Spurfy’s Fasting Log

ValiantThor08

ValiantThor08

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I have no idea why it posted 5 times or why I cannot delete these. Suffice it to say I want to punch a hole in my wall right now and throw a potted plant through my living room window.
Which one do we follow? Lol
 

Fasted

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Hey, sorry you are going through such a terrible time. I wish i had some great wise words to help you along, but i dont. Just keep your head up and keep on pushin. You will feel happiness again. The good news and the bad news is that everything is fleeting. Best of luck with your fast and health and happiness.
 
hairygrandpa

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I hope to have healed my body enough that I can begin training again, and most-importantly to try to see life as a gift instead of an affliction. Presently, the only time I’m not abjectly miserable is the short period each week I get with my son. It would be nice to be able to see at least some of the joy and wonder and amazement of this world like my son does, instead of seething with sadness, anger, resentment, and regret. I can only barely remember what it felt like to see my life as anything but a tremendous burden. Except for when I’m with my son? all of my hope, optimism, inspiration, humor, joy, gratitude, compassion, empathy, and warmth are just gone and no matter how deeply I dig, I just can’t find them. I’m constantly filled with emptiness so profound that I have stopped loving everyone but my son and have basically abandoned all of my friendships. I used to want to change the world for the better — now I find myself hoping for a nuclear war or Yellowstone eruption. I don’t want this any more.
You already found the reason for your life. Nothing stays but your offspring. He deserves the best start he can get.
This realization may never cure your misanthropy -but sure gives you a reason to live.

I'm ready to follow!
 
LeanEngineer

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I will follow a long as well! Maybe an admin can delete the other threads so we don't get confussed. ha
 
YoungThor

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This is a transformative, spiritual-type fast. I like this plan. That combined with coming off the drugs will probably have some incredible benefits but I imagine you’re only going to sink even lower in the first couple weeks as you ween yourself off opiates. But in the long run I’m confident this will workout for you.

I’ve quit opiates so many damn times it’s insane. I quit cold turkey about five times in the last six months. Each time I relapse soon after and then use for a short period, quit again, and then repeat the cycle. And I’ve been stuck in this rut many times before over the last seven years, sometimes being clean for almost a year at a time. This time there’s not a doubt in my mind that I won’t go back. Now I do intermittent fasting, and eat very low carb and high fat. So, my point is that I can relate. Before you know it you’ll get goosebumps when a song you like comes on or you’ll be overcome with joy at the sight of a sunset. It sounds corny but you’ve been blocking your emotions and when you take those blockers away you’ll be very emotionally raw. I get extremely nostalgic and sentimental when I come off drugs. But I’m sure you know about all that. And the fasting might only make these feelings of appreciation for little things in life even more intense.

The last thing I’d like to add is that you should do this for your son but you should also do this for yourself. There’s nothing wrong with being selfish when you’re trying to make major life changes like you are. I think the people who have the most success in these instances are the ones who not only make changes for their family and loved ones, but even more importantly, they make these changes because they desperately want to treat themselves better and have a happier more fulfilling life for themselves.

Anyway, good luck and I’ll be following along.
 

Whisky

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Keen to follow and genuinely hope this provides the benefits you want.

I won’t pretend to understand what you are going through as I’m fortunate to have not been there myself, I do however know that with effort and time things can and do turn around.

Keep moving forward brother
 
Humble

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Godspeed to you in reclaiming your life, Spurfy.

I will be following your journey. I perceive you as a smart and giving person. Forgive me if I’m out of line here, but recommend adapting the plan to your body’s needs and spiritual needs during your journey. Be forgiving and kind to yourself.

Stay safe! Stay strong!

P.S. Posted earlier on one of the “multi-verse” posts!
 

danielvp

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Hang in there Spurfy, I know you are going to feel so much better once you've fully detoxed from painkillers.

Looking forward to following along as you take back your health and your life, and for all the knowledge you are going to drop on the way!
 
YoungThor

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I’d be very careful about making any important, long lasting changes to your social life at this time. Your pre-existing mental health issues combined with coming off a variety of drugs is a toxic combination. Then you throw in a very strict diet plan and you’ve basically created a formula on how to have the perfect meltdown. So whenever you’re on the verge of snapping remind yourself that how bad you feel now isn’t remotely close to how good you’ll feel in a few months (if you stick to coming off the drugs and reaching homeostasis). But in the meantime you’re about to fight an all out f*cking war in your mind.

Even though I’m offering this advice to you, I myself have recently been the victim of my own insane outrage, and in the moment I had no idea that my temporary psychotic break was the result of me withdrawing from opiates. In the beginning when all the physical withdrawals ravish my body it’s easy to remember I’m coming off drugs. After that, I forget sometimes that how terrible I feel is still the result of my brain chemistry readjusting. Due to this forgetfulness I indulged myself in some serious anger that I thought was justifiable but later I realized I was totally in the wrong and my irritation was childish. I almost destroyed the most important relationship in my life in a matter of minutes because of the way I acted and hours later I had some serious regret.

Also, I’d like to mention something else important. It seems to be a pretty common phenomenon that when a person decides to make a change in their life they set out to make seven changes all at once. I’ve tried this multiple times and the success rate is much lower and it actually increases the chance that you’ll come away making zero long term changes. You may have a level of discipline I don’t have though. I still think you’d suffer less if you fought your battles one by one, although you’ve already began this journey and probably don’t want to go back. But for example, I think you’d suffer much less if you got over your mono first, then quit opiates, then quit corticosteroids, then implemented a rigorous diet plan. Some of the less drastic changes you could throw in at anytime, like quitting tv news consumption. But again, even though I’m offering this advice, I have to admit I’d have a hard time following it myself, as I too like to make several changes at once.
 
hairygrandpa

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^^^ This.

Also, breaking relations to "normal" people isn't a good choice. That leaves you with whom? I mean, there is always "The loner living in the woods with his dog" approach -but it would interfere with watching your son grow up.
 

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Day 2 (3/2)

Dinner: 16 oz bone-in ribeye steak, 2 small potatoes fried in pan drippings and bacon grease, small Greek yogurt

Met some friends at their house for a small get-together and pulled no punches, refused to put on a happy face, and generally made everyone uncomfortable. It felt good. Spent the entire time with my son and trying to ignore everyone else. Hopefully no more invitations are forthcoming.

Disowned (and then blocked) my brother and one of my few remaining close friends last night via text on a whim. What's the point of maintaining relationships with people who will never understand you? It's completely one-sided and their normalcy does nothing but make me feel even worse about who I am.

My son is here and he's mostly felt like a burden, even though he's been nothing but sweet and funny and clever. I'm trying very hard to salvage this visit and enjoy the little time we get to spend together. Every time he's told me "I love you, Dada" it has cut through me like a knife. I'm utterly exhausted from this mono and don't even have the strength to play with him. I'm constantly on the verge of snapping at him for minor things and am trying my best to bite my tongue -- I'm not an angry parent and I never yell or hit, but his energy and enthusiasm are annoying me. He really truly deserves much better than me.
Man, love and hope sent. I agree with HGP, as much as you may want to close yourself off to friends and family, this may be one of the more important times to try to reach out and/or listen to them. And as far as being "normal", the normies wish they were special and the speshies wish they were normal. Who cares whats normal, we should all just strive for the best sustainable quality of life.

On a random note, do you listen to music? What kinds?
 
hairygrandpa

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Day 3: (3/3)

Dinner: 1 lb bone-in ribeye, small Greek yogurt

Mono is absolutely destroying me right now and I had to take my son to hospital last night for non-asthmatic difficulty breathing — he’s fine but it was a tense several hours. Argued a bit with the ED doc about potential causes until he realized I probably know about as much as he does and he agreed on some unconventional possibilities and noted them, none probably serious. Follow-up with his pediatrician this week. Another flat tire in the parking garage — patch didn’t hold. Finally just towed it to tire shop this morning and bought a new tire. Anyone else who owns a high performance car knows that this wasn’t cheap...

Spent all night last night alternating between the most deliciously vivid erotic dreams I’ve ever had and dreams where I was crying so hard in them I woke up sobbing. Something broke in my psyche last night and today I feel lighter and actually hopeful. Here’s to self-healing... ��

I’m too weak to write any more, and will reply when I can, but suffice it to say I’m not one to ignore sound advice and will be staying on and doubling-up the prednisone until this mono is wiped out even though my weight is now moving upwards thanks to massive water retention. That said, my muscles look like I’m on dbol, Var, and deca, so it’s not completely awful.

Thank you all for your support and advice. Spurfy’s brain is seriously broken and badly needs to be fixed or Spurfy isn’t going to make it and the only person who matters to him (his son) will ultimately be the one most hurt.
Get better soon!
 
hairygrandpa

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Spurfy , one more reason to drag your azz a little longer over this planet is:
Leave something behind: Finish your book!
 
THOR 70

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Hey man I’m really struggling with life at the moment too. Pretty sure I have ankylosing spondylitis and tore something in my knee. Pockets of inflammation everywhere and feel 90 years old when getting out of bed. Hang in there man. I’m going to be using your thread for motivation. YOU WILL OVERCOME THIS
 
hairygrandpa

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I have this recurring thought about all of the evil, awful people who inevitably will use my book to enrich their evil, awful lives, and live even longer evil, awful lives, and it makes me want to smash my laptop and destroy all backup copies of my manuscript.

I won’t.

But I want to...
Repeating your misanthropic thoughts over -and over again can't be good for healing. Its like mental masturbation. I sometime hope that an alien race is coming to harvest us for their protein macros, that way humanity at least has a purpose. Looking really forward to it. But in the meanwhile, lets focus in multiplying said protein, by caring for the offspring, shall we?

:)
 
THOR 70

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Day 5: (3/5)

Dinner: 1 lb bone in ribeye, three eggs

Mono symptoms are much improved, other than some lingering fatigue. I think going low-cal and low-carb have frozen EBV replication, and I didn’t take any prednisone today. Disc pain is also significantly reduced. I’ll probably have to take a replacement dose (5 mg) of prednisone tomorrow since I’m almost certainly adrenal suppressed.

Mood is still garbage. Dreams are still haunting me. Outlook is still hopeless. Contempt and disdain for humanity is still ever-present. But at least that f*cking awful, evil little virus is seemingly getting crushed.

Tonight I’m taking 25 mg of promethazine before bed, hopefully this spares me from nocturnal psychic torture. If nothing else, tomorrow the lingering anticholinergic effects should make me too stupid to be abjectly morose.

I did get a voicemail today from my son saying “Dada, I love you. Bye bye Dada.” It was a good reminder why I’m doing this. I have given up on myself for my own sake, this is the honest truth, but for whatever reason that little boy adores me and that’s reason enough to keep pushing forward. Hating myself is hating his very favorite person and ultimately hurting him.
Selflessness is a most honorable trait a man can struggle to develop. My kids are also my source of motivation. Gotta have something bigger than yourself. I commend you for this perspective
 
THOR 70

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(3/5)

Developed acute akasthesia (oops) from the promethazine — recognized symptoms immediately. Akasthesia is *extremely unpleasant* and I wouldn’t wish it on anyone. It’s hard to describe, but if I had to I’d describe it at the complete opposite of an orgasm.

Treated the akasthesia with a 21 mg nicotine patch, 10 mg of selegiline, 2 mg clonazepam and 200 mg of l-dopa, which worked very well (and pretty quickly) but as would be expected, this combination absolutely wrecked my sleep.

On the plus side, light sleep meant that my dreams were nonsense and unremarkable.

Woke up today with an improved mood in spite of feeling like I’d been hit by a bus.

I’ve been very cold and unable to adequately maintain body temp in spite of the warmer weather so I’ve started 100 mcg/day T4, which I will terminate a week before my water fasting begins.
Obviously you know what you’re doing, but at which point do you taper the external inputs and work to obtain homeostasis? Or is that what you’re using these tools to minimize pains on the path to homeostasis?
 
hairygrandpa

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(3/5)

Developed acute akasthesia (oops) from the promethazine — recognized symptoms immediately. Akasthesia is *extremely unpleasant* and I wouldn’t wish it on anyone. It’s hard to describe, but if I had to I’d describe it at the complete opposite of an orgasm.

Treated the akasthesia with a 21 mg nicotine patch, 10 mg of selegiline, 2 mg clonazepam and 200 mg of l-dopa, which worked very well (and pretty quickly) but as would be expected, this combination absolutely wrecked my sleep.

On the plus side, light sleep meant that my dreams were nonsense and unremarkable.

Woke up today with an improved mood in spite of feeling like I’d been hit by a bus.

I’ve been very cold and unable to adequately maintain body temp in spite of the warmer weather so I’ve started 100 mcg/day T4, which I will terminate a week before my water fasting begins.
Man, that looks like way too many meds to get, well, off the meds. Hopefully you can pull that off. For now it looks, for a bystander, like putting out fire with gasoline
 
hairygrandpa

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Treating the akasthesia was the right choice. If I had let it run it very well probably would have induced a psychotic state. Akasthesia in someone already experiencing a mental health crisis is a psychiatric emergency.

And I get what you’re saying, but not substituting drugs for more drugs. I’m completely off opioids at this point (thank you tianeptine) and on a minimal dose of prednisone, which will be completely withdrawn by weeks’ end.

The promethazine was to try and sleep without dream torture, but in retrospect suppressing my dreams is suppressing emotion that needs to be addressed and as unpleasant as the dreams are, they need to happen. Lesson learned.

The T4 is somewhat of a necessity at this point — my basal temp has been around 96°. Without adequate thyroid hormone levels and with a current EBV infection, my immune system will be taking a massive hit.

I’m trying to make the transition to water fasting as gentle as possible, and if this involves judicious use of other drugs to ease that transition then that’s what I’ll do. The end result is all that matters to me.
Do what you have to do -but get better. Go-go-go!
 
THOR 70

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So regarding fasting and steroids, I had a IM shot of Kenalog 40mg & delo-Medrol 80mg on the second day of my 5 day water fast. I noticed the fast was extremely easy. From your previous comments, did I inhibit autophagy due to adrenal suppression of cortisol? Im dealing with autoimmune stuff and was hoping that I could drastically drop my systemic inflammation as my CRP was 5.9 on that Monday. Unfortunately the fast didn’t seem to do aaa much as I hoped for my pain, inflammation, and healing. Any input is appreciated. I want to fast more but half life of kenalog is 30+ days I believe.

Dude that’s awesome you mood feels better. Must feel good to use you knowledge to make a step in the right direction. Keep it up!
 

Fasted

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The fact that I developed akasthesia from promethazine, which is a somewhat rare side effect, coupled with the fact that taking multiple dopaminergics not only stopped the akasthesia but actually put me in a pretty good mood today, leads me to believe that my present mental health state may be largely due to inadequate dopamine signaling.

Today I am literally not depressed. At all. Just tired and stiff and sore.

The “chemical imbalance” theory of depression is mostly true but very much misunderstood. Psychological stress creates the imbalance which further reduces coping ability and a downward spiral where reduced coping causes more stress which creates more imbalance. In other words, the chemical imbalance is not the initial cause of the depression, it’s a function of it, but which if left unchecked, becomes a co-contributer.
Yiu are quitting opiods...your mental.health state is definitively greatly effected by lack of dopamine. Your body needs to learn how to produce it again. Is there any way you can get someone like a mental health "spotter" to keep you safe through your withdrawals? Cuz this is a very heavy "lift" you are doing right now. Don't do this alone if you have options.

As far as the chemical imbalance of depression, everything we think and feel has momentum. Every time we think or feel something it builds that connection. Right now you have pruned all your good feeling connectiins other than opioids and you need to find things in the physical, not chemical world, to start making a new path and build that connection until it flows freely. When there is no path, you must MAKE a path. And its going to be a lot of work blazing a path through that jungle, but just keep swingin that machete!

You have to try to entertain yourself, whatever that may be. Research, lifting(if you can), movies, games, music. Hell, do some **** youd never do. Go go carting, or to an amusement park. Switch it up. A lot of cues are environmental. Change the environment, change the cues.


Also, do "wim hof method" breathing amd then hold your breath in in the last of the 30 breaths (last part is a slight variation). Make sure you are seated not driving or anything. I know it sounds stupid, but it will blow your mind how doing this a few rounds can calm you. The guy wim hof claims he can control his autonomic nervous system. I believe it is true. Theres a path to build. Id also love to hear your opinion on any. He started cold exposure in ice water and claimed it was the only thing that could rip him from his depression after his wifes death. I also believe in that very much after practicing it over a year or so now.

Good luck and keep it up!
 
THOR 70

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In my opinion:

1. The steroid injection probably increased autophagy

2. Your fast was too short. 10 days is the sweet spot for inflammation and widespread healing and should be considered a minimum when trying to overcome serious physical ailments.
Welp. 10+ day fast then it is haha.

Can you explain the increases autophagy/steroid moa?

Have you considered high dose niacin for your mental? I took a gram of it then did 30 min dry sauna and felt quite nice. Took some diatomaceous earth right after to mop up any toxins released.

I’d love to work with you one on one when you have the space and energy. Might help you with some of your finances too.

PM me when you’re available.
 
THOR 70

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I don’t get what you get from people. People don’t support or inspire me, instead they try and fix me, not the psychological problems, but *me*, at my core, because the fact that they cannot relate to me with both an absurdly high intellect and Asperger’s is somehow *my* malfunction. I really have no use for friends any more at this stage in my life. I’ve never really relied on anyone but myself anyway, so this isn’t a new path I’m blazing.

I don’t understand your (ie, the general, non-Aspie) kind, I’m just really really really good at making you think I do so that things aren’t constantly awkward. And when I ask how things have been for you and what you’ve been up to rest assured I’m daydreaming or pondering research the entire time you think I’m listening, with perfectly timed “Mmm hmm” and “Oh! Really!”, and perfect eye contact and body language, all the while making sure a small part of me is keying in on specific words so that later I can ask follow-up questions that will make you feel listened to and validated, even though I really did not pay attention at all to the incredibly boring and tedious drivel that you thought I would actually want to hear, and really could not care less about your problems with your daughter’s boyfriend and that your boss talks about you behind your back, problems that literally everyone has. Try being an alien on this planet where you can never be yourself, then we can talk about what real, overwhelming, insurmountable problems are like...

I have to literally get into human character to have a conversation.



I carefully read this and have taken a number of your points to heart. Fact is, I’ve been numbing myself in one way or another since my separation/divorce — alcohol, drugs, lifting, tons of risky sex, cycling — because I miss my son constantly and feel like if I don’t keep this suppressed most of the time I will simply not be able to function.

I’ll give the breathing a shot.
I think you’re a bit too hard on yourself. I have to do a lot of the same **** for my job and it’s exhausting honestly trying to care. You just need time, and a few true friends that don’t care if you make them feel like you don’t care all the time.
 

Whisky

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(3/6)

Dinner: 18 oz ribeye, mixed baby greens, 1 orange, 1 banana

Dry fasted most of the day. Considering fasting until Friday after sundown and dry fasting during daylight hours.

Took a walk today in the rain, felt nice to get out but calf muscle began cramping badly on the hills, hence the high potassium fruits at dinner.
You ever considered breath work whilst out walking? Supposed to do wonders for ones mental state and peace of mind.... someone mentioned wim hof earlier in this thread and breath work plus exposure to cold had a radical effect on his life (plus the cold exposure is supposedly extremely beneficial to the body).

Personally I’m just about managing 30s cold shower and 10 mins of mediation so miles away from knowing my sh1t on this but I’ve heard many positives from many people smarter than me.....

Something to consider anyway
 
THOR 70

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(3/7)

Dinner: 18 oz bone-in ribeye and an orange.

Weight loss is apparent. Everything is loose. I’ll weigh in on the 21st on my first day of water fasting. Decided to fast until I’m absolutely shredded and true hunger returns. Go big, right?

I find I get a lot of inspiration when I don’t eat. I’m developing a topical fat loss compound that should be very potent, much better even than my previous iteration, but that I’ll never try to bring to market — just use on clients.

Walked about 5 miles today, enjoyed none of it — cold, windy and damp — but getting fresh air is important. I much prefer the rain, actually I’ll never complain about it, but piles more snow on the way. Luckily it melts fast here.

Walking around downtown and the college I am loathe to run into anyone I know. I’d prefer a vicious stray dog — at least I have an ASP for that.

Academia sucks and I’m glad to be out of it. Walking around the college reminds me how much I hate the beauracracy of it all and how good research is constantly stymied by bean counters and risk management nerds. If I had gotten my way, I’d be running a large scale cancer study using fasting right now on end-stage metastatic patients.
Nice work bro! Your reflection tonight is more positive that previous posts. Day 1/10 fasting done for me.

What are your thoughts on using a sauna during an extended fast? I’m keeping my trace minerals and electrolytes up. Also, anything clinically proven to increase autophagy during a fast? Thinking about doing a dry day or two mixed in
 
THOR 70

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Thanks. Mood is slowly improving. I would say I’ve replaced depression with apathy, which is fine by me.



It’s superb as long as you...



...and don’t overhydrate. Only small sips when you’re thirsty.

I like to apply “magnesium oil” all over my body several times during a long dry sauna. Definitely improves stamina and really pushes the relaxation to the next level.



Clinically proven? Not really...

Dry fasting, light (below lactate threshold) exercise, sunbathing or UV-B tanning beds. Corticosteroids, obviously. Anything that increases free radicals won’t increase autophagy but will increase apoptosis to a net positive effect. Mild stressors.

Sauna should cause a massive acute spike in autophagy due to sharp increase in metabolic rate.

My disc pain is nearly gone, btw.
Awesome suggestions. If I don’t keep magnesium up I noticed my legs get achy and uncomfortable after sauna. I used to use magnesium oil and got away from it when it ran out. Great call on this, I’ll have to get some more and try that.


Glad your mood is improving as back pain diminishing. Keep at it! We are rooting for you
 

Fasted

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Thought about this a lot and apologized to my good friend who I “broke up with” — he was completely cool about it and said he’s 100% behind me.

You’re right. This would be more manageable with the support of a friend and it was a mistake to slash and burn. I only somewhat regret cutting off my brother, but honestly I think it’s been a relief for him.



Been thinking about this a lot too. It’s not a new idea to me, but it’s one that I frequently disregard in favor of blaming circumstances. But the biggest barrier for me is that I miss my son constantly — I have no idea how to think my way around that. All I do is merely survive until the next time I get to see him and feel alive once again. This is not a problem that’s going away any time soon, and I literally have no idea how to solve it.
I got a sister who is not always very easy to deal with. We are so different we can barely communicate. She drives me nuts and i piss her off...and i love her to death! Thats what siblings are. Im sure you and your brother have had plenty of arguments, but he still loves you even if he'll never understand you.

The ice will take your mind off almost anything, but thats just a few minutes. When you do the things it takes to control your breathing and relax your muscles in the ice you are practicing controlling your autonomic nervous system and mind in a way that i dont really know how else youd excersize those things. It sucks to do, but afterwards you feel GREAT. And thats ohysical and mental. You spoke of disk pain, Id love to hear the difference a 2 minute FULL BODY ice bath makes in the next 48 hours for your pain.

As far as what you are going through with your son, im just sorry. My liftin bro's baby mama moved out of state so he couldnt see his kids. He wanted to be a good father. She just wanted the check. Damn shame fathers who want to be there cant. Dont let it make you crazy. Now that i think about it, there should be some form of support group for that kinda thing.

Anyways, its impossible to NOT think about somethimg, but its possible to get focused on something else. Write that book! Get in some ice! Watch some porn! Call your bro! You got this, and youve been killing it so far! Youll feel that downhill slope soon enough.

*hope im not annoying you. Just trying to give you as many possible things i can think of...
 
THOR 70

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Spurfy how has today been?

I thought this was interesting and might shed some light as to some of the mechanism behind the magical 10 day mark. It looks as if gluconeogenesus plateaus around day 10. Is this the point at which autophagy really targets damaged dna and starts to knock out the root of disease? Forgive my non scientific oversimplification/speculation of this I just love to learn

IMG_7328.JPG
 
THOR 70

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Yes, this is my theory and I've seen this chart before.

The 7 day mark is when things really start to take off, but as I've said, 10 days seems to be where the peak magic is and where autophagy and apoptosis really begin to shine. This is also where the fat burning, especially stubborn fat, really seems to accelerate and hot flushes become common.

This is why fasting paradoxically gets easier the longer you go, until the point where bodyfat reserves are exhausted. A fasted body at, for example, day 14 is very efficiently destroying everything that is excess -- bodyfat, scar tissue, tumors, damaged cells, etc. All of these things are converted into fuel or amino acids/collagen for tissue repair.
Awesome and motivating. How are you feeling?
 
THOR 70

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Very full, still, and mood is great. I had forgotten what it was like to be kind to myself. A good friend, a few bowls of a nice stony indica, a buffet of delicious junk food, and laughing at cartoons, was just what I needed.
So therapeutic! I have a theory about drugs, primarily alcohol. The community, mood boosting effects, insane amount of laughter, are hard to measure in a study. these obviously have a ton of benefits. Just can’t make it your crutch to be able to experience these things

I am on day 3 of my fast and am determined to go long with this one. So what I’m gathering is the longer I can go past 10 days the better. You said in the past you determined 10 days the best point for results and compliance. I have plenty of body fat for fuel so I think I may go longer.

I have an stem cell allograft scheduled on the 18th to further assist in correcting this autoimmune stuff I have going on. I’m thinking I might just fast through that and a couple days past to fully focus on healing. What are your thoughts on this? Also I’ve been taking milloxicam for pain and it’s light dmard properties while I overcome this. What are your thoughts about how this would affect my fast results, and my stem cell treatment?
 
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Yes, this is my theory and I've seen this chart before.

The 7 day mark is when things really start to take off, but as I've said, 10 days seems to be where the peak magic is and where autophagy and apoptosis really begin to shine. This is also where the fat burning, especially stubborn fat, really seems to accelerate and hot flushes become common.

This is why fasting paradoxically gets easier the longer you go, until the point where bodyfat reserves are exhausted. A fasted body at, for example, day 14 is very efficiently destroying everything that is excess -- bodyfat, scar tissue, tumors, damaged cells, etc. All of these things are converted into fuel or amino acids/collagen for tissue repair.
Is it recommended that you don’t exercise during one of these long fasts? I’ve only ever done intermittent fasting but I’m starting to get curious about extending it to a day, and then maybe working my way up from there.
 
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Is it recommended that you don’t exercise during one of these long fasts? I’ve only ever done intermittent fasting but I’m starting to get curious about extending it to a day, and then maybe working my way up from there.
Clinically proven? Not really...

Dry fasting, light (below lactate threshold) exercise, sunbathing or UV-B tanning beds. Corticosteroids, obviously. Anything that increases free radicals won’t increase autophagy but will increase apoptosis to a net positive effect. Mild stressors.

Sauna should cause a massive acute spike in autophagy due to sharp increase in metabolic rate.

My disc pain is nearly gone, btw.
His response to exercise
 
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Alcohol is the only way I can completely hide the fact that I have Asperger's in social situations. I can talk with friends, talk with strangers, pick up girls, and do everything else that "normal" people can do socially. Which makes sense, because we Aspie's are hyperanalytical and prone to overstimulation. Dumbing down our brains with alcohol is an easy way to overcome these and present a facade of normalcy *IF* we've already trained ourselves and practiced how to appropriately interact socially -- otherwise we just make fools of ourselves. Basically, alcohol turns down the noise in our brains that distracts us from how we should be speaking, maintaining appropriate eye contact, providing feedback, how our body language should look, and that we should do more listening than speaking.



Yes. The ideal fast is one where you fast until the return of true hunger, which is unmistakable.



10 days should be considered a minimum to reap *all* of the benefits of fasting.



I cannot give you any medical advise on this, I can only tell you that if it was me, I would continue fasting, if for no other reason than to speed healing.



Honestly, around day 10 you'll probably find that your pain and inflammation are (or are nearly) non-existent. How can you hunt if you're constantly hurting?

As to your stem cell treatment? NSAIDs are net destructive (aspirin is an exception) -- if you can get by without using them then I think that would be a very good thing. Honestly, I would ask to be put on a low dose of prednisone (5-10 mg/day) during this time and drop the NSAID, if it were me. But this is just what *I* would do based on the information you've given me. I'm not your doctor and I don't know your complete medical history so nothing I've stated in this post should be construed as medical advise. Obviously, talk with your doctor about all of these things.
I appreciate the “thoughts” and have a steroid on rx if I want it per my physician. Thanks man.
 
enhanced

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I just caught up on this. Things are definitely getting better as the days go by. The knowledge in this thread is absolutely amazing!! Keep at it Spurfy! Your son's love is awesome!!!
 
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Is it recommended that you don’t exercise during one of these long fasts? I’ve only ever done intermittent fasting but I’m starting to get curious about extending it to a day, and then maybe working my way up from there.
Here is my successful weight loss approach and understanding of how to exercise. I did this for four months straight and lost 60 lbs preserving 96% of my lean muscle mass.

My approach when on a low-calorie ketogenic diet (800-1,000 calories per day) is to target exercise intensity between 60%-70% of my maximum heart rate, commonly known as top end of the range of the “fat burning” or “oxidative energy” zone. Anything above 70% will put you in the “glycogenic energy” zone and without glucose/insulin metabolic fuel, your body is more likely to catabolize muscle.

Stay safe! Stay strong!
 
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Spurfy, can you recommend anything for appetite suppression during IF?

I'd like to get to a 4 hour eating window, but I get ravenously hungry during the day..
 
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Been pounding black coffee and I get jittery, but remain pretty hungry...
 
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Spurfy, can you recommend anything for appetite suppression during IF?

I'd like to get to a 4 hour eating window, but I get ravenously hungry during the day..
Been pounding black coffee and I get jittery, but remain pretty hungry...
Be aware its all in your head.
I made a mentally bond between gym and food. No gym = no food. Food is the reward after gym. On "Off days" (no gym) , its a bit harder.
 
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Spurfy, can you recommend anything for appetite suppression during IF?

I'd like to get to a 4 hour eating window, but I get ravenously hungry during the day..
The answer to your question is literally in his first post of this thread. Please read thoroughly to not dilute the valuable information in this thread
 
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Lol copy that...sorry sir
 
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Awesome. You've got this!

One day at at time.
 
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Started fasting today. My disc pain has been horrible and all-over inflammation is very high.

Not much else to say, except that I probably will not have another meal until sometime in April.

I took a bunch of before pics and pulled no punches. Bright lights and fullly in frame. I really look like sh*t right now. It’s *amazing* how quickly fat piles on when you’re injured, sedentary, comfort eating, taking opioids for pain, and taking corticosteroids for inflammation.

I’ll try to keep a daily log going.
I'm eager to see what improvements you'll get out of fasting! The theoretical part is sorted out, now comes the practical approach.

 
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Started fasting today. My disc pain has been horrible and all-over inflammation is very high.

Not much else to say, except that I probably will not have another meal until sometime in April.

I took a bunch of before pics and pulled no punches. Bright lights and fullly in frame. I really look like sh*t right now. It’s *amazing* how quickly fat piles on when you’re injured, sedentary, comfort eating, taking opioids for pain, and taking corticosteroids for inflammation.

I’ll try to keep a daily log going.
Hang in there. What is your longest fast?
 
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10 days, but those were always cut short due to pressure from the (now-ex) wife. In no way did I feel the need to eat when I broke those fasts, but...

Sometimes it’s just better not to fight, especially when your wife is crazy.

I’m serious when I say that I am *fat* right now. This is the fattest I’ve ever been. Looking back, I was probably eating about 5000 calories a day while being sedentary and this was immediately following (actually very tail end of) my TE/NPP/Mast bulk, where I was already putting on fat without worry in anticipation of fasting when it warms up, and I can tell that the corticosteroids have wrecked my insulin sensitivity. A few weeks ago I had a fasting BG of 119, where I’m normally 75.
Yeah I’m fat too. Always struggled with weight. Was 275 in college as a thrower, got down to 219 and could see abs post collegiate. I was 268 prior to my first 5 day fast a few weeks ago. Now on day 6 which is a a record for me and down in the low 240’s.

I’m really fascinated by the “true hunger” you describe. I’m wondering if this occurs when bodyfat gets so low, or a specific micronutrient runs out and the body is screaming for it. If it’s running out of fat for fuel, then I can probably go for a long time. Prob around 17% bf.

It will be interesting to see how this fast goes for you since you have ample fuel on you. Prob will be super hard at first as your body works through all the external inputs and your injuries.

Question about hydration. I’ve been drinking mineral/electrolyte water only when I feel thirsty. My urine has been pretty dark and very strong smelling. I also have 1-2 small loose bowel movements during the day. Am I under hydrating? I’m just wondering for cleaning toxins and broken down waste tissue if chugging water one or two day would be beneficial.

Thinking about doing something like chugging a gallon of distilled water before noon, then focus on sipping very rich electrolyte water the rest of the day. Thoughts?

Also, I had a weird breakout all over my back. My wife and I had never seen anything like it before, even when I was on a gram of test and had some backne. Almost looked like chicken pox. Thinking it was a detox reaction or something.
 
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Keep going. This is quality weight loss and as I've said before, any muscle you lose during fasting comes back very very quickly once you start eating and lifting again.



My understanding is that during prolonged fasting, ghrelin is essentially completely suppressed. Once bodyfat levels reach whatever your genes say is "critically low", ghrelin massively surges and does not reduce.

The "critically low" bodyfat levels for most people will be in the 5-10% range, but unless you're an Inuit I see no reason why any man can't get and hold sub-10% bodyfat through fasting and then specific eating patterns. This "critically low" level is the signal that you no longer have enough bodyfat to meet your caloric needs and that organ and lean tissue destruction is imminent. The body will burn through skeletal muscle and then cardiac muscle when skeletal muscle is exhausted, at which point you die.



It should be pretty easy, actually. The fatter you are the more your body "wants" you to fast, metabolically speaking.



If you're not walking around thirsty then you're properly hydrated. You can cheat your way to quicker fat loss by overhydrating followed by recharging electrolytes (since you're flushing ketones that will not be used as fuel), but I don't recommend this at all since the risks far outweigh the benefits.

You might want to try a short overhydration *WITH* electrolytes, because you do have signs of what I would call "toxic overload"

The majority of very nasty environmental toxins (mercury, PCBs, pthalates, etc) are easily stored in adipocytes. When you fast these toxins are released and can cause low-grade chemical poisoning. You also may be experiencing a Jarisch–Herxheimer reaction, which is caused by toxins produced from the lysis of harmful bacteria. Probably both.

Try drinking a bit more water.
Great info as always. I think I will give this a shot. I did a turpentine detox and I think I created a cytokines storm and my liver wasn’t able to process. Would diatomaceous earth be smart am and PM to try and pull any toxins?
 
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You'd be in the hospital if you had a cytokine storm -- this is a life-threatening condition and you'd feel the worst you've ever felt, like the worst alcohol hangover (which is mostly caused by pro-inflammatory cytokines, not dehydration as most people think) x 1000.

There's not really much I think you can do that your body isn't already going to be doing to rid yourself of these toxins. Stay hydrated, keep up your electrolytes, get enough sleep, and get fresh air/sunlight.

You may want to take a selenium supplement to assist in protecting against the detoxification of mercury (this is actually the mechanism of mercury toxicity -- selenium depletion).

I take high dose melatonin when I fast (20-30 mg/night) to help protect against the neurotoxic effects of all of these chemical nasties. You could give that a shot.
Good to know. I’ve been taking 60mcg selenium BID
 
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Update

Starting weight (3/2): 222.8 lbs
Today's weight (3/13): 205.6 lbs

I may or may not have utilized various tools in my arsenal of knowledge to facilitate this rapid weight loss.

Muscles are still very full.
Spurfy poppin Clen, T3, and bath salts behind the scenes! ?

Im day 7 and can’t do much physical else I gas. Upped my water/electrolytes but it seems to go through my GI.

How is your mood/outlook?
 
hairygrandpa

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Update

Starting weight (3/2): 222.8 lbs
Today's weight (3/13): 205.6 lbs

I may or may not have utilized various tools in my arsenal of knowledge to facilitate this rapid weight loss.

Muscles are still very full.
You lost 17 pounds in 11 days?



 

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