I used to be one of the "ego lifters" but I dont care anymore i've started lifting 6-12 reps and I have experienced much better gains than before when i used to do 5-8 Here is a poll what do you guys think?
It also improves your technique throughout the lift. You can't have good TUT with ****ty form.Fully agree with Rodja. I started focusing on a TUT routine and experienced huge results. Personally I like incorporating TUT principles and mixing it up with more "athletic" type training to both keep the body guessing (more growth aand progression) and incorporate it with a lot of real life things.
I wouldn't start Max-OT during a cut, though. I am a big fan of the program, but it is not the type of lifting that you will want to begin while in a kcal deficit.I stick to 4-6 reps. I used to do 8-10 reps like you are talking about and made gains but very very slowly.
I started the Max 0T program and I put on 15 lbs and added alot of weight to my lifts in about 12 weeks.
and when I say 4-6 reps I mean that you are overloading your muscles by using a weight that is light enough to do atleast 4 reps but heavy enough that you CAN NOT do more than 6 reps.
Even if you are cutting you should still be lifting the same way. It's your deit that gets adjusted.
This is Max OT in a nutshell:
4-6 reps
2-3 minutes rest in between
6-9 heavy sets per muscle group
1-2 muscle groups trained a day
5-7 days rest between training a certain muscle part
8-9 weeks of training and then you take a week off
30-45 minute workouts. The idea is short but intense vs. long and drawn out.
alot of this goes against what you see most people doing in the gym...with supersetting and burnout sets etc.
But for a hardgainer like myself I found this program to be just what the doctor ordered.
and as for "ego lifters." I'm not really sure what that means. Sure there are guys who like to do low reps simply because they value the weight they can lift more than the shaping of their physique but that doesn't mean that everyone that sticks to this rep range is doing this so that they can pump their chest at how much weight they can put up.
I lift this way simply because I've found that for my body type it is the most efficient and productive weigh to slap on muscle mass.
Like my friend who's an absolute monster and who basically got me into "truly lifting" likes to say: "The weight you can put up is just a number. Sure it can tell you that you are making gains and you need to be increasing the weight you do periodically in order to make gains. But when it comes down to it, would you rather be the guy who can bench 400 lbs. or the guy who looks like he can bench 400 lbs.?"
really? I haven't really tried it on a cut yet. But in the program it clearly emphasizes that you should keep lifting heavy and "overloading" your muscles in order to keep strength and muscle mass while losing as much fat as possible.I wouldn't start Max-OT during a cut, though. I am a big fan of the program, but it is not the type of lifting that you will want to begin while in a kcal deficit.
I agree that your training should not be altered too much while cutting, but you shouldn't try a physically and mentally demanding routine while cutting.really? I haven't really tried it on a cut yet. But in the program it clearly emphasizes that you should keep lifting heavy and "overloading" your muscles in order to keep strength and muscle mass while losing as much fat as possible.
Like I said I haven't tried it on a cut yet but I intend to. I've tried cutting before and doing the whole high rep thing and usually I just lose a ton of muscle along with the fat. So will see what happens.
So how would you change the program when cutting?I agree that your training should not be altered too much while cutting, but you shouldn't try a physically and mentally demanding routine while cutting.
A routine like 5x5 I feel like unless your mega dosing BCAAs or have a recovery agent/cortisol blocker in your arsenal that your body would really wear out/feel the effects of over training very quickly in a cal deficit. Cortisol would be in the back of my mind every day if I were to attempt something like that.really? I haven't really tried it on a cut yet. But in the program it clearly emphasizes that you should keep lifting heavy and "overloading" your muscles in order to keep strength and muscle mass while losing as much fat as possible.
Like I said I haven't tried it on a cut yet but I intend to. I've tried cutting before and doing the whole high rep thing and usually I just lose a ton of muscle along with the fat. So will see what happens.
I wouldn't change it too much, but I would try it for 8 weeks or so while at maintenance or a slight kcal excess. After that, I would take a week and the begin again, but at a 10% kcal deficit. The main thing I would do is increase the rep range to 4-8 per set.So how would you change the program when cutting?
yeah but Max OT is not really 5 by 5. 5x5 would mean you are doing 5 sets of each exercise. That's not Max OT.A routine like 5x5 I feel like unless your mega dosing BCAAs or have a recovery agent/cortisol blocker in your arsenal that your body would really wear out/feel the effects of over training very quickly in a cal deficit. Cortisol would be in the back of my mind every day if I were to attempt something like that.
I don't know that I would be dropping my cals 10 percent right away. I'd probably be starting out at maintenance level for 4 weeks or so and get a solid recomp and then start slowly lowering the calories. I agree that immediatley dropping my cals from 3800( bulking) to 3420( -10 percent) would be pretty drastic to keep that kind of lifting program going.I wouldn't change it too much, but I would try it for 8 weeks or so while at maintenance or a slight kcal excess. After that, I would take a week and the begin again, but at a 10% kcal deficit. The main thing I would do is increase the rep range to 4-8 per set.
What's a good routine during a cut to hold on to muscle? More of a dogcrapp routine? I'd assume you have to keep the weights heavy.I wouldn't start Max-OT during a cut, though. I am a big fan of the program, but it is not the type of lifting that you will want to begin while in a kcal deficit.
Too much microtrauma for restricted calories. I'd lift in rep ranges that build muscle for you, focus on increasing strength, and don't do very slow negatives.What's a good routine during a cut to hold on to muscle? More of a dogcrapp routine? I'd assume you have to keep the weights heavy.
Right on. That's what I'm saying. Whatever method of training works best for you in building muscle should be the method of training you employ in order to maintain muslce when cutting.Too much microtrauma for restricted calories. I'd lift in rep ranges that build muscle for you, focus on increasing strength, and don't do very slow negatives.
Isn't that essentially option 3? Also I think a lot of people have dabbled with muscle confusion.I didn't vote simply because the answer is none.
The best rep range is the one you're not doing.
Your body will respond well to inconsistent training. I don't mean skipping 2 workouts in a row for no reason. I mean, lifting with different intensity, rep ranges and so on. What you shouldn't change too much is the total number of reps. 24-50 total reps per muscle group is the hypertrophy zone.
You have all probably changed your routine and found that your gains from doing this routine were much better than before. Why is this? Because your body has something completely different it needs to adapt to.
I won't go into detail here because if you really want to know about this you'll research it yourselves. However, I challenge you all to switch up your routine dramatically and see what happens. For example: switch from 3x8 to 10x3.
well said, but TUT is something you have to vary, and relenquish in cycles as it is hell on your joints, and can stagnate fast twitch muscle fiber
I didn't vote simply because the answer is none.
The best rep range is the one you're not doing.
Your body will respond well to inconsistent training. I don't mean skipping 2 workouts in a row for no reason. I mean, lifting with different intensity, rep ranges and so on. What you shouldn't change too much is the total number of reps. 24-50 total reps per muscle group is the hypertrophy zone.
You have all probably changed your routine and found that your gains from doing this routine were much better than before. Why is this? Because your body has something completely different it needs to adapt to.If getting bigger was as simple as changing up your routine often don't you think there would be less argument about this.
the reason there is such a discrepancy between some people saying less reps and other saying more is three fold:
1) everyone's body responds differently. Certian routines work for person A and fail miserabley for person B. A routine that works for a mesomorth may not work for an ectomorph. I think we can all agree on that much.
2)like you said people think program B works great simply because it is a change from program A and they made gains because of the change.
3) Diet. When working out on routine A the person may be following a much better diet with increased calories but by the time they move to workout routine B they have not increased there calories in a while and thus are not making gains anymore. Diet really has more to do with gains than the program if you ask me.
As for saying that the best rep range is the range you are not doing may be true in the short term. But I'm a believer that there is a certain rep range that works best overall for most people for the most extended periods of time.
As for creating variety you can achieve this by other means than simply changing your rep schemes. How about different movements/exercises. Dumbells instead of barbells etc.
For me..if you are trying to add mass the most efficient and best place to start is in the 4-6 rep range. I might change it up once and a while but for the most part for me that's the range where I've far and away experienced the quickest and greatest gains.
Change is great.As for the best range,Doug,imo their all best.2 reps hit a different muscle fiber then 20 reps.Lower reps increase strength more,and higher reps produce better pumps.While a happy medium will do both.So i vote for 1-20 for upper and 1-50 possibly 100(from what i've seen) for legs.I don't know about you guys, but I vary my program every 2 months or so to keep the body from adapting. It's kind of strange but I've noticed the biggest gains I've made are using heavy weight 75-85% for 6-8reps or going lighter 65-75% using 12-15reps. Why that is I'm not sure, maybe it's the jump between the two. The 8-10 range has never given me good results except for when I first started lifting.
I think that the number of sets performed is also key so it's hard to say what the best rep range is for me without taking that into consideration.
I'm doing 4/2/2 and it kills. Going for 15 reps as i'm back to phase 1 of OPT. I have no idea how they are low intensity for you, these seem very hard and my heart rate gets up much quicker this way. I'm actually quite confused how this is easier for you than whatever other tempo you are using seeing as the eccentric part of a movement is the hardest on the muscle.Agreed I wish this was discussed more, I used TUT for some time and I always felt slow and sluggish and my workouts were very low intesity. Your breathing is off and you don't get your heart rate up because it is such a slow movement. However this did bring out the sides of my Triceps and and helped my shoulders to round a little more, but I didn't feel good leaving the gym after a workout like this.
People get confused on what intensity is.I hear some say that they're going to shorten breaks to keep intensity up.You can rest 10 seconds between sets and have low intensity within a set.You can rest 10 minutes and and have high intensity within a set.Watch Branch warren train and you will realise what intensity is.
Such a good dvd!I'm goping to have to watch it in the morning before the gym.If I watch it now I will be so pumped and will have trouble sleeping.
I stick to 4-6 reps. I used to do 8-10 reps like you are talking about and made gains but very very slowly.
I started the Max 0T program and I put on 15 lbs and added alot of weight to my lifts in about 12 weeks.
and when I say 4-6 reps I mean that you are overloading your muscles by using a weight that is light enough to do atleast 4 reps but heavy enough that you CAN NOT do more than 6 reps.
Even if you are cutting you should still be lifting the same way. It's your deit that gets adjusted.
This is Max OT in a nutshell:
4-6 reps
2-3 minutes rest in between
6-9 heavy sets per muscle group
1-2 muscle groups trained a day
5-7 days rest between training a certain muscle part
8-9 weeks of training and then you take a week off
30-45 minute workouts. The idea is short but intense vs. long and drawn out.
alot of this goes against what you see most people doing in the gym...with supersetting and burnout sets etc.
But for a hardgainer like myself I found this program to be just what the doctor ordered.
and as for "ego lifters." I'm not really sure what that means. Sure there are guys who like to do low reps simply because they value the weight they can lift more than the shaping of their physique but that doesn't mean that everyone that sticks to this rep range is doing this so that they can pump their chest at how much weight they can put up.
I lift this way simply because I've found that for my body type it is the most efficient and productive way to slap on muscle mass.
Like my friend who's an absolute monster and who basically got me into "truly lifting" likes to say: "The weight you can put up is just a number. Sure it can tell you that you are making gains and you need to be increasing the weight you do periodically in order to make gains. But when it comes down to it, would you rather be the guy who can bench 400 lbs. or the guy who looks like he can bench 400 lbs.?"
You simply need to eat more my friend.I promise!I would like understand more about it really. Ive read and read and read the last 2yrs now of real serious lifting...
Im an EXTREME ecto and ive "hit the wall" per se, since i dont look any bigger and havnt gone up in lifts much?
Ive been wondering about this for awhile as well. Ive done 5x5, HST and my stuff which all have worked but still cant get over 170pds and weights aint going up! I personally got teh most gains outta my own throw together of DC/TUT style
Im thinking about trying DeFrancos style starting next week, since im running outta ideas???
Maybe i should start another thread for it???
Anywho, back on topic....... Max Hypertrophy
I wish it was that easy! Im tryin put away between 3-4k cals a day! Im not sure if i can eat more and good food aint cheap! Even have some Black Hole thanks to a friend of mine from BB.com which helps, but if i need to have more then that, i dun know if i can do it?You simply need to eat more my friend. I promise!
Thread starter | Similar threads | Forum | Replies | Date |
---|---|---|---|---|
The Beat Rep Range for Ultimate Muscle Growth | Training Forum | 17 | ||
strength gaining rep range | Powerlifting/Strongman | 5 | ||
Ideal Rep Ranges | Training Forum | 7 | ||
Alternating low and high rep ranges. | Training Forum | 10 | ||
Deadlift Frequency, rep ranges, progress, etc. | Training Forum | 14 |