Suggestions; what to add to a Tamox cycle

Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
I'm about to do a 2 month 20mg ED tamox cycle. Have some gyno that's giving me headaches and I want to reduce it as much as possible. I am not on cycle, my last cycle was 4 months ago, and I do not want to go on cycle. It's summer, I hate being on cycle when it's hot ...

Anyway, as I know what tamox does to my libido and mood, I want to add something that wont suppress me more then 50 -70% but will keep my mood and libido up. Was thinking maybe just proviron at 50mg or maybe even primo at 100mg, or heck, what about DHB at 100mg : D Talked about androsten... something something that I can't seem to remember it's name. Androstenedione? Or maybe Mast at 100mg, mast also helps with gyno/estro directly ... Methyl's and c17 orals are out of the question as I have some Billirubin chit that I am dealing with atm. Although var at 10mg wouldn't be so bad probably, I would still like to avoid it.

Anyway, curious about your opinions, tnx
 
Last edited:
booneman77

booneman77

Legend
Awards
5
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • Best Answer
Tamox alone will not REDUCE gyno at all... it will only prevent it from getting worse by blocking the receptors...

A much more common cycle for gyno redux (and one I have personally used) would be Ralox + Letro.
 
Whisky

Whisky

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
  • Best Answer
Yeah was thinking ralox and letro as I read the post....

not seeing the point of a tamox only tbh.

I always keep a stock of those two in just in case
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
While I've used ralox in the past, I've also used tamox and they both work more or less just the same. Ralox is better but tamox is also effective and has been used for gyno treatment for a long time. It's still mostly the defacto treatment options thath MD's prescribe.

Results: Mean (SD) age of treated subjects was 14.6 (1.5) years with gynecomastia duration of 28.3 (16.4) months. Mean reduction in breast nodule diameter was 2.1 cm (95% CI 1.7, 2.7, P <.0001) after treatment with tamoxifen and 2.5 cm (95% CI 1.7, 3.3, P <.0001) with raloxifene. Some improvement was seen in 86% of patients receiving tamoxifen and in 91% receiving raloxifene, but a greater proportion had a significant decrease (>50%) with raloxifene (86%) than tamoxifen (41%). No side effects were seen in any patients.


In any case, I cant get a hold of ralox atm. Unfortunately in EU we don't have RC sites like MA's ... and I can't find an ugl that has it in stock. So tamox it is ...

Anyawy, what would ya'll recommend? How liver toxic is androstenedione? And is it basically only a PH for DHT? So is thus more logical to just use Mast (which I have in my drawer)? I also have proviron. But was also thinking maybe primo, to help with my cut, need to lose 4 more pounds and it's really a pain keeping muscle mass without a gym.
 
Whisky

Whisky

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
  • Best Answer
While I've used ralox in the past, I've also used tamox and they both work more or less just the same. Ralox is better but tamox is also effective and has been used for gyno treatment for a long time. It's still mostly the defacto treatment options thath MD's prescribe.

Results: Mean (SD) age of treated subjects was 14.6 (1.5) years with gynecomastia duration of 28.3 (16.4) months. Mean reduction in breast nodule diameter was 2.1 cm (95% CI 1.7, 2.7, P <.0001) after treatment with tamoxifen and 2.5 cm (95% CI 1.7, 3.3, P <.0001) with raloxifene. Some improvement was seen in 86% of patients receiving tamoxifen and in 91% receiving raloxifene, but a greater proportion had a significant decrease (>50%) with raloxifene (86%) than tamoxifen (41%). No side effects were seen in any patients.


In any case, I cant get a hold of ralox atm. Unfortunately in EU we don't have RC sites like MA's ... and I can't find an ugl that has it in stock. So tamox it is ...

Anyawy, what would ya'll recommend? How liver toxic is androstenedione? And is it basically only a PH for DHT? So is thus more logical to just use Mast (which I have in my drawer)? I also have proviron. But was also thinking maybe primo, to help with my cut, need to lose 4 more pounds and it's really a pain keeping muscle mass without a gym.
brother, in the EU we have our pharmacy with exceptional opening hours 😉
 
thebigt

thebigt

Legend
Awards
6
  • Best Answer
  • The BigT Award
  • Established
  • Legend!
  • RockStar
  • First Up Vote
sustain alpha will keep libido and mood really nice.
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Resveratrol and 7,8-benzoflavone ... While I'm up for trying otc products, I am going to try something more potent. Tnx
 

CroLifter

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
  • RockStar
  • Best Answer
Resveratrol and 7,8-benzoflavone ... While I'm up for trying otc products, I am going to try something more potent. Tnx
I have come to the conclusion that it doesnt make difference i if i, say, go all in and do trt dose of test and shut myself down fully or if i use some semi suppressive stuff like xi kt. I still need to pct after.

If hcg is used pct poses no issues and i feel fine.

However, an inevitable crash comes for me months later, and it is something i wasnt able to fully comprehend yet.
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
I have come to the conclusion that it doesnt make difference i if i, say, go all in and do trt dose of test and shut myself down fully or if i use some semi suppressive stuff like xi kt. I still need to pct after.

If hcg is used pct poses no issues and i feel fine.

However, an inevitable crash comes for me months later, and it is something i wasnt able to fully comprehend yet.
I dont want to go on cycle. Really. I want to be "my self", psychologically speaking. Cycling turns me into somebody else and I don't want that atm. Besides, it's summer. Cycling sucks in summer time. I really just want to avoid the loss of lybido and mood while on the serm.
 

CroLifter

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
  • RockStar
  • Best Answer
I dont want to go on cycle. Really. I want to be "my self", psychologically speaking. Cycling turns me into somebody else and I don't want that atm. Besides, it's summer. Cycling sucks in summer time. I really just want to avoid the loss of lybido and mood while on the serm.
I understand, i just said that in my experience taking sth semi-suppressive ends up in me being suppressed.

And i get it when you say you become someone else. I also did. Even on just 100mg of test, i am more of my 16 yeard old self lol.

I find that i am most stable on roughly 100mg of test. Being off, oike now, i find myself to be too mellow and emotional. More test, and i lack empathy.


I find that i listen to totally different music on test and off test. Amazing, but true.
 
Alchemist11

Alchemist11

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
You should consider adding Igf-1 lr3, many claim that it enhances libido and mood, plus, Nolva will tank your igf levels in blood.
And it's win win situation, you can even gain with it...
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
You should consider adding Igf-1 lr3, many claim that it enhances libido and mood, plus, Nolva will tank your igf levels in blood.
And it's win win situation, you can even gain with it...
Actually, I'm ordering cjcdac and hex ... but am not counting on that to help with mood that much. You basically saying igf1 has mood/libido enhancing properties? Or just lr3?
 
Alchemist11

Alchemist11

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Actually, I'm ordering cjcdac and hex ... but am not counting on that to help with mood that much. You basically saying igf1 has mood/libido enhancing properties? Or just lr3?
Well igf-1 overall, lr3 is just less hustle, with it needing to inject it just once a day. I use it in my every pct, it makes huge difference
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Interesting.

I had suspicion that ig1 helps with mood. I once gave my mother Mk, and she quit after a week or two. Saying she felt to aggressive, that she just started jelling at people and storming out off meetings ...
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Damn, has anybody seen prices for mast lately? It's like 70€ for E.
 

CroLifter

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
  • RockStar
  • Best Answer
Damn, has anybody seen prices for mast lately? It's like 70€ for E.
Got 10 grams of mast e powder 😎

But in all seriousness, a useless compound for me, side effects in a bottle. Test and proviron are better than it at everything.
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Got 10 grams of mast e powder 😎

But in all seriousness, a useless compound for me, side effects in a bottle. Test and proviron are better than it at everything.
Seems like a good idea in my case, as not should it only help with mood and libido but also helps with e2. Mast was once used for such purposes just in and by it self.
 

CroLifter

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
  • RockStar
  • Best Answer
Seems like a good idea in my case, as not should it only help with mood and libido but also helps with e2. Mast was once used for such purposes just in and by it self.
In my case it worsens the mood even at lower doses. For example even at 100-200mg a week, i just cant stand anything. Cheeky individuals the most. I remember being at a family lunch and an older relative was trying to make fun of me for doing "stupid sh1t" in my shop/garage. I was on 100mg test and i injected 100mg of masteron few days before. I was sooooooooo close to flipping the entire table onto him and jumpkicking hin into the face. I felt extremely moody after the iniection and it culminated at that lunch. I restrained myself barely, smacked the hell out of the table and left.

And the traffic ooooh man. Thinking about side ramming the car in front of you into the streetlight because he is an idiot driving too slow.

Clomid gives me similar rage issues. Test and proviron on the other hand i feel pretty calm.
 

Jaa0023

New member
Awards
0
Surgery.

4 months of having gyno. Too late to reverse now.
 

CroLifter

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
  • RockStar
  • Best Answer
My mk677 induced lump has gone away on its own withput any serms.
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
In my case it worsens the mood even at lower doses. For example even at 100-200mg a week, i just cant stand anything. Cheeky individuals the most. I remember being at a family lunch and an older relative was trying to make fun of me for doing "stupid sh1t" in my shop/garage. I was on 100mg test and i injected 100mg of masteron few days before. I was sooooooooo close to flipping the entire table onto him and jumpkicking hin into the face. I felt extremely moody after the iniection and it culminated at that lunch. I restrained myself barely, smacked the hell out of the table and left.

And the traffic ooooh man. Thinking about side ramming the car in front of you into the streetlight because he is an idiot driving too slow.

Clomid gives me similar rage issues. Test and proviron on the other hand i feel pretty calm.
This story ... it's beginning to sound like a myth, a fable : D "CroLifter and his Mast yourney"
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
If you have proof of someone getting rid of gyno after 4 months of having it. I’d like to see.
Dude just f-in google raloxifene and gynecomastia. Official studies have been done on it. It removed or substantially diminshed gyno. Even pubertal gyno got hammered. And you don't need to look at official research even; plenty of guys have used ralox to help with existing gyno. Tamox also. Do some research before blatantly posting uneducated opinions and creating unnecessary side discussions.
 

Jaa0023

New member
Awards
0
Dude just f-in google raloxifene and gynecomastia. Official studies have been done on it. It removed or substantially diminshed gyno. Even pubertal gyno got hammered. And you don't need to look at official research even; plenty of guys have used ralox to help with existing gyno. Tamox also. Do some research before blatantly posting uneducated opinions and creating unnecessary side discussions.
You’re correct. They have used it to “help with gynecomastia” not to actually get rid of it completely and diminishing the gland that can still reoccur. If the gland is still there is can still be a problem.
But you’re 100% correct it has been used to reduce the size of the lump and to take away some of the soreness and puffy nips. But if you want it completely gone and for it to never reoccur again, surgery.
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
But you’re 100% correct it has been used to reduce the size of the lump and to take away some of the soreness and puffy nips. But if you want it completely gone and for it to never reoccur again, surgery.
Granted, I was a bit liberal with "removed". Actual glands can't be removed (or at least I don't think so). I was speaking in a sense that it is no longer visible and that the soft tissue fatty mass behind the nipple has been more or less diminished.
 
Project223

Project223

New member
Awards
1
  • First Up Vote
Surgery.

4 months of having gyno. Too late to reverse now.
Not sure if it’ll help people who have developed voluptuous bitch tits from Gyno. But Ralox has worked great for me in getting rid of hard lumps and puffy, sore nips that persisted longer than 4 months.
Plan on dosing 50-60ish mg for 2-3 months. It takes a little while to start working so don’t be discouraged if nothing happens in the first week or two.
If you have those symptoms it’s well worth trying before considering surgery!

Good luck with your tits
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Yeah. Tnx this is how it looked 2 years ago. It's like 10% worse now ...
 

Attachments

Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Has anybody pinned mast subq? I have prop at 100mg ml and e at 200mg ml. Was thinking of starting with 100mg/week. So that would be cca 0.13ml of prop ed pinned subq.

E I would just inject IM 2xweek. But I want to try prop first as I have a limited amount of E.
 

CroLifter

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
  • RockStar
  • Best Answer
Has anybody pinned mast subq? I have prop at 100mg ml and e at 200mg ml. Was thinking of starting with 100mg/week. So that would be cca 0.13ml of prop ed pinned subq.

E I would just inject IM 2xweek. But I want to try prop first as I have a limited amount of E.
I pinned test subq and didnt seem to notice difference. Perhaps less of a "rush" that night, i would sometimes get amped up at night if i injected in the morning.

Those were small volumes i pinned subq (up to 0.25ml) so no lumps or anything. However, i never pinned the stomach. Not even hcg. Always thigh fat.
 
Nac

Nac

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Has anybody pinned mast subq? I have prop at 100mg ml and e at 200mg ml. Was thinking of starting with 100mg/week. So that would be cca 0.13ml of prop ed pinned subq.

E I would just inject IM 2xweek. But I want to try prop first as I have a limited amount of E.
Ive tried pinning just about everything Ive run subq, and my recommendation would be to avoid doing so with compounds that tend to produce pip (dhb, bold cyp, etc)...you should be fine with mast E.
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Ive tried pinning just about everything Ive run subq, and my recommendation would be to avoid doing so with compounds that tend to produce pip (dhb, bold cyp, etc)...you should be fine with mast E.
Prop wouldnt be much different huh? E i would pin IM ...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nac

CroLifter

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
  • RockStar
  • Best Answer
Prop wouldnt be much different huh? E i would pin IM ...
Just go for the thigh fat. It was my reasoning if anything happens at least it is further away from vital organs. Besides, stabbing my stomach seemed counterintuitive and a bit scary to me.

Why would i do that when i can stab my leg (obviously avoid blood vessels you can see on your skin lol).
 
Nac

Nac

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Just go for the thigh fat. It was my reasoning if anything happens at least it is further away from vital organs. Besides, stabbing my stomach seemed counterintuitive and a bit scary to me.

Why would i do that when i can stab my leg (obviously avoid blood vessels you can see on your skin lol).
John Crisler (famous trt doc) advocated stomach subq, and in his demonstration vidz you could see he was quite lean as well. I only mention this as I found fatty tissue much easier to pin there, from a fool-proof point of view. There and glute area.
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
John Crisler (famous trt doc) advocated stomach subq, and in his demonstration vidz you could see he was quite lean as well. I only mention this as I found fatty tissue much easier to pin there, from a fool-proof point of view. There and glute area.
Yeah, you dont even need to "pinch" on the glutes.
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Just go for the thigh fat. It was my reasoning if anything happens at least it is further away from vital organs. Besides, stabbing my stomach seemed counterintuitive and a bit scary to me.

Why would i do that when i can stab my leg (obviously avoid blood vessels you can see on your skin lol).
My fat on my quads is almost non 3xistent atm. But I dont think it really matters where you actually pin subq ...
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
A funny thing I noticed today. I took 40mg tamox, and later in the evening my balls started to hurt lol Like they do on cycle sometimes. I also became very aggressive and angry. Although that's partially from me not sleeping much the past week and from modafinil I was cranky, but still, some gay guy in front of a club totally pissed me off, and I had to walk away and breath and throw some stuff around. I only get like this on cycles. Weird.
 

Jaa0023

New member
Awards
0
Didn't even had anything to drink ...
Hey Jin. What else you take along side the tamox when you gyno flares up a bit. I did some digging into the research and I want to try it out. Got some on the way.
 

CroLifter

Well-known member
Awards
4
  • First Up Vote
  • Established
  • RockStar
  • Best Answer
All kinds of old(ish) thread revival.
 
Jinsun

Jinsun

Well-known member
Awards
3
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
  • RockStar
Hey Jin. What else you take along side the tamox when you gyno flares up a bit. I did some digging into the research and I want to try it out. Got some on the way.
Generally tamox is enough. But it depends on what's the underlying problem. If it's prolactin, then you might benefit from caber. Although tamox by it self lovers prolactin, it does so in a limited amount. So caber can still be beneficial. In certain instances, you can actually just take caber and no serm.

If E2 is the problem then you need a serm combined with an Ai. For the most part, but you can also just lower the offending compound, if you wish to do so.

If you are not on cycle then playing with Ai's doesn't make that much sense. Your hormones should re-balance by them self's. And you should also take care of the underlying problem, why your hormones are off balance.

If you are on exogenous test, then masteron is a good compliment to a serm or an Ai as it has a different mechanism of blocking estrogen then both the serm and the Ai. Masteron was used for breast cancer until the invention of other more useful compounds, ie. serms ana Ai's.
 

Similar threads


Top