Test to Deca gainz comparison Q

Joshinator

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Just a quick question. For those who have tried, what is the gains comparison of Testosterone and nandrolone?

is 100mg of T = 100mg of nandrolone?
 
hairygrandpa

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Test is the weakest of all the roids. Set aside the anabolic/androgenic ratio, tbol would be weaker -but isn't.
Meaning: Do low dose test and let other compounds do the work.
 

Joshinator

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Test is the weakest of all the roids. Set aside the anabolic/androgenic ratio, tbol would be weaker -but isn't.
Meaning: Do low dose test and let other compounds do the work.
Gotcha. Thats what i would do. For comparisons sake, in terms of gains, what would be the comparison? Would 500mg of test = like 200mg deca?
 

CroLifter

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Test is the weakest of all the roids. Set aside the anabolic/androgenic ratio, tbol would be weaker -but isn't.
Meaning: Do low dose test and let other compounds do the work.
You want to say that test is weaker than primo and masteron when it comes to adding tissue?

edit: Not trying to be rude, just interested. I can understand that 19-nor is superior, but to say that test is the weakest of all seems a bit too stretched.
 
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Chados

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You want to say that test is weaker than primo and masteron when it comes to adding tissue?

edit: Not trying to be rude, just interested. I can understand that 19-nor is superior, but to say that test is the weakest of all seems a bit too stretched.

No you're correct and I don't think he was referring to these as mast really won't add any size and primo very little. Both of these are however superior to test in other ways. These two are more of an addition to a cycle. I'd much rather cut with primo than test.

Any bulking oral or injectible will be stronger than test.
 
Chados

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Just a quick question. For those who have tried, what is the gains comparison of Testosterone and nandrolone?

is 100mg of T = 100mg of nandrolone?

Both compounds at that dosage would be terrible, effective dosage with deca is probably half that of test.


Some compounds like dbol is arguably stronger per mg than anadrol but at effective dose anadrol is more effective, deca will be more effective per mg and at effective dose
 
RickyBlobby

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I think something like 250 test 250 deca 250 eq would be a great cycle. And you minimize the prolactin and gyno issues by running a low dose of test and deca.

Or 250 test 500eq
 
starterchems

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I would run something more along the lines of test and EQ or test and primo. will not **** with deca anymore my self and way to many ppl I have to talked to get ED issues with deca. In my opinion better to run compounds that will help up the sex drive and have you acting like a beast inside and out side the gym.
 
Old Witch

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I would run something more along the lines of test and EQ or test and primo. will not **** with deca anymore my self and way to many ppl I have to talked to get ED issues with deca. In my opinion better to run compounds that will help up the sex drive and have you acting like a beast inside and out side the gym.
Deca is the classic “Need to take these three other drugs just to take this one drug” type of steroid. Never been a fan myself either.
 

Joshinator

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Im asking because i have legal access to deca and im trying to gauge its effectiveness in combination with trt
 
Old Witch

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Well, generally there won’t be any portion of the trt replaced by Deca, meaning if your optimal levels are x amount of test, that’s your base, then they’ll add up to 100mg Deca a week on top. So no reason to versus with testosterone.

Let’s say they have you on 200mg a week. They then add 50mg Deca a week.

Now you’re not taking 50mg less test, you’re only adding the Deca.
 

Joshinator

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Well, generally there won’t be any portion of the trt replaced by Deca, meaning if your optimal levels are x amount of test, that’s your base, then they’ll add up to 100mg Deca a week on top. So no reason to versus with testosterone.

Let’s say they have you on 200mg a week. They then add 50mg Deca a week.

Now you’re not taking 50mg less test, you’re only adding the Deca.

Right, im curious how anabolic i would be with 200mg test and say 60 - 100 mg deca. How much muscle i might gain. And to get an idea, im using the only standard i have which is testosterone.

So my thinking goes something like this-- If im on 200mg test plus 60mg deca it might equal 320mg of test in terms of muscle gain. Is that right?

Somebody raised a good point that theres a minimum effective dose. Im not an expert. I did read a study that showed low doses of deca (60mg i believe) still increased nitrogen retention. So what im saying is-- i think 60mg of deca would provide small amount of gains in an anabolic nieve individual.

Ive never been a heavy steroid user, ive used the andros and methylstenbolone. And i havnt ran them for years (with one exception). so i would think it would help with some gain in a small way.

on a side note I am taking deca with my trt and i could post updates if you are interested. im about 5 or 6 weeks in.
 

Highlanda01602

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Right, im curious how anabolic i would be with 200mg test and say 60 - 100 mg deca. How much muscle i might gain. And to get an idea, im using the only standard i have which is testosterone.

So my thinking goes something like this-- If im on 200mg test plus 60mg deca it might equal 320mg of test in terms of muscle gain. Is that right?

Somebody raised a good point that theres a minimum effective dose. Im not an expert. I did read a study that showed low doses of deca (60mg i believe) still increased nitrogen retention. So what im saying is-- i think 60mg of deca would provide small amount of gains in an anabolic nieve individual.

Ive never been a heavy steroid user, ive used the andros and methylstenbolone. And i havnt ran them for years (with one exception). so i would think it would help with some gain in a small way.

on a side note I am taking deca with my trt and i could post updates if you are interested. im about 5 or 6 weeks in.
Your feedback would be so great to have, and we would all appreciate that to say the least.

We are oddly in a similar boat right now. Years ago, I cycled 19 Nor compounds twice, and saw good results. Not a huge fan with the estrogen related side effects however which seemed to effect me more than most. Have stayed away from them for a bit of time, but thought I'd give a low dose to see how my joints would feel through a low-dose.

On 175mg Test weekly on TRT, and on a "blast/experiment", with 70mg Deca and 200mg Masteron.
Daily - Test 25mg (SubQ) + NPP 10mg (SubQ)
BiWeekly - 100mg Mast E

Going to run for 8 weeks. I've been doing SubQ for about 6 weeks now, and I've noticed it's given me greater estrogen control. Was able to ween off an AI and will be completing another round of blood work at the halfway point to gauge numbers. So far, so good however. Estro sensitive, but only minor. Weighing in at 190-192 daily, with between 8.5-9% BF. Goals are longevity, but as a former competitive athlete, staying strong and well rounded. No longer compete, but enjoy pushing my limits.

After an extended break (returning back to 175mg Test weekly, only), I plan on trying out a similar cycle, with Trest Ace.
Alternating daily injections - 25mg Test on Day 1, 10mg of Trest Ace on Day 2
BiWeekly - 100mg Mast E
 
Old Witch

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Right, im curious how anabolic i would be with 200mg test and say 60 - 100 mg deca. How much muscle i might gain. And to get an idea, im using the only standard i have which is testosterone.

So my thinking goes something like this-- If im on 200mg test plus 60mg deca it might equal 320mg of test in terms of muscle gain. Is that right?

Somebody raised a good point that theres a minimum effective dose. Im not an expert. I did read a study that showed low doses of deca (60mg i believe) still increased nitrogen retention. So what im saying is-- i think 60mg of deca would provide small amount of gains in an anabolic nieve individual.

Ive never been a heavy steroid user, ive used the andros and methylstenbolone. And i havnt ran them for years (with one exception). so i would think it would help with some gain in a small way.

on a side note I am taking deca with my trt and i could post updates if you are interested. im about 5 or 6 weeks in.

I would suspect that one could maintain actually quite an impressive physique on that. How long it would take to get there on that much though... I wonder.
 
Chados

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I Dont know what this deca dick is about, personally it's reversed if anything. People seem to be taking deca too high, not using caber etc.

200 test 200 deca would be the lowest I'd even consider worth running deca.
 
Old Witch

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I Dont know what this deca dick is about, personally it's reversed if anything. People seem to be taking deca too high, not using caber etc.

200 test 200 deca would be the lowest I'd even consider worth running deca.
Well, medically, it’s only going to be up to 100mg. It’s going to do a lot for what maybe a retired pro bodybuilder could maintain of their former size without all the hassle of blasting and cruising. For a mere mortal, trying to get big, yeah not sure.
 
Chados

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Well, medically, it’s only going to be up to 100mg. It’s going to do a lot for what maybe a retired pro bodybuilder could maintain of their former size without all the hassle of blasting and cruising. For a mere mortal, trying to get big, yeah not sure.

Well pretty much any steroid even at a lower dosage will make you keep muscles quite easily, maybe not keep you lean though if diet isn't perfect. 100mg deca would do little to a beginner for being such a potent steroid, it's smarter to get something like primo at 400 then do run deca that low. For an experienced person 100mg of deca would be pointless.

If people decide to run a strong cycle they might as well run it at effective dosage or close to
 
Matthersby

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I Dont know what this deca dick is about, personally it's reversed if anything. People seem to be taking deca too high, not using caber etc.

200 test 200 deca would be the lowest I'd even consider worth running deca.
I’m definitely with Chados on this. I don’t love Deca but I do feel it’s a great bulker to add some size long term, especially if on TRT Adequate test dose and prolactin antagonist on board and I have never seen any real issues.

I will say you can’t compare test to Deca like OP is trying to do. 100 doesn’t equal 200 and so on. Even when using AA ratio. I don’t even care about that ratio as it may not even be relevant with how I respond to a compound and what other compounds and doses I’m running will ALL factor as well.

—there’s way too many variables.—
And strength of a compound only means what you need it to mean. I may mean “how much size does it put on you?”
Where you may mean “how strong does it make you”
It’s all trial and error and even then, highly individualized. And on top of that, could vary at the time you administer it.
I’m making more gains this year with higher test, but I typically like to run test at 200 and a 19nor at something like 500+

I will say SEVERAL of us have noticed it is far easier to push a dosage of a bulking drug with lower test and experience far less sides. But the worst part of that is YOU may not experience that at all!!!!
Ive never ran test at a gram/week but the way it’s treating me this year I may.
This is a game of personal trial and error, we can only give advice based on our own research and experience. You’ll never see everyone agree around here al the time.

I was just in another thread where half of us love Prami and experience no side effects at any dose and the other half take .25mg and hallucinate and pass out.
 
Old Witch

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So, you guys are literally saying if the doc you get your HRT from offered you 100mg of deca a week you would pass on it?
 
Old Witch

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When I go on HRT I’m going for the whole package through a concierge service man... I’ll take the Deca, the anavar, the glutathione and methyl b12 injections, the GH... everything I can afford.
 

jrock645

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When I go on HRT I’m going for the whole package through a concierge service man... I’ll take the Deca, the anavar, the glutathione and methyl b12 injections, the GH... everything I can afford.
Ha you and me both. I want the Long Island iced tea equivalent HRT cocktail when it’s time to go down that road.
 
Matthersby

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Ha you and me both. I want the Long Island iced tea equivalent HRT cocktail when it’s time to go down that road.
I’m still just too damn cheap to go to the places that will give you all the goods. I found one that will work with you on a lot and I’m certain they are just a really really squeaky clean, insurance-accepting drug dealer. Only problem is they are after the money, so while they could prescribe me the test, let me self administer at home and pay $12 for my test at the pharmacy... they actually want you to come in, pay your copay, let them inject you all for $125 a week. These are the clinics you get Deca from. But you’re going to pay for it.

I can’t do it for one reason: I refuse to pay $125 for $3 worth of testosterone.
**** that. I’ll just use UGL’s until I’m filthy rich and then I’ll think about it, but I’ll probably still be too cheap then.
 

jrock645

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I’m still just too damn cheap to go to the places that will give you all the goods. I found one that will work with you on a lot and I’m certain they are just a really really squeaky clean, insurance-accepting drug dealer. Only problem is they are after the money, so while they could prescribe me the test, let me self administer at home and pay $12 for my test at the pharmacy... they actually want you to come in, pay your copay, let them inject you all for $125 a week. These are the clinics you get Deca from. But you’re going to pay for it.

I can’t do it for one reason: I refuse to pay $125 for $3 worth of testosterone.
**** that. I’ll just use UGL’s until I’m filthy rich and then I’ll think about it, but I’ll probably still be too cheap then.
Can’t fault you. $125 a week is no joke.
 
Old Witch

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I’m still just too damn cheap to go to the places that will give you all the goods. I found one that will work with you on a lot and I’m certain they are just a really really squeaky clean, insurance-accepting drug dealer. Only problem is they are after the money, so while they could prescribe me the test, let me self administer at home and pay $12 for my test at the pharmacy... they actually want you to come in, pay your copay, let them inject you all for $125 a week. These are the clinics you get Deca from. But you’re going to pay for it.

I can’t do it for one reason: I refuse to pay $125 for $3 worth of testosterone.
**** that. I’ll just use UGL’s until I’m filthy rich and then I’ll think about it, but I’ll probably still be too cheap then.
Well, Titan certainly won’t make you come to them for injections but they make you buy the drugs direct from them. They’re a full concierge service meaning they handle prescription writing and pharmaceutical compounding altogether. They make you buy quite a bit at once and it is a bit pricey.
 
Matthersby

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I pay 35 dollars a week for trt. And that still hurts
Ya. I found the best way to it, and like an idiot I went off it.

You find a urologist or endo or sometimes a pcp, and just be certain your levels are basement low. If you’re lucky enough and they are somewhat competent, they’ll just prescribe you the standard 125/week and check your labs every 90. All your out is the office copay and if they treat you like an adult, your copay for the test and rigs at the pharmacy. It’s magnificent. A bit harder to find but well worth it. I’ve met two docs over the years that we’re awesome and prescribed me.
 
Codybenz

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I was at 305 total test 3 years ago. Range is 290-1100. Doc wouldn’t prescribe me and insurance wouldn’t pay because I wasn’t “low” I got pissed off and went to anti aging clinic and have been paying ever sense.
 
Matthersby

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I was at 305 total test 3 years ago. Range is 290-1100. Doc wouldn’t prescribe me and insurance wouldn’t pay because I wasn’t “low” I got pissed off and went to anti aging clinic and have been paying ever sense.
That’s crap...
I’d run a 20 week Deca Trest Test cycle and go back after 4 weeks of NO pct and get a 112 test lab draw. Just to get insurance to cover that shyt
 
hairygrandpa

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Personally, no more deca dick -nor prolactin sides since adding Proviron at 75mg/d - 100mg/d. I lactated in the past from 19-nors. Proviron takes care of it.
 
Old Witch

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Titan will prescribe as long as you’re under 400. They’re a great clinic IMO. I will be going through them if they’re still open, when I need it.
 
Old Witch

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Seriously. I need to get some proviron and just run alongside every cycle. The stuff is magic.
I’m actually planning the same. Three packs of 100 every six months is all it takes for year round use. I weighed the pros and cons and it seems like it’s worth it for me to just be on that. I’ll go 50 on cycle and 25 when off. It should add a nice edge without fucking up my pct.
 
Codybenz

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I had 200x 50mg enroute.For research purposes of course. But I don’t think it’s gonna make it. Ever.
 
hairygrandpa

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Gotcha. Thats what i would do. For comparisons sake, in terms of gains, what would be the comparison? Would 500mg of test = like 200mg deca?
Deca never yielded "awesome gains" for me. Not Deca -nor NPP. We are all different. I got the best bang from stuff like anavar, winstrol, trest (not using again) and s-drol/DMZ -always with moderate/low test as a base.
For me personally I figured:
-19-nors only with DHT (Proviron), but will never use 19-nors again (better options available)
-insulin pre-workout with intra carbs are most anabolic/effective (do some reading before, if you value your life)
-PDE-5 inhibitors are a MUST (I prefer cialis, 5mg e3d)
-most DHT derived roids > than others.
 
Renew1

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Deca never yielded "awesome gains" for me. Not Deca -nor NPP. We are all different. I got the best bang from stuff like anavar, winstrol, trest (not using again) and s-drol/DMZ -always with moderate/low test as a base.
For me personally I figured:
-19-nors only with DHT (Proviron), but will never use 19-nors again (better options available)
-insulin pre-workout with intra carbs are most anabolic/effective (do some reading before, if you value your life)
-PDE-5 inhibitors are a MUST (I prefer cialis, 5mg e3d)
-most DHT derived roids > than others.
Why the Cialis? realize the answer is probably obvious.... I just missed it
 
Matthersby

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There’s a couple studies stating test groups didn’t gain more muscle or some nonsense.
However, cialis and viagra have just a slightly different action than nitric oxide supplements and anyone that’s tried it for gym sessions can tell you it’s like a weaker IGF-1 type pump.
I take it anyways just to be the best I can for the lady, but the pumps in the gym are clearly better.
On paper Deca and NPP are crap. But it seems like if you can drop your test to a high TRT dose and really get aggressive dose, you can put on decent size.
The next 3 months are the last time I’m using NPP and Deca. I just want to give them both a chance to see how far I can push it. And if I don’t see what I’m wanting to see, I’m sticking with Trest and going to start using other compounds not as common, dhb, EQ, primo, etc etc.
I’ve gained a decent amount just nothing in comparison to Trest or ANY decent oral. I may cruise for joints possibly
 
hairygrandpa

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Why the Cialis? realize the answer is probably obvious.... I just missed it
Here a nice summary:


I don't agree to take it daily (video), as it has a long HL. E3d is what I do.

I mainly take it for better blood flow due to vasodilation = better nutrient delivery to muscles. The combo of : slin+cialis+glycerol+salt (electrolytes)+carbs intra workout is a HUGE game changer, mark my words.
Keep in mind it elevates cortisol a bit. Since most of us already take fish oil and B-vitamins, that should be a no-brainer.
 
hairygrandpa

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There’s a couple studies stating test groups didn’t gain more muscle or some nonsense.
However, cialis and viagra have just a slightly different action than nitric oxide supplements and anyone that’s tried it for gym sessions can tell you it’s like a weaker IGF-1 type pump.
I take it anyways just to be the best I can for the lady, but the pumps in the gym are clearly better.
On paper Deca and NPP are crap. But it seems like if you can drop your test to a high TRT dose and really get aggressive dose, you can put on decent size.
The next 3 months are the last time I’m using NPP and Deca. I just want to give them both a chance to see how far I can push it. And if I don’t see what I’m wanting to see, I’m sticking with Trest and going to start using other compounds not as common, dhb, EQ, primo, etc etc.
I’ve gained a decent amount just nothing in comparison to Trest or ANY decent oral. I may cruise for joints possibly
Tadalafil is right now being studied for muscle hypertrophy. Study started 2018. I already guessed the outcome :) .
 

Joshinator

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There’s a couple studies stating test groups didn’t gain more muscle or some nonsense.
However, cialis and viagra have just a slightly different action than nitric oxide supplements and anyone that’s tried it for gym sessions can tell you it’s like a weaker IGF-1 type pump.
I take it anyways just to be the best I can for the lady, but the pumps in the gym are clearly better.
On paper Deca and NPP are crap. But it seems like if you can drop your test to a high TRT dose and really get aggressive dose, you can put on decent size.
The next 3 months are the last time I’m using NPP and Deca. I just want to give them both a chance to see how far I can push it. And if I don’t see what I’m wanting to see, I’m sticking with Trest and going to start using other compounds not as common, dhb, EQ, primo, etc etc.
I’ve gained a decent amount just nothing in comparison to Trest or ANY decent oral. I may cruise for joints possibly
Weird i was under the impression NPP and deca was the creme da la creme after a few others. Maybe its just you?
 

jrock645

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There’s a couple studies stating test groups didn’t gain more muscle or some nonsense.
However, cialis and viagra have just a slightly different action than nitric oxide supplements and anyone that’s tried it for gym sessions can tell you it’s like a weaker IGF-1 type pump.
I take it anyways just to be the best I can for the lady, but the pumps in the gym are clearly better.
On paper Deca and NPP are crap. But it seems like if you can drop your test to a high TRT dose and really get aggressive dose, you can put on decent size.
The next 3 months are the last time I’m using NPP and Deca. I just want to give them both a chance to see how far I can push it. And if I don’t see what I’m wanting to see, I’m sticking with Trest and going to start using other compounds not as common, dhb, EQ, primo, etc etc.
I’ve gained a decent amount just nothing in comparison to Trest or ANY decent oral. I may cruise for joints possibly
NPP is crap?! Now you tell me...
 

Joshinator

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Here a nice summary:


I don't agree to take it daily (video), as it has a long HL. E3d is what I do.

I mainly take it for better blood flow due to vasodilation = better nutrient delivery to muscles. The combo of : slin+cialis+glycerol+salt (electrolytes)+carbs intra workout is a HUGE game changer, mark my words.
Keep in mind it elevates cortisol a bit. Since most of us already take fish oil and B-vitamins, that should be a no-brainer.
Super cool!

Are you not taking trest again because it aromatizes so much?
 
hairygrandpa

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NPP is crap?! Now you tell me...
Weird i was under the impression NPP and deca was the creme da la creme after a few others. Maybe its just you?
Well, for some its crap. For me:
-lactating nipples (proviron/caber = solution)
-gyno due to progestin/prolactin (proviron/caber/ralox = solution)
-bloat (low carb/low sodium= solution)
-elevated BP (cialis/telmisartan/low sodium diet = solution)
-dead penis (proviron/cialis = solution)
-cramps due to low sodium/potassium (!) (canceling low sodium diet and accepting bloat = solution)
-gains vs sides ratio = not interesting enough
 
hairygrandpa

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Super cool!

Are you not taking trest again because it aromatizes so much?
Yep -and because caber/proviron is expensive. It really doesn't aromatize much -or not by aromatizing enzymes, hence AI isn't working with trest as it would with test....long story -and different for everyone.
 
Matthersby

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NPP is crap?! Now you tell me...
On paper.
It’s been used forever for bulking quite well.
Sometimes All the pedigree info on a drug don’t matter if it does what you need it to.
They work for bulking, just not as drastic as a lot of us would have thought. Water is a good thing. I keep more size with a drug that puts water on me.

Problem is I discovered Trestolone.
Which shits on NPP(previously my favorite bulker)
 
hairygrandpa

hairygrandpa

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On paper.
It’s been used forever for bulking quite well.
Sometimes All the pedigree info on a drug don’t matter if it does what you need it to.
They work for bulking, just not as drastic as a lot of us would have thought. Water is a good thing. I keep more size with a drug that puts water on me.

Problem is I discovered Trestolone.
Which shits on NPP(previously my favorite bulker)
I can bulk on anything -but as soon as its a wet compound, sides vs outcome are not aligned well enough for me. Loved trest in the past -but since rediscovering slin, I'll go with something dry and insulin.
 
Matthersby

Matthersby

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I can bulk on anything -but as soon as its a wet compound, sides vs outcome are not aligned well enough for me. Loved trest in the past -but since rediscovering slin, I'll go with something dry and insulin.
It works quite well.
 

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