is probably much lower. Prior to Clomid my total test was around 415ng/dL.

If I'm going to use HCG, Testosterone, and either arimidex or exemestane as an AI, what are your guys suggestions for dosing?

What would the following protocols likely put me at?

250mg HCG sub Q/EOD
50mg Test Prop Intra muscular EOD
0.25mg Arimidex ED

Or
250mg HCG sub Q/EOD
75mg Test Cyp Intra muscular on Mondays and Thursday's
1.5mg arimidex

Will these protocols put me near the numbers I want to get? Or way above it? Or way below those numbers? If I were to choose one of these protocols which one would be better and what would give steadier blood levels of all those hormones?

Also I'll probably also be taking DHEA.

To be honest man there's no way to tell what the listed protocols will put you at. Everyone is so different. There's guys on here that pin 200 mgs a week of test cyp and it keeps them in the upper range. I personally inject 100 mgs and it keeps me in mid upper range. As far as an AI that's going to depend on the individual as well and also how your body reacts to HCG. Some guys are super sensitive to HCG and it sends their E3 through the roof. Most guys drop HCG unless they plan on having kids. There's other ways to keep the boys plump without HCG. My recommendation to you is start out with 100 mgs of test cyp split in two weekly doses. Get blood work done to see how your T levels are and where your E2 is. Also get vitamin D, DHEA and pregnenolone tested. Once you get that dialed in, then add HCG if you really feel like you need it. That way if you have E2 problems you'll know it's from the HCG and can adjust accordingly. For what it's worth, I take .25 mgs twice a week on injection days of arimidex. Keeps me at 19-22 range for the past 2 years.

 

[Mward97]

To be honest man there's no way to tell what the listed protocols will put you at. Everyone is so different. There's guys on here that pin 200 mgs a week of test cyp and it keeps them in the upper range. I personally inject 100 mgs and it keeps me in mid upper range. As far as an AI that's going to depend on the individual as well and also how your body reacts to HCG. Some guys are super sensitive to HCG and it sends their E3 through the roof. Most guys drop HCG unless they plan on having kids. There's other ways to keep the boys plump without HCG. My recommendation to you is start out with 100 mgs of test cyp split in two weekly doses. Get blood work done to see how your T levels are and where your E2 is. Also get vitamin D, DHEA and pregnenolone tested. Once you get that dialed in, then add HCG if you really feel like you need it. That way if you have E2 problems you'll know it's from the HCG and can adjust accordingly. For what it's worth, I take .25 mgs twice a week on injection days of arimidex. Keeps me at 19-22 range for the past 2 years.

Well I'm only in my twenties so I'd like to stay fertile atleast a little if at all possible. What other ways beside HCG do you have to keep your testicles semi-functional. Do you really think there is a chance 100mg test could put me over the 1000ng/dL mark?

 

[sammpedd88]

Well I'm only in my twenties so I'd like to stay fertile atleast a little if at all possible. What other ways beside HCG do you have to keep your testicles semi-functional. Do you really think there is a chance 100mg test could put me over the 1000ng/dL mark?

Why do you want to be over the 1000 mark? If it's for gym reasons then blast and cruise every now and then. More is not better as far as TRT. Most guys do very well with levels around 700-900. Since you're young and kids could be a possibility then you'll need the HCG. Regular blood work will help with keeping your E2 in check. Start with 100 mgs of test cyp and see where it puts you after a few months. BTW....I'm 43 and my total T before TRT was 300.

 

[Mward97]

Why do you want to be over the 1000 mark? If it's for gym reasons then blast and cruise every now and then. More is not better as far as TRT. Most guys do very well with levels around 700-900. Since you're young and kids could be a possibility then you'll need the HCG. Regular blood work will help with keeping your E2 in check. Start with 100 mgs of test cyp and see where it puts you after a few months. BTW....I'm 43 and my total T before TRT was 300.

Because I don't really see an issue with it. 300 additional ng will improve performance and recovery, can donate blood every two months to keep hematocrit down. And I am on corticosteriods which makes it near impossible to push my weight over 200lbs. Right now I'd probably rather just cruise on a slightly higher than normal dose as opposed to blasting. I'd prefer slow and steady increase in gains as opposed to adding 15lbs then losing 7 off cycle them gaining 12 lbs then losing 4. I'd rather just get steady blood levels at the very top of the natural range. I don't really see how 1100ng/dL could cause any more harm than 900ng/dL.

Also are you saying start with 100mg test cyp / week and 250mg HCG EOD? Or just the test cyp.

 

[sammpedd88]

Because I don't really see an issue with it. 300 additional ng will improve performance and recovery, can donate blood every two months to keep hematocrit down. And I am on corticosteriods which makes it near impossible to push my weight over 200lbs. Right now I'd probably rather just cruise on a slightly higher than normal dose as opposed to blasting. I'd prefer slow and steady increase in gains as opposed to adding 15lbs then losing 7 off cycle them gaining 12 lbs then losing 4. I'd rather just get steady blood levels at the very top of the natural range. I don't really see how 1100ng/dL could cause any more harm than 900ng/dL.

Also are you saying start with 100mg test cyp / week and 250mg HCG EOD? Or just the test cyp.

Remember the human body isn't designed to be at max levels all the time. I have a hard enough time keeping my hematocrit down by donating blood. It's not as easy as it sounds. I would start with 100 mgs of test cyp and get it dialed in beige adding HCG.

Being in your 20's, what has caused your low T?

 

[Mward97]

Corticosteriod use for 13 years.

 

[Mward97]

Remember the human body isn't designed to be at max levels all the time. I have a hard enough time keeping my hematocrit down by donating blood. It's not as easy as it sounds. I would start with 100 mgs of test cyp and get it dialed in beige adding HCG.

Being in your 20's, what has caused your low T?

But at 20 years old....isn't that the age when the body IS MEANT to be maxed out? It's the one time in your life you can handle some additional strain truly well?

 

[sammpedd88]

But at 20 years old....isn't that the age when the body IS MEANT to be maxed out? It's the one time in your life you can handle some additional strain truly well?

Not necessarily. I'm not saying you're definitely going to have issues at 1000. But what I am saying is there's no reason to strive to be at the max level not know how your body will react. You may be in your sweet spot at 800. You don't know until you start out low and increase as needed.

 

[Mward97]

Not necessarily. I'm not saying you're definitely going to have issues at 1000. But what I am saying is there's no reason to strive to be at the max level not know how your body will react. You may be in your sweet spot at 800. You don't know until you start out low and increase as needed.

Gotcha thanks, also was your E2 at 19-22 on the standard E2 test or an ultra-sensitive test? Thanks for all the help. Do you think it's maybe possible to get a off label script for like 100mcg Ipamorelin once daily if my bloodwork shoes elevated Alkaline phosphatase( specifically Bone-Alkaline Phosphatase was elevated) and BUN(blood urea nitrogen) at twice the normal max value, 4 days after a 35 minute chest workout. Blood workout shoes elevated bone and muscle breakdown after LIGHT exercise. Also have had trouble gaining strength, and cannot lost any bodyfat below 15% because he muscle just melts off by the day. Is it worthwhile to pursue the Ipamorelin also? I really need to get out of this 24/7 catabolic state considering I'm already currently eating 8,000 calories a day.

 

[sammpedd88]

Gotcha thanks, also was your E2 at 19-22 on the standard E2 test or an ultra-sensitive test? Thanks for all the help. Do you think it's maybe possible to get a off label script for like 100mcg Ipamorelin once daily if my bloodwork shoes elevated Alkaline phosphatase( specifically Bone-Alkaline Phosphatase was elevated) and BUN(blood urea nitrogen) at twice the normal max value, 4 days after a 35 minute chest workout. Blood workout shoes elevated bone and muscle breakdown after LIGHT exercise. Also have had trouble gaining strength, and cannot lost any bodyfat below 15% because he muscle just melts off by the day. Is it worthwhile to pursue the Ipamorelin also? I really need to get out of this 24/7 catabolic state considering I'm already currently eating 8,000 calories a day.

What kind of Dr are you seeing?

 

[Mward97]

Already saw one endocrinologist, he was awful and didn't listen, hardly treated me like a patient let alone a human. Going to another endocrinologist soon

 

[sammpedd88]

Already saw one endocrinologist, he was awful and didn't listen, hardly treated me like a patient let alone a human. Going to another endocrinologist soon

Unfortunately you have to keep looking for a good Dr. Most of them are not up on the TRT. Look for an integrative medicine dr also. They are into treating the cause and not the symptoms.

 

[kisaj]

Already saw one endocrinologist, he was awful and didn't listen, hardly treated me like a patient let alone a human. Going to another endocrinologist soon

That is unfortunately all too common. I went to two before finding one that was good and understood hormone treatment.

 

[TheMatzah]

Great thread, interesting read. Thank you fellas. OP - hope you find the answer and a long term effective solution.