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Taking Supps: TIMING HELP!

PegasusActual

PegasusActual

New member
Hey all,

"They" say it's good to take protein and slow digesting carbs 30-60 minutes before your workout. I workout first thing in the morning so I am torn between getting protein immediately into my body upon waking up or going with my pre-workout mix first, then like 15-20 minutes later going with protein.

My problem is I don't want my protein shake and oatmeal to interfere with my pre-workout mix's ingestion.

So I guess my question is does that even matter anymore? Does eating solid food and protein inhibit the absorption of my pre-workout mix?

Here is my plan thus far, and lemme know if I am maximizing my supps and timing wisely:

Pre-Workout
Wake up: Jack3d pre-workout mix
15-20 mins later: Shake with 20-30 grams Whey/Soy and 5 grams glutamine, side of oatmeal
15-20 mins later: On gym floor lifting (drive to my gym blows hence the 15-20)
50-60 mins later: Done with gym, post-workout shake

Post-Workout Shake - I throw all the below ingredients in this
Distilled Water
30-40 grams Whey/Soy combo
Scivation Xtend bcaa's
5 grams Creatine
Dextrose or Organic Honey (thinking of subbing in Waxy Maize btw.)

Thanks in advance - I just want to make sure I am maximizing everything here in terms of timing and how it relates to my supps.

PA
 
I work out first thing in morning also. I get up eat eggs and oatmeal, take my Pre workout shake then wait like 15 - 30 minutes(getting weights ready for all exercises) before I lift then take my creatine within 5 mins of finishing. Works fine for me. I'd suggest saving whey shake until after workout. but wait for others input. Noone ever told me to take in any whey before workout, only afterwards. If that's a good idea , heck i'll even start it.
 
looks good to me. do the same thing here. wake, supps and pre w/o mix, 30 minutes later some sort of carbs and whey
 
PegasusActual said:
Hey all,

"They" say it's good to take protein and slow digesting carbs 30-60 minutes before your workout. I workout first thing in the morning so I am torn between getting protein immediately into my body upon waking up or going with my pre-workout mix first, then like 15-20 minutes later going with protein.

My problem is I don't want my protein shake and oatmeal to interfere with my pre-workout mix's ingestion.

So I guess my question is does that even matter anymore? Does eating solid food and protein inhibit the absorption of my pre-workout mix?

Here is my plan thus far, and lemme know if I am maximizing my supps and timing wisely:

Pre-Workout
Wake up: Jack3d pre-workout mix
15-20 mins later: Shake with 20-30 grams Whey/Soy and 5 grams glutamine, side of oatmeal
15-20 mins later: On gym floor lifting (drive to my gym blows hence the 15-20)
50-60 mins later: Done with gym, post-workout shake

Post-Workout Shake - I throw all the below ingredients in this
Distilled Water
30-40 grams Whey/Soy combo
Scivation Xtend bcaa's
5 grams Creatine
Dextrose or Organic Honey (thinking of subbing in Waxy Maize btw.)

Thanks in advance - I just want to make sure I am maximizing everything here in terms of timing and how it relates to my supps.

PA
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I would simply switch the timing up. I would eat first, then dose Jack3d. Also, you may want to research Soy protein. I am a strong opponent of Soy.
 
Hey Boro,

Yes a lot of guys are against using soy but according to recent study reviews in Muscle and Body magazine they say that Soy helps to build lean muscle and also has these added bennies:

Enhancing muscle recovery and growth
Increasing nitric-oxide production
Enhancing fat loss
Improved heart health and cancer fighting

The phytoestrogens that men have been told to be so afraid are actually powerful antioxidants that do NOT lower testosterone. Phytoestrogen chemical structure closely resembles estrogen but in fact is not the same and research has proven that they do not lower test or raise estro. A study was also done showing that bodybuilders taking a soy protein shake twice a day for 12 weeks gained an equivalent amount of muscle mass as those taking whey shakes twice a day. The study also showed no altering of test or estro levels.

Check out this article here which supports this:
bodybuilding.com/fun/drobson71.htm

Final call is up to you, but this evidence was enough for me to at least give combining whey and soy a shot ;)

PA

PS: I will try switching up the dose time as wel l- thank you!
 
PegasusActual said:
Hey Boro,

Yes a lot of guys are against using soy but according to recent study reviews in Muscle and Body magazine they say that Soy helps to build lean muscle and also has these added bennies:

Enhancing muscle recovery and growth
Increasing nitric-oxide production
Enhancing fat loss
Improved heart health and cancer fighting

The phytoestrogens that men have been told to be so afraid are actually powerful antioxidants that do NOT lower testosterone. Phytoestrogen chemical structure closely resembles estrogen but in fact is not the same and research has proven that they do not lower test or raise estro. A study was also done showing that bodybuilders taking a soy protein shake twice a day for 12 weeks gained an equivalent amount of muscle mass as those taking whey shakes twice a day. The study also showed no altering of test or estro levels.

Check out this article here which supports this:
bodybuilding.com/fun/drobson71.htm

Final call is up to you, but this evidence was enough for me to at least give combining whey and soy a shot ;)

PA

PS: I will try switching up the dose time as wel l- thank you!
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info, however I stand opposed.

Please let us know how the new protocol works for you!
 
Haha ok man that's cool. If you think there is something I should know about soy protein that may be counterproductive though, please let me know. Education == good.

Tried the new protocol this am. Ate a power breakfast then about 50 minutes later downed my Jack3d and still got my tingles within 10 minutes so I think absorption was pretty decent.

Thanks again!

PA
 
While the methods used to determine a food’s biological value (BV) are not entirely standardized, the one most scientists use is described as the efficiency with which that protein furnishes the proper proportions and amounts of the essential or indispensable amino acids needed for the synthesis of body proteins in humans or animals.

BV = Nitrogen Retained divided by Nitrogen absorbed X 100
= (dietary N) - (F - Fm) + (U - Ue) divided by (dietary N) + (F - Fm) X 100

Soy 74 (Worst)
Egg white 77
Casein 88
Milk 91
Whole egg 100
Raw whey 104
Engineered Whey Protein 157 (Best)
 
Right but the worst BV is no reason not to take it and besides that's why you cut it with another protein, like whey.

A low BV value has a negative effect of NO retention but Soy has shown to actually increase NO retention to positive levels and also being stacked with GH aminos glutamine and arginine, it seems pretty nice for body building. So the low BV is kinda cancelled out IMO.

I dunno, like I said, I think people have been scared of soy for so long but we also once thought the world was flat, you know? Anyways, I don't want to try to convince anyone, just presenting some interesting info that some folks might like to know. I could care less if people take soy protein or not :D

I actually bought some hemp protein today - very excited based on the research for this complete protein.
 
PegasusActual said:
Right but the worst BV is no reason not to take it and besides that's why you cut it with another protein, like whey.

A low BV value has a negative effect of NO retention but Soy has shown to actually increase NO retention to positive levels and also being stacked with GH aminos glutamine and arginine, it seems pretty nice for body building. So the low BV is kinda cancelled out IMO.

I dunno, like I said, I think people have been scared of soy for so long but we also once thought the world was flat, you know? Anyways, I don't want to try to convince anyone, just presenting some interesting info that some folks might like to know. I could care less if people take soy protein or not :D

I actually bought some hemp protein today - very excited based on the research for this complete protein.
Click to expand...

Whey protein is still the best for post workout shakes. It's the fastest absorbing and will help increase protein synthesis the most.
 
Delita420 said:
Whey protein is still the best for post workout shakes. It's the fastest absorbing and will help increase protein synthesis the most.
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Yup I'm with ya there. I just like to mix my ptoteins for different reasons/effects which is why I do about 20-30 whey 10-20 soy post workout. I took Hemp before bed last night mixed in with my MuscleMax High 5 which is a 5 blend nighttime slow digest mix.
 
You'll have better luck with eggs if you need slow digesting protein. It's one of the best complete protein sources. Eggs contain vitamins and minerals, including zinc which is great before bed. They are a good source of fat, this is good for bodybuilders. Contrary to popular belief, the cholesterol is also beneficial. All of our steroid hormones are made from cholesterol. I believe many magazines are putting out articles on the benefits of eggs now.
 
Delita420 said:
You'll have better luck with eggs if you need slow digesting protein. It's one of the best complete protein sources. Eggs contain vitamins and minerals, including zinc which is great before bed. They are a good source of fat, this is good for bodybuilders. Contrary to popular belief, the cholesterol is also beneficial. All of our steroid hormones are made from cholesterol. I believe many magazines are putting out articles on the benefits of eggs now.
Click to expand...


Yeah they are saying to bang out at least three whole egss a day for test levels an all.

The High 5 has egg protein in it - it's one of the five proteins in the blend. A lot of folks have had good results with this protein sup from Max Muscle. here is a nice review on it:

Take out underscore then cut and paste in browser to view:
_thesupplementrating.com/listing.php?id=394
 
I workout first thing in the morning. I would never recommend ingesting any protein or food until postworkout.

I like the 8-9 hours of empty stomach with nothing in me other than Axis Labs SMASH Fully Loaded and Axis Labs HemodrauliX with a multivitamin. However, I also set my alarm midway through the night to take in a quick whey shake then go back to sleep.

That is just how I prefer it.
 
Clickster said:
I workout first thing in the morning. I would never recommend ingesting any protein or food until postworkout.

I like the 8-9 hours of empty stomach with nothing in me other than Axis Labs SMASH Fully Loaded and Axis Labs HemodrauliX with a multivitamin. However, I also set my alarm midway through the night to take in a quick whey shake then go back to sleep.

That is just how I prefer it.
Click to expand...

Personally, this is how I do it as well. I slam DominATP pre-training and do not eat until after training.
 
Clickster said:
I workout first thing in the morning. I would never recommend ingesting any protein or food until postworkout.

I like the 8-9 hours of empty stomach with nothing in me other than Axis Labs SMASH Fully Loaded and Axis Labs HemodrauliX with a multivitamin. However, I also set my alarm midway through the night to take in a quick whey shake then go back to sleep.

That is just how I prefer it.
Click to expand...

Well, say you take a slow digest protein lasting for 4 hours (like MuscleMax High 5 with milk and some fiber and and oil) then you have nothing left after that for another 4 hours while you are sleeping, isn't that putting your muscles in a catabolic state if you don't shoot down some quick protein when you get up?

Secondly, why are so many "experts" advocates of pre-workout protein dosages? It seems to makes sense that if your muscle are fed before destroying them in the gym that they will recover better and again prevent catabolism while working out. I don't know, that just seems to be the consensus.

Thirdly, haha, the alarm thing is a good idea. I usually have to pee around 4 - 5am or so and I have a shake ready in the fridge when that happens.

Is it safe to say that if you are drinking protein timed via alarm/getting up to pee in the middle of the night, that muscle breakdown is kept at a minimum for your AM workout?

Sorry for all the questions, just trying to figure this out ;)

Thanks guys!

PA
 
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