Sostenol
- Thread starter VanillaGorilla
- Start date
- Status
BigMattTx
Active member
Im not surprised that you are able to do this without serious health risks. I just finished up a 3 weeker of SD (day 2 of PCT) and I felt good the entire time. I did feel the decrease in cardio towards the end but that wasnt until week 3 and no sides other than and lethargy.
pistonpump
Banned
i have a feeling GR doesnt have a source or has issues with legality.
GotRipped, how much muscle would you say you have gained since the start of 2006? Im just curious to see how much you actually keep doing the seesaw and everything....
GotRipped, how much muscle would you say you have gained since the start of 2006? Im just curious to see how much you actually keep doing the seesaw and everything....
gotripped
Banned
Around..... April or so. I was running a 2 weeker of the original AX Phera-Plex to test it out. Then mid-summer I ran TRN/Zol... did my load blowers log to get back to normal (Get my weiner a workin) then once I was back I ran some superdrol PP Halo TRN Zol. Mostly trying out Pulsing techniques. Ya might wanna do a search on pulsing. The weight gain from 175-180 was from TRN/ZOL. The Short amount of PP I ran in April was for swimming as I was cutting down and building up a strength/cardio base. The TRN/ZOL that should have been a cutter went to a bulk that I never gained much on but 5lbs. Then the SD/PP was a definite bulk that made me go from 180 to 190. And the Halo/TRN was a 5 lb addition to make it to 195.
Fact is with designers ya gotta reaaaaaaaaaallly push it and have your diet in check. I could probably have gained alot more if I wouldn't mess around with things like Halo/TRN/ZoL and just stuck to Phera/SD. Now there's always Running SD and IGF-1 which is always a good one. But the fact is the cardio is killing my gains. I can't run on SD and yet I have to run somewhat. (Not to my own liking)
Fact is with designers ya gotta reaaaaaaaaaallly push it and have your diet in check. I could probably have gained alot more if I wouldn't mess around with things like Halo/TRN/ZoL and just stuck to Phera/SD. Now there's always Running SD and IGF-1 which is always a good one. But the fact is the cardio is killing my gains. I can't run on SD and yet I have to run somewhat. (Not to my own liking)
gotripped
Banned
The Breakdown
I really didn't care about Sostenol but It might be worth a run.
70mg.
50mg of Halo (Methandrol-50)
10mg of SD (Oxodrol-12) 2a, 17a-dimethyl-17b-Hydroxy-5a-androstan-3-one
10mg of PP (WebbPharm's PP) 17a-methyl-etioallocholan-2-ene-17b-ol
Serving Size: 2 Capsules
Servings Per Container: 30
That's a 2 week Cycle. 15 Days. I'd need 2 bottles to run it effectively. At that price I'd rather go buy the designers separately in their generic version.
I really didn't care about Sostenol but It might be worth a run.
70mg.
50mg of Halo (Methandrol-50)
10mg of SD (Oxodrol-12) 2a, 17a-dimethyl-17b-Hydroxy-5a-androstan-3-one
10mg of PP (WebbPharm's PP) 17a-methyl-etioallocholan-2-ene-17b-ol
Serving Size: 2 Capsules
Servings Per Container: 30
That's a 2 week Cycle. 15 Days. I'd need 2 bottles to run it effectively. At that price I'd rather go buy the designers separately in their generic version.
VanillaGorilla
Active member
My advice to read up on why you shouldn't stack two methyls together let alone three. If you bothered to read about it you would see some times the liver problems can happen a while after the cycle not just during.I would also read up on what the liver does because taking relatively unresearched products can mess with the various functions of the liver. It's not just your liver shutting down. It cholesterol, controling blood sugar ( if you remember a few people were complaining about this on m1t), regulates fat storage ect. Lets just say you get 20 - 40% more gains taking this but get 200% more side affects. Do you really think that's worth it? What if you fine for a few years but you body has a major problem regulating blood sugar. How about your immune system? Do you think it's worth it? The answer is no. You are going to stack three methylated compounds together and your not going to bother reading about why you should stack two of them together? If you guys want to mess with this that's your business but the fact you don't know some of this is scary. This is why supplements get banned.
BigMattTx
Active member
I personally have never seen an actual study on how much more dangerous it is to stack orals as opposed to just taking a higher dosage of one.
And I hope that is not directed towards gotripped cause he has more oral cycle experience then almost anyone here and he gets his blood checked.
And I hope that is not directed towards gotripped cause he has more oral cycle experience then almost anyone here and he gets his blood checked.
VanillaGorilla
Active member
I know one person who is stacking Superdrol and halodrol together. He put on 30 lbs. Pretty cool huh? However, just the other day he was having heart palpitations. HMMMMMMMMM Lets see 30 lbs vs. heart problems for the rest of your life? Tough choice. These supplements are steroids. The meathead philosophy of more is better with these newer generation of supplements is going to get people into trouble. God gave you a brain for a reason I suggest you use it.
BigMattTx
Active member
VanillaGorilla said:
Hey man..I agree with you but lets just go with what we know to be fact. You don't know that he will have permanent health issues just because he is getting heart palpitations on cycle. superdrol/HD doesnt sound safe to me and superdrol/PP/HD is even scarier but all I'm saying is theres no telling how bad it is for your liver.
gotripped is living proof that you can run these compounds safely and have everything check out to be OK on bloodwork.
Your quotes bring up very good points however, I still believe that the hepatoxicity and other dangers of these new orals is somewhat overexaggerated.
Regardless, I have recently decided to switch to injectibles and it just sounds way safer overall to me. Less worries about lipids/liver, you can be on cycle for much longer plus the gains should be easier to retain since you body has time to adapt to the new mass.
VanillaGorilla
Active member
We don't know that it won't cause any health problems either do we?
Do you have any studies to back that up at all? Or are you just taking the word of one guy on the internet? What if he has some health problems a few years from now? What if there is someone else who did the exact same thing he did but does end up coming back with a bad blood profile?
VanillaGorilla
Active member
There is quite a dichotomy from the mainstream say all steroids are bad and from the BB community that says all steroids are good. Is taking one methylated compound for a month a few times a year going to kill you? Probably not. Is stacking three of them together? Maybe or it could set you up to have health problems later. The point is both sides are wrong. Steroids used sensibly aren't that bad for you but steroids that are abused are bad for you. The fact that people are considering stacking three methylated compound together with absolutely no knowledge about why you shouldn't stack two together is just plain idiotic.
B5150
Legend
For the most part you are in the midths of debating a mortality issue with those who believe they are invincible...the youth.
On you behalf VG, I have bumped this old one Invalid Link Removed
There has been a recenet surge of ignorance or at least denial by the niave or optomistic youth who have access to previously legal OTC AAS.
On you behalf VG, I have bumped this old one Invalid Link Removed
There has been a recenet surge of ignorance or at least denial by the niave or optomistic youth who have access to previously legal OTC AAS.
VanillaGorilla
Active member
WTF Happen to this board 5150? It seems like a year ago someone who was taking or even thinking about taking three methyls would have been disemboweled in here.
B5150
Legend
They will be disembowled at autopsies in morgues and mortuaries sooner than later :whip:
I started that thread before I became moderator/administrator. I have my own children's lives to protect. I grew tired of banging my head against inanimate things some time ago :frustrate:
You try and try and none will listen. After all "gotripped is living proof that you can run these compounds safely and have everything check out to be OK on bloodwork."
It works for MattHines!!!
EDIT: Apparently I have become very cynical :yawn:
I started that thread before I became moderator/administrator. I have my own children's lives to protect. I grew tired of banging my head against inanimate things some time ago :frustrate:
You try and try and none will listen. After all "gotripped is living proof that you can run these compounds safely and have everything check out to be OK on bloodwork."
It works for MattHines!!!
EDIT: Apparently I have become very cynical :yawn:
gotripped
Banned
Ah **** son. I'm not saying everyone else should do what I am doing. That is of my own choices and decisions. Generally, I would not run three compounds together, but I nevertheless with blatant disregard did it anyways. Not all at once but nevertheless three methyls. Sure I haven't had any heart palpitations, no health problems have arisen just yet. Nevertheless as I continue on I will be more conservative with my cycle selections. In fact, I will most likely just run Test E/superdrol cycles as the compounds like Halodrol, Phera, and SD while being effective, are also not completely long-term health effective.
VanillaGorilla
Active member
The problem is people do read your experiences and think it's ok. An 18 year old with the philosophy of " totally extreme bro" look at what you post and may try to one up you. They think if three methyls work 4 must be better or at least think stacking two is ok because nothing happened to you. The problem is what you if have a health issue a year from now and don't post that you do in here, how are they going to know? Also it did even occur to you that stacking two methyls isn't very good for you or to bother reading about it. Which tells me that you really shouldn't be taking anything at all. These compounds are not vitamin C they are drugs .
BigMattTx
Active member
VanillaGorilla said:
I agree but whats even worse are the ones that take superdrol because it was available at the local supp store with NO knowledge of PCT or that they are even taking a steroid. As you said, the youth have an "invincible" type mindset and some guy advising against it will not stop them from taking it once their mind is set on it.
I agree though...stacking methyls is playing with fire. It is obvious that this product--Sostenol was intended to spread by word of mouth of the youth. Anyone that knows what they are doing would likely avoid it at all costs.
pistonpump
Banned
yah I cant see how they put this kind of stuff on actual shelves. Online with a credit card at some sites I can see but at your local supp store? uhhh uh :nono: PCT and liver protection is so important along with a bunch of other things that some guys that take this know NOTHING about! unfortunate.
gotripped
Banned
VG all are viable of course. However, it's my own experiences. If an 18 year old wants to one up me than that's a different thing all together. I just had my PHA or Physical Health Assessment today. They said my liver was that of a "19 year olds". The liver values were at 32 for AST and ALT. Now it's not a good description, but this is my own personal experience. Obviously, you don't want to die over internet advice, but if this is going to cause harm to AM by influencing 18 year olds (as how could not any logs of aas not influence teens?) Then I will not log any of my taboo cycles. And actually I won't be running 3 methyls in one cycle any longer. From now on I'll be sticking to Superdrol/Phera-Plex/Test E for cycle combinations along with IGF-1 and B12.
VanillaGorilla
Active member
gotripped
Banned
I'm pretty aware that BOTH superdrol and phera are methylated. I'm not going to stop using them just because of that. But I'm not going to be stacking three methyls together. I might overlap Superdrol and Phera and close out with Superdrol. But there's no REASON to not cycle with those products when you take time off. Sure I've done a large amount of cycling in the past 3 months, but my liver values are unaffected post cycle. Dianabol, Winstrol, Halotestin, Anavar, Anadrol are all used by Pros, Regular Body builders and Powerlifters. I will agree to disagree with you on this subject. And quit it at that. Our opinions will always be different. Best of luck to your education program of other newcomers to AAS.
VanillaGorilla
Active member
here is more
VanillaGorilla
Active member
There is some sound reasoning. Maybe you should do a search of the pro's that have health problems or dropped dead. Also, more are known about the steriods you listed than the new ones like superdrol.
I posted several reasons why you shouldn't stack two methyls. I also posted several reasons why it's not about taking time off. So far your only reasoning is that you have had blood work done. Yet, blood work doesn't show hepatic angiosarcoma or adenomas. So far you have shown four things.
1. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
2. You should not be posting this on message boards.
3. Instead of "large amount of cycling in the past 3 months" you should have been doing a large amount of researching on the subject.
4. You should not be using anything at this point.
The meathead philosophy is going to get people hurt and supplements banned.
Innings Eater
Member
Um.....so let me get this straight........
Sostenol or any oral stacked methyls wouldn't really be very healthy to feed to my two sons, "Walker", and "TexasRanger"?
:nutkick:
Sostenol or any oral stacked methyls wouldn't really be very healthy to feed to my two sons, "Walker", and "TexasRanger"?
:nutkick:
pistonpump
Banned
:icon_lol:Innings Eater said:
SrT4u2Nv
Member
Off Topic but even though these local stores sell them (halo,superdrol,Phera) they tell people their perfectly safe and dont need Post Cycle. I hear them tell people (as well as myself) thats its fine all the time. And this is two local stores. Ive seen high school kids buy two or three bottles of superdrol and just leave thikning its ok and they'll be huge in 2 months...
The Insanity of Ignorance!
The Insanity of Ignorance!
xtraflossy
Board Supporter
I just want to throw my 0.02 in (mainly becasue Im at work, have nothing to do and it's Friday
Stacking 3 methyls shouldnt be the main concern,.. in concept.
If I take 5mg PP, 5 mg superdrol and 5mg HD,.. totaling 15mg methyl compound,... then than the total compound (or methyllated product) is less then that of 1 dose of HD-50
Now,.. some people will do 30-40 mg superdrol, and the like. And it's ok becasue their bigger then most?
Im NOT saying that it is completely safe,.. Im also not intending to fully understand all ther eis to know on the subject, but relesing a product like this is a kitchen sink approach anyways.
Lets not forget and act like the only methyl's out there are OTC steroids. There are antibiotics that are methylated. And they come in MUCH larger doses (per day) and are intended to be taken for something like 2-4 weeks.
I think the bigger issue is with prolonged use of larger doses of ANY steroid.
In addition, would it be any "safer" in anyones mind (or would you tell someone to go ahead with) for a Phera, TRN and ZOL cycle (all compounds at the same time)?
I dont have an answer for the above
Is it the fact that their methylated OVER us really not knowing long term/other effects of these designer steroids.
I would (personally) be more conserned about not knowing what Im putting in my body over the fact that it's a methyl.
These are just my thoughts on what I have read.:dump:
Stacking 3 methyls shouldnt be the main concern,.. in concept.
If I take 5mg PP, 5 mg superdrol and 5mg HD,.. totaling 15mg methyl compound,... then than the total compound (or methyllated product) is less then that of 1 dose of HD-50
Now,.. some people will do 30-40 mg superdrol, and the like. And it's ok becasue their bigger then most?
Im NOT saying that it is completely safe,.. Im also not intending to fully understand all ther eis to know on the subject, but relesing a product like this is a kitchen sink approach anyways.
Lets not forget and act like the only methyl's out there are OTC steroids. There are antibiotics that are methylated. And they come in MUCH larger doses (per day) and are intended to be taken for something like 2-4 weeks.
I think the bigger issue is with prolonged use of larger doses of ANY steroid.
In addition, would it be any "safer" in anyones mind (or would you tell someone to go ahead with) for a Phera, TRN and ZOL cycle (all compounds at the same time)?
I dont have an answer for the above
Is it the fact that their methylated OVER us really not knowing long term/other effects of these designer steroids.
I would (personally) be more conserned about not knowing what Im putting in my body over the fact that it's a methyl.
These are just my thoughts on what I have read.:dump:
stxnas
Well-known member
xtraflossy said:
Actually...from what I have read here on the board 1+1 doesn't equal two when adding methyls...
I don't know the science behind this, but I'm pretty sure that I've read some posts from a certain clown that stated methyls don't add up that way. I'll see if I can find the thread.
This should be self evident in the fact that people take H50 in amounts of 50mg, 75mg, 100mg...Try SD in that amount and then listen to your liver scream...I'm assuming the base compound probably has a lot to do with the toxicity in addition to it being methylated (or vice versa)...I could be wrong though. NOTE: PLEASE DON'T TAKE 100MG OF SD! LOL.
xtraflossy
Board Supporter
stxnas said:
I wasn't tring to make that point... I appoligize if I misspoke.
When their not adding up like 1+1=2, who's to say that 20 mg of a mixed compound daily is any better or worse then 50mg of a single compound....
I remember that thred your refering to. I think it involved taking Ergomax and Phera.
BigMattTx
Active member
VanillaGorilla said:
Wow! First I thought you were trying to help but now you go attacking him! gotripped is one of the vets on these boards...he knows his ****.
As to your comment about the metabolites, let just say that you are taking 10mg of SD and 10mg of PP verus just taking 20mg of SD. in theory, you would have twice as many different metabolites, but half as many of each.
And you say that bloodwork is no sign of hepatic angiosarcoma or adenomas. You just can't win! Doctors use bloodwork to determine overall health...and you are saying that bloodwork alone is not adequate??? What do you suggest one should do to determine liver health then?
B5150
Legend
Whether someone is a 'vet' or not is not the issue. What makes someone a vet. Suppose a vet told you otherwise. You have heard the opinion and voives of other vets but determine that because one is in agreement and the other is not that the one you agree with has credibility and the other does not. I'm a vet by age and by tenure on the board. Why is not my opinion more valid than gotripped?MattHines said:
Regardless. You/we are all putting ourselfs at considerable health risks using orals. No one knows the longterm health risk there is associated with these steroids.
This is purely ignorant and boarders stupidity:
Proprietary Blend 70000mcg
4-Androstene-4-chloro-17a-methyl-3b,17b-diol,
2á, 17á-dimethyl-17â-hydroxy-5á-androstan-3-one,
17á-methyl-17â-hydroxy-5á-androst-2-ene
BTW: MattHines where are YOUR bloodwork results?
xtraflossy
Board Supporter
stxnas said:
lol- And my first cycle in quite a few years was SD + Ergo :dance:
YEah,.. I know how my liver SREAMED at me (but not when taking the SD+ergo) when I got a really bad infection and was prescribed antibiotics... which turned out to be methylated!! (of course, I dropped my dosing drasticly on both SD+ergo when I took my antibiotic).
I mean, I was in pain anyways,.. but I could practicly feel my liver tring to rip a hole through my side to get the hell out ! :fool2:
Anyways,.. vendors are not always going to come out with the safest products. Especially in this industry, It needs to be up to the consumer to weigh the risk / bennifit ratio on all these products.
Unfortunitely, like myself before finding my way to AM, I thought I had all the information that I needed.
HE who knows he knows nothing, knows everything...
OH- and I DO remember the craziest -ish!
(good for relationships,.... now if I could just remember the truly important things):aargh:
VanillaGorilla
Active member
What is this body building.com? If you bothered to read up on this stuff you would see that's not how it works.
Are you kidding me? You are compairing anti botics to steriods? Not all methylation equates to being hard on your liver. Cafine is methylated and not hard on your liver at all. You are compairing apples to oranges. You also don't know what you talking about either. Instead of throwing your 2 cents in you should be reading about this stuff.
VanillaGorilla
Active member
If got ripped thinks stacking two methyls is ok, hasn't bothered to read about why you shouldn't stack two methyls, ignored the posts I made about why you shouldn't stack two methyls, and has no rebuttal to anything I posted other than he got a liver test he doesn't know what he is talking about. Just because someone does many cycles doesn't mean he knows anything. I could give a rats ass about how many cycles he has done the fact is he is wrong. Not only is he wrong he is posting on here and people think he knows and he doesn't. That is dangerous. The fact he ignored everything I said and isn't even remotely curious about reading more also says something.
You theory is flat out wrong. That's not how it works and please stop repeating that BS. Some 18 year old is going to read that and think it's ok and it's not.
That was coming from bobo who most people who read this board are aware is one of the few people in the bodybuilding message board waste land who KNOWS WHAT HE IS TALKING ABOUT.
VanillaGorilla
Active member
Yet, blood work doesn't show every thing does it? So that point is wrong. The bottom line is stacking two methyls is flat out dangerious. If you want to believe that it's not that great but don't spread the garbage in here because it's wrong. If you want to ignore what I posted and aren't intellectly curious enough to look into it more that's fine too but don't come on here and try to come off like you know what your talking about. and this posts prove it
VanillaGorilla
Active member
I couldn't have said it better...........
xtraflossy
Board Supporter
VanillaGorilla said:
REALLY!... I am aware that this is not BB.com,..We JUST went throught this!.. you need to read through things before you decide to start throwing your... -sigh- Nevermind,..
VanillaGorilla said:
Ok- this one just deserves a straight just STFU :FUfinger:
Comparing the 2,.. no. one gets ya big, one gets ya well (oh crap,.. perhaps I should mention that was kind of a joke before you pop a vein or something)
I have read about the subject. I am also NOT a doctor.
I am aware not all methylation is hard on your liver,.. (sips coffee). What I was really saying is that there are so many unknowns as to what everything equates to in regards to OTC anabolics. And when things don't add up anyways, who says your math is any better.
I admit,.. I have a way of viewing multipul sides to issues, but I beleive that has more to do with being open minded to all reasonable information.
BigMattTx
Active member
xtraflossy said:
That was exactly my point!
Id think it would be common sense that stacking two steroids that are methylated (and hard on liver/lipids) together would not be good idea. Stacking 3 seems like it would be even worse.
However, I do think it is good to view all sides of it to see if this is really the case. There is no conclusive scientific proof that stacking two at half dose is any safer or more dangerous than taking twice the amount of just 1 steroid.
Vanilla, your info is broology at best. Sure, its from some very knoweledgeable people but it is mostly speculation.
pistonpump
Banned
wow. thats all i can say......WOW!
VanillaGorilla
Active member
Is there multiple ways of viewing 2+2 X? Stacking two methyls is bad. As far as I know the pros don't even do it. You post again shows that you don't know what you are talking about and should not be commenting on this subject. Ignorance is one thing but the inability to learn or look into things is just flat out stupidity.
VanillaGorilla
Active member
What side is any one else presenting. The I had a liver test done so stacking two methyls is ok view? No conclusive proof? You haven't even bothered to do a search about why you shouldn't stack methyls and ignored everything I posted. Are you trying to tell me you have been looking into scientific data on the subject? Your argument is meathead got a liver test so it's ok but any other points of why it's not ok are met with well that's just another opinion. So my info. is based on speculation but yours isn't? So basically I might be right and you might be wrong. If that's the case you are setting your self up for problems down the road. If it is not known isn't it better to side on the caution? The problem is you aren't posting anything to back your view point are you. The things you have posted is wrong. Taking 10 mg of superdrol and 10 mg. of any other is not the same as 20 mg of superdrol. Sometimes the metabolites are more toxic than the parent hormone. The fact that you flat out don't care to learn more about this, are just going to ignore it and keep what your doing, thinking this is just a matter of differing opinions, commenting on a subject that you don't know anything about is the apotheosis of stupidity. What's going to happen is some jackass is going to think the way you do and come down with a serious health problem. Guess what's going to happen then? Goodbye to all the crap you are taking. What you are agreeing is like saying it's ok to take triple the amount of ephedrine than what is recommended or my uncled smoked for 30 years and didn't have any problems. When someone points out that you are wrong you say meathead did that and he didn't die and you are just presenting a different opinion. You might think I am nit picking but the bottom line is I am preventing someone from making the same mistake you are making. Stacking methyls is a horrible idea and everyone with half a brain in their head knows this.
BigMattTx
Active member
That is not my opinion at all, Vanilla. If you track back to my posts and reread them you will see:
I personally think that stacking methyls is dangerous. I am not arguing that stacking is just as safe as taking twice the dosage but just using one steroid..All I was trying to do is get all sides of it.
I don't have any factual proof and neither do you--thats my point. We dont know what the truth is. Both sides of it present speculation based on some facts that we know to be true (such as the fact that different steroids have different metabolites).
MattHines said:
I personally think that stacking methyls is dangerous. I am not arguing that stacking is just as safe as taking twice the dosage but just using one steroid..All I was trying to do is get all sides of it.
I don't have any factual proof and neither do you--thats my point. We dont know what the truth is. Both sides of it present speculation based on some facts that we know to be true (such as the fact that different steroids have different metabolites).
- Status